C3 EXPERT SAS / Supports de bande « 

pas long » / 2019-02

Between the 2 end pulleys of a conveyor, the belt must be

supported under the feed section, then throughout of
conveyor, for the carrying and bottom sides.
What are the distances between all these idlers?

Technology of « long spacing »

Between the idlers of belt conveyors.
This technology of the "long spacing" (1) between idlers was first developed, on the basis
of an obvious, for the idlers of the return side in 1986. By analogy, the principle was
extended to the idlers of the carrying side..

"long spacing" between idlers: advantages & disadvantages! A long spacing it's winner!

OBJECTIVES With the removal of all the return rollers, the

belt has reached a normal longevity for this kind
The objectives, about of spacing between the idlers,
of application!
are:
 To guarantee a centered trajectory of the band,
over the very long term and thus:
o reduce all costs related to instability of belt
trajectory, such as:
 Soiling of the conveyor and the ground
 the absorbed power by the device
Figure 1.1: Metering conveyor with drive pulley at tail =
 untimely production stops
return side belt stretched = belt sag is null = belt pressure
 breakage and premature wear of on roller nearly nil.
components, including belt.
 the lowest level of conveyor safety that
results.

1st EXPERIENCES OF ‘’LONG SPACING’’

In 1986, I used for the first time a "long spacing"

on a raw flour metering conveyor of a cement
factory. The distance between extremity pulleys Figure 1.2: each disc digs a rut in the belt cover (belt/disk
speeds ≠).
of this conveyor was 6 m, with 3 return rollers
with thin steel discs. These rollers were the
Satisfied by this first realization, still in 1986, the
cause of the premature wear of the belt, with a
customer entrusted me with the maintenance
form of rut (fig.1) in the rubber coating, to the
of a conveyor of 120 m of along with whose belt
right of each disc. These ruts are the result of
was changed several times a year, because of
the high inertia of the rollers and the low belt
several offsets and intense friction against the
pressure on the circumference of discs which
frame. I removed all the self-centering idlers
imply a difference between the speed of
(they were mounted upside down!?), And I
advance of the belt and the peripheral speed of
arranged the return rollers in excess for a
the discs, hence the typical wear described.

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spacing of 6 m for the straight sections and a

spacing of 12 to 18 m for the section "concave It was a question of establishing the
curve". The 12 to 18 m pitch of the concave correspondence between the physical laws and
section was obvious, by simply observing the their mechanical applications in the field of the
"non-contact" (fig.2) of the belt on the rollers conveyor. This approach qualified the "long
with the original spacing of 3 m. spacing" between idlers.

ANALYSIS OF ISO STANDARD 5048 # 5.3.3

Applications with a ‘’long spacing’’
Figure 2.1: in the concave curve the belt does not touch Idlers, return side
the roller with a usual spacing of 3 m
The calculations, confirmed by experience, show
that, statistically, the ideal spacing between
idlers of the return side is 12 to 15 m (2), if one
Figure 2.2: in the same concave curve, the belt touches complies with the requirements of article 5.3.3
the roller with a conforming spacing of 18 mm (fig.3 ). This distance can be 18 to 24 m (2) in the
concave curves. In the case of short conveyors,
In 1987, the same customer entrusted me with this spacing, return side, is easily 30 m, i.e. there
the rehabilitation of conveyor of the quarry link, is zero roller on this length, depending on the
about of 400 m along, with au drive pulley at weight of the belt and its breaking strength.
tail, that is to say a belt "tense", return side.
During work preparation, the factory ordered an
insufficient number of return rollers of a specific
model (base: old standard). During the erection
of the new rollers on the conveyor, according to
the original spacing of 2.5 m, instead of the Figure 3: max sag = 2% of spacing = [2.3°*2] = 4.6° of arc
theoretical 3 m considered during the
preparation, we find that there was a lack of Idlers, carrying side, regular design section
rollers. Given the delay in replenishing the On the same ISO basis, the calculations show
missing rollers, I proposed to erect the rollers in that the spacing between idlers of regular
a sequence of "one out of two" over the entire design section(3), carrier strand, can vary from
along of the conveyor, a spacing of [2.5 * 2] = 5 0.5 to 6.0 m, or more.
m and thus finish the work in the allotted time.
Note: a small spacing (fig.4.2) of 0.2 to 0.5 m can
From these first montages, with a double be recommended in the concave curves of large
spacing of the original value, I noticed: downward conveyors, to limit the belt
• a greater belt stability and reliability over festooning (collapse) between idlers (fig.4.1)
time. when braking phase.
• an ease of adjusting the rollers during "on-the-
fly" setting (method at that time).

