Dialogue With Non Muslims on

TOPIX / FAQ About Islam (Vol-6)

Introduction:

In the name of Allah, the Most Gracious, The Most Merciful

All praise be to Allah and May His Peace and Blessings be on to His Last and Final
Messenger Prophet Mohammad and on his family and companions and those who
followed in their footsteps, afterwards,

This is the sixth volume of the discussions I had during the past six months with Non
Muslims on the threads of TOPIX, five volumes of which have already been published on
Scribd.

I have chosen style for this sixth volume, which is a combination of Vol-4 and Vol-5. i.e.
the questions from both parties are included, but the topics have been arranged in broad
categories.

The Name of Thread and the page on which the original discussion took place and given
under brackets after each question. Only first name of thread is mentioned and the full
names are given as below. The questions have been abridged to save space on this
volume.

As usual, I would like to warn, that any views expressed here are my personal and not of
Islam’s , I have taken care to present Islamic views, but if I have committed any errors,
these are mine and not of Islam’s.

I pray to Allah to forgive any mistakes or shortcomings in my answers and do not hold
me accountable for these on the last day, when every other connection would be snapped
and individuals shall be responsible to Him for their acts of commission and omissions.

I request readers to go thru these and if any one gets his doubts clarified or gets some
useful information, I would be thankful to Allah the greatest.

With this short introduction, I take your leave.

M.U. Qidwai

Jubail, Saudi Arabia,

March 2010.
 Index
Introduction: P2

Names of Threads and their locations: P4

Chapter-1 (Christianity) Page 5 to page 76

Chapter-2 (Jews) Page 77 to Page 163

Chapter-3 (Islam-1) Page 164 to Page 262

Chapter-4 (Islam-2) Page 263 to Page 366

Chapter-5 (Evolution) Page 367 to Page 412

Chapter-6 (Terrorism) Page 413 to Page 446

Chapter-7 (Miscl.) Page 447 to Page 480

 Names of Thread and their Abbreviations used in this Volume

Israel = Israel’s End is near

http://www.topix.net/forum/world/TB2GI1T80CJ638O9S

Jews Don’t = Jews don not Deserve a country

http://www.topix.net/forum/world/T94692GH71K6952PR

Messianic = Messianic jews are persecuted in Israel

http://www.topix.net/forum/world/TM3OVM4FAOEGMHG12

Should = Should Evolution be taught in High Schools

http://www.topix.net/forum/world/TCTDUMIJ55H2B2JHI

Who is= Who is Allah (Archeology Forum)

http://www.topix.net/forum/science/archaeology/TT8JHO8GH6HK7IJPA/

Who is 2 = Who is Allah (World News Forum)

http://www.topix.net/forum/science/archaeology/TT2K02G7VI86J9572/

Elite = Elite US troops expanding operations

http://www.topix.net/forum/world/TD8PHDO0NN502KATC

Herald = Herald can use Allah

http://www.topix.net/forum/world/T7NF8QTQHIRU01KL5

Afghan = Plan B for Afghanistan

http://www.topix.net/forum/world/T053PO1K8I8VEGL1L

Two British = Two British soldiers killed

http://www.topix.net/forum/world/TVTNJUL7ADDQCMMDM

Holocaust = Israel plays Holocaust Card

http://www.topix.net/forum/world/TN6H9RL0MM3OIS8HL
 Chapter-1 (Christianity, Bible, Jesus, Trinity and others)

Q1 , 666 (Herald, 38)

..Firstly I think you should understand the meaning opposite trinity concept ---- > which is
Father, Son and Holly spirit (3 in 1)

---- > Three person in one Godhead (Namely : ALLAH).??????

Father (Allah) appeared as human after Mary giving birth to --- > (Jesus) and revert to pure soul
(Holly Spirit --- > Allah) after Jesus (Allah) crucified.

That’s why they give these excuse and claim that they also deserve to worship the god namely
ALLAH (The one and only God) because they also worship only one GOD !...

ANS.

I think you are going away from the main topic.

I never said that Christians are right in their beliefs (about Jesus being
Son of God and God be one in Trinity).

Quran itself warns Christians against this belief. But does Quran says
that Jews and Christians believe in some other god than Allah?

Let us say what Quran says:

“O people of book (O Jews and Christians) let us come to a common
term between you and us. That we never worship anything but Allah,
and make no partners or associates with Him…” Ch.3 V 64.

Does not Quran invite Jews and Christians to worship Allah?

So my basic question was that we Muslims have no right to say that

Jews and Christians worship any other God than Allah.

Their mistake is in the concept of Allah they have. We have to correct

that concept.

Finally Malaysia is not an Island and has no special status that only
Malaysian Christians we stopped from using the word Allah and they
can use it everywhere else in the world.

It is unfortunate that this controversy has dragged that long. The

sooner it is finished, the better it will be for every one.

Walaikum Assalam.
Q2, Smelly Cross (Herald, 37)
Just short answer for you :

You still can’t change their attitude on Islam if the Allah word is permitted to use by those .. right
?

If they use Allah word, but at the same time their heart is fixed atheist and not open to accept
Allah as only one, so what the difference ?

On your question : how Allah can be misused ?

How about these .. Allah never forbid us from eating Pork !

And

Jesus is Allah

(3 plus 1 = Trinity Concept ---- > So Jesus is Allah (One)– Not Jesus Ibn Allah !)

ANS.

I tried to understand your logic, but forgive me if I am not convinced.

Let us go back to the time when Quran was being revealed. Even at
that time Christians believed in Trinity and even in that Time Christians
believed that Jesus is Son of God.

It is mentioned in Quran that Christians say that Allah is third of the

three and that Jesus is Allah!!

Even then Quran never said that Christians believe in any other God
than Allah. They have wrong concept about Allah and that is what we
should do to correct.

The truth remains truth and we cannot change it to suit our purpose.

We cannot force Christians to use TUHAN, ILAH, ELI or OLI when they
translate their Bible in Malay language.

In fact it would be good if they use word Allah and then we can show
and argue with them to say that Allah in Quran means such and such
and see how inferior your concept of God is.

I still feel that a trivial issue has been blown out of all proportion, the
sensitivity of Malaysian Muslims has been wrong.
We should get over it and start doing our job, to call every Non Muslim
to the true path of Islam.

Such petty issues have no significance really in front of our High Goals.

Q3. Ali (Israel, 677)

Oh MUQ, how dangerous a little knowledge is!!!

You dont know that Jesus came to fulfil the Law and not destroy it? You dont know that the Law
was the shadow of that which was to come, meaning the New Testament? Everything in the Old
Testament was speaking in kind of that which was to come. You didn't know that man failed in
his covenant with God, so God had to make a New Covenant with Himself, and making man the
beneficiary? Kimo Sabbi?

Of course the Qur'an is such a confused book that the Muslims quote it and revere it, but live by
the Hadith. Tell me of Kaliph Uthman who burned all the varients he could find in order to
declare Zaid's copy to Khadijah the official version.. You mean you didn't know? Tut, tut!

I've seen personally a few variants of the Qur'an - in Istanbul's Topkapi Palace Museum, in the
British Library, London, in Damascus, and in the Egyptian Museum, Cairo. I also possess a few
copies myself!....

ANS.

I know, I know, one way of to “fulfill” a law is to abolish and abrogate it

and that is what Jesus did!!

But you forgot these words of Jesus where he said “that any one who
breaks or teaches the least commandment of God shall be called least
in the Kingdom of God…”

Obviously you do not know anything about how Othman published the
official version of Quran and what are those variants readings of
Quran….

Gather any Muslims from China….India…..Africa…..Europe….USA… and

ask then to recite Quran.

Listen how they all sound together.

Then do the same for any book of Bible….. there are 100 % chances
that they may not be able to understand each other at all!! And none
of them would be able to read Manuscripts of any OT or NT books
which are in Hebrew and Greek.
That is the difference between Quran and Bible…Quran has been in
hands of people since its very beginning and Bible has always been the
property of Church or synagogues and Priests.

You say Bible is 66 books, Catholics say it is 73 books…now who is

speaking the truth.

Another beauty of the history of Bible is that the more you read it….the
more convinced you become that it was not a Word of God…in the
sense in which Church or priests present it.

Some time I marvel at the courage of Bible Thumpers like

you….criticizing “variants” of Quran and forgetting their own book.

It is like what Jesus’ meant when he said “how come you try to remove
straw from the eyes of your brother…when you yourself has a log in
your own eyes. First remove your log, so you can see better.

Q4. Ali (Israel, P 678)

Hello MUQ. Must I teach you again about your own religion??? When you don't even know your
own, how dare you talk rubbish to us about ours!!!

Mohammad is dead in the grave, and I promise you that Jesus' grave in Jerusalem is empty - I've
sat in it - it is not next to Mohammad's grave somewhere in Saudi A!

Regarding Jesus; you are showing your religion's mindset. Islam means: Don't think, only
SUBMIT AND OBEY. Qur'an means RECITE - parot fashion; no brains required. Muslims have
brains in many aspects, but not in their religion.

Jesus came as the Christ, the anointed one sent from God to carry out God's mandate; He also
came as the man, Jesus (God incarnate), to successfully live a pure and holy life (which no one
ever did before or since, not even M) and suffer wrongfully, die, and become resurrected. If you
don't know the difference (and no muslim knows the difference) then you deserve to continue to
be a victim of misinformation. He however promised to come again, but this time as Lord and
Master, to whose name every knee will be forced to bow, even yours, MUQ; like it or not!...

ANS.

Before teaching me about my religion, is it not prudent to know about

your own religion?

The way you have described the mission of Jesus, is not the way in
which he himself described it!! It is the way, your Paul describes it?

So do you mean to say that Paul knows about jesus’ mission than Jesus
himself?
If you think my God (which as per your “personal” opinion is different
from Judeo / Christian God) changes His mind, then how come “Your
God” changed His mind about Laws and Commandments of Torah? He
sends them as eternal laws and then your “puny” Paul abrogates the
whole book of Torah and nails it on the Cross?

It is not befitting for you to talk about “variant Quran’” when you have
innumerable of “Versions” of your own Holy Bible!! It is like a pot
calling the cattle black!!

Jesus will indeed come back to earth, to kill Anti Christ, and to get rid
of This Trinity and Cross and to execute Final Judgement on these
“pesky Jews”!!

Q5. Ali (Israel, 684)

MUQ: Its amazing how a Muslim will always try to hog (excuse the Western word)the limelight
to argue with untruths against the infidels. This is not an Arab forum so I dont want to boar
(excuse the similar word again) other readers with a list of Qur'an variants - to other readers: there
are as many as 17 variants which MUQ will not own-up to.

MUQ, you quote the Bible as so many Muslims before you have done - all the same, all from the
same imam and pseudo-intellectual who is feeding all muslims with the same pack of lies. Bible-
believing people do not learn their Scripture as a tool to be used against people like you. They
read it to live by because it is readable, logical, beautiful, chronological, the true Word of the
Living God and available in most languages of the world so that all can read and meet this
personal God….

ANS.

I like your evasive style of answering….since it is not an Arab forum, so

I cannot Quote all Quranic contradictions…..there are 17 variants of
Quran…but unfortunately I cannot read any of them, so I do not know
what they really mean!!!

Bible must be the world of God, because people do read it in their own
language (and every one becomes a master of Bible by just reading it).

All the mistakes, contradictions and variant readings in Bible can be

easily explained, if we BELIEVE that it is the Word of God!!

If the message inside Bible if holy, what does it matter, if people were
playing with its text!!! There was no way they could have had their
hands to modify the portion which was holy!!

Just see who is living in the world of Hallucination!!

You ask me to come out of Cocoon while you continue to hide yourself
in Cocoon!!

Q6. Ehav (Israel, 674)

Muq,
I appreciate your perspectives.
I do realise the true message of Jesus. If not, I would of converted, or looked for another religion.
I have witnessed people healed, with severe physically damage, by using the name of Jesus. This
validates Jesus position as more than a Messiah.
I could list many, many, other super natural occurrences.
To my knowledge only Jesus made these claims.
Making Jesus Lord/God. For only God has the power to heal and change things, humans cannot.

What appears to the human eye, and logic, is far from the thoughts of God. …..

ANS.

You have posted a very long reply and it covers so many points, that it
is difficult to answer all of them.

Why don’t you raise one point at a time. I would answer a few which I
think are relevant:

A. Miracles as proof for Genuineness of Christianity:

In fact Miracles are no proof at all for genuineness of any religion. You
should talk logic and prove your point from scriptures and words of
Jesus.

I am from India and in India there is no shortage of Miracles and people

who perform them. So we have become a sort of immune to this form
of logic. There are Hindu Yogis who perform all sorts of miracles, so do
you think that their message is right?

B. Jews being gathered from all corners of the world:

I appreciate all those quotations that you have provided. I want to ask
you one question:

Why would God gather Jews from all parts of the world? Will it be for
good cause or for bad cause?

A good cause in the eyes of God is a society that follows His Laws and
Commandments. Have you seen any signs in the Present state of
Israel that shows that this country is following God’s Laws and
Commandments?

The modern state of Israel is run by Atheist, Materialists people who

have Jewish sounding names. They do not follow Jewish religion and
have no regard for God’s Laws and Commandments.

Do you mean to say that God wants that type of Jewish nation and that
is why, he should gather Jews from all corners of the world?

If this is not the case, then in my view, some great calamity is to befall
all these Jews. They could become extinct after that calamity…as no
Jews would be left in any other part of the world.

Think about this and respond.

Q7. Ehav (Israel, 678)

Because the deity of Jesus is above all the prophets.

For if you believe in the prophets, whom do you believe Ezekiel, the prophet Micah prophesied
that the Messiah would be born in Bethlehem, Birth of Jesus Christ Foretold 700 Years before
His Birth by Prophet Isaiah.
yet Muk, you fail to mention these key prophesies.
And I am going to leave it here. I hope you come to the realities of whom Jesus is.

ANS.

It is not for me or you to grade the rankings of every prophets. Islam

teaches us that all Prophets were from god and they are equally
honorable for us. We do not distinguish between one prophet or
another.

However it is God, who gave more favor to some prophets than other,
To Some one He Spoke Personally and raised some one in rank… but
we should not praise one prophet so much that is amounts to insulting
other.

That is the balanced teaching of Islam as to how to deal with various

prophets and their messages.

It is strange that you first want to prove the birth of Jesus’ from Ezekiel
and then raise his level to God yourself!! Did Ezekiel said that God will
be born in Bethlehem 700 years afterwards? Are the term Messiah and
God synonymous?
I have no qualm in believing that there were many prophesies about
jesus in Old Testament. And that Jesus was a Great Prophet of God…

But Jesus was not the Last Prophet. Jesus himself and Moses before
him prophesized that Last prophet will come to the world “To guide
you into all truth”….that last prophet was no other than our prophet
Mohammad (may peace and blessings of God be on to all His prophets)

So you should broaden your outlook and study of your own scriptures.

Q8, MEHS (Israel, 677)

You're right , Jesus WAS more than a prophet. He was the son of God. Numerous EYEWITNESS
accounts saw him crucified, entombed and risen. Doubting Thomas demanded to see the spear
wound in his side and the nail holes in his hands and feet. When shown in front of witnesses he
no longer doubted. Fairy tale ? No more a fairy tale than any eye witnessed only yet archeological
supported event in history ie the exploits of Hannibal, Alexander, Cesar(s), Plato, Socrates or
even the US revolutionary war.

Others are free to doubt or believe as they choose and live peacefully side by side with me. I have
no doubts

ANS.

Sorry for rocking your boat…. There was not a single eyewitness of
Jesus' Crucifixion and Resurrection, who has given his or her testimony
to us.

None of the Gospel writers were an eye witness of these events, and
they did not record who told them these things.

They were just writing from "hearsay" that Jesus was crucified, so they
assumed that he must have resurrected.

Jesus was Son of God in the sense of Jewish language, which denotes a
righteous prophet and a godly person…. Not in its literal sense as
suggested by Paul.

You talk about Archeological evidence…if it was not for 1500 Million
Muslims giving testimony about Jesus, it was hard to proof that Jesus
even existed as a historical person!!

You have no doubt, because you have closed your mind and accept
Paul's words without any analysis.

Q9. TRP (Israel, 685)

that is just it our holy bible does not have in it instruction for war it has only the history of the
tribes and there is not anything in depth about treatment of prisoners of war it never says to
behead it never says to steal their possessions it never says to murder non believers it has clear
historical facts about what took place that they enslaved some and when the children of isreal
betrayed God they were enslaved by those they had once enslaved as punishment for their
wickedness against the almighty a great deal of what is in our holy bible the worst was done to
the children of Isreal Gods own favored people whom he entrusted his covenant and the religion
and laws and beliefs for them to pass on righteously and loyally, ….

ANS.

If your Bible does not give instructions as to how to conduct a war,

then it is the defect in your Bible.....Why should you expect that Quran
also should not give any instructions as to how to conduct a war.

You did not spoke the whole truth, Bible indeed gives instructions as to
how to conduct war and how to deal with the conquered races. It
seems you feel shy to quote them here, or think that they have
become outdated, then it means that Bible is not applicable for all
ages.

You said that since Bible did not give instructions as to how to conduct
wars, so Jewish and Christians tribes and nations decided their own
rules. This is another defect in your book, that you cannot decide about
any war strategy, if it is right or wrong as per your religion.

You may use, Chemical, Atomic, Biological, Genetically or any type of

weapons, and no one can say if they are allowed or not allowed.

In case of Islam, it is very easy to decide on each action, if it is Islamic

or Non Islamic.

I asked you for reference, where Quran says that you should kill all
unbelievers, if that was the instructions of Quran, they why Muslims
did not followed it?

Why there are still Millions of Arab Jews and Arab Christians in Arab
lands despite 1400 years of Islamic rule?

On the contrary, how many Muslims were left alive when Christians
took back Spain after 700 years of Islamic Rule?

Islam is the perfect religion on the face of this world, it gives

instructions on each phase and each sphere of human lives. They are
most suitable and practicable for any given situation.
My advise to you is to study Islam and its teachings and do not
generalize based on insufficient information.

Q10. Bach7 (Jews Don’t, 69)

Umm I don't think you know what the Talmud is. It's not the Old Testament. Please research it
first-(only takes a google search or dictionary)

HAHHAHA is that poetic Islamic teaching???.

I think you're referring to the Trinity (the Father/The Son/The Holy Spirit) Where does it mention
a three headed monster???. If you'd like to condescend to outright bigotry I'll be more than happy
to discus the Koran in an honest fashion. However if you are actually simply confused I'm very
happy to have discus it with you.

ANS.

What is OT but Jewish scriptures? What is Talmud but the scripture

with its commentary?

If Trinity is not a Three Headed Monster, what else it is? There are
three persons in God hood, all of them are co-eternal, co-existent and
equally powerful…. But they are only one God!! How else can you
explain it, except as a three headed monster?

You can feel free to discuss about Quran…. But you have to be civil
and use civil language. That is the only condition, I put from my side.

Q11. Bach7 (Jews don’t, 69)

The Talmud is a commentary of the Old Testament. it's subjective. It is not the word of God- and
it is not inspired by God. So it is gods word corrupted by man.

The Quran is incredibly hard to believe. I'll start with one point at a time:

First of all men were and are promised virgin sex slaves/sex objects:

The specific Hadith in which the number of virgins is specified is Hadith Al-Tirmidhi in the Book
of Sunah (volume IV, chapters on The Features of Paradise as described by the Messenger of
Allah, chapter 21, About the Smallest Reward for the People of Paradise. The same hadith is also
quoted by Ibn Kathir in his Quranic commentary (Tafsir) of Surah Al-Rahman:…

ANS.

Thanks for clarifying the status and position of Talmud. Now let me
clarify the Islamic position regarding the matter of Sex in Paradise as
mentioned in Quran at many places, some of which you have quoted
and many more you did not quote:
1. First as per Islamic beliefs, humans will resurrect in the hereafter
with both Body and Soul. So their life will be as they have on this
earth.

2. Then Paradise is a place where every desire of humans will be

fulfilled. On this earth it is not possible to fulfill even a single desire of
humans, because the end of life itself is the biggest spoiler in
enjoyment of any wish.

3. The life in the hereafter shall be eternal, so that will be the place of
real enjoyment.

4. The pleasure of a good and beautiful companion is one of the

strongest wish in every human being, how it will be the case if this
genuine desire of humans shall be left unfulfilled in Paradise?

5. That is why it is mentioned in Quran that Allah will fulfill this desire
of humans also and the believing women and extra women from
heavens shall be given to them.

6. But the purpose of sex on this earth and in the hereafter is totally
different. On this earth the main purpose of sex is for securing the
continuity of humans race and family tree of an individual, but in
hereafter that will be not the case. The pleasure shall be pure
companionship and closeness which a man feels when in close contact
with a woman.

7. We should call that as pure love and enjoyment and not the
discharge of semen and reproduction acts etc…

8. It is not correct to say that God wants to entice us with women and
sex… God tells us the rewards for a life spent is restraint, for following
God’s Command while living on this earth.

9. Quran at many places mentions all the good things that will be
available in Paradise… but this is only mere description for us to
understand. That will be a new world, with every thing new. We
should not take the words in their literal meanings.

Q13. Bach7 (Jews don’t., 69)

The god of the Talmud is not the God of Christians. From what i've seen it's Satanic worship and
not worship of the God of the torah.

ANS.
How come then Jesus and Paul quote frequently from OT books?

How come they derive their logic and proofs from OT writings?

If they did nor believe in God of OT?

Actually it is Christians who are guilty of changing the God of Torah

into A Triune God...a Three Headed Monster...whom no one is able to
explain logically or scripturally

Q14. Hugh Be (Messianic, 321)

As regards guarantee for Salvation, I do not think there is any one who has any GUARANTEE
for Salvation.”

MUQ, salvation is ONLY a GUARANTEE to them that meet the requirements for salvation and
that includes FAITH and WORKS i.e. obedience to God’s commands. No murderer, no thief, no
adulterer, no one that knows and habitually DESECRATES anything that God has blessed will
get Salvation.

ANS.

I agree with you, my point was that, it is God only who knows who is
sincere in his or her faith and who did good deeds to please Him and
gain His favor.

As humans we only see the outside of every thing, it is God who knows
the secrets hidden inside our hearts and minds.

That is why I said, we only HOPE to get God’s Mercy, Blessing and
Salvation…if we try our best….. we have no GUARANTEE that our faith
and deeds are acceptable to God.

That was a humble stand and we Muslims are humble people. We do

not boast about us, our faith and our deed as you have noticed some
other people doing on this and other threads.

Q15 Kathy Dew (Messianic , 321)

John 5 Faith in the Son of God

1Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God, and everyone who loves the
father loves his child as well. 2This is how we know that we love the children of God: by loving
God and carrying out his commands. 3This is love for God: to obey his commands. And his
commands are not burdensome, 4for everyone born of God overcomes the world. This is the
victory that has overcome the world, even our faith. 5Who is it that overcomes the world? Only
he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God.
6This is the one who came by water and blood—Jesus Christ. He did not come by water only, but
by water and blood. ….

ANS.

I thank you for quoting your scripture to me. You are entitled to your
faith and beliefs, and I do not want to comment on it.

As regards guarantee for Salvation, I do not think there is any one who
has any GUARANTEE for Salvation.

We only have HOPE in receiving Salvation and Mercy and Blessings of

Allah….. if we believe in Him, in His messengers including Last and
Final messenger….and do OUR LEVEL BEST to walk in the ways of life
as Given to us thru His Last messenger.

We only have HOPE and no GUARANTEE!!

I really ENVY humans like you who have RECEIVED THE GUARANTEE
FOR SALVATION!!

Enjoy in the Good Fortune that you have!!

Q16 Kathy Daw (Messianic, 321)

MUQ, you don't HAVE to "ENVY" you are more than welcome to have what I have. There is
plenty of peace & love here for all who want to receive.(just a thought) Thank you for responding
to my question graciously, I know you could have just ignored it, I do appreciated it.

ANS.
No I mean it, I ENVY any one who has a GUARANTEE from God that he
or she has attained salvation.

Only Prophets and messengers of Gods and some of their companion

have received that GUARANTEE in Books of God.

Rest of human kind are only on the ROAD TO SALVATION. They HOPE
and Beseech the Mercy and Salvation of God.

I appreciate your post.

Q17 Maverick, (Messianic, 323)

Curious, Why are you adding Christians to the everlasting covenant that pertains to Isaac and his
seed?

ANS.

I am adding Christians to the “everlasting Covenant” simple because

Jesus was of Jewish decent. He was a Jewish prophet and he preached
to only Jews. He was also a seed of Isaac (from his mother’s side at
least!!)

His Gospel was a continuation of older jewish prophets…..most of early

Christians (including 12 chosen Disciples of Jesus, were all Jews)

With all his defects, St. Paul was of Jewish origin and he used the logic
of OT books to justify his own false logic.

Then there have always been jewish followers of jesus…. I think the
topic of this thread is also related to it “Messianic Jews”.

PS:

1. By the way “everlasting covenant” made thru Isaac and his seed…..
does not mean that God cannot make ‘another everlasting covenant”
with some other people.

2. The Jews shall be covered by their “everlasting covenant” if they

abide by its rules and regulations.

3. That is what is the call of Quran to all Jews and Christians, let us
come on a “Common Platform” (3:64) and the terms of common
platform are nothing but Basic Fundamental Teachings of Torah!!

4. It says that Jews and Christians have no ground to stand, unless they
practice what is written in Torah and Gospel. It asks them to practice
their own books…… to fulfill their part of “everlasting covenant”!!

5. Can you find any better way to deal with people of other faiths?
(rather than calling them imposters and demonize them). Quran’s is
the best way to carry out any dialogue with people of other faiths. It is
totally without any bias and prejudice. How it could be considering
that it is Revelation from God Most High…..Creator of All Humans….
Jews, Christians , Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists etc.
Q18 Aikman (Who is, 1072)

what knowledge do you think i am lacking? the muslim injeel or isa. do you want to tell us
everything there is to know about the two. i leave it to you to share with us what you muslims
have about the two. impress us or we will have to assume, no, assert that the INJEEL is the Bible
in another language and Jesus is ISA and there is no Islamic INJEEl or ISA to speak of except the
fantasy Muhammad dream up for the Quran.

ANS.

Your post again shows that you have no knowledge about either your
own religion or about Islam.

I will give you a few hints, so you can start.

ISA or Eisa is Arabic Translation for English word Jesus which in Hebrew
is pronounced as Yeshua….there was no J in Hebrew or ancient
Greek….the letter J was added later by Romans.

INJEEL is the revelation of God to prophet Jesus or EISA. It is not NT, it

is not four Gospels combined together and it is certainly not Holy Bible,
which is a collection of 66 books.

Quran is the Final Revelation of God given to His Last and Final
Messenger Mohammad. PBUH.

A Muslim is one who submits himself to his Creator….all prophets of

God were true Muslims.

Q19, Aussie Boy (Who is, 1098)

And the teachings Jesus of according to the gospel of Barnabas proves that you have the wrong
Mohammed and your Quran is corrupted.

ANS.

I am glad that you can say these things now that your out of KSA...finally you can seek the truth
No Gospel of Barnabas shows us the real teachings of Jesus. These are
not teachings of St. Paul but from the Jesus' own lips.

This Gospel has also suffered in preservation and transmission (as

have the other books of OT & NT), but it still retains some matter of
truth.

That is why We are not dogmatic about this gospel. We view it with
caution and reserve.
As regards you second remark, I am currently on vacations in my
native country India, and I will be back in KSA in the first week of Jan
Inshallah i.e. God willing.!!

My stand inside or outside KSA has been same, to speak truth and be
with truth.

Q20 Bryant (Who is, 1031)

I thought I answered you.

Analysis of the Gospel of Barnabas

1. In the Gospel of Barnabas (Chapter 1) "Barnabas" is called an Apostle. This is not correct in its
implication. Although Barnabas is referred to as an Apostle (Acts 14:4,14), the Gospel of
Barnabas concept is quite different. It says in the introduction that Barnabas was one of the
twelve original disciples of Jesus and he was not.

The conversion of Barnabas took place after the Day of Pentecost and consequently he does not
qualify for apostleship as outlined in Acts 1:21-22. The Day of Pentecost happened after Jesus'
resurrection so Barnabas was not one of the twelve.

2. The surprised reader of the Gospel of Barnabas finds Nazareth on the shore of Lake Galilee
(Chapter 20), whereas it is a town miles away from the Lake, surrounded by mountains.

3. In the next chapter, we see Jesus going UP to Capernaum, whereas Capernaum is situated right
on the shore of the Lake.

4. In Chapter 151 we are told that Jesus embarked on a ship (from Nazareth?) and next we read
that he arrived in Jerusalem. We might well ask whether this was also done by boat? ….

32. Muslims who accept the Gospel of Barnabas ought to consider the fact that in Chapter 115 it
very strongly endorses monogamy.

33. Likewise we refer to Chapter 38, in which the Islamic principle of abrogation is rejected.

Muslim scholars have urged Muslims to stay away from this book because it contradicts the
Quran too.

ANS.
I appreciate your long post, by which you have tried to PROOVE that
Gospel of Barnabas is a 15th Century forgery. These are your
allegations and not proofs.

Then I asked you to apply the same STANDRADS for all other books of
OT and NT and then find if by using the same standards, they can also
PROVEN to be forgeries!!

If GOB contains some historical mistakes, some wrong statements and

some errors, then which book of OT or NT is free from such mistakes?

If we apply the same standards as you apply to GOB then none of the
OT and NT books can claim to be authentic word of God.

Before I go further , let me clarify Islamic position (once again)

regarding this Gospel.

A. Islamic Position regarding GOB and all previous scriptures:

a. As per Quran God did sent His message, revelation and guidance to
all nations thru, prophets and books. All prophets preached the same
message and all books contain the same fundamental article of faith.

b. The difference was only in rituals and local culture and way of life ,
but these are minor variations.

c. After death of prophets, the followers changes, lost, corrupted and

removed parts from the original message and added many of their own
teachings and words into these books.

d. Quran as final and preserved Last revelation from God, confirms as

well as protects all past scriptures. It confirms the original message
and fundamental teachings common to all prophets and rejects the
human corruptions, interpolations or human theories added into these
scriptures.

e. So we do not look at GOB as Final Word of God, or take any article of

faith from it. We see it as any other past scriptures and confirm only
what is confirmed by God.

f. When we look at it closely, we find that this Gospel presents for most
part True teachings of Jesus which mostly match with Quranic concept
of Jesus' teachings.
g. There are indeed a few mistakes, some errors and many things
which are rejected by Quran. That shows that this Gospel has also
suffered during transmission.

h. But if we took that as the basis of calling it a forgery, then every OT

and NT book should be called a forgery.

J. Muslims scholars who have cautioned against GOB is for common

folk, who takes this as Authentic or original INJEEL and base his faith or
arguments on it. I am only using it to show Christians of our day , that
a better an more reasonable version of Life of Jesus is available in their
hands, why do they not look at it.

You have given your PRROFS in four parts, if I answer to each point, it
may extend to Eight or more parts. So it is very time consuming to go
point by point.

I would base my reply on Four Main Criterion:

A. Who was Barnabas and What was his position in Original Church:

1. I think every one who has read the Book of Acts know the
importance of Barnabas in the early. That he was chosen so early to
replace Judas Iscariot as an Apostle, shows that he was very much
associated with Jesus and his teachings.

2. Barnabas’ own statement that Jesus chose him as one of the 12 is

credible seeing that the list of 12 Disciples is not same in all the four
Gospels. 11 Names are common, but in 12 th name there is difference.
It seems that one name was blotted out and then each writer put one
name whichever came to their mind.

3. Barnabas’ influence on Apostles is evident because it was only on

his evidence that Paul was accepted in the Early Church.

4. Till Chapter 15 of book of Acts, Paul and Barnabas are always

together, but suddenly after chapter 15. they separate from ach other
and then are never to be seen together.

5. The issue on which these two “close friends” separate for ever is so
trivial , that it is very strange that it could be true.

B. Should Barnabas have written a Gospel?

1. Chapter 15, mentions the proceedings of Jerusalem Council , where

Paul got some concession from Chosen Disciple and immediately after
that we see that Barnabas , Peter and other disciples of Jesus also
disappear from Book of acts!!

2. It is not illogical to believe that the differences between Paul and

other Disciples continued even after that Council. And that is why Paul
and Barnabas and other disciples were blacked out from Acts by Luke
who was on Paul’s side.

3. So it is very logical that Barnabas would have put down in his own
handwriting his version of the teachings of Bible.

4. Seeing the status of Barnabas and his closeness to Jesus’ and

Disciples, his views have more weight over that of Mark, and Luke who
were not that close to either Jesus or Disciples.

C. How the Present Gospel reached us?

1. There is mention of Barnabas Gospel by earlier church fathers, so it

is not a thing that just materialized in 15th century all of a sudden.

2. Barnabas must have written it in the language of Jews (Hebrew or

Aramaic) and then it would have been translated as other Gospel like
that of Matthew was translated.

3. What copy we have, must have suffered during copying and

translations, but the same is the case with all other Gospels and other
books of OT and NT. For none of the OT and NT books we have original
signed manuscripts. But when you can accept these books as
Authentic, why you put different standard for this Gospel only.

4. The Gospel was hidden by Church and was not in wide circulation,
one copy was found in the library of Pope Sextus, from where it was
smuggled and people came to know about it. GOB is not unique in this
regard. If you read the Book of Kings, you find that in the same way
Torah was also “accidentally” discovered while cleaning Temple. Yet
every one believes in the authenticity of Torah.

5. What you say about “Dead Sea Scrolls” which were discovered in
20th Century? Are they also 20th Century forgery?

D. Where GOB contradicts other Gospels:

1. You have given many instances where GOD contradicts existing

gospels. But as mentioned that all existing Gospels have been
“wetted” by Paul’s supporters, there is no harm if such be the case.
2. There are many things in which these Gospels contradict each other,
we try to justify these contradictions, why we treat GOB separately?

E. Where GOB contradicts OT Books.

1. This is also nor unique for GOB, there are instances where other
gospels also misquote or contradict other OT books.

F. Where GOB provides NEW Information (not found in OT or NT

books).:

1. This does not harm this book, because Paul and his supporters
removed “unwanted” portions from these books. In GOB they are
present.

G. Where GOB "Borrows" from Quran:

1. There are instances where GOB seems to be “borrowing” from

Quran. This is also an allegation, because Quran confirms past
revelation and there is no harm if there is some thing common
between them.

2. However mention of the Name Mohammad as such seems to the

works of Translators and copiers. Quran says that Jesus prophesized
about Ahmad and not Mohammad. But in GOB the word Ahmad never
appears, but Mohammad appears many times.

3. So while copying, some one translated the name Ahmed with

Mohammad, as the two words almost mean the same thing.
Translating names of Individual is favorite pastime of Bible Translators
and copiers!!

H. Where GOB Contradicts Quran:

1. There are instances where GOB contradicts Quran. These could be

the mistakes of original writer and translators and editors.

2. GOB is not unique in this, many OT and NT books contradict Quran,

but you say nothing about them. Then why single out GOB?

I Where GOB commit Historical Blunders:

1. There are many factual or historical mistakes in Gob, I admit. But if

you make this as accepting Criterion of any book, then I am sure that
none of OT book is free from such errors and blunders.
2. So if we find some mistakes in GOB, we try to attribute it to writer or
translators.

3. But this does not diminish the authority of book, so that you can call
it an “outright forgery”

J. Summary:

1. GOB is Barnabas’ own account of what he heard and saw while with
jesus. This is not verbatim Word of God or Words of Jesus.

2. The book is so different from other Gospels, because it presents the

view point of the Party which was opposing Paul in the initial stages of
Nascent Church.

3. The Book has been translated many times, might have been edited
or corrupted )may be more than other Gospels), but it cannot be out
rightly rejected as forgery.

4. The evidence that it is 15th century forgery are not conclusive and if
we apply the same criterion to any book of OT and NT, none can be
taken as authentic.

5. The book presents teaching of Jesus in a more coherent and more

systematically than any of the four existing Gospels.

6. It should therefore be studied carefully and then we should decide,

summarily rejection is not correct.

That is what I had to say in summary of your four long posts. If you
want, I can answer each and every point that you have mentioned, but
then it will become a very long discussion.

You should mention one point and I will answer that, then we will move
to the next point and so on.

Q21 Dr. SRV (Who is, 1107)

A message for BMZ

I'll ignore most of what you say as just silly and abusive and not representative of Muslims
generally who are fair, reasonable people. But I can't let you get away with your comments about
the gospel of Barnabas. Even Muslim scholars acknowledge it is a total forgery dating from the
15th century. BMZ needs to ask himself, if the gospel of Barnabas was written by the apostle of
that name in the early Church why is there not one Muslim scholar from the death of Muhammad
in 632 CE to the 15th century disproving Christianity by referring to it? The simple answer is, it
didn't exist. If your faith is worthy of respect BMZ then please don’t use lies and forgeries to
support it.

ANS.

You have heard the reply of BMZ on this issue, as an interested party
let me also put down my views for your information.

Your post is based on errors upon errors, let me clarify some of them.

A. No Muslim Scholar discredit Christianity using GOB before 15 th

Century:

1. You do not know the writing style of Old Islamic Writers. I do not
know of any one who has devoted his books to compare different
Biblical books and their contradictions and errors.

2. In those days, Bible was not such easily available and very few
Muslim Scholars knew the Greek or Latin language. They based their
arguments based on whatever Arabic books they could lay their hand
on.

3. The appearance of various Biblical books in hands of public started

after start of Protestant movement in 16th century. And when people
read books of Bible, they came to know about real contradiction and
errors in these books. It were Christian scholars themselves who
realized this and pointed it out in their commentaries.

4. As for as my knowledge goes, the first book written by any Muslim

scholar which dealt with contradiction and errors in Bible was IZHARUL
HAQ written by R A KAIRANWI of India. It was written in Middle of 19 th
Century

B. Muslims never knew about GOB unless it was discovered by

Christian themselves:

1. No Muslim Scholar referred to GOB before 15th Century because the

book was hidden buried in the Vatican Library. Its discovery and
publishing is a very interesting story and can be seen in any
introduction to this Gospel.

2. GOB was included in the list of Apocrypha books in 5th Century itself.
The Pope issued an edict banning this book to be read in public (and it
is very clear, why)
C. There are internal evidence that this book could not have been
written in 15th Century:

1. The “Local color” is so evident in this book that it is hardly unlikely

to be a forgery.

2. It is logical that Barnabas , who was such an important person in

Earliest Church, could not have written his memoirs specially after he
was “Blacked out” by Paul and his disciples.

So before calling it a 15th Century forgery and presenting Muslim

Scholars as witness in your support, you first make sure of your
charges.

Q22, God’s Seer (Who is, 1070)

Ps 118:22 The stone which the builders rejected Has become the chief cornerstone.
Mt 21:42 Jesus said to them, "Have you never read in the Scriptures:' The stone which the
builders rejected Has become the chief cornerstone. This was the LORD'S doing, And it is
marvelous in our eyes'? Ro 11:9 And David says: "Let their table become a snare and a trap, A
stumbling block and a recompense to them. Let their eyes be darkened, so that they do not see,
and bow down their back always."
I say then, have they [Jews] stumbled that they should fall? Certainly not! But through their fall,
to provoke them to jealousy, salvation has come to the Gentiles.
Now if their fall is riches for the world, and their failure riches for the Gentiles, how much more
their fullness!

ANS.

I would like to comment on the following portion of your post:

“Ps 118:22 The stone which the builders rejected Has become the chief
cornerstone. “

And

Mt 21:42 Jesus said to them, "Have you never read in the Scriptures:'
The stone which the builders rejected Has become the chief
cornerstone. This was the LORD'S doing, And it is marvelous in our
eyes'?

Who is the stone which builders rejected and which became the Chief
Corner Stone? And became marvelous?

Christians generally interpret that it refers to Gentiles (Non Jews) who

got the message of Jesus (thru Paul) and entered Christianity in mass…
This is not a good explanation, because it does not explain fully the
phrase “whom the builders rejected…”

You should read Gospel of Barnabas where Jesus explains the meaning
of this sentence.

Whom the Builders rejected refers to Ishmael and his progeny… when
Abraham sent Hagar and Ishmael to Arabia, Isaac and his progeny
were always jealous of Ishmael. His family settled in Arabia and were
far removed from Isaac and his progeny.

God sent prophets only to Isaac Branch of Abraham….as if Ishmael and

his progeny were like a stone cast away and not suitable for any
building.

But it was mercy of God….that when time came….the rejected Stone

became the Chief Corner Stone…..the Last and Final Prophet came
from Ishmael branch and overshadowed all the combined glory of all
Jewish Prophets (including Jesus), May peace and Mercy of God be to
all His Prophets and Messengers.

If any one wants to wonder….Jesus said that it was done by God…..and

it looks marvelous to us!!

I do not want to comment on other parts of your post. Because I do

not want to comment on any of the Paul’s self created theories and
fantasies.

Q23 Gods Seer (Who is, 1043)

Muslims have an innate ability to think shallow. The Levirate Father was a Jewish Tradition
In the Jewish world of that time, there was concern about a man’s legal inheritance. It seems that
often a man would marry a woman, but die before he had fathered any children. The custom was
for the deceased man’s brother to marry the widow. The first child born from that marriage would
be considered the legal heir and descendant of the deceased man, even though he was the
biological son of the man’s brother….

ANS.

Thanks for providing us the “insight” about Jewish custom of Brother

marrying childless widow of his brother to keep the family line running.
But what “deep” meaning it has on genealogy of Jesus, I cannot
understand.
We may think shallow, but we think straight and clear answers.

If you assume Gospels to be word of God and inspired writings, then

they should not contain any lies or contradictions. If these are the
writer’s own personal perceptions, then they cannot be called words of
God. You cannot have it both ways.