STRATEGY Figure 4.1: when braking, the belt festooning between the
idlers, with a standard spacing.
Based on its first experiences, I looked for the
recommendations from the standards, with the
aim of guaranteeing the stability of trajectory of
the return strand, without using
complementary devices, like the belt-training Figure 4.2: when braking, the belt does not festooning
idlers. between the idlers, with a small spacing.

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This variation of "spacing" (0.5 to 6.0 m), on the

same conveyor, is easily understood in the case Spacing reduced between idlers, compared to
of an overall ascending profile, with a concave with time
curve at the end of the 1st section and a high
elevation for the following sections. In fact, to 1. Section under the feed, fall zone:
obtain a "short" concave curve radius (fig. 5), it Here, the calculation must take into account, in
is necessary to have a low pre-tension in the addition to the normal load(4) of the product on
belt, before the curve, hence the need for a the belt:
short spacing between the idlers, of this section, o the load from the product column (fig.7) in
for meet the requirements of Article 5.3.3. support of the feed. This depends on the
Conversely, when considering the sections at section of the trough, delimited at the level
the head of the conveyor, with a high elevation, of the belt and extended upwards according
the tenseness in the belt increase considerably to the vertical projection of this section ;
and the calculations show that a spacing of 6 m o the impact energy resulting from the fall of
is perfectly consistent in terms of belt sag, to the product from the equipment upstream.
the maximum prescribed limit of 2% of the These are two distinct values that must be
spacing between idlers, belt at full load. considered the most restrictive.

Figure 5: Spacing variable between supports (S à XXL).

Inverse principle: "short spacing", carrying side

If this article advocates designs with a long
spacing in the general case, there are two
special cases for which a short spacing is
recommended, except for the variable spacing
described previously and the spacing of the
idlers of convex curve which is calculated in Figure 7: Idler spacing, feed section
angular value (fig.6.1), as a function of the S: shot ; M: average ; L: long.
maximum permissible stress in the belt edges.
Here, it is a question of limiting the belt sag
(fig.3) between two idlers of this section, so as
not to generate:
 of product loss (lateral leakage)
 an excessive strength to the belt movement,
by an excessive belt sag (fig.8).

Figure 6.1: convex curve: spacing in angular value.

Figure 8: Sag between supports excessive = Strong

strength important ... until infinity!

Figure 6.2: Straight section: spacing in linear value. Of a usual pitch of 300 mm, the calculation
often recommends a pitch of 200 mm, see 150

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 C3 EXPERT SAS / Supports de bande « pas long » / 2019-02

mm. Thus, the subject is perfectly mastered for side, which is a stretched strand, between the
a low cost. This design is true for the extractors head pulley and the drive pulley, 216 m further,
and even more true to right of the drain door of on return side. On this same 5 km conveyor, the
the same extractors. The lack of calculation on idler spacing of carrying side is 6 m near the
this point is at the origin of the sliding supports head. Since the change of spacing, the disorders
in the feeding sections; which is a progress in have disappeared and I received congratulations
general, but a source of disorder in some cases. from the director of the plant.