If you believe that Jesus was born without human father…then why
bother about his genealogy? Only the genealogy of Mary is what is
really needed to identify Jesus. And the name of Mary is missing from
both Matthew’s and Luke’s Lists!!

And then you accuse of Muslims to think shallow!!

There are atleast ten errors in the list of Matthew alone!!... The list of
Luke is nothing but pure imagination. Who is the world have preserved
the genealogy of such a man as Joseph the Carpenter all the way up to
David!!

As per Matthew total generations from David to Joseph the carpenter

are 24…As per Luke they are 42…This could be another of those
Miracles!!! And you say we Muslims think very shallow!!!

Q24 Hugh Be (Who is, 1016)

“Really! Then why did he have numerous confrontations with Pharisees regarding their teachings
and hypocrisy?”
Jesus was not a Pharisee and I know that. “Also, people of Jesus' day were in a better position to
make a determination as to whether He taught like a Pharisee, however, they didn't not call him a
Pharisee.”
Correct

ANS.

If the word "Pharisee" means the one who is learned of Law, then Jesus
indeed was a True Pharisee.

However if "Pharisee" denotes a particular cult of Jews who were

hypocrites and only cared about rituals and letters of the law and forgo
its spirit, then Jesus was as removed from Pharisees as East is from
West.

So it not only a question of words, but its inherent meanings.

Q25. Jesus is (Who is, 1042)

AND IF THE GOSPELS WERE FORGED BY CHRISTIANS WHY DO YOU THINK THEY
LEFT THEM DIFFERENT?

I know the answer: Because both Joseph and Mary were descendants of King David!!!!!
Matthew, who wrote his gospel for Jewish readers, records the genealogy of Joseph because Jews
don't consider the bloodline of females. Matthew therefore recorded the legal line of Jesus to the
throne. Luke, who wrote his gospel for the gentiles, gives the genealogy of Mary, proving that
Jesus was a blood descendant of King David.

God allowed both genealogies to go in to show that a cursed King was on Joseph's line, therefore
God had to do the virgin birth trick to both honor His curse and Keep His promise to King David
at the same time.

ANS.

AND LOOK HOW ST. LUKE WORDED IT:’ being AS WAS SUPPOSED son of Joseph; of
Eli,' Luke traces the genealogy of Jesus from Heli, the father of Mary and father-inlaw of Joseph,
the wife of Joseph. This line of descent establishes Jesus' NATURAL right to the Messiah ship as
a son of David.

I JUST TOLD YOU THE ANSWER and if you are not satisfied with that you are going to have
to work out why no one ever changed it!!!!!!!
To: Jesus is

This is your own “imagination” that both Mary and Joseph the
Carpenter were the descendants of King David. There is not an iota of
proof from the scriptures about this “theory”.

Your scholars have “invented” this to save the mistakes in both these
Gospels.

If Jews do not accept the Genealogies of females….then Jews also do

not accept that any man will be born without a Human Father!!

Then why do you not fulfill the Wishes of Jews and invent a Human
Father of Jesus also.

You calling David a “cursed king”…shows the meanness and bad

manners.
God calls him “You are my Son, today I have begotten you” and you
call him a “cursed King” ?

His Psalms are considered Word of God and are sung in Church every
day…and you prove many of your theories by quoting from these
Psalms and you call him a “cursed King”.

Jews lay their claim on Palestine based on David’s exploits and you call
him a “cursed king”….Star of David is on nations flag of Israel and you
call him a “cursed King”?

God preserved both these genealogies to be an “eye opener” and

show the “extreme stupidity” how men would go to any length to
defend their own concocted beliefs and theories.!!

Q26 Kozak (Who is, 1084)

you were a Christian you didn't understand Christianity. Allah and Mohammed are not the true
faith, God the Father and Jesus is the foundation of all. Your tale, is I think, Muslim propaganda.
Catholic Christians do not say that the pope is sinless, that is misinformation. Perhaps misguided
Christians in the past would have acted in the manner you described, but certainly not now…..

ANS.

You can have your own interpretation …. Antony and thousands like
him think otherwise…..

I do not force anyone to follow the reasoning of these people who

converted to Islam, but they indeed open a new path for us to think
about Islam

Q27 Local Yodel (Who is, 1083)

Wake up and smell the coffee. None of Jesus' teachings are anywhere in the Bible except second
hand from the four gospels. Paul never met Jesus, since He was gone by then. And Jesus' Mother
carried on her Son's work after he was gone. She also had a great following until Paul sabotaged
her. Think about it. Paul came out of nowhere and claimed he'd been blinded by a bright light, i.e.
Jesus. Now if someone came up to you and claimed all this would you think he was a nut? This is
why I have such a problem with the preaching of a man who previously was hell bent on killing
everyone associated with Jesus. Peace

ANS.

You have written a very common sense and balanced post about Paul.

The points you have raised are so logical that I doubt that any
Christians will post a logical answers about them.
I do not say, that once you hate some religion.... you can never
become its follower.... people do have change of heart and people
have been converting to religions that they hated at one time in their
life.

But their attitude is different... if some one becomes a follower of a

new religion whom he did not know earlier... his or her first attempt is
to gain first hand and authentic knowledge of that religion.

He does not become "expert and authority" on new religion the very
day he accepts that religion.

The case of Paul is Unique in religious conversions.

He did not meet Jesus in his life time....if he got convinced of the truth
of Jesus' message after seeing a vision on road side.... the most
natural approach for him was to go to the Chosen Apostles of Jesus and
learn about the teachings of Jesus.

But Paul did nothing of the kind...from day one of his conversion he
claimed equality and even superiority over the chosen disciples of
Jesus.

He introduced his own ideas and philosophies and superimposed them

over simple and straight forward teachings of Jesus.... Greeks and
Romans who had no earlier knowledge about Prophet hood, revelation,
and religious terminology became his followers and gained the upper
hand in Christianity be their sheer numbers.

That is why many religious scholars say that of all revealed religions, it
is Christianity which has the weakest and shallowest foundations.
Christians derive most of their logic and proofs from the words of a
Man, who was neither a prophet nor a direct pupil of a prophet.

The case of Constantine the Great is some what similar to Paul . Being
a Pagan, he became the arbitrator to solve the theological dispute
between major Christian factions!!

Q28. Mary (Who is, 1029)

MUQ, lol well, there are many people who wrote fictions about what they believe not the truth.
good for him he open his heart.. that will help him for his after life, for his salvation. that is nice.
but it got nothing to do with me. May be he inspires you but not me.

I don't think I need or want any difference in gospels. if something is difference then there is
something fishy about it. but again that is my thinking.

I have a lot of other gospels not recorded in the Bible, not barnabas....I don't believe anybody
saying they are eyewitness. But I believe that with Almighty everything is impossible. I believe
Almighty won't deceive people....with wrong gospels taken out....we only find few who come up
trying to say they are eyewitness. but anyway ....good for you if you believe barbabas writing.

ANS.

I think your study of religion and scriptures is very imperfect. If there

was not any chance of false prophets and false scriptures being able to
mislead the people, then why would Jesus, Paul and many others would
advise people to beware of them?

Jesus says “That many false prophets shall rise…they will show signs
and wonders to mislead even the very elect…”

Paul says “beloved not believe in every spirit, for many false prophets
have gone into the world…”

God has given you brain and reasoning power, you should use them
and decide if the particular teachings seems to be true to you. Non
just because since Church says that and is saying it since centuries, it
must be right.

Gospel of Barnabas shows us the true face and true teachings of Jesus.

I have nothing personal against Matthew, Mark, Luke or John…. I only

say that these books that we have today were not written by the real
people of these names. These are also anonymous books which some
one put wrong label on.

If we accept your reasoning that God is one…so there should have

been only Gospel…why should we have four Gospels? And what you
will say about those events where all four Gospels give different or
contradictory statements?

For example genealogy of Jesus as given in Matthew is totally different

from the one given in Luke? Which one of these are Words of God?

Q29 Mary (Who is, 1033)

MUQ,

If any prophet came and say the previous teaching is wrong, and follow me...then that is the false
one. But if you have brain in your skull you would know which is true and which is just bla bla.
Jesus want people to beware of people who preach wrong.....changing the word in order to suit
them. Like what is people do in Church and so on. Those are misleading people to astray. These
people are putting people in great danger.

Yes, Almighty is ONE. We have four gospel ? we have more than 4 gospel actually but the
WORD IS all same.....If anything is contradictory to the other, then it is WRONG. There are
many many gospels...which is not put out...for reason am quiet not sure... but will found out about
it in due time….

ANS.

So you agree that there is a possibility for false prophets to come and
false doctrines to be preached and false books to be written.

That is why prophets told you to be on guard against these teachings

and check first before believing in it.

The Genealogy of Jesus as recorded in Matthew is totally different from

the one recorded in Luke from David Downwards. Only two names are
common, David and Joseph the Carpenter (who had nothing to do at all
with Jesus’ Genealogy).

How could both be true and how could both be revealed by the same
God?

One of them is not speaking the truth….tell me which one?

How can you say, all the 4 Gospels are the same? John is so different
from other three, that it is impossible to believe that same Jesus talked
in two totally different styles.

In fact John puts his own words and thoughts in the mouth of Jesus
rather that recording Jesus’ words. This could be a sort of fiction, if you
know what a fiction really is.

Q30 Mary (Who is, 1042)

MUQ,

First of all ,nobody have the original teaching like we do, trust me.....even long before you or
Muslims created or existed in earth, we are there.... we have all of it...if it is right or wrong. we
know it. I told you to point out there in the Bible, it is written, which contradicts the Genealogy of
Jesus? can you point out? If the genealogy of Jesus is important for you then it would have been
written...All 4 gospels are the same....yet you don't see it. Now point out where you say they are
different...I will say it again.. point out where the 4 gospels have different meanings or sayings? if
not , then do not speak what you are not sure of.

ANS.
If you are asking such types of questions, then it proves that you have
not studied your own scriptures in any details at all.

I will say that you have never even read all four gospels from end to
end. You only know bits and pieces from here and there or those
parts that are often read from the pulpit.

If you cannot see the difference in the genealogies as recorded in

Matthew and as recorded in Luke, then you are really simpleton.

If you cannot see that style of writing of John is different from the other
three Gospels…. Then you are just a Bible Thumper.

Just because some book or some religion is older than the other will
not make it right.

Pharisees opposing jesus were before Jesus, but their argument and
their practices were declared wrong by Jesus.

Jews and their Talmud is older than Jesus, but you think them to be on
the wrong path.

If you want that I should discuss one by one all the mistakes, all the
errors and all the contradictions present in these Four Gospels….there
will not be enough space on this thread.

My advice to you is go and first read all these four Gospels from end to
end. Read footnotes if you find them and then reflect and think.

Peace be on to you also.

Q31. Maryam (Who is, 1094)

who is barnabas? and when/where/which place is he born? and when/where did he write his
gospel and why I haven't heard of him before?
Peace

ANS.

Let me introduce you to the opening remarks before I started posting

excerpts from the Gospel of Barnabas, It will answer most of your
queries
“ We have seen the real value and real status of most books of OT and
NT. It is very clear that most of the books included in the Bible are not
written by the authors whose name appear on the Title. These names
are only symbolic and cannot be traced to the original people of that
name.

We have also seen that very few of these books can only be claimed as
written thru Revelation or inspiration. They have suffered during
transmission and copying to a lesser or larger extent.

Now coming to the Gospels, it is clear that none of the Gospel writer
was a disciple of Jesus, nor has written from an eyewitness account. It
is clear that Jesus did not write anything during his short ministry, nor
asked any of his disciple to write any thing during his life time.

After Jesus left the earth, many people wrote their memoirs whom the
called as Gospel. There are records of more than seventy such
Gospels, out of which Church selected four (Matthew, Mark, Luke and
John) as canonical and rejected others as Apocrypha. What was the
criterion used by Church for this selection has not been listed.

In our times, one such Gospel has come into light, which is known as
Gospel of Barnabas. This Gospel is very different from the Canonical
Gospels and hits at the very root of Modern Day Pauline Christianity. I
will put excerpts from this Bible for interest of our readers.

Before I start my posting, I would like to say a few words about its
author and about this Gospel.

A. Who was Barnabas: To any reader of Book of Acts, the word

Barnabas is no stranger. In the first 15 Chapter of the books of Acts,
there will hardly be a chapter where his name does not appear. As per
book of Acts, his name was Joseph and he was a Levite, he sold all his
worldly belongings and put the money at the feet of Disciples. They
named him Barnabas, which means Son of Well Wishing.

B. Status of Barnabas: He was very prominent figure in early Church.

In fact he was the one who introduced St. Paul to the Disciples. It was
due to influence of Barnabas that Paul could get the confidence of
Disciples. He and Paul were companions till Chapter 15 of Book of
Acts, after which Barnabas separates from Paul and his further life is
blocked out form Acts and from NT. Nor only Barnabas, Peter and all
other Disciples all disappear from Acts after Chapter 15 (more details
on Ch. 15 later on- MUQ)
C. Was Barnabas one of the Chosen 12 Disciples: Barnabas Claims
that he was Chosen by Jesus himself amongst the 12 Disciples, though
his name does not appear in the Four Gospels. When we look at the
list of 12 Disciples in the four Gospels, we find a strange thing. The list
of 12 Chosen disciples is not the same in all four Gospels!! There is
one unique name in each of the Gospels. It seems the name of
Barnabas was removed and then each writer wrote one name by his
own logic, that is why there is discrepancy.

D. Why Barnabas and Paul Separated?: Is it not strange that Paul and
Barnabas who are always together till chapter 15 of Acts develop such
a difference that they separate from each other for ever. Then the
reason given in the book of Acts is so trivial, that it does not seem
feasible that two close friends would separate from each other for ever
over such an issue.

The real reason is not what is stated in the book of Acts, it was the
differences in their perception of Christianity which caused this
separation. The real reason was of Jewish and Gentile Christians.

E. Counsel of Jerusalem: Jesus preached mainly to Jews and all his

chosen disciples were Jews. After jesus left, his disciples continued his
mission amongst Jews. But a new convert to Christianity Saul (later
called Paul) took his mission to Non Jews against the wishes of Jesus
and his apostles. When large number of Non Jews started to enter the
new faith, it caused friction with the Jewish Christians.

These Jewish Christians insisted that New Converts have to obey all
laws of Moses also including circumcision. Paul opposed this view
tooth and nail, since his new teachings were totally against laws of
Moses.

To solve the problem a council was held in Jerusalem, in which Paul

and his party won a major concession from the Jewish group. It seems
after this “Victory” Paul intensified his attack on Torah and laws of
Moses, and that is what caused the tiff between Paul and Barnabas and
all the Chosen disciples of Jesus.

That is why we found that Peter, Barnabas and most of disciples

disappear from the Acts after Ch. 15.

It is not so unreasonable to believe that Barnabas would have written

his own Gospel to put his side of the story.
F. Accusation against Gospel of Barnabas: The Church is strictly
against this Gospel from the very beginning. This Gospel is mentioned
amongst the list of Books which were banned for all Christians. When
we go thru the Gospel, we can see, why Church is so much against this
Bible.

Another accusation against this Gospel is that it was written by a

Muslim!! If that would have been the case, it would be very popular
amongst the Muslims, but no Muslim knew or wrote about this Gospel,
before it was discovered. Besides it contains many teachings which
are against Islam and it is very unlikely that any Muslim could have
written such a book.

The Writer seems to have a very deep knowledge of OT books and

often carries out long discussions, based on OT books and quotations,
Such style cannot be copied by any Muslim.

G. How the Manuscript of this Gospel was discovered: That is in itself a

very interesting topic and those who are interested in it, should ask
separately. It was indeed a miracle of God, that despite so many
hands bend upon its destruction, it some how survived and is in our
hands.

H. Some peculiarities of this Gospel: There are a few characteristics of

this Gospel.

1. It lists all the miracles mentioned in all four of Gospels. Most

episodes spread in different gospels are found here in one book.

2. It provides answers to “difficult” passages mentioned in Gospels

without any answer. For Example Jesus asks Scribes and Pharisees
“How could Messiah be David’s son, since David calls him his Lord”?
There is no answer to this question in any of the four Gospels.

3. It provides the true picture of Jesus as a prophet and as a teacher. It

shows how Jesus taught his chosen disciples. It is totally different from
what we see in other Gospels.

4. It shows how much Jesus detested the title “Son of God” and God.
How severe was his reaction when Peter called him Son of God and
Christ.

5. It solves the riddle of crucifixion, the riddle of “Missing Judas

Iscariot”, the riddle of “Missing Corpse” and various Jesus’ sighting
after alleged crucifixion.
I. Some shortcomings of This Gospel: The most blatant shortcoming of
this Gospel is total omission of the office of John the Baptist. The writer
puts many words attributed to John the Baptist into the mouth of
Jesus.

J. How authentic is the Gospel of Barnabas: It is certain that what

Gospel we have is translation of the original gospel. Barnabas must
have written it in Hebrew, from which it was translated into old Italian,
Spanish and then English.

It could have suffered in translation and transmission as other books,

may be somewhat more, but that is not the reason to reject it totally.
Because none of OT and NT books can claim immunity from these.

I think Christianity is doing itself a great injustice by totally ignoring

this Gospel. If they considered this Gospel with care, it would have
solved many of their theological disputes and infighting between sects.

Q32 Maryam (Who is, 1095)

MUQ,
ok, I can't disagree with you before I read about barnabas. I didn't know barnabas was written in
Acts. I will read about his gospel and tell you if it is right or wrong. I have nothing against Paul
teaching. For me Paul is inspiration . I love him. I wonder why you and many other Muslims are
against Paul. I believe Almighty inspired Paul to be an example of millions of Christians
followers now a days. It must be something that Paul is inspired by Almighty to be a leader and a
writer of the New Testaments which billions of Christians all over the world follow....it didn't
happen out of the blue but through Almighty. Nothing is impossible. I am not good at being
against anything unless I can feel it. If something is wrong. I Know it, trust me. I am going to
read Gospel of barnabas and tell you what I feel about it. We might talk in details about this
subject.
peace

ANS.

I am very happy about your positive and logical attitude. You should
read book of acts to know who was Barnabas and what was his position
in that early church.

We have nothing personal against St. Paul. Our only complaint is that
since he did not meet Jesus during his life time and learnt nothing from
him, what is his source of knowledge and what is his authority.

He should have gone to chosen disciples of Jesus and learned from

them about Jesus and his teachings before going on preaching mission.
Instead of that, he started preaching from the day he got converted …
and what more…his ideas and teachings are different from those of
Jesus.

You read all his Epistles, you will see that he Quotes from all other
books and from every prophet…. The only thing Missing in his Epistles
are Quotation from Gospels and Quotation from Jesus!!! Can you
believe it?

That is our objection to St. Paul and we think that we should follow
Jesus and his words rather than Paul’ and his non corroborated
theories.

If some one things that Paul was a messenger and prophet of God… he
should come forward and say it. They confuse themselves and others
by passing off Paul’ teachings and ideas as Jesus’

You go thru GOB and check how it matches with the personality and
teaching of Jesus as proved by his own words preserved in the existing
Gospels of Matthew, Mark and Luke.

Q33 Scholastic (Who is, 1105)

Christians have a tradition of destroying any text of dissenting views from the trace of history:

364 - Emperor Jovian ordered the pagan library in Antioch to be burnt

391 - the famous library of Alexandria emptied of its books by Emperor Theodosius I

1109 - the Crusaders burnt the muslim library in Tripoli

1204 - the Crusaders burnt ancient Greek and Latin manuscripts in the library of Constantinople

1236 - Pope Gregory IX started burning the Talmud and other Hebrew writings, and it went on
throughout the next centuries

1415 - one Jewish writing titled "Mar Mar Yesu" was singled out for burning

1562 - even the ancient writings of the Mayans were not spared during the Spanish conquest, as
bishop Diego de Landa proudly said, "We found a large number of books which contained
nothing but superstition and lies of the devil, so we burnt them all"

when the Christians realised that it was impossible to burn all the books with the invention of the
printing press, Pope Paul IV introduced the "List of Forbidden Books" with the Talmud topping
the list

ANS.
Thank you for the info. You are right, Christians of past had a hate for
knowledge, that is why they vandalized every thing old and ancient.

It is only the pat two or three centuries that they have got a taste for
learning and preserving old writings…..but now it is too late….they
have not left any old manuscripts, except a bit here and a bit there.

How can you construct a sky scrapper with so little original material.
But they are trying their best to some how do it.

But is cannot stand any small shaking or pulling and pushing…it falls
on the ground.

Q34 Shehah (Who is, 1059)

MUQ: Its amazing how a Muslim will always try to hog (excuse the Western word)the limelight
to argue with untruths against the infidels. This is not an Arab forum so I don’t want to boar
(excuse the similar word again) other readers with a list of Quran variants - to other readers: there
are as many as 17 variants which MUQ will not own-up to.

MUQ, you quote the Bible as so many Muslims before you have done - all the same, all from the
same imam and pseudo-intellectual who is feeding all muslims with the same pack of lies. Bible-
believing people do not learn their Scripture as a tool to be used against people like you. They
read it to live by because it is readable, logical, beautiful, chronological, the true Word of the
Living God and available in most languages of the world so that all can read and meet this
personal God.

ANS.

You have written some very good things in your post….God is only
one….Muslims, Christians, Jews basically worship the same God.

…There are good things in all scriptures….why should be try to criticize

each other? Why cant we just try to accommodate each other and
discuss the points which are common amongst us.

This is a very sound advice and I fully support and appreciate it.

Q35 VOM (Who is, 1072)

QUOTE who="Voice of the Minority"]<quoted text>

So, in what year did my ancestor's convert to Judaism and what were they before the conversion?
[/QUOTE]

ANS.
Before Jesus came, those Jews who were following God' Laws and
Commandments were "Muslims" i.e. those who submitted themselves
to their Lord.

When Jesus preached his mission, those Jews who accepted Jesus
continued to be "Muslims" i.e. they continued to submit themselves to
their Lord and accept whatever came from their Lord...

But those people who rejected Jesus...continued to call themselves as

"Jews".... which is a racial term and not a religious term.

Q36 X Caliber (Who is, 1062)

So, please feel free to tell me exactly what Jesus modified and how they were perfected in the so-
called "code of Islam". Who wants to bet that this Muslim B.S. artist don't answer?

ANS.

There are many examples of Torah laws which were modified by Jesus
and which wee later perfected by Quran. I would give a few examples
of each kind:

A. Those which were modified by Jesus:

1. The law of Divorce: “It has been said old that when someone
divorce his wife, he should write to her a bill of divorce, But I said to
you that if some one divorces his wife…..”

2. Law of Equality: It has been said of old that an eye for an eye and a
tooth for a tooth….but I say to you, that if some one strikes you on
right check…..

3. Law on Sabbath: Sabbath was made for men and men were not
made for Sabbath……so Jesus modified the rigidity of Torah and
allowed many works to be done on that day.

4. Lessening the Extreme Ritualistic life of Jews: Jesus loosened many

of the Extreme Rituals which Jews had introduced into the laws of
Torah. He emphasized on Spirit of Laws and not mere wordings.

B. Those modified by Quran: Some examples are :

1. Universality: Torah Laws were for Jews only. Quran made them for
Universal for all nations.
2. Law of Equality: Quran kept the law, but introduced pardon into it.
The victim could pardon the offender, which was not in Torah.

3. Banning Alcohol: In Torah, Alcohol was not banned totally, Quran

banned that evil for ever. It did the same for Gambling and any other
chance games.

4. Banning Usury: Torah did not ban Usury strictly….Quran banned this
evil practice totally and strictly.

5. Direction of Prayer: Quran changed it from Jerusalem to Makkah.

Uniform Direction for all mankind….in honor to the House Constructed
by that Symbol of Monotheism, Abraham.

There are many such examples, but I mentioned only a few to start
discussion.

Your comments on Islam are totally uncalled for by the way.

Q37 BMZ (Who is 2, 490)

Have Gospels been modified?

ANS.

You are right, existing Gospels have been "vetted" by Church many
times and that Church was under the influence of Paul’s followers.

That is why we only see the reflections of Paul's letters in the existing
four Gospels.

But there are bits and pieces of Jesus' words which are left intact and
become a sort of riddle to those studying these Gospels.

One was what I quoted here regarding the Corner Stone.

Another is where Jesus asks Jews "You say that Messiah shall be son of
David...when David calls him his Lord (The Lord said to my Lord, sit at
my right hand sight, till I make your enemies as your footstool...Book
of Psalms)....How can Messiah be his son/"

There is no proper answer by Jews and Christians on this question of

Jesus....they speak in contradictory terms.
The proper answer is provided in GOB, where Jesus said that "The
Messiah shall come from the Progeny of Ishmael...so David can call him
as his Lord, because he is not his son!!

This GOB solves many such puzzles distributed here and there in the
four Gospels.

I am grateful for your appreciation.

Q38, BMZ Fake (Who is 2, 536)

no do not conflate the two jesus and muslim isa together. as far as islam is concerned the muslim
isa did not know he was going to be save. you agree with this point, don't you. his apostles would
have known about it and not fear anything. but the jesus of Christianity knows that his time will
come and told his apostles to not fear. it is a vast difference. so for Christianity they will take
their Christ to the masses, and for the muslims they will keep their muslim isa who knew nothing
of what to come to the muslims. easy enough for you.

ANS.

There is no separate Muslim ISA or Christian Jesus. They are same

person.

What is the difference is that ISA or Jesus the Christ is a real human
being and the messenger of God. He is an historical and real person.

On the other hand Resurrected Jesus is an imaginary character, which

was invented by St. Paul. Resurrected Jesus therefore does not exist
and all efforts to trace him have ended in futility.

So it is your choice, believe in a real Jesus and follow him and his
teachings or believe in an imaginary Resurrected Christ, and get lost in
the philosophical ramblings of uncorroborated logic of self claimed 13 th
Apostle of Jesus , St. Paul the Great!!!

Q39, Citizen (Who is 2, 567)

It is our soul and it is spiritual. it relates to our very being that makes us aware that we are alive.
Our body is not spiritual. It profits nothing in our internal life. Our essence of our life is to seek
the one true good which is GOD and unite with him internally. But because we are affected by
the disobedience of Adam and eve our will at times choose an apparent good which is not a good
at all. This is where our intellect comes in and shows us that apparent good was not a good
choice. All the external and internal forces that affect our body that keeps us alive are considered
as good. Our will and intellect can only be affected by gases and forces that would destroy our
body.

ANS.

The first part of your post where you explained about Body and Soul
was excellent.

Then you went haywire and started babbling about Adam’s and Eve’s
sins affecting our soul. This is a figment of yours (and St. Paul’s before
you) imagination.

Sin in not inherited, otherwise a burden is put on us, about which we

did not contribute and which we cannot do any thing.

So please stay on the logical path and say that we try to improve our
soul by walking in the ways which has been shown to us by our Creator
thru Prophets.

The more one walks in the way of Lord, the more is his soul purified
and nearer he gets to his Creator.

This is the simple and logical path which scriptures show us.

Q40 Citizen (Who is 2, 568)

You muslims are all a like you don't understand what you read. WE inherited the faulty faculties
of intellect and will from Adam and Eve.
Our image of GOD is our intellect and will. Not our physical body. Adam and eve made what is
called an apparent good. eating the apple she thought was to enhance her life but it had an adverse
affect on her life. When she and Adam conceived we inherited her faulty intellect and will. WE
are descendence of Adam and Eve….

ANS.

As usual you are very confused in your arguments and do not

understand what are you talking about.

1. Child Inheritance from Parents:

a. A child inherits many things from his parents, like looks, some
diseases, color of skin, eyes, and intellectual traits etc.

b. But since a child has no control over these things, he will not be
questioned and punished for having these traits.

c. For example God will not question or punish for some one being
black, or white, or what language he speaks, or why was he born blind,
dumb , deaf or with diabetes or other diseases.

d. A man will be questioned only about what actions he did with his
own free will.

2. Adam and Eve’s Mistake:

e. The Adam’s and Eve’s mistakes for disobeying the command of God
in no way affects their children. If there was any fault at all, it was with
them and not with their off spring. Then as per Quran both Adam and
Eve repented before God for their mistakes and God forgave them.
f. There was nothing big to be made for theirs mistakes as St. Paul and
his followers have blown it out of all proportions and built their high
rise buildings on that weak foundation.

3. What is Sin?

a. Sin is disobeying the Commands and Laws of God knowingly. That is

the sin which is questionable and punishable in the eyes of God.

b. The remedy for that sin, is for the sinner to repent and ask
forgiveness from God personally. There is no intercessor between God
and humans for this action.

c. This is the teaching of all prophets including Jesus.

4. Our prophet’s “Sins”?

a. All prophets are blameless before God. They are specially chosen
people from God and are role model for their followers.

b. Therefore all prophets are sinless before God and there is no

difference between Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Mohammad regarding
this.

c. The so called “sins” of prophets are not sins in literal sense. They
only refer to choice of course which is slightly inferior to their high
positions. Even in such cases, God corrects the error of judgment
made by the prophet, so that there is no room for any doubt.

d. So all your babbling about “sins” of any prophet has no ground in

reality.

Q41. Citizen (Who is 2, 569)

No I am not confused. I didn't say we inherited sin from Adam and eve, you said that. You are
trying to explain sin to me from Islam point of view.
I know all about sin and repent. Your point that GOD corrects the miss-stakes of prophets is not
biblical. You are making an excuse for the prophets sins and blaming GOD for making the wrong
choice for prophet. You didn't think-If the prophet makes a mistake and kills the wrong person in
GODS name, ….

ANS.

1. Concept of Sin:
Now are you trying to confuse me? The whole Christianity is based on
the concept that all Humans inherited Sins of Adam and Eve and all
humans are sinners.
To cleanse humanity of this sin, God send His Own Son to come and
die and take away the sin of whole humanity.
Now whosoever believes that Jesus died for his sin will be saved and all
others will go to hell for eternal punishment.
Tell me if these are not the teachings of St. Paul and whole Christian
Churches, RC , Protestants and what nots!
I marvel at your cheek to come and talk to me about Sin, what it is and
what it is not?
2. Mistakes of Prophets:
I am not unaware that crimes of highest orders by each and every
prophet are recorded in books of Bible.
In fact this is the mistake of Biblical writers and Quran rejects many of
these crimes. In Quran none of these acts are mentioned and as per
Quran all prophets of God were sinless and above blame.
Quranic concept of prophet hood is much refined and much superior to
the one we find recorded in Bible.
That is why Bible is to checked with Quran as standard. Because we
do not really know who wrote these books and Quran is nothing but
Revelation from God Al Mighty , Creator of this Universe!!

Q42 Citizen (Who is 2, 570)

Thank you for your kind words. In my life the wisdom of God’s words and His commandments is
what I strive in life to live by. To me sin separates me from God and so I try to avoid it. But not
being perfect If I sin I must come to the realization that I did sin and repent to God asking his
forgiveness. I have come to understand the wisdom of GODS commandments. I see in them his
love for me. I have come to understand that GOD did all the research and knows all the negative
consequences that happen in life if we break his laws…..

ANS.

I also thank you for your beautiful and honest post. You have spoken
truth that our sins become a barrier between ourselves and God.

We should try our best to avoid committing sins and when we do

commit it, we should repent and ask for God ‘s forgiveness.

We should have trust in His Mercy and in His Grace that He loves to
pardon the people who repent.
That is the sum total of all the prophetic teachings. They are same in
Moses’ time, In Jesus’ time and in times of our prophet.

You see nowhere in this argument, any notion of inherited sin, any
vicarious atonement and any one dying for sins of others.

If you are on the path as you mentioned, you are not far away from the
Mercy of God.

May peace be also with you.

Q43 Citizen (Who is 2, 577)

Deedat and Swaggert missed the mark. In Revelation chapter 23;12to 15 the message applies to
both muslims and Christians. GODS kingdom is is like a city and the entrance to his Kingdom
has a gate. And only those who wash off doing evil from their robes{SELF} will enter in to his
kingdom. Muslims believe Jesus was a prophet, so his message in Revelation applies to both
Christians and muslims. To the muslims- The prophecy of Jesus as a prophet and messenger of
GOD is that there is no more permission from GOD to continue to do evil things. That same
message is given to Christians as coming from GOD himself….

ANS.

Before making such tall claims, you should first prove the authenticity
and authority of the book of revelation first!!

Who was its real author and to whom it is addressed must be decided
before we make our sky scrapper on that.

No one really knows who is the real Author of this book. It is most
certainly not John the Apostle of Jesus.

That Jesus was a prophet is confirmed from the lips of Jesus himself.

Those who say that he was God is coming from their lips and not the
lips of Jesus.
Why we need the message from the book of revelation that people
should avoid committing sins? This message is very clear in the
message of Jesus, Moses , all prophets of OT and confirmed by the Last
and Seal of all prophets.

So instead of blaming Mr. Deedat or Jimmy Swaggart, we should check

our source of info first!!

Q44 I Think (Who is 2, 527)

Sorry, NO! my God revealed Himself thru His Son. He said things like "turn the other cheek" &
"love your enemies & give them food". the god of the Quran says things like "love those who
comply". HUGE difference there 'muqy' baby. your dealing with someone who knows God now!

ANS.

Jesus was Son of God in the same sense as were Jacob , David,
Solomon… before him. God does reveal himself thru all prophets…
Jesus was no exception.

As for beautiful teachings like “Turn the other Cheek” , “Love your
enemies” etc… can you tell me what should have been a Christian
response to 9/11 attacks? (open up Empire State Building as other
Cheek?)…. Against Hitler ? (Give him USA and Russia also?) Against
Japan for Pearl Harbor (Allow them to attack any other US base they
wish?)

Love your enemies? What would do to Osama ? Offer Presidentship of

USA?

Our Quran says that “ Repel evil with goodness” … “The recompense
for evil is like itself… but if you forgive it will be better for you”.

These are practical teachings and conforming to human psychology,

not one sided statements like “turn the other Cheek” and “Love thy
enemy”…

Q45 John (Who is 2, 495)

Nonsense. Allah is a made-up name for God. Jesus, the Son of God, called Himself by His name,
and the first person of the trinity Father. Jesus revealed the nature of the one true God to be a
trinity. Muslims say God cannot be divided, as do Christians, and they say God is not restrained
by human reason, yet they also say (by human reason) that God cannot be a trinity. Who are they
to define the inner nature of God?

ANS.

Did Jesus created Himself? How come he entered into the womb of
Mary? Did you mean to say that it was Second Person of Trinity which
was in the womb of Mary for those nine months?

Was it second person of Trinity who was born as babe in the hands of
Mary, sucking breast of Mary, wetting her clothes etc…

I think during all these days (when Jesus was walking on earth) Trinity
was not complete….only Two Persons were present in the heavens!!!
This concept of Trinity is most absurd and unreasonable that any one
can think or imagine.

It cannot be explained or understood. It is against reason, logic and

truth.

What we Muslims say that we cannot understand the personality of

God is totally different. We say that we cannot fully grasp the
Personality and Attributes of God. But what we believe are not against
reason and logic.

Q46 Kathy Daw (Who is 2, 537)

MUQ, Christians are following the word of GOD; Rm.15:28-NIV,For if the gentiles have shared
in the Jews spiritual blessings, they owe it to the Jews to share with them their material blessings.
& Gen.12;3, I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you, I will curse. Seems pretty
plain & easy to understand to me!

ANS.

It is a strange relationship that you have mentioned between Jews,

Christians and God.

The Jews generally do not believe in the message of Jesus and speak
bad words about Jesus and his mother. Despite all this they are still a
favored people by God!!

Do you mean to say the believing in the message of Jesus and taking
him as your personal savior is optional? Or is it optional for only Jews?

Jews shall still attain salvation whether they curse Jesus and ridicule his
mission, and Christians have to support Jews and do all the dirty work
of them?

This is the most one sided view, if there was any!!

Q47 Local Yokel (Who is 2, 473)

Has anyone considered that there is but one true Supreme Being, simply called God, Allah,
Yahweh, depending upon which language is used. Therefore can we not find some common
ground by knowing that we all believe in the One. As for the triune, look at the star of David. One
triangle overlapping the other depicting the three fold nature of God reaching down to the three
fold nature of man reaching up. This is not difficult to understand if one just uses one's mind.
Jesus's teaching were profound. He was simply trying to level the playing field for all people
regardless of their social standing, financial standing or whatever. Think about it. We all come
into this world without a dime, hair or teeth and most of us go out of it the same way. And I
cannot find anything about tithing in Jesus's teachings. If it's there, someone tell me where.
ANS.

I really appreciate your post, in this climate, where followers of each

religion, try to out do each other, and use any means to demonize
each other… you have made a very valid point.

The truth is that followers of all revealed religion (Judaism, Christianity,

Islam, Hinduism etc) indeed worship the same God. They call them by
different names (YHWH, God, Allah, ESHWAR etc.).

There is some difference in presenting attributes for their deity, but

basically they believe in the same being. The one who is Sole Creator,
Sustainer and Cherisher of this entire cosmos.

Christians however have distorted their concept of God, by introducing

the concept of Trinity, which is not to be found in other revealed
religions. But what they call as Father in Heavens is no one else but
Allah, and YHWH of Jews.

The mission of Jesus was very simple and straight forward, he was the
biggest reformer of Jewish religion and the last prophet to rise from
them. His mission was only for Jews. But St. Paul extended it to all
nations and in the result got separated from the main Jewish theme of
Jesus’ religion.

It is time that entire humanity join in the worship of sole Creator and
Sustainer of Universe. One power who has created us all. We all
should worship Him and no one but Him..

Q48 Mohammad (Who is 2, 484)

IN scriptural language, a "book" may not always be a written book with chapters and verses
numbered and bound in front and back cover. A book may mean "An open Tablet" or teachings
and sermons and preaching. Injeel means good news , what Jesus' injeel or good news was
coming closer the Kingdom of God.....
The sermons, teachings and sayings of Jesus were part of the injeel. The good news which Jesus
delivered was the coming of last and final prophet for whole world.
Jesus' injeel is distributed in the pages of Gospels in bits and pieces.

This is where you muslims charm the non-muslims with quotes from the Quran about Allah
telling his prophets to write holy books, including that of Quran, and how he would preserve and
protect them until caliph uthman came along, of course. so how did Allah preserve and protect a
book like the tablet injeel that was never ever meant to be written in the first place.

There is no mention of the 'tablets' ever being put in a book form, not even the Quran. The only
physical books Allah would have known of by the time Muhammad came about would be the
completed books of the TORAH and the BIBLE…..

ANS.

We Muslims do not try to “charm” any one, we speak the truth only.

As per Quran, God mostly send revelation to His prophets and

messengers thru the medium of angels. The prophets memorize that
message and then communicate it to people which people write down.

Some times prophet receive the message thru dreams or visions and
then tell it to people.

There have been very few instances where the revelation came down
from the havens in written form. Ten Commandments of Torah and
some other important instructions were given to Moses in the form of
written tablet.

So your saying that God asked prophets to write down the books is not
entirely correct.

It was in god’ plan that since these revelations were for temporarily
purposes, so there was no requirement for their verbatim
preservations till end of time, that is why God did not make any special
arrangement for their preservation. And there is nothing that people
can complain about.

In God’ plan, Quran was to be the Final book for all humanity till last
day and Prophet Mohammad last prophet for all nations. So it was
imperative that the message be preserved till the last day.

That is why God took special precautions for preservation of Quran.

From the earliest day, it was to be recited in daily prayers. That is why
it was getting into the breast of people at the same time when it was
being written down.

It came to Arab people, who were not very adept in writing, so they
used to memorize most of their poetry and history. That is why
memorizing Quran was made easy for them.

During the life time of prophet whole Quran was preserved in the
memory as well as in written form. Within two years of prophet’s
death, First Caliph Abu Bakr, got the whole Quran written down and
kept it with Wife of Prophet.
Third Caliph Othman got the many copies made from that first copy,
and verified once again with the available written records. This
happened in less that thirty years of prophet’s death, when thousands
of his companions were still alive. Othman made 7 or 8 copies and
sent one each to major provinces. Two copies survive till this day.
Anyone can compare those copies with modern Quran and verify the
authenticity.

Comparing Quran’s purity and authenticity with other scriptures is

comparing apples against oranges. I really feel pity when you people
speak against variants reading of Quran forgetting what is the situation
of Biblical books in this regard.

I am told that not two or so called ancient manuscripts are exact

copies of each other. They even vary in the number of books they
contain, forget about differences in text.

Torah was God’ revelation to prophet Moses and INJEEL was the Good
News preached by Jesus and Psalms were the revelation sent to
Prophet and King David.

But we do not say that First five books of OT are that Torah or the four
Gospels are INJEEL, or the present book of Psalms is the original book
of Psalms. The books do indeed contain some portion of old revelation,
but they are mixed with other things also.

Q49 Neotics (Who is 2, 585)

Oh, yes. There definitely is a common point- DEATH. Its universality is a very common point.
Denial of death is delusion. There are over a billion people who do that consciously and a large
part of the rest do that unconsciously!! Education, knowledge etc has nothing to do with that.
From the illiterate street kids to the mighty Pharos of yester years, to the geniuses of today do
that. that is a deceitful solution to their existential angst.

ANS.

Yes death is another common point in which we agree.

When I said that we agree on life after death, that meant that we also
believe in death.

But I am aware that some people are very happy to complicate the
simple words. They are not happy unless the simple words get some
strange and twisted meanings out of it.

Death is simple the end of our test period on this earth. Period
between life and death is our “opportunity window” to try to get
Paradise or Hell Fire. This period is fixed by our Creator for EACH AND
EVERY HUMAN BEING.

Every one, from pauper to Kings, from common men to prophets of

God, from sinner to highest saints all have tasted the taste of death
and those are alive today will taste it sooner or later.

There is nothing special about it and there is no mystery about it.