2. Dual direction belt: Many short conveyors, up to about 30 m center

In the case of a belt with a single way, the distance, upgraded by me, have zero idler on
rollers of the supports have the 2nd function of bottom side (fig.9).
"guiding" the belt. For this, it requires a
maximum radial force of belt on the roller, but
within the limit of a belt deflection according to
Article 5.3.3 and consistent with the product
handled.
Figure 9: Bottom side = zero idler ! It’s great !
On the other hand, for a two-way belt, it is
necessary to aim for the smallest possible effect
of direction by the rollers in general and the side All new conveyors, repaired or upgraded with
rollers in particular (trough support); therefore, the support of C3 Expert, have benefited for 30
replacing the side rollers with sliding pads is an years from a spacing of 12 to 15 m, bottom
advantage when possible. For the same pre- side, whatever the industry and the
tension of the belt and the same product load, geographical zone in the world.
by reducing the spacing between the rollers, the
radial force of the belt on the rollers is reduced
as well as the directional effect of the side COMPARATIVE ANALYSIS
rollers. Here, one seeks a "neutral" direction
applied by the rollers to the belt, whatever the Comparing a "short" (usual) spacing between
direction of belt movement and which is not idlers of the bottom side of a conveyor, i.e. 2.5
influenced by the manufacturing uncertainties to 3.0 m according to the example ISO 5048 #
of the brackets (usual tolerance of manufacture) 5.3 of 1973, with the automobile world, this
and their adjustment on the conveyor.. would correspond to an over-inflated car tire
with 15 bar (usual pressure 2.5). In this case, the
Note : for a two-way belt. tire contact on the road is a "point" instead of a
 In addition to the design with a reduced surface and the handling of the car becomes
spacing between idlers, carrying side, it is particularly fragile. From this comparison, we
appropriate to apply to the belt a pre-tension can assume that a short spacing between idlers
of the order of 4% of its breaking strength; does not guarantee a good belt trajectory.
for this, it must be ensured that all the
components of the conveyor can withstand
this constraint, in particular the pulleys The apparently centered trajectory of a belt,
(ferrule, shaft, bearings, bearing-housings). supported at a short spacing between idlers (3
 Brackets with "pinch" are not compliant for m), is always "random & precarious (5)" and a
this application. source of disorder.

The longest spacing between idlers, currently in HISTORICAL SOURCE

service since 2007, is 36 m, for 300-350 mm of
sag (fig.3). The idlers support the belt, bottom Until the 1970s, the belts with cotton carcass
were heavy compared to them strength and the

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 C3 EXPERT SAS / Supports de bande « pas long » / 2019-02

examples in ISO 5048 of 1973 were coherent observation shows that the belt have a laterally
with an arrow limit of 0.5% to 2.0% of spacing moves without being influenced by the rollers
between idlers. These values came from tests. because there is no contact.

In the September 1989 version, the 2 examples

it’s removed which indicated a pitch of 1.0 to
1.5 m for the carrying side idlers and 2.5 to 3.0
m for the bottom side idlers. It can be deduced
that the standardization commissions had
realized that the examples of 1973 no longer
corresponded to the recommended limits of
sags (0.5% to 2.0% of spacing), because of the
evolution of the belts, especially with polyester
carcass

TECHNICAL BASIS

What are the technical criteria that make a belt

sag less than 0.5% or greater than 2.0% of idler
spacing give a problem?

Deflection less than 0.5% of idler spacing

This technical point concerns only roller Figure 10: if Pb tends toward to 0, the directional effect of
supports. All models of "slippery" supports are the rollers "dir" tends toward to 0 because the roller force
excluded by nature; as well as the idlers of Fr tends toward to 0.
Attention, the angle x° is accentuated to be visible.
convex curved sections and two-way belts
governed by other rules.
With a wealth of this observation, it remains
only to identify the origin of the "asymmetric"
Here, it is the function of "direction" of the
force or forces that influence the belt trajectory.
rollers, applied to the belt, which must be
Either it is a defect in the belt during its
considered. When the belt sag between two
manufacture, its implementation, its
idlers tends to zero, the "steering" function of
exploitation and / or it is, often, a geometric
the rollers tends to disappear ( fig.10). as
position defect of at least one pulley.
previously described with the over-inflated tires
of a car. In this case, it is the real forces in the
Note : in some cases, this asymmetry of forces
belt, in the observation zone, which give the
in the band can be corrected (6) ... but especially
direction (trajectory) to the belt. Of course,
not with self-training idlers!
everyone thinks of the misalignment of the
product on the belt to cause its offset; this
Deflection greater than 2.0% of idler spacing
offset will be a maximum of ½ of the
This technical point concerns first the return
decentering value in mass and in millimeters of
idlers.
the product on the belt, because it is necessary
to take into account the forces of pre-tension
If we take again the example of the tire of the
and traction applied to the belt.
car, but correctly inflated with 2.5 bar, its
contact on the road corresponds to a "surface"
To illustrate the belt forces internal, it is
of very precise dimensions and defined by the
sufficient to observe a belt, running empty, in a
manufacturer. By transposing this example to
concave curve and affected by asymmetric
the conveyors, it is easy to deduce that the belt
forces at the conveyor axis, with little or no belt
contact on the rollers must correspond to a
contact on the roller, in the curve. The