Some people try to project death in some other mysterious words and
ways and want to draw some special meaning from this Universal
Word.

I only say to these people, that please do not use common words which
have straight forward meanings and drive strange philosophies out of
them.

Are you by any chance one of these fellows?

Q50 Noetics (Who is 2, 194)

That is fine, Koran also sometimes uses allegories. But you are still dodging or missing the point.

Point 1.

1. The question was not who use what from where or why. Rather it was your contention that
allegories cannot be used to explain what you call the "spiritual". Now you have to shift your
position, since Koran also as you claim uses allegories. So you have to accept that using
allegories to comprehend even feebly the Biblical Trinity is rational and sound.

Point 2.

2. Your initial premise was that Injeel has been corrupted and could not be preserved. Now you
have changed your position to: Injeel has been ABROGATED and is now substituted by the
Koran which you identify as a later revelation…..

ANS.

Your post is again based on your hallucination …. You use phrases like
“Lamb will return like a Lion…” which shows the state of your mental
faculties.

That past revealed books have been corrupted or modified… for this
we do not have to look at Quran…we have to look at these books
themselves…these books are proof that original message was
tampered with.
For example, why there are only Four Gospels which are authentic? If
Jesus’ sayings were recorded by many of his disciples and followers,
what is the reason that Church selected only these four as authentic
and rejected all others as Spurious?

What is the standard that Church followed to select only these four?

Quran only says that people of the book change the wordings of their
scripture with their mouth, they write books with their hands and then
say, It is from God.

There is one Most Important Quranic prophesy which is getting fulfilled

in all ages, from the first day of prophetic mission till our time and will
continue till the very end of time, it is:

“ It is He (i.e. God), who send His Messenger (i.e. Mohammad) with

Guidance (i.e. Quran) and a way of Life (i.e. Islam) so as to Overwhelm
all other ways of Life (i.e. man made religions and philosophies) ,
Whatsoever Unbelievers and MUSHRIKS may detest it”!!

This single Quranic prophesy supersedes all your Lion, Lamb and other
allegories!!

Q51 Noetics (Who is 2, 490)

Is there any "theist" of any stripe who does not reconcile with a "diunity" when it comes to
his/her own "self"? You die today or tomorrow, your body will perish sooner or later, but "you-1"
in body certainly believes that "you-2" will be with Allah to receive all the heavenly goodies- that
is if "allowed" despite all your good works.

The Bible consider a human being as a "tri-unity" of Inner-self (spirit), Mental self (soul) and
physical self (body). The body will perish but will be resurrected a glorious body to be united
with the soul/spirit which is hidden in the Infinite Messiah…..

ANS.

You are confusing, when you compare or want to create parallels

between Creator and His creations.

Human’ body consist of two parts, one is physical body and another is
soul, which is not physical.

When a man dies , it is only his body which dies and the soul leaves
the body. Body is treated separately and soul separately.
On the last day, soul and body would be re-combined to become
human once again.

But in no way, we can use that logic for God and His Person and His
Spirit. We must hold our tongue in this regard and only say what He
Himself says about Him thru His revelations.

This Human Logic and Reasoning to prove Trinity, is therefore totally

wrong and has no proof from Scripture.

Allah and Elohim are same persons, Allah and Elohim did not want to
preserve Injeel, since it was only a temporary phase in the
development of religion….and wanted to preserve Quran as the Last
and Final message for all Nations till the last say…there is no mistake
and contradiction or problem here.

God, YHWH, Allah and Elohim….do what He wants to do!!! Not what
WE WANT or WISH Him to do!!!

Q52 Noetics (Who is 2. 491)

No, just confessing. "If I have told you earthly things and you UNDERSTAND NOT, how shall
you- MUQ- believe if I tell you of heavenly things" said Yah Shua Messiah to another MUQ
[Mum Upon Query] in John 3: 12. "The natural man receiveth NOT...." [1 Cor 2: 14].

The natural man of course will receive the counterfeit Gospel of Barnabas!!! Barnabas never
wrote anything, he just disappeared from the scene into Cyprus after disagreeing
That which is INVISIBLY coupled to, integrated into, interacts with and functions in synchrony
with the VISIBLE physical must be INVISIBLE physical. "There is a natural BODY (physical)
and there is a spiritual BODY (physical)" 1Cor. 15: 44). In all ancient languages- Hebrew,
Sanskrit,Greek, Latin etc- the word spirit has the same root which simply means "breath",
implying when the breath leaves th spirit leaves.

How does that negate the reasoning presented? While LIVING MUQ is at least a "DIUNITY" of
"spirit and body" according to your own words.

ANS.

I think no purpose will be served , while you continue to speak in

“allegorical” language and I in Plain English.

Your comments regarding Barnabas , shows how the people were in

those early days of Pauline Christianity.
A man dedicates his life for the service of his masers, sells his all
belongings, introduces Paul to the Disciples, travels and suffers with
Paul for many years….

And then just “Disappears” into Cyprus, after having a Trivial argument
with Paul about Mark….never to be seen again.

Same things happen to Peter, James and other Disciples of Jesus after
the famed Council of Jerusalem!!!

It is logical…when your minds are programmed to accept something as

illogical as this Blessed Trinity….you can believe and accept
everything!!!

Q53 Noetics (Who is 2, 492)

These things are an allegory Galatians 4:24; Yheses things ar ensamples

(examples)...1Corinthians 10:11
Allegories, parables, metaphors, symbols, exanples, thought experiments etc are the insightful
approaches to comprehend complexities, normal to discerning humans. The Bible
is replete with them. I understand the Koran is bereft of them. What figures-of-speech does a
unitary loner deity provide for his creation which contrary to his essence is intrinsically a "Unity
in Diversity"? ….

ANS.

There is no problem if a book uses allegorical language, but the

allegorical language should be used in allegorical sense and not
literally.

Quran also uses “allegorical” language at many places, Description of

God’s personally and His attributes and description of heavens and hell
are all in allegorical language. But Muslims interpret these verses in
allegorical sense and not literally.

It is the “genius” of Christians that they use these Allegorical verses

and words in literal sense causing all these confusions and
contradiction.

That is how concepts like Trinity originated in Christianity which were

unknown to Jews.

Innocent phrases like Son of God, Holy Spirit, death and Sin became
something mysterious and unique.
Just see posts of these Christians and wonder how they make a
mountain of a mole hill.

Q54 Noetics (Who is 2, 500)

Noetics simply quoted what is WRITTEN.

You are going in circles again and again. This is a repetition ad nauseam to the question: "Your
Allah can keep the Koran in tact, but Elohim who you recognize as Allah could not do that to the
Injeel?"

Again ad nauseam repetitions. The Apostolic signature is what determines the authenticity of the
NT, not the whims and fancies of the Church Fathers. There are two groups of Apostles: The
Twelve (Direct Appointment by the Messiah) and a few others commissioned by the Holy Spirit
after the Ascension of the Messiah.
Why Four? Again repetitions!!

The Messiah prophesied as Jehovahin the OT John

The Messiah prophesied as King in the OT Matthew
The Messiah prophesied as the Man in the OT Luke
The Messiah prophesied as the Servant in the OT Mark ….

ANS.

You quote from the scriptures no doubt…. But you interpret literally
what are supposed to be allegorical verses. And that is the real reason
why most Christians have taken a wrong stand on Jesus and his
sayings.

I told you, Allah, God, YHWH and Elohim are different names for the
same being…. So My Allah and Your Elohim are not appropriate words
at all.

OUR God Wished Quran to be preserved verbatim as Final revelation so

it was.

OUR God did not wish that Torah or INJEEL to be preserved verbatim,
so it was.!!!

If you cannot trace any present Gospel directly to any Apostle…what

else shall you do? Every Christian has his or her own theory about
their religion.
Messiah is not a unique title or post in Jewish scriptures. There have
been many Messiahs before Jesus and there was one Final Messiah to
appear after Jesus. Jesus was also a Messiah.

This is the explanation which will take you out from “Difficult spots”.
Was Jesus a King? He himself said “My Kingdom is not of this world”!!

The present mistrust and violence between Islam and Christian nation
is the handiwork of Jews and one sided support which Jews and Zionists
receive from their “Christian Friends?

If you remove that support most of the present problems would be

solved.

Meanwhile Islam is spreading and continue to spread to all parts of the

world, irrespective of what you say or do!!!

That is a prophesy from OUR God!!! Not My Allah or Your Elohim!!

Q55 Noetics (Who is 2, 505)

Now, this means at least a dialogue is possible, unless you return to pontification again.

Now this is pontification by MUQ. The Koran is very clear to state that God has no Son. Clearly
the God and Father of the Adonai Yah Shua Messiah is not Allah. God the Son takes the form of
the human flesh and thus the "Sentence of Death" pronounced by God on all mankind including
MUQ and cancels it through HIS death and resurrection. That is not Allah of the Koran. Allah
wants you todie for him, so that your heavenly suite of virgins is secure. Otherwise you tale a
chance with Allah's mercy! Two different Creators!!! One of the Loran and the Other of the OT
and NT.

You claim to have read the books you are critiquing. There is not one Book except arguably the
Epistle to the Hebrews where the Signature of the Author is missing. Indirectly Peter refers to
Paul's authorship the Hebrews and the internal evidence of the Hebrews points to Paul's
authorship. Just imagine any human being unless inspired by the Creator Himself ever writing the
Book of Hebrews. No Sadducee or Pharisee or Scribe will do that unless he had a direct
encounter with the Risen Messiah!! The author is describing first hand knowledge of the Risen
Lord of Creation….

ANS.
1. Why Quran, even old Testament books say the same thing that God
has no Son in its literal sense. Otherwise you will have to accept that
God has many Sons…Adam, Jacob, Joseph, Ephraim , David, Solomon
and so many others. Jesus is not an exception.

2. What you say about Jesus is based on Paul’ logic and preaching and
Paul has no real authority in theology.

3. None of the book says that it was penned down by such and such
person. Have you pondered at the word “according to” on the front
page of each Gospel….why it does not say “Gospel of Matthew”
instead of saying “Gospel according to Matthew”? It shows that
Matthew did not write the Gospel which is going on by his name!! and
same for other books.

4. You have got the meaning of Messiah correctly…. But mumbled that
all by superimposing Paul’s philosophy over the real position of Jesus.
That is the basic problem with Paul and his followers. To take phrases
from OT books and superimpose their own thoughts on them.

5. Jesus was not “That Messiah” “That Prophet” whom the Jews were
waiting for and you will find the clarification of this confusion in the
Gospel of Barnabas, which you should read carefully.

Q56 Noetics (Who is 2, 505)

The Higher Critiques do not claim to be ORTHODOX Christians and they cannot do so anyway.
The claim to be "scholars", but very little of that scholarship is in Greek or Hebrew. It is mostly
their brand of "theology" and of course they usually have a degree in some arts or humanities.

The agreement of the Dead Sea Scrolls worth the OT Books is too remarkable for any unbiased
scholar to ignore.

If the Islamic/Koranic dogma of authenticity of Injeel is correct, and then applied to all ancient
literatures 100% of them must be thrown out as fraudulent. The Koran itself comes under its own
axe, because its author was illiterate (a point considered as supportive of the Koran's validity) and
could not sign any of those writings. It is all third person narratives of what others "heard" from
the "foaming" mouth of the prophet. …

ANS.

1. To speak truth, you need not be Orthodox Christians or Unorthodox

Christian. You should truthfully analyze the evidence and then give
your judgment. Scholars of Higher Biblical Criticism have done the
same.

2. They verified the authenticity of all old manuscripts and differences

and mistakes between them and proven that these books were never
written by the people to whom they are referred. These are
anonymous books written and edited by unknown hands and then
assigned to some prophets. This truth is evident to any one who even
takes a glance over these books. You need not be a great scholar to
notice it. But you should not be a Blind Follower of Bible either.

3. We do not recommend that you destroy 100 % of your old

scriptures. We ask you to use a proper criterion to separate truth from
the falsehood and that Criterion is Quran (since it is 100 % authentic
and is 100 % Word of God). Accept what Quran accepts, Reject what
Quran rejects and keep silence where Quran is silent. This is most
prudent, practical and balanced view point and that is what we
promote.

4. No one has the right to coin his or her own phrase and then insert it
into the Book of God...just to fight against a self supposed heretic sect.
It is not correct to make your own sentences and then insert them into
Gospels so as to counter argue against Agnostics or Aryanism or
whatever. That is what the Church did in those dark ages....each sect
played with the Book of God and inserted their own views into them
and that is how these books became unreliable and suspect.

5. Let people call our prophet what they wish, but we will never modify
our Scriptures so as to answer these critics or invent new phrases. We
invite all to the religion of peace promulgated by our prophet....those
who find it acceptable are welcome to join it....those who do not like it
can have their choice.

There is no compulsion in religion.

Q57 Noetics (Who is 2, 505)

We have gone through this point by by point many times, including the scientific way of
determining authenticity of ancients writs. The New Testament is about 30,000 times more
credible than Plato's record for Socrates! That is true of the OT also, though a lesser number, but
it has the Dead Sea Scrolls in addition.

You can believe a bogus GNOSTIC writing called Gospel of Barnabas as genuine, but not the
NT. That, both OT & NT describe as a manifest evidence of how corrupt the human mind can
be!!

ANS.

I know we have gone thru about the topic of authenticity of NT and OT

Books. If you had read any books dealing with Higher Biblical
Criticism., then you will not be so cocksure about your claims.
The way Biblical text has suffered during infighting between different
church groups is not a secret any more.

If you think that Dead Sea Scrolls prove the authenticity of whole OT
text, then you are mistake. These scrolls are themselves questionable
as we do not know their real authors.

As I told you that I am not dogmatic about Gospel of Barnabas, neither

I consider it as the True INJEEL from cover to cover.

But this book is not as fake at its critics claim, there are many internal
and external evidences that it was written by an eye witness and it was
written very close to the age of Jesus. It has also suffered as other
books of OT and NT, may be more than them, but that is not a reason
to abandon it altogether, when it does explain and clarify many of the
Jesus sayings and teachings which are vague in other Gospels.

This book therefore is a very big aid to know about real teachings of
Jesus and find out the innovations which Paul and his followers
introduced into the simple and straight forward teachings of Jesus.

I know it is very exciting to dwell on allegorical verses and deduce far

fetched ideas from them.

But the truth in most cases is very simple and expressed in the most in
ambiguous language….like Chapter 112 of Quran :

“Say He is Allah the Only, Allah the absolute and Eternal!! He begets
not, neither was He begotten and there is none (Anywhere) like Him”.

This simple 3 verse chapter, clears all the cobwebs which Trinitarian
have created around the personality of God and Jesus and Holy Spirit.

Q59 Noetics (Who is 2, 533)

Sorry, MUQ. You are simply jumping from fire to frying pan. Stay in the frying pan. At least
there is some one to turn you around and stir you up.

By your own logic you relied on the "pagans" to disprove the ONE and ONLY ONE (ECHAD)
Elohim of the Bible in THREE and ONLT THREE PERSONS. Now that is your frying pan of
choice.

Now I am only pointing out there were "pagans" in Babylon, who also believed the same way as
you do. Now you want to jump out of your frying pan into the fire of self-contradiction.

Stay with your premise, one at a time. If your premise is wrong state so and go to your next
premise. You have ignored my previous notes and evading the issues that are troubling your
preconceived or "indoctrinated" notions…..

ANS.

We have had many discussions on the subject of Trinity…. The best

moments are when you try to explain Trinity using logic and reason.

The language you speak can be anything but simple English. There
are no Three Gods but only one God.

But Father, Son and Holy Spirit all Gods in their own rights. There is no
way to say that one of these is More Powerful than the Rest… If that
not makes them Three Gods…what else?

But in the end you say that God is only one!!

If God has multiple persons in God head, then why only three? There
could have been ten or even hundreds persons in the God head.

Hindus seem more reasonable on this account than the Christians….

Because for them every attribute of God is represented by a distinct
personality.

But the real issue is that if Trinity was such an important article of
faith….why did not the past prophets in OT and Jesus himself explained
it in clear words?

Why did he use ambiguous words and allegorical words (mostly in

John’ Gospel). Why it took many centuries for concept of Trinity to be
finalized?

The truth is that, this concept of Trinity was not known to Jesus when
he was walking on this earth. This is the brain child of Paul and his
followers…. Who borrowed it from pagan societies.

Trinity is not a concept which was taught by any prophet of God. And
in theological matters, views and teachings of prophets have authority
over and above all others.

Q60 Noetics (Who is 2, 535)

That is too simple and infinitely different from

Infinity-1 + Infinity-2 + Infinity-3 = 1-Infinity

Field-1 + Field-2 + Field-3 = 1-Field
Infinite Person-1 + Infinite Person-2 + Infinite Person-3 = 1- Infinite Elohim (UNIplural Noun)
….

ANS.

You are mistaken, it is not Bible or any prophet of god who tell us that
God has three personalities in His God head and that these
personalities are co-eternal, co-powerful and All Mighty.

It is Saint Paul who came with this philosophy borrowed from Greek
and Roman mythology and that view was taken up by his followers.

The logic and explanation may look reasonable or logical, but they
need not necessarily be true!!.

For any logic and reason to be true it needs PROOFS from Scripture
and prophets and not from others.

Q61 Noetics (Who is 2, 538)

MUQ wrote "So your saying that most of seducees beacme Christains is not correct. Number of
Chriostians increased dramatically when St. Paul started preaching "His Gospple" to Non Jews
against the strict order of Jesus Christ."

This is a misquote. No Sadducee is ever recorded as accepting the Messiah. The very Jerusalem
crowd who hailed Him as King a a day before, shouted for His crucifixion the next day!!.
However after the RESURRECTION record is " 11 ("hiding for fear of Jews", 120 in the Upper
Room, 3,000 after Peter's first sermon, 5,000 then "multitudes both men and women".. "Priests,
Pharisees". These references have been posted earlier. No Sadducee mentioned….

ANS.

Your post is very incoherent and very difficult to decipher. But if you
want to convey that majority of Jews accepted Christianity and only a
handful remained outside Christianity, then let me tell you that you are
wrong.

The book of acts and history conforms that majority of Jews did not
accept the message of Jesus Christ. A Small minority of Jews accepted
the message of Jesus and became what is knows as Jewish Christians.

Due to teachings of St. Paul many Romans and non Jews accepted
Christianity and they soon became the dominant party.

You are right that heresies started in Christendom, but they started
very early in the history of Church, during the time of Apostles
themselves. Peter, James, Barnabas etc being one party and Paul
being in the other party.

Most of early Christian communities have been declared as Heretic by

Pauline Church. If these earliest Christians could be called heretic,
then you can understand , what would have happened in later ages.

Aryanism is a very late phenomenon, Arius lived in the fourth century,

the council of Nicea was held in 325 CE to discredit the teachings of
Arius, who was still alive then.

Therefore I was not that much wrong in my posts!!

Q62 Noetics (Who is 2, 567)

This is a very common mistake often made about the Bible. The word sin has lost its original
meaning in the Hebrew and the Greek- missing the mark. Nobody can inherit sin (missing the
mark), only the consequences of sin (missing the mark)can be inherited. A child can inherit a
venereal disease (consequence of mother missing the mark of chastity) from an erring mother, not
the profligacy of the mother.
MUQ did not inherit Adam's sin, only the consequences thereof. Death- yes DEATH a subject
nobody wants to talk about- is the consequence of Adam/Eve missing the mark of FREE WILL,
HONEST, RIGHTFUL, VOLUNTARY SUBMISSION to their CREATOR. Death is the
Sentence pronounced by the Creator for that Willful Cosmic Treason. Only the Creator can
cancel that Sentence. He did it HIS WAY, not MUQ's way, by taking that Sentence upon Himself
and RISING again- conquering death. You accept that CANCELLATION freely and be with the
Risen Lord of Life or reject it wilfully and continue DEAD in Adam/Eve genetics.

ANS.

Thanks for your clarifications. You use Sin and Death is a very
mysterious sense. Every one Dies, believer in Jesus or those who do
not believe in him, so what is this mysterious thing you say about
death.

A. Child inhering disease from parents is a totally different matter.

That is not accountable. God will not question a Child or punish him,
just because he inherited any disease from his parents.

But Children of Adam inheriting Sin is totally different. They all will go
to Hell, unless they BELIEVE that Jesus died for their sins, that is a
totally new Philosophy, not supported by any Prophet of God.

B. Killing Animals for Food:

Is seems that you are “More Merciful” than God Almighty!! God
Almighty the Ultimate source of Mercy has allowed the meat of these
Animals as food, but “Your’ sense of Mercy” prevents you from doing
that.

Even Jesus ate Passover Lamb along with all his disciples. Are you
more merciful than Jesus?

I do not say that every one must eat meat, but those who are
“vegetarian” on moral grounds are hypocrites in my view.

Killing animals for food is neither a “crime” nor a genetic disorder.

Crime is going against the Laws and Commandments of your Creator.

Regarding your other questions, they are of “philosophical” nature and

have more to do with your state of mind than reality.

If you think they are important, then you should go one question at a
time and not in that long list.

Q63 Noetics (Who is 2 , 570)

Nothing mysterious, clear as day light. Death is universal. That points to Capital Punishment on
the biosphere. Innocent babies die, even in the wombs, just as the most vicious criminals do!!
Only the Creator can pronoune that Sentence. Only the Creator can cancel it also.

"The sting of death is sin..." 1 Cor 15:55-57

"Thanks be to Elohim who GIVES (freely) us the victory through Adonai Jeshua Messiah"
(v.57)does not mean those who accept this gift will not have bodily death. "It is appointed for
man ONCE to die, and afterward JUDGEMENT" Hebrews 9:27. Just as Afonai Jeshua Messiah
DIED so also ALL will die. Just as HE rose from the dead. all who died in HIM will also be with
HIM in their spirits and be joined to their resurrected bodies upon HIS Return. ….

ANS.

Part A of your message was nothing but a standard “verbatim” Pauline

Logic.

Some one died for you sin, he was resurrected and in him you live and
in him you die and in him you will be resurrected.

You are free to believe in anything you want. But do not say that these
are teachings of jesus Christ.

At best these are teachings of Saint Paul. And he has no authority to

Decide the fundamentals of beliefs.

In Part B you clarified your stand on vegetarianism. You eat only

vegetarian food or non vegetarian food. But let us not denounce each
other.

That is why I said, I am not against vegetarian food, but those who are
vegetarian on “moral grounds”, them I consider as hypocrites.
Because they kill many life forms, but disallow slaughtering animals for
food!!

Q64 Noetics (Who is 2, 572)

No, this is the logic of Abel, Noah, Abraham, Moses, King David, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel,
Daniel,-- all the OT Prophets, completing in Adonai Jeshua Messiah, all the NT Apostles, All the
true Church Fathers, All the true Churches of all the ages and all the testimony of all the present
believers in the Messiah's accomplished REDEMPTION. All true Churches no matter what their
names exist only because of that Prophetic/Apostolic testimony. The foundation is the
FORENSIC DELARATION FROM THE ALMIGHTY THAT THERE IS "NO MORE
CONDEMNATION" TO THOSE WHO ARE IN ADONAI MESSIAH JESHUA THE RISEN
LORD OF LIFE.

ANS.

I must disagree with you. The concept of original sin and vicarious
atonement was only the brain child of your own St. Paul.

You should not drag innocent and honest prophets of God like Noah,
Abraham, Moses, David, Solomon, Ezekiel, Daniel and Jesus into it.

I agree that this Pauline philosophy was accepted by All Christian

Churches in the end, but you know that it was not a unanimous choice.

It was forced upon them after centuries of infighting and disputes

amongst different churches.

You can never say that Christendom was unanimous on this during first
400 to 500 years of its existence.

You should study the history of earliest churches and how your dogmas
were formed and evolved.

Q65 Noetics (Who is 2, 583)

For the sake of TRUTH which I suppose all here seek, will you as k the " True Christian" to
define a " true Christian first before making those comments? Otherwise his/her postings will
appear to be stealthy (perhaps by a well meaning Muslim), and even nefarious.

Biblical definition of a Christian/Church comes from these facts:

1. Church (not individual Christians) is not an after thought in Elohim's mind- ordained 'before
the foundation of the world', according to the Scriptures.

1. There was a Church in the wilderness beginning with Moses and the "mixed people" redeemed
by the "blood of the lamb" ordained BRFORE and slain FROM the foundation of the world,
according to the Scriptures.

2. True Members of the Church are REDEEMED people and not DNA specific! There is no
ethnic redemption or racist Kingdom of the Messiah, according to the Scriptures.

ANS.

I touched upon the commonalities between the faiths and you want to
touch upon the differences.
You may keep your definition of “true Christian” with you. We do not
want to comment on that.
We believe in One God, the Sole Creator of Universe.
We believe in Angels
We believe in Prophets.
We believe in Revelation which God sends to His prophets.
We believe in Books which God sends down to some of the prophets
for guidance of their followers.
We believe in the Concept of Life after death and on the Last day.
Let these be the common points between us for cooperation and let us
leave aside who is a “True Jew, a “True Christian” or a “True Muslim”
Let us leave that question for our Creator to decide on the Last Day!!
In the same way, who goes to heaven and who goes to hell, shall be
the prerogative of God on the last day. I would shudder to have that
CONTROL IN MY HAND!!
Why can we not cooperate and live peacefully and discuss common
points instead of disagreeing with each other?
That was the spirit in which I wrote down my post.

Q66 Noetics (Who is 2, 586)

 The most mysterious way is viewing DEATH [which is the worst destructive of all live
experiences] as the easy way to get to their HEAVEN. Some have made it most mysterious by
assuming that if they die in the name of defending their DEITY's honor they will surely go
directly to their Heaven with no questions asked. Over one billion people accept that as
reasonable. Over another one billion people just ignore death as UNREAL. The only reality is
whatever they believe as after death "life"!Of the remaining people most just make a mockery of
death, even laughing over their dead ones, some just deny it is coming, some just are so scared
they do not want anybody ever even mentioning it! ….

ANS.

“Let us reason together” is probably the reason why we are on this

thread…. Otherwise there is no need to be for people with different
faiths and different backgrounds to be here.

But our aim should be either to educate each other, or know about
each other or to find common thread that runs in our different faiths.

That should be purpose of our writing here, but some people use these
threads to denounce each other, to create hatred between each other
or to make fun and demonize each other.

That is the attitude against which I am always writing.

Now you asked me, what Quran says about death, let me quote to a
few verses on that:

1. Death is also a Creation of Allah like Life:

“He who created Death and Life, that He may try which of you is best
in deed” (77 :2)

2. Every one shall taste death:

“Every soul shall have a taste of death…” ( 3:185)

“ Truly You (O prophet) will die (one day) and truly they (your
opponents) too will die (one day), In the end, ye (all) on the Day of
Judgment settle your dispute in the presence of your Lord” (39:30-31).

4. Death (on this earth) is no penalty and it is not the end of road:

“Every one shall taste death and only on the day of Judgment shall you
be paid your full recompense. Only he who is saved from the Fire and
admitted to Garden will have attained the object of life: for the life of
this world is but goods and chattels of deception (3:185)

There are many such verses, clear and concise and no hidden
meaning.
These are the teachings in which we believe and tell to others also.

Q67 Maverick, (Israel, 755)

IMO you are merely lumping everyone into a box. Would it be ok if folks lumped all
Muslims into a box?

My answer would be no. What part of the Tanakh is corrupted in your opinion? Note:
others may state that the Quran is corrupted.

ANS.

A. Lumping into one Box:

I am not lumping every one in one box. I have clarified repeatedly that I only criticise
those who have done wrongs to our brothers and driven them out of their homes and
lands.

Similarly those Jews and Christians who are engaged full time in Anti Islam and Anti
Muslim propaganda, I am writing against them.

I have no grudge with normal Jews and Christians who want to leave in love and peace
and want to co-exist with Islam and Muslims. I want to engage them in healthy debates
so as to remove doubts and misconceptions regarding Islam and Muslims.

B. Which part is corrupted?:

You have asked me, which part of Tanakh is corrupted in my opinion. If you go by the
history of your books, you will find that none of them were actually written by the name
of author which appears on the front page.

So legally, all the books are of doubtful nature and as such cannot be taken as Word of
God, unless there is some strong evidence, that this part is really Word of God.

The existence of so many varying manuscripts and contradictions, additions and

omissions are proof that these books have suffered during copying and transmission over
the centuries.

This is a fact which no serious scholar of Jewish and Christian scripture can deny.

So we need a standard to verify these books and Quran provides this standard, because it
is word of God and nothing else but word of God.

Now coming to your question, which part of Tanakh is corrupted, let me say, that part
which is expressively contradicted in Quran, that part is really corrupted.

The part which is confirmed by Quran is Original word of God, the part where Quran is
silent, we reserve our judgment.

C. Why Quran is not corrupted?:

Now coming to your second point “Some one may say Quran is also corrupted”

1. Well people can say ANYTHING. Some one may say that Sun rises from the West
and sets in the East, we cannot hold any one’s tongue!

2. But he has to provide evidence for it, There is only one Quran in the world. You travel
from any country to any country in the world and you will see only one Quran.

3. You see any Quranic manuscript, irrespective of year it was written down, you will
find it exactly matching with what we have with us.

4. Quran was always preserved both in written from as well as memorization by Muslims.
There is an unbroken chain of Quranic memorizers. There was no period in Islamic
history, when there were not thousands of people that had memorized whole Quran by
heart.

5. If in spite of all this some one says that Quran is corrupted, then he may as well say
that it is Moon which gives the light in day time and not sun!!

Q68 Lion of Judah (Israel, 754)

Yeah yeah...
And in the bible we understand exactly what is Ishmael dynasty :
"He will be a wild donkey of a man; his hand will be against everyone ..and everyone's
hand against him, …and he will live in hostility …toward [b] all his brothers." …
(Genesis 16:12)

ANS.

The “Younger brother’s” jealousy to his “elder brother” is well known.

So I am not in the least offended by what your (corrupted) books say about Ishmael and
his progeny.

But facts are facts, and we should not forget it, and some of them are:
A. Ishmael and his children took complete possession of the land allotted to them
(Arabia) and have kept that possession for more than 4000 years. That should be a world
record!!
B. Children of Ishmael, took full possession of every land where Abraham, Isaac and
Jacob ever set foot (Palestine, Iraq, Egypt, Jordan, Lebanon, Syria…..) and it was ONLY
thru them that the promise of God to Abraham was fulfilled

That was for Children of Ishmael, now coming to Children of Isaac:

a. Despite God allotting them the land of Palestine (on conditional basis), they could not
take full control of that land for first 1000 years (Abraham upto David).
b. They could only took control of whole land of Palestine for less than 100 years (during
reign of David and Solomon). After that they were in the state of loosing their lands to
others.
c. They have been kicked out of Jerusalem twice and have their temples destroyed at the
hands of their enemies (such a fact never occurred to temple of Arabs i.e. Kaaba in 5000
years!!).
d. They have been reduced to the state of captives (for 70 years) and wanderers in the
land (for 2000 years), a feat which never came to Ishmael and his children!!
e. Since 1948….they have taken a partial control of land of palestine (thru intrigue,
mischief and help from their “Christian Brothers”) and the land has not seen a day of
peace since they have returned back.

These are facts of history and no mere gossip!!

How can I find fault with you, if you are “jealous” and “call names” to your elder cousins
and his progeny

Q69 Maverick (Israel, 764)

Muq, Torah is instruction, teaching, etc. It allows someone to grow closer to G-d. It
leads to righteousness. Faith and obedience There is only ONE Torah for both gentiles
and Israelites.

ANS.
I told you that I agree with you that Torah is instruction, teaching, makes people closer to
God, leads to righteous ness and faith and obedience….and all that.

But the question is where is the original Torah which was given to Moses?

That is not the Pentateuch that we have in our hand today…. It contains part of Original
Torah…mixed with some thing else (commentaries, notes, local folklore, history and
some dirty stories too).

The question is how we can separate Word of God from things that are Not Word of
God?

What solution you have? Pardon me for giving a simile :

If you KNOW that glass of water which you have in your hand, Does contain one Drop
of Urine in it, will you drink it? When pure water bottle is available within your reach?

Mixing your own words with Words of God is worse in theological language, that mixing
a drop of urine in a pure glass of water!!

Q70 Maverick (Israel, 763)

Muq, His Torah was given for folks to know how to be righteous and obedient before G-
d.

ANS.

You are very right; Torah was given to righteous fellows to be righteous and obedient
before God….
If you study Quran, you will be amazed at the praises it has for Torah….in fact every
epithet used for Quran as Word of God has also been used for Torah…

But there is a difference: What Quran means by Torah “Is the Revelation which God
gave to Moses”

And

What Jews and Christians mean by Torah is “First Five Books of Bible”!!

They are not the one and the same!!

What Quran says is that people have “deliberately and knowingly changed or corrupted
some part of the Original Torah and some they lost”. Any one with any knowledge of
history of Biblical books cannot take exception to this just and unbiased Quranic
comment.

Therefore it is the question of authenticity and not of origin. If we could locate the
original manuscript of Torah which was preached by Moses…it would be as clear and
authentic as Quran, we have no doubt about it.

Even the present “five books of Bible” contain many portions from the original
Torah…..but the question arises, which portions?

So we need a standard to separate them, how can we do it, without having a reliable
standard?

And Quran being the impeccable Word of God provides that standard!!

Q71 Maverik (Jesus, Israel, 748)

Ultimately they also lost their softness and patience....and spoke in that words.
See How Jesus was forced to used strong and harsh words against the people of his time.

Now tell us what type of Jews you speak of:

Essene, Pharisee (School of Hillel or School of shammai), Saduccees
Nazarenes, Zealots, Hasids, Publicans, Ebionites, etc

ANS.
I do not criticize any individual Jew or Christian (unless there is some specific reason).

When I spoke about Jews, it was them as a group. It is very common that while there is
differences in individual thinking, nation or races as a group behave in some set pattern.

That is the way in which Jews are addressed in OT and NT books. I do not speak of any
type of Jews and that is Jews a s a group.

While we find individual Jews as logical, reasonable, devoted to good cause and service
to humanity and with creative talents, their majority as a group is racist and they are
staunch enemy of Jesus and our prophet too.

Our Quran is the best example of this, after criticizing Jews in these terms

“Shame it pitched over them (like a tent) wherever they are found, except when under a
covenant (of protection) from God and from men; they draw on themselves wrath from
God, and pitched over them is (the) tent of destitution. This is because they rejected The
Signs of God and slew the Prophets in defiance of right; this because they rebelled and
transgressed beyond bound” (3:113)

It immediately inserts this exception

“Not all of them are alike: of the portion of People of Book are a portion that stand (for
the right): they rehearse the Signs of God all night and they prostrate themselves in
adoration. They believe in God and the Last day; they enjoin what is right and forbid
what is wrong and they hasten in all good works and they are in the ranks of righteous”
(3:114,115)

This is what I call a balanced view and no Arab could have written it 1400 years ago!!

But in the End Quran mentions the reality “But most of them are perverted
transgressors….” (3:110)
 Chapter-2 (Jews, Israel, Palestine and Related Topics)

Q72 Alex (Jews don’t, 144)

Me and most of the jews in israel were born here, who are the 3rd generation of people that have
been living abroad to tell try and evict us. you have a bigger chance of evicting India than your
pipe dreams of jews just evicting israel. the whole middle east will be nuked to ashes before that
would happen.

ANS.

I know you are a 3rd generation Jews and only know Israel as your home
land…. Have you ever given any thought about those people who were
living in those lands for 40th Generations?

Your grandfathers turned these people out of their lands and evicted
them and forced them to live in tents for ever… What about plight of
those people?

Why should they not get their homes and lands back?

Evicting Jews from Palestine is not such a unique thing in human

history… It has already been done twice… If a thing that has been
done can be called a piped dream?

It should be a lesson to Jews not repeat same mistakes as they did

earlier (cause mischief in the land , and always make neighbors as
their worst enemies)…. But we see that present generation of Jews are
repeating the same mistakes…. It seems they are true descendants of
their forefathers….and must face the same consequences.

Q73 Alex (Jews don’t, 144)

There are more jews outside israel than there are in israel. i think you are wrong about gods plan
but why don't you shoot yourself and ask him in person...

ANS.
Number of Jews outside Israel are smaller and they are also getting
attracted to move to Israel. I think in near future US and Israel will be
the only country with significant Jewish population.

Since US has tied its future irrevocably with Israel, US security and
existence is les important for many US citizens than the security of
Israel…. It should not be surprised if same fate awaits US as it waits
Israel.

God’s plan is known only to Him, but He has provided some hints about
it thru our prophets and prophets of old. Much of that is recorded in
our books and their books.

There is no need for me to know EXACT dates when it shall be

accomplished… by shooting myself I will not gain anything new!!

Q74 Alex (Jews don’t, 145)

did you say you wanted things in israel to go back to 1900 or so back than muslims were only
about 10% of the population of Jerusalem.
muslims are the foreign invaders that came flooding Jerusalem to take it out of the jewish
majority ownership and later on occupied it by force with the Jordanian army destroying the
jewish neighborhood and synagogues and expelling and ethnically cleansing the eastern side from
jews.

ANS.

I think you should remember that Muslims did not take Jerusalem from
Jews and evicted them.

That was done by Roman Empire in 70 AD and Christians did not allow
Jews to return to Jerusalem when they ruled there from 325 CE upto
650 CE, when Muslims came there.

If you want to go that back in History, then remember Jews were also
not the original inhabitants of Palestine. They were also invaders who
took possession of land of others.

In the same way, all people of North and South America, Australia ,
New Zealand etc they all are invaders occupying lands of others.

You should use same laws for every one, not a special law for Jews and
another for Non Jews.

Q75 Alex (Messianic, 322)

funny i was thinking about the exact same thing israel after being attacked from all directions by
Palestinians Jordanians Egyptians Syrian Iraqis, should let bygones be bygones and give back the
land as if nothing happened?
but i was thinking more in the way of you and your partner travel and finish a big business deal at
night he trys to stab you to death while you are sleeping and steal the money. you manage to
overcome him and in the morning he says ahh let by bygones be bygones...what were we saying,
50-50 right?

ANS.

I was explaining to the gentleman the situation around the time for
War of Trench in Medina and Treachery of the jewish Tribe…

Now you jump to the situation of present day Israel…. First you should
know that the present day Israel are the aggressors themselves and
not the victims in the least!!

These are the fellows who came from thousands of miles, drove out
our brothers from their homes and lands and occupied it for
themselves.\

Now when these poor people, ask their homes and lands back, they are
treated as terrorists and extremists and subjected to all kinds of
brutalities!!

It is Israel which is saying “let bygones be bygones….let me keep all

the land and all the houses that I stole…lets us make friendship….. and
you vacate any land that I may need in future”

This is “Friendship an Peace Terms” they are demanding!!

It was you cheek to compare this situations with when Muslims were
overwhelmed from all directions from enemies who “came for Outside”
to attack them!!

Q76 Alex (Messianic, 325)

ok if things are so bad for them in Israel why is it that palestine Arabs got so outraged when
politicians like libermen offered to move some Arab Israeli towns to the Palestinian authority?
no one was to be evicted of his home? no refugees just instead of being treated "bad" by the
jewish government they would be under their own peoples government in a free palestine. does
that sound like a normal behavior for people which are abused?

ANS.

I am not familiar with day to day politics of Palestine or bickering

between the two.
I only discuss the broad issues.

Arabs are naturally “suspicious” of any Israeli move….because they

have much more experience of their tactics…..the have dealt with
them for many decades now.

They know that every Jewish and Israeli move has a hidden
agenda….so first they have to prove their sincerity and eagerness to
broker a “Honest and real peace” and not like a checkered board
game.

Q77 Alex (Messianic, 325)

moving a few arab Israeli towns under Palestinian control in a 1:1 land exchange for settlement
blocs and those Israeli Arabs that choose to maintain their Israeli ID are free to sell their house
and move anywhere they want in israel. giving lands outside the 67 borders for land kept by israel
in the west bank and reducing the numbers of people that have to be forced out of their homes,
how is that not right?

ANS.

I told you I am not interested in day to day politics between Israel and
Palestinians.

I know both parties are suspicious of each other. They feel , You have
a hidden agenda to deprive of them of their homes and lands for
ever…

And you think that they have a secret agenda of destroying israel for
ever…

In this atmosphere of mutual distrust, how they can accept blindly any
proposal coming from Jewish side?

You have to first make the climate of mutual trust….by talking honestly
with them….putting your cards on table…not hiding yours and asking
them to accept whatever comes from your side.

Your intention for Palestinian Free State is clear that “It cannot have
Advanced Weapons like Air planes….”

Why?

How will it defend against its enemies? Israeli planes will be at ease to
come and destroy their Parliament, Assembly and homes any time
they wish!!

What about Israel abandoning its army and air force in lieu of
GURANTEE from all Arab states that it will remain within fixed secure
borders that were allotted to it in 1948?

Why there should be a separate law for Palestinians and separate for
Jews?

Q78 Alex (Israel, 699)

Terrorist supporters like you will always try to find excuse why it is ok for muslims to murder
innocent civilians.
if all bets are off than stop whining about every little thing israel does. if Palestinians have the
right to do anything in their means to take control of our land why do expect israel to just take it
without response.

ANS.

I have mentioned many times that I am not a terrorist supporter. I

condemn all type of terrorism, but I find that armies and nations are
the biggest terrorists.

In the garb of Nationalism and Love of nation, they do and allow their
armies to do the most appalling acts of terrorism and these acts are
then supported by these governments. If Governments be true to their
pledge to remove terrorism from the face of the earth, then they
should also act themselves what they preach and control their armies
and police force.

That is the main reason, while spending billions of Dollars and killing of
hundreds of thousands of terrorist in the world, terrorism is always on
the rise.

I am not whining against Israel’s terrorism against Palestinian, I am

whining against the double standard that world adopts in this regard.
They condone one party and give them free reign to do whatever they
like and they try to condemn and restraint the party who is the real
sufferer.