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surface and not to a line or to one or two o a very high level of safety for zero cost.
points (the 2 edges of the belt). Thus, a belt  Clean floor under the conveyor
deflection of 2% of the idler spacing o A hazard of falling (slipping) removed;
corresponds to a winding arc on the roller of  No maintenance charge;
4.6°; that is to say an area of: [roller Ø * / 360 °  No risk for bad belt trajectory due to clogged
* 4.6 ° * belt width]. rollers, poorly adjusted;
 Amortization of jolts at start-up;
 Measurement of the continuous tension of belt;
With this first criterion of contact surface, one
 Reduced overall cost on this item;;
must also consider the factor "belt longitudinal
stiffness(7)", to obtain a centered and perennial Disadvantages
belt trajectory. The longer the idler spacing, the • In some cases of existing conveyor, it is necessary
longer the belt longitudinal stiffness decreases. to move the cross struts of the frame to let the
passage of the belt
It is the combination of the maximum permitted o The belt sag can be reduced by applying a
"winding arc" factors (see maximum sag 2%) large pre-tension; in this case it is necessary to
and "idler spacing" the longest possible that make sure of the good choice of the belt and
the pulleys (shaft, bearings, ...).
make the belt trajectory quality.
 No other inconvenience.

So, why not recommend belt sag greater than Long conveyor, center distance greater than 30 m
2% of the idler spacing? The idler spacing is:
Because: Belt with soft strand: 12 à 15 m.
1) The belt trajectory quality is not improved Belt with soft strand, concave curve : 18 à 24 m
because other negative factors are involved. Belt with stretched strand: 36 m and more.
2) The forces resistant to the belt running, Advantages
therefore the power absorbed by the  Reduction in proportion to the trapping hazards
pressing of the belt on the rollers, increase of and hazard by roller ejection.
exponentially (fig. 8), in particular carrying o Either a reduction of the cost of the protective
side, beyond 2% of the deflection of idler devices to these two hazards.
spacing. The mathematical model used does  Great stability of belt trajectory and durable in
not support this condition. time;
o a high level of safety as a result;
o Either the removal of all the self-trainer idlers!
AVANTAGES & DISADVANTAGES  Easy and quick adjustment of rollers, conveyor
"off, safe";
The long idler spacing’s are in perfect conformity  High adjustment accuracy (≈90 ° +/- 0.05 °);
with: o the belt becomes the measuring instrument (8)
* Directive 2006/42/EC for adjusting the rollers.
* The safety standard EN ISO 12100, articles 4 and  Precise continuous measurement(9) of the belt
6. tension in location T2 and T3
For the record, the EN 620 standard (conveyor o this measure is decisive, especially for
safety) is normally applied after the requirements of strategic conveyors;
EN ISO 12100 have been exhausted. o conversely, the measurement of belt tension,
* Technical standard ISO 5048, article 5, of1987 with a usual spacing of 3 m, of 6 m, is affected
by a major uncertainty which makes the
Bottom side measurement unusable.
Short conveyor, length up to about 30 m  Long life of rollers(10);
Either « zero » return idler!  Major amortization of jolts in transient phases
and in operation;
Advantages o The "long spacing" is much more effective
 No trapping hazard and no hazard for ejecting than counterweight pre-tensioning systems to
rollers; limit load surges on the belt.