How could we remove the menace of terrorism by using this double

standard?

Q79 Alex (Israel, 705)

`doesn't it seems strange to you that the Palestinians want to cut the land of israel into 2 countries
but that the Palestinians now living abroad will be moved in to the jewish part and not Palestinian
part. if self definition is so important to the Palestinians why wouldn't they want to live with their
own in palestine.
you can't have to both ways

ANS.

Palestinians want to live in the lands and homes in which their fathers
and forefathers were living. It does not matter in which part of
Palestine that land lies.

If European Jews living in Europe for 2000 years has a birth right and
inheritance in land which their forefathers held. How can you deny
similar rights to those Palestinians.

We want to have it the way it was before 1917, when millions of Jews
swarmed to Palestine form all parts of the world to evict Palestinians
living there for 1200 years.

Q80 Alex (Israel, 709)

the muslim are doing us a favor? so you are finally admitting that "Palestinians" are just an
invention to try and destroy israel. its all an arab muslim collective we are dealing with, if its the
muslims that are doing us a favor. otherwise no one really cares what you muslims think and no
one cares about what favors you think you are doing because you have no relation or any rights
over israel its between us and the Palestinians.

ANS.

Yes if Arabs are allowing Jews to “walk away” with the loot they did in
1948, then indeed they are doing them a favor.

I wish the Israel issue was really a Muslim-Jew Issue. Due to the idiocy
of Arab Leaders it is presented as a local ME problem.

You enjoy your sleep till the problem gets out from being a local
problem.

Q81 Alex (Israel, 710)

thats the diffrent between you and i. you don't really give a damn about the Palestinians and you
couldn't care less if they live in the gutters for another 1000 years. like typical muslim all you
care about is you pride and your bruised ego. you can't stand the fact that where once muslims
ruled now the jews are in charge.
the Israelis are offering Palestinians a chance for a normal life like every other country in the
world but you like most muslim warmongers are willing to fight to the last drop of Palestinian
blood, heck its not you who is paying the price so why should you care? after all Allah promised
you a happy ending right...

ANS.

I really appreciate your “love and goodwill” shown towards

Palestinians, why you just change your name to an Arab and enjoy all
that “benefits” of being a loyal subject of Israel living in Gaza!!

Yes the freedom and self determination is often worth more than the
mere luxuries of life. The life of a faithful dog does not suit every one.
May be it is the Jewish idea to live and survive any how, it is not what
Islam teaches us.

We are ready to go back to pre-1917 level, that we expel all Foreign

Jews from Palestine, that all Jews who came from Muslim lands return
back there and Israel is dissolved and Palestinians gain control of their
land. The question is that if Jews are ready for that?

You want to have your cake and eat it also!!

Q82 Alex (Israel, 710)

that’s the different between you and i. you don't really give a damn about the Palestinians and
you couldn't care less if they live in the gutters for another 1000 years. like typical muslim all you
care about is you pride and your bruised ego. you can't stand the fact that where once muslims
ruled now the jews are in charge.
the Israelis are offering Palestinians a chance for a normal life like every other country in the
world but you like most muslim warmongers are willng to fight to the last drop of Palestinian
blood, heck its not you who is paying the price so why should you care? after all allah promised
you a happy ending right...

ANS.
I really appreciate your “love and goodwill” shown towards
Palestinians, why you just change your name to an Arab and enjoy all
that “benefits” of being a loyal subject of Israel living in Gaza!!
Yes the freedom and self determination is often worth more than the
mere luxuries of life. The life of a faithful dog does not suit every one.
May be it is the Jewish idea to live and survive any how, it is not what
Islam teaches us.
We are ready to go back to pre-1917 level, that we expel all Foreign
Jews from Palestine, that all Jews who came from Muslim lands return
back there and Israel is dissolved and Palestinians gain control of their
land. The question is that if Jews are ready for that?
You want to have your cake and eat it also!!

Q83 Alex (Israel, 735)

so the jews were so horrible to the Palestinians taking their land and making refugees of some of
them. but its ok to deport millions of jews out of their homes and the country they built? why
should Palestinians feast on the lands and homes jews have built? what’s the difference?
how about this deal Arabs will be allowed to live only in the land of Arabs, Saudi Arabia and will
be deported from all other lands they expended into, sounds just as fair.

ANS.
If you want to go by ancient history books, then Jews should only get a
very tiny part of land of Palestine (which their forefathers Abraham,
Isaac and Jacob) held there.
If it is all right in you r own view for millions of Jews to migrate into the
land of Palestine and evict Muslims living there for more that 1200
years, what is wrong if those Jews are driven back to their countries
and Arabs take possession of their lands after mere 60 years?

Jews can take their homes with them while going, we do not want to
live in them at all!!
If Arabs have to come back to their natural lands, what about all
Europeans to vacate South America, North America, Australia, New
Zealand and other territories they occupied during past 400 years?
You should begin with the lasts cases first and not with the oldest ones.
Is it not fair?
Why should you have a different rules for Jews and White race and
another for Arabs and Muslims in general?

Q84 Alex (Israel, 736)

ok lets begin with the last cases bring back the thousands of jews who were evicted from their
homes in the gaza strip.
i still can't understand how can you say a thing like "Why should you have a different rules for
Jews and White race and another for Arabs and Muslims in general?"
whine about arabs in 1948 and demand to do the same to jews now... hypocrisy at its best…

ANS.
Why not start at 1917…when these jews came from Europe and took
possession of lands belonging to some one else!!

When some one is evicted from the property of some one else, what
happens to him? Check with any court.

You want to take wheel of history any years back, I do not mind, but
apply it on every one, not only on Jews.

If Jews claims of 2000 years old are valid, then why not other nation’s
who are 200-500 years old.

Only Jews living in Palestine before 1917, have RIGHT to remain there
and even have their own state there (the land should be portioned in
proportion to their population pre-1917).

That is Justice and that is equity. Any thing else is the law of Jungle.

Q85 Alex (Israel, 739)

so you still haven't answered me if we are going back to 1917 we can deport all the muslims out
of Jerusalem since they were a tiny minority of the city’s population back then.
so in 100 years the jews you want to deport now out of israel could claim for justice only if they
are allowed back to the country they built?
"When some one is evicted from the property of some one else, what happens to him? Check with
any court."
so you agree with the Israeli court that is evicting illegal muslim squatters in east Jerusalem that
took over jewish homes in 1948 when you muslims evicted the legal owners of the city and
burned down holly sites.

ANS.

Why only 1917, even prior to 1967 Jerusalem was a majority Muslim
population city.

The Israel will never be justified, since from the day European Jews set
foot there, Arabs have been complaining and lodged their protest.
Their struggle for freedom is one continuous struggle.

The position is different for Jews, who once evicted by Romans in 70

CE, never carried out their claim or struggle against Romans. They
resigned to their fate and accepted their wandering status.

In the same way, when Muslims conquered that land from Byzantine, in
650 CE, they abandoned their claim and resigned to Muslim rule .

The efforts they made during Crusade wars were a feeble effort and
whence they lost to Muslims in 1099, they abandoned their claim for
ever.

So Muslims are defacto and de juro rulers of the land.

The present occupation by Jews is similar to what Crusaders achieved

in 1000 CE. They were thrown out in 1099 CE.

Let us see, how long Jews last. But if they continue with their bully like
attitude, they sure would be thrown out of Palestine.

This is as clear as day light. No kingdom or nation based on

Oppression, Tyranny, Injustice and mischief can continue for long time.

And the present Zionist state of Israel is all these things personified. It
has to have but a short leaf of life!!.

Only hope for them is to some how, any how make peace with Arabs
and Palestinians to get some longer leash of life!!

The repercussion otherwise shall be very painful (Jews already know

that, they have been chastised number of times in their long history of
4000 years).

What a pity for otherwise so talented people, so educated….their

Racism has done them in….if they would have believed in Jesus…they
would be controlling most of the world….had they believed in our
prophet….well they would have got WHOLE land of Palestine for
EVER!!!

But the price of in-equity is grief. Some how Jews always choose the
path of inequity when choice is given to them!!
Q86 Alex (Israel, 744)

Jews in the 19th century were concentrated in Jerusalem Hebron safed and tiberias and most of
the were in Jerusalem.
look how demographic changes in arab country’s how the population of Egypt multiplies every
few years how the Christians that not so long ago were the overwhelming majority in lebanon
will soon be the minority. so things in almost 2000 years things can't change for jews in their
holly city?
i didn't say jews were the majority in palestine but they were the majority in Jerusalem and
together with the numbers of Christians they were the overwhelming majority of the city…..
.
ANS.

You did not understand my objection. When Jerusalem was Holy to

Muslims and they took it after lot of struggle with Crusaders, how could
the allow Jews to become Majority and Dominant force there?

On one hand you tell us that Muslims discriminated against jews and
did so many bad things to them….

Then how come they allowed Jews to become majority in the holiest
site for all Muslims?

The demographics changed in Egypt, Lebanon, Syria and Jordan

etc…..because the people there converted to Islam in hordes.

The same way whole Europe and Roman Empire changed from pagan
to Christian!!
The reason that Jerusalem was always holy to Muslims is PROVED by
the Existence of Al Aqsa Mosque and Dome of the Rock which were
constructed around 1300 ago.

Al Aqsa mosque is mentioned in Quran 1400 years ago.

If Jerusalem is not holy to Muslims then why there were Crusades or

present tussle between Jews and Muslims?

You have a mind which is fed with Jewish propaganda and you do not
listen to reason.
Q87 Anikitos (Messianic, 323)

Palestine, Israel, and Jordan have not existed prior to the division and redistribution of land after
WW2. Palestinians and Jordanians are same people. Why doesn't Jordan wants to take them and
allow them to get away from the refugee status? Why didn't they do this after Arab countries
around the Jewish state attacked Israel in the first war? Israel took all of the Jews that had to leave
Jordan.

ANS.

This is a strange logic. There was no Israel prior to WW-2. All the land
was under Arabs and Muslims. Jews , Christians and Muslims were
living together in peace and there was no problem….

WW-1 Ends and Britain get their foothold in Palestine….they allow

millions of Jews to immigrate to Palestine and start taking possession
of land from Arabs, Christians and Muslims…

Then in 1948 (end of WW-2) they divide palestine into two parts (50-50
division) one part for Arabs and another for Jews. Jews who accounted
for only 10 % land prior to WW-1 now get 50 % , five time their share!!

Jews from all adjoining areas “migrate” to their new homeland.

Now Jews also want their share in the land of Jordan, Syria and
elsewhere too!!

Any better example that “Have your cake and eat it also”!!

You must marvel at the working of jewish minds and their “gullible
Christian Friends”!!

Q88 Anikitos (Messianic, 324)

Wrong, land was not divided 50/50. Israel was given 7% of the land. Rest was given to Arabs.
The initial land given to Jews was really tiny. You are forgetting to include Jordan in this
distribution.
Arabs then have attacked Israel, and lost large chunks of their land to the attacked country,
furthermore they have balls to call a victim in this.
Instead of Jordan taking in refugee Arabs from lost lands, they have forbidden them into entering
the country. Israel on the other hand routinely give Arabs citizenship. Muslim Arabs, Jew Arabs,
Christian Arabs. How many Jews live in Saudi Arabia? Better yet, how many jews live in all
Muslim countries in the middle east? Compare that to Muslim Arab population that live in Israel.
ANS.

ANY land acquired by Israel since 1948, is illegal and against UN

resolutions. So all of that land must be returned.
If Israel was given 7 % of the land by Britain (which is 100 % wrong
according to me), then they should have only 7 % of the land and no
more!!

The Arab refugees are those who were forced out By Israel from its
portion of the lands and why should any other Arab state take them
back?

There has been NO JEW in Saudi Arabia for past 1400 years, why
should Saudi Arabia take some Jews into its country? What is this type
of logic?

Which ever Jews and Christians are living in Muslim countries they are
all living in peace. I never hear that they are brutalized and victimized.

You can say that Jews are the WORST Rulers and the BEST Subjects,
while we can say that MUSLIMS are the BEST rulers and the WORST
subjects.

So why not change the roles, so that world can live in peace!! Let
every one do the role, he or she is BEST in it?

Is it not logical?

Q89 Barbara (Messianic, 322)

You are a hypocrite or need to try a lot harder "Not to wrong any one in speech". I refer to this
comment you made:
"if by Jews it means, some one who deals in Usury, Pornography and hate literature against a
major world religion, "

You have made a blanket, bigoted statement. You have wronged an entire group of people based
on your prejudices. I would never condemn every Muslim based on the actions of the fanatics.
ANS.

Thank you for calling me a hypocrite…. Who could judge better a

hypocrite than another hypocrite?

I gave you several meaning of the word jew…. And gave you choice.
Why you pick the bad ones?

With every wrong choice , I gave you a right choice also. It is upto you,
to put you into wrong slot or right slot.

By your emotional outburst, it seems that you put yourself in each of

the wrong slots and now trying to prove that I am a hypocrite!!

Q90 Big Joe (Israel, 700)

Only one problem you have no chance of a military victory zero. Israel's neighbours aren't
interested in full scale war with Israel as they already know it's futile something you fail to see.
You preach jihad and suicide attacks do us all a favor and blow yourself up like your jihadist
brothers and go to your fanatic paradise.

ANS.

The chances of Military Victory keep on changing with time… no

country or military remains “Invincible” for ever. So the Military
fortunes keep changing with time. We have to show perseverance and
patience to reach our goal.

I know Israel would love a short all out attack against all its
neighboring countries… so that it could gain some land and then UN
will intervene and enforce a ceasefire and Israel will attack the
captured land to Greater Israel”… That was the tactics going on in the
wars of 1948, 1956 & 1967…. Where a better equipped and more
mobile Israeli army win swift short term victory against ill equipped, les
mobile armies of Arab Neighbors.

But now Arabs have become smarter… any future war with Israel will
be open ended… No ceasefire until one party is victorious or
exterminated…. On short term Gorilla type warfare shall be used
against Israel to increase their fatigue.

Every one likes to fight according to his strong points. Israel likes a
short all out war and Arabs a long dragged on war..

Q91 Big Joe (Israel, 701)

Our goal? Have you become an honorary Arab recently? Your dreams you speak of, this all out
war of extermination is a pipe dream and nonsense.
The Arab nations are not interested in your total war desires with Israel, Jordan and Egypt have
peace treaties. Nuclear weapons also deter these ideas.
Israel is here to stay whether you like it or not the final borders between the two states are yet to
be agreed upon it's that simple.

ANS.

I know the Arab leaders are divided amongst themselves and are more
interested in scoring points over each other.
That is the main reason for Israel’s superiority that we see today.

But the bulk of Arab population does not agree with the actions of their
leaders and there is strong undercurrent to unite all of them under one
banner.

When there is a strong desire amongst common people, it is only a

spark that is needed to throw out these divided leadership and join
ranks to fight the common enemy of them all “The Zionist state of
Israel”

You may call it a pipe dream…. The same was the situation in 1899
when Jews started the ides of homeland for Jews in Palestine!!

Q92 Big Joe (Israel, 708)

Only one problem who is going to get Israel to go back to your pre-Israeli existence 1948
borders? These conquest dreams are nothing but absurd pipe dreams there is no chance of it who
is going to attack and wipe out Israel? And what about Israeli's nuclear arsenal nobody is going to
take them on like i said before your wasting your time.
The two state solution is the only realistic answer but then i am talking to an unrealistic person
why would i expect anything logical?
ANS.

If Israel going back to pre-1948 or pre-1017 borders looks like a “pipe

dream” to you, then with hindsight the following events would also
have been “pipe dreams”

1. That Jews would return back to Palestine was a “Pipe Dream” in

1800.

2 That Jews would take control of Jerusalem would have been a “Pipe
Dream” in 1948.

3. That USSR will loose in Afghanistan and will breakup would have
been “Pipe Dream” in 1970 s.

4. That US will loose Vietnam war and come back empty handed with
eggs on their faces would have been a “Pipe Dream” in 1950 s.

5. That British Empire would shrink back to Island of England would

have been a “Pipe Dream” in 1900

All these events would have been “Pipe Dream”, but we KNOW they all
became reality.

So do not count too much on invincibility of Israel.

One thing is certain, any Kingdom formed on the basis of Oppression,
Tyranny, Injustice, Intrigue and Mischief has but a short leash of life.

That is the proven fact of History and Right now Zionist state of Israel
is Oppression, tyranny, injustice and mischief personified, so it must
have a short leash of life, that much I KNOW!!

Q93 Big Joe (Israel, 708)

But did not the Muslims invade vast portions of the Middle East conquering nations one after
another? The land grab and Muslim indoctrination is obvious isn't it?

Israel exits and is a member of the United Nations it's not going anyware and it gets stronger by
the day your wasting your time.

ANS.

Yes Muslim armies did invade many countries and expanded their
domain. This is a fact of history. And Muslims are not the only people
who did it. All nations , Britain, France, Germany, Italy, Spain, Dutch,
USA all are guilty of the same crime.

So why you single out only Muslims. Jews also did the same. But we
are not discussing old history, we are discussing modern history.

If you want to justify Israel’s existence only on force, we have no

objection, but then Muslims also have a full right to take back
whichever lands were taken from them.

Our goal will then be pre-1917 position. In fact Muslims are doing Jews
a great favor by asking them to return to pre-1948 borders!!!

Israel being member of UNO is neither here nor there…. Taiwan was
also once member of UNO known as CHINA… USSR also was once a
member of UNO…. So were Yugoslavia, Chez Slovakia and many
others…. Where are these countries now?

UNO membership is no guarantee for survival of any nation!!

Q94 Chris ( Israel, 693)

As i am looking from the outside being of neither religion. I am of the religion of open
mindedness. It is not recognized and nor is it of any specific faith,

What are you fighting fir? A piece of land in israel? There will be no land left if nuclear weapons
are used. This is clearly going to be the case very shortly and it is sad, as the majority of
population in both areas have more of a watered down feeling and view of the situation that the
few are furiously creating i.e.gov erning bodies of both countries.

I now think that the only solution would be that no one lives in Israel. And both countries
population visit the country when thier religion requires them to. So next problem, how do you re
house a population? Your thoughts?
ANS.

You have indeed opened a totally new solution that we should de-
populate the whole land of Palestine and keep the land as empty.

This is indeed a strange solution and has never been tried in the
history and I doubt if any one will really try it.

In my view Nuclear arms are not used for winning or loosing ay war.
They were successful in WW-2, because neither Germany nor Japan
had it. If any of those countries also had Nuclear Bombs, I doubt if US
would have used it in war.

The situation where one party has it and another not, is alarming,
because the party having is shall always act as bully. This is human
nature and you cannot change it. In my view UN and US had to be
blamed for allowing Israel to quietly have Nuclear capability and at the
same time stopping Arab states and Iran of having the same.

That was double standard and bigotry and it will be not successful for
more time. Sooner or later all Arab states including Iran shall have
nuclear capabilities.

The solution for Palestine lies in deporting those Jews who migrated
there after 1917 to their native countries and dividing the land
according to population of pre-1917 levels.
Q95 Concerned Citizen (Jews don’t, 151)

And I will add that Palestinians will also have a right to holy lands as well. But not this way.
Terrorism must cease, hamas ousted and Israel recognized. Otherwise, Israel has a right to defend
it's population, Arabs and jews alike. I would love to see a thriving Gaza where tourists can visit
and dump their money into the local population. But when terrorists run amuck, it makes it kind
of hard to achieve peace.
ANS.
I like you approach that Terrorism must end. But can you tell us who
started this Terrorism and what is its history?

If you trace its route, you will find that Israel is the main cause of this
terrorism and is the main perpetrator and instigator of these acts.

Palestinians were the victims for many decades and it is only now that
they have also started having some rudimentary sort of armaments.

So if you to realize your wish, there should be some way to restrain

other side also.

What guarantee we have from Israel that it will make Real Peace with
these Palestinians and agree to their justified demands.

It should be give and take and not only take and take.
Q96 Concerned Citizen (Jews don’t, 155)

You would have some credibility if you also acknowledged that Arabs have committed offenses
just as bad if not worse. But you only criticize Israel as if the Arabs are completely innocent in
this. Sorry, but your hate shines through very clearly.

ANS.

I do not take sides. I do not say that some Arabs did not take part in
violence. I am all for them to be apprehended and punished for their
crimes.

But it should not be one sided. Jews and Israeli army personnel who
also did acts of violence and terrorism must face the same penalty.

You should not have two laws in the same country, one for Jews and
Jewish army and another for the hapless Arabs.
Then Arabs are the suffering party….because they were kicked out
from their lands and homes. They have more reason for anger and
grievances against Jews.
As victims they have certain more rights than the aggressors….but in
this world the rules are reversed. The aggressors get more protection
and sympathy and victims get nothing but hate and more aggression!!
Q97 Dave (Israel, 708)
Being a Native American, I am thankful to NOT be in 95 percentile. Israel, Like the Phoenix rose
from the ashes of oppression, The Madness of Hitler and Genocide to become a peace loving
State. ever think for an instant that these people will lie down like dogs or go out with a whimper.
AND YOU DO NOT SPEAK FOR ME! I SPEAK FOR MYSELF!