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 C3 EXPERT SAS / Supports de bande « pas long » / 2019-02

 Elimination of clogging of standard rollers (steel) Advantages

or rollers coated 35 Shore rubber;
o this design:  Guarantees the steering effect of rollers on the
 eliminates the auxiliary conveyor called belt;
"crumb tray" placed under the head o trough idlers with "pinch(11)" angle are no
section of the main conveyor. longer needed
 renders the belt-turning systems useless;  Reduces energy consumption, by reducing the
The belt is wrung out at the passage of first number of rollers and the pinch angle of the
rollers. usual idlers.
 Reduced purchase cost, including high quality  Reduces the cost of protection devices against
rollers; the trapping hazard.
o a conveyor frame of type caisson, with a
suitable profile, allows for a span, between Disadvantages
two feet, of 12 m to 15 m, which reduces civil  Without any significant inconvenience, apart
engineering. from having to calculate the conveyor and the
 Reduction of energy consumption; idler spacing; what is the minimum expected of a
 Low maintenance costs. manufacturer; this which is, also, within the
scope of maintenance department.
Disadvantages
 Sensitivity to crosswinds
o In the case where the frame design does not CONCLUSION
provide side wind protection, a wind net or
other device must be added. The balance between advantages and
 In new works, this disadvantage does not disadvantages largely demonstrates that the
exist insofar as the frame design design of the conveyors, using a "long idler
incorporates a "windshield" profile. spacing" constitutes a benefit without
• In the case of existing rollers of the "anti-clogging
equivalent. It's up to you to make this design,
rubber ring" type, they must be replaced by
more than 30 years old, the rule now usual.
standard rollers (ring-free ferrule), bare or coated
35 Shore rubber.
• Adjustment training, conveyor belt to standstill,
safe, is highly recommended. YOUR QUESTIONS
o C3 Expert is at the origin of a simple method,
Because this technology of "long idler spacing"
accessible to all, very effective.
can question you, intrigue you, then, ask your
Carrying side questions on our forum : http://www.c3-
All conveyors expert.fr/.
Of which the idler spacing is: greater than the usual
1.0 m to 1.50 m.

**********************************************************************************
(1)
Long spacing: C3 Expert considers that the distance between 2 idlers is "long spacing" when it is at least 3 times greater
than the usual spacing, as given in the examples of the ISO 5048 standard, # 5.3.3, version 1973; either the values of 1.0 to
1.5 m, carrying side and 2.5 to 3.0 m for bottom side. Attention, these examples were removed in the 1989 version. In my
first applications, in 1986, I attributed the qualifier "long spacing" to distances between idlers of 5 to 6 m, before considering
that this qualifier did not apply not for these lengths..
(2)
12 to 15 m, 18 to 24 m: it is a multiple of the usual spacing of 3 m, but this spacing can be a "non-multiple" value and of
the same order of magnitude..
(3)
Regular design section: This refers to all sections of the conveyor after the end of the feed chute and to the jetty pulley.
(4)
Normal load of product: here, it is the mass of product, per meter, at the peak flow (basis of calculation), found on the
regular design sections, carrying side.
(5)
Precarious and random Trajectory: A belt trajectory is precarious because it takes a small variation of one factor for the
belt to drift and the trajectory is random because we do not know when the drift will occur.

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 C3 EXPERT SAS / Supports de bande « pas long » / 2019-02

(6)
Method for correcting the belt asymmetric forces: refer to my articles "Mastery belt trajectory belt _ prerequisites /
Settings".
(7)
Longitudinal belt rigidity: this criterion can be likened to the stiffness of a wood board, seen in the transverse direction.
When the rollers are poorly adjusted, the belt is shifted off; when this longitudinal rigidity decreases, the belt rotates in the
same roller direction.
(8)
The belt becomes the measuring instrument: irrespective of its intrinsic quality, the belt is used as a precision measuring
instrument, knowing that the amplitude of belt offset is proportional to the number of meters of belt passing on the roller in
observation (see articles «Mastery belt trajectory_ prerequisites / Settings»)
(9)
Accurate continuous measurement of belt tension: Since 2002, C3 Expert has developed a method of continuously
measuring belt tension, with very little uncertainty, using an ultrasonic sensor.
(10)
Long life of rollers: in the case of the usual 3 m bottom side, the load applied to them by the belt is 5% to 20% of their
admissible load and yet they perish too quickly; on the contrary, the rollers, arranged in a long spacing with a applied load of
100%, have a considerably longer life.
(11)
Pinch angle of trough idlers: this angle meets the ISO 1537 standard. In this case the side rollers of trough idler have a
force convergent to the conveyor axis. It's supposed to re-centering the belt in case of drift. This angle represents a
considerable power absorbed on the long conveyors, for a very relative efficiency.

*********************************************************************************
Marc des Rieux, Expert
[email protected]
www.c3-expert.com

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