ANS.

If you choose to be not with 95 %, then you must be in that minority of

5 % who are warmongers and egg on USA to find military solution to
every problem.

These 5 % were spearheaded by the late and unlamented former US

President GWB the Great. That age is gone, so you should reflect how
much USA has lost and is loosing and will continue to loose by that
approach.

To say that Israel is a peace loving country is being economical with

the truth. From the first wave of Jewish immigrants to Palestine in
1917 till the present day, Israel is known as a bully in the region. It
believes in “War for Peace” theory of GWB the Great and its cronies.

Just because they survived for 4000 years prove nothing… why only
Jews, Egyptians, Hindus, Chinese, Arabs … so many people have
survived for more that 4000 years and are still living and controlling
their lands and nations. Why it is such a big deal if Jews have also
survived for more than 4000 years.

Q98 Ehav (Jews Don’t, 85)

God allowed to us to kick the people in Canaan, like he allowed to kick the Palestinians from our
Holy Land.

you can keep with your worthless hate and propaganda, you think that will get you somewhere??
you just wasting your time, instead of it you can learn, study, work, find a woman, be with her, go
out with friends, go to a club, movie, bowling, go see a game, play Play station or Wii.

don't you think it's better?

I am proud of being Jewish, if i wasn't Jewish i was killing myself. i prefer to die as Jew and to
live as Non-Jew….

ANS.

At least you have courage to speak the truth!! That it is God which
allowed you to kick the butts of people of Canaan in the past and the
present day Palestinians.
Going by the same logic, it was the same God which allowed Hitler to
kick your buts in near past and Nebuchadnezzar and Titus some times
earlier in the past.

Then why should you blame Hitler and Nazism, and create ridiculous
laws like Anti Semitism?

Nothing happens in this Universe without the consent of God… then

why should we have all this police, army and laws etc?

Every one should love one’s country and try to protect it. But loving
your country does not mean that you hate other countries? Preserving
your right does not mean that you trample on rights of other people.

You should love your country, but should not worship it. This extreme
nationalism has already resulted in two World Wars and many more
are possible unless this type of nationalism is kept in check.

Only achievement of Jews is that they have survived…. So have

cockroaches and weasels and rats…..and also Loins and Tigers and
leopards. It depends how you survive?

Q99 Ehav (Israel, 678)

There is much I disagree with regarding Israel. And Islam. And here. But when the line is drawn.
I will always be pro-Israel. For Biblical reasons. If I let my own personal feelings draw me, I
would have deep discontempt for all mankind.

Has their not been a nation, or or Kingdom that has not oppressed? No. Even the radical arm of
Islam does so. America does so. People do so to each other.

ANS.

Why should be Pro-Israel when the chips are down?

Why cant you be Pro-truth and Pro-justice and Pro-peace?

Why Biblical background should program you for doing injustice and
wrongs to other people? I do not think that Bible teaches you to do
that.
Just because people oppress each other or nations do to other nations,
it dos not become a right thing to do.

So we should keep our conscience clear and always support truth,

Justice and peace and oppose Oppression, tyranny and injustice…
irrespective of who is doing it.

Jews,

Christians

Or Muslims?

Q100 Eric (Jews don’t, 143)

The problem is that no one was evicted. An eviction is where one is forced to leave. No one was
forced to leave. The partition allowed all to remain where they were. The Arabs could remain in
the area under Jewish control with their lands and belongings. The Jews could remain in the area
under Arab control with their lands and belongings. The Arabs sought to grab the Jewish
controlled area. They lost. Some if not most of the Arabs decided to leave Israeli controlled areas
voluntarily. No one was forced to leave. Once they left, it was under normal peace negotiations
when and if they were to return. But, when the Arab leaders decided not to enter into normal
peace negotiations, those that voluntarily left suffered. The Arabs that remain in Israel are full
citizens. There are Arabs in the Knesset.

If the Arabs who voluntarily left have a gripe about their plight, it should be with their leaders
who sought war instead of peace.
ANS.

To say that no one was evicted is really being economical with truth.
Do you think that we are little children and will just believe what you
write?

Division of one country into two parts is not such an unheard of event.
We have had North and South Vietnam, North and South Yemen, East
and West Germany, We still have north and south Korea.

Was in any country the bulk of population was imported from other
parts of the world? Or was it only realignment of existing people?

The case of Israel and Jews is totally different, bulk of its population
was imported from Europe and other parts of the world. The people
living there were made to appear as a minority and the land was
equally divided into two halves.
The Jews who were less than 10 % of population before 1917, got 50 %
of the land and you are standing here and telling me that there was no
eviction and no injustice was done.

Even if Arabs left voluntarily why cant they return back? When you
give rights to Jews who were forcefully evicted 2000 years back to
come back why cant those Arabs come back to their own land which
they left during war?

Was Arab Israel the only war in which people left their lands during
war? There have been many such cases and in each of which people
come back to their lands and homes when the fighting ends?

It seems every issue dealing with Jews becomes special and

preferential treatment has to be given to them in every case.

As a Jew I can appreciate your stand on this tilted justice, but when
Christian and others try to justify this stand it looks comical to say the
least.

Q101 Eric (Jews don’t, 143)

The problem is that no one was evicted. An eviction is where one is forced to leave. No one was
forced to leave. The partition allowed all to remain where they were. The Arabs could remain in
the area under Jewish control with their lands and belongings. The Jews could remain in the area
under Arab control with their lands and belongings. The Arabs sought to grab the Jewish
controlled area. They lost. Some if not most of the Arabs decided to leave Israeli controlled areas
voluntarily. No one was forced to leave. Once they left, it was under normal peace negotiations
when and if they were to return. But, when the Arab leaders decided not to enter into normal
peace negotiations, those that voluntarily left suffered. The Arabs that remain in Israel are full
citizens. There are Arabs in the Knesset.

ANS.

To say that no one was evicted is really being economical with truth.
Do you think that we are little children and will just believe what you
write?

Division of one country into two parts is not such an unheard of event.
We have had North and South Vietnam, North and South Yemen, East
and West Germany, We still have north and south Korea.

Was in any country the bulk of population was imported from other
parts of the world? Or was it only realignment of existing people?

The case of Israel and Jews is totally different, bulk of its population
was imported from Europe and other parts of the world. The people
living there were made to appear as a minority and the land was
equally divided into two halves.

The Jews who were less than 10 % of population before 1917, got 50 %
of the land and you are standing here and telling me that there was no
eviction and no injustice was done.

Even if Arabs left voluntarily why cant they return back? When you
give rights to Jews who were forcefully evicted 2000 years back to
come back why cant those Arabs come back to their own land which
they left during war?

Was Arab Israel the only war in which people left their lands during
war? There have been many such cases and in each of which people
come back to their lands and homes when the fighting ends?

It seems every issue dealing with Jews becomes special and

preferential treatment has to be given to them in every case.

As a Jew I can appreciate your stand on this tilted justice, but when
Christian and others try to justify this stand it looks comical to say the
least.

Q102 Eric (Jews don’t, 144)

Muq

I never intimated that the land was substandard. I said that if the Arab inhabitants wanted a nation
(since they had none previously) they were given one in 1948 on which they could flourish if they
had wanted to. They did not. They wanted to wage war instead. They lost. Their leaders would
not negotiate peace because they wouldn't recognize the right of those who were attacked to exist.

If the Arab inhabitants have a beef, they should take it up with their leadership who sold them a
bill of goods and didn't deliver. They could have celebrated the 60th anniversary of their nation in
2008 also.
ANS.

Thanks for your advise. You have already decided in FAVOR of

ISRAEL !!

That they had a RIGHT to get half of the land of Palestine. Thanks for
showing this generosity and charity on behalf of Arabs!!

You can gift any amount of land that does not belong to you to any one
you like to wish!! And then put the blame squarely on the other party!!

The blame lies with Arabs one way or other. Why they disputed
Creation of Arabs and why they waged the war.

The Jews were like lambs, poor fellows, without any means , just
hanging out for whatever piece of land came their way. Hungry,
uneducated people, just free from the Gas Chambers.

That is the image which you want to paint for the two sides. Have you
worked in films by any chance?
Q103 Eric (Jews don’t, 144)
The problem as to why they haven't been able to return is their leadership. After a war if the
refuges are to return is part of the peace negotiation process. If their leaders won't come to the
peace negotiation table because they do not want to recognize Israel, then what is to be done?

Again, if the Palestinians have a problem they need to take it up with their leaders who refused to
negotiate peace in 1948.

Think of how great a nation the Palestinians could have been if they would have lived in peace
with their neighbors on far more land than they now request, or at least if they would have
negotiated peace with the Israelis after they got their tushes kicked in 1948.

ANS.

This is a very strange logic for not doing anything!!

The Palestinians were denied justice when Palestine was portioned into
two halves by Britain and Israel is using every pretext to block any real
peace initiative on one pretext or other.
How great a nation Palestine would have become or will become will be
judged by the future generations.

May be the Crusaders would also have “advised” local population what
“benefits” they will reap to accept the “new masters”. But after 99
years it was made clear who the real masters were.

I do not think that military superiority or military defeats (that two

when dice were heavily loaded against them from the start), is
justification to accept falsehood as truth.
Q104 Eric (Jews Don’t, 146)
You need to stop reinventing history. No one turned anyone out at all. All could stay. No one was
to lose their land. All Arab inhabitants of the area were guaranteed their continued ownership of
the land. Unfortunately, some if not most of the Arabs living in the area decided that since their
leaders waged war and lost that the inhabitants should leave. No one told them to leave. They
could have lived there. Some did remain and are citizens now.

You cite nothing to back your premise that the Arabs were turned out. Because it never happened.
ANS.

I think you will be the person who will decide (after a few decades) that
never ever was anything like WW-1 and WW-2!!

Just close your eyes and imagine nothing ever happened.

If you think that the land of Palestine was a vast desert in which
millions of European Jews settled themselves without touching any
one’s nerves….then let me say that you are wrong.

Read news papers from Arabian countries from 1917 -1947 and you
will see in them nothing but complaints against jews atrocities and
undue favor given to them by US and UK.!!

With all this contemporary data available, I really marvel your cheek to
say that nothing ever happened in ME and all were palls.

We can also say that there were no wars in 1948, 1956, 1967, and
1973, can we?
So let the slate be wiped clean and let us forget and forgive every
thing. Jews stay with their loot and Arabs with their loss?

That is justice according to you and like minded persons like you. Is it?

Q105 Eric (Jews don’t, 319)

Can you offer us a citation to the fact that Muslim people lost their lands and homes to the Jewish
settlers between 1917 and 1947?[I take that you mean that they were forced out.] Or did the Jews
settle on unoccupied, unwonted lands? Or did the Jews buy land and homes from the current
owners?
Is that because the Jewish inhabitants of the Saudi peninsula were driven out or killed, especially
in the Hejazi community? Kind of a self serving opportunity. First eliminate the heterogeneous
population. Then say that the remaining population is homogeneous.

ANS.

There are many myths which Jews have concocted to justify their
claims on Palestine and one of which is that the land was a waste land,
a dump yard, a swamp, full of mosquitoes and flies and a land totally
unfit for human residence.
It were Jews who “cleaned up” swamps, killed all mosquitoes and flies,
drained all swamps . cleaned the waste accumulated over centuries of
neglect and abuse by the “illegal occupants” of the land and
transformed it into a beautiful country flowing with milk and honey!!

If some one can believe in this myth, then how can one argue with him
or convince him?
The land of Palestine was considered by Muslims as a blessed land, it
was land of prophets and Muslims felt honored to be given chance to
own it and maintain it.
If Muslims had laid the land as waste, what was the need for them to
fight tooth and nail with Crusaders in 1000 CE and not rest till they
have taken it back from them?
The beauty and grandeur of Aqsa Mosque and other old mosques in
that religion tell its own story.

Now you want documentary proof as to which piece of land was bought
by jews and which one was “taken up them from waste yard or from
dump yard” , I cannot say.
What I have is proof of protests from Muslims all over the world (and
recorded in contemporary News Papers) complaining about large scale
migration of Jews to Palestine and the problems being faced by the
indigenous population there.
This is natural, because Palestine under Muslim land was not a swamp,
was not a waste land, was not a neglected land, it was a primarily
agricultural country and full of Olive, Grapes and dates trees. A land
flowing with Honey and Milk since the time immemorial (and confirmed
by Bible too).
In no way it was different from the surrounding countries. Muslims felt
honored to go there on pilgrimage and pray in the Mosque where our
prophet is supposed to have prayed when he visited there during that
Famous Night Journey.
For Muslims the land is as holy as it is to Jews. After all we have the
same link to Prophet Abraham as Jews have. As eldest son, claim of
Ishmael and his progeny is not less than that of Isaac and his progeny!!
Q106 FC (Jews don’t, 76)
I think you are right

ANS.

Thank you Fearless Cartooni for your appreciation.

The relation between US and Israel are one sided.

US only gives, gives and gives more....and in return it only receives

grumblings....empty words of praises and abuses (if it opens it mouth
to protest against Israeli atrocities against Palestinians).

Israel only takes, takes, and demands more.... It holds no responsibility

towards US...it even spies on its biggest donor and helper...

How US people are tolerating such type of bondage?

I think they have no choice...Jews controlled Media and Financial

Institutions have US in their vice like grips.

Let us hope that US one day wakes up and breaks these bondage...and
becomes a country of FREE!!!
Now they are only FREE to follow the dictates of their Jewish Minority
and Masters.
Q07Gray (Israel, 695)
We should not support any party blindly
ANS.

I think the approach of Mr. Gray is most reasonable. We should not be

blind supporter and blind hater of any religion or religious or ethnic
group.

We should judge each one according to individual acts and should not
generalize.

What he says is that in US and Western media, there is lot of pro-Israel

and Anti- Arab bias.

This should not be, because Jews are no angels, they are as cruel as
stubborn and as oppressive as the Arabs whom they criticize day in
and day out.

So I think , this approach is very reasonable and we should support it

and try to be accommodative, instead of generalizing and demonizing
one particular group.

If this balanced approach is taken, much of misery and intolerance and

violence in the world could be removed.

Because violence and fighting is never a solution to any problem. The

solution comes only by understanding and accommodating each other.

Q108 Gray (Israel, 703)

Excellent examples but, sadly, just the tip of the iceberg. I'm disgusted that MY (AIPAC owned
and operated) government and media are complicit in the crimes of today's Master/Chosen,
Race/People and their obsession with "Greater Israel/Lebensraum etc.

For MORE of today's Master Ethnic Cleansers......well, you decide the merit of this site
But First

http://www.middle-east-info.org/take/wujshasb...

ANS.

Thanks for your appreciation. You are right, most people do not think
themselves.

They have child like faith and belief about what they see on their TV
screens and what they read in their Newspaper.

By carefully controlling these powerful mediums, the minds of common

people are tuned to accept one sided stories.

This is the main reason as to what we see in the west today… as

Individuals most people are kind and loving… but when they are
biased, they behave with a mob mentality.

Thanks for the addresses provided.

Q109 Honestly ( Jews don’t, 92)

As with all invaders and OCCUPIERS of the Holy Lands given to the Children of Israel, the
Arabs have been repelled. That's why Allah has seen that each act of aggression by the Arabs in
contrast to His Will means they lose more land.

Moslems, particularly Arab Moslems continue to defy the Will of Allah, and you know that there
is payment required for doing so. The Gulf states for example have had a 100 year run, gaining
material wealth. This is due to oil, which is running out. The Arabs will return to trying to figure
out what they can make with sand, or steal from someone else.(if you recall, Mohamed was a
caravan raider...we call such people "pirates" today)

ANS.

If we go by your logic, then Allah was happy that Jews should be

banished from Jerusalem for past 2000 years. Allah was happy that
Arabs should rule Jerusalem for past 1300 years.

Now Allah wants that Jews should take temporary possession of

Jerusalem, till Muslims improve their lot and return back to their
original spiritual level.

Arab nations might have had a tough time, or a good time… but Islam
is not for Arabs only. More than 80 percent of World Muslims are non
Arabs.

So irrespective of what is the fate of any Arab state, Islam will continue
to grow and expand, till it encompasses whole world.
Q110 JAG (Israel, 728)
Religion is often used in power plays. You should know this better than anyone. And for the
record, I was aware about British dealings in Palestine. History is my favorite subject.
As for saying the religion was all peaceful before then? Are you making a sick joke? The place
has been rioting and been invaded and re-invaded since time immemorial. It has been invaded by
the Hebrews, the Babylonians, the Egyptians, the Greeks, Macedonians, Hittittes, Romans,
Byzantines, Crusaders, Arabs, Mongols, Turks, British, French.. and a whole host of other nations
and ethnic groups too numerous to mention. And most, if not all, have run foul with one another.
And all imperial powers who have ever attempted to bring peace to the region have all failed and
made the situation worse. The Ottomans and Americans were, and have been, no less failures
than all the others.
ANS.

If history is your favorite subject, then let me tell you that your
knowledge about Islamic rule in Palestine is very limited.

What you told about the rampage and blood shed and massacres was
when Jews had their stay in that land. They lived there by sword and
they perished by sword.

Under Muslim rules the area had seen peace for more than 1200 years
when no major battle took place there (except for 100 years of
Christian occupation during Crusade).

The area has again become the byword for blood shed and violence
since the times Jews have returned there for their Third and Final
Innings!!

If you think that Americans and Europeans are trying their level best to
bring “peace” there, then I think your idea of peace is totally different
than what is understood by common people.

US and Europe act in a biased and one sided manner , their

sympathies and their support are only for Jews and for Israel. They
have never tried for just and equitable peace there.

Sorry to disappoint you, but since history is your favorite subject, you
should read both side of the story before making any decision.
Q111 JAG (Israel, 730)
To MUQ:

I don't think you fully listened to what I said earlier. Pogroms and rampant, wide spread anti-
Semitism had everything to do with it, especially in the Jewish Pale of Settlement (modern day
Poland and Ukraine) within Imperial Russia. There were rampant pogroms taking place there in
the late 19th century, which grew especially acute leading up to World War One. The Ukrainians
and Polish detested them. Russia was suspicious of them. The Germans and French grew
increasingly hostile. The British wanted nothing to do with them. The Vatican continued to
condemn them for the act of "deicide." They were universally hated in Europe, which lead to the
founding of the Zionist movement when assimilation had failed…..

ANS.

The way you have put apology for Jews, one would feel compassion on
them. But you never told why would EVERY ONE would detest Jews?

Certainly they have some traits which causes EVERY ONE to hate
them!!

The reason you have given for choosing Palestine as their RESTING
place is very weak. It is like doing Charity at some one else’s
expenses. You bask in the glory and the poor fellow suffers!!

I think you have tried your level best to put the case for Israel’s
creation. If you believe in it, then I have sympathy for you.

You say Jews do not control US media, but Rupert Murdoch does, he is
an Australian, but he is also a Jew!! All big news papers, magazines,
film distribution companies all are controlled by Jews , directly or
indirectly. I have written a monograph on that, see the following link:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/80o4976/

If Islam is misunderstood in West, a large part is played by Jews in that.

The events of 9/11 were a carefully planned conspiracy in which

Muslims were implicated. There is a growing cry in US to reopen 9/11
Investigations. The real planners and executers of that tragedy are
still at large.
But overall I think, you have a more balanced outlook and more grasp
than guys like MKOT and others. They hate Islam and Muslims, while
you are objective and not hostile to them.

How come a nation with 1.5 Billions in it would become Terrorist and
grossly lacking in every human trait?

How come such religion would continue to attract best minds from
other groups to its side?

Why would more and more people in West and world would accept
Islam despite such a virile propaganda against it?

These are the questions that need answers.

Q112 JAP (Israel, 769)

King David never got to finish building the Temple because God took his life for being a
murderer.

I would hate to put up many more cases in Israel where Jews take more than one wife today. You
see Jews and Muslims are close in biblical the "Torah and the Koran" are the same just the
Muslims added the part at the end chapter about Mohammad.{Zionist would never educate the
public about that close relationship family connected and praying to the same God/laws}

ANS.

I appreciate your post that deals with issue of similarities between

Bible and Quran…

But your post shows that you have never even opened the Quran
yourself!!

Otherwise how, you could have written such a sentence like:

“…You see Jews and Muslims are close in biblical the "Torah and the
Koran" are the same just the Muslims added the part at the end
chapter about Mohammad…”
Quran no doubt confirms past revelation of God including Torah,
Gospel and what was given to earlier prophets. But at no place it
copies any thing from Bible and adds ‘a chapter in the end about
Mohammad”!!

Yes Quran says that Islam is the religion of all prophets and they
preached the same message….but at no place there is verbatim
quotation from any book of NT or OT.

There are many things common between Jews, Christians and Muslims,
Quran says that we worship same God….the basic pillars of worship
are also same, but there is lot of difference in the ritualistic part of
them.

Polygamy:

You are right on that, Polygamy was never banned in either OT or NT

or in any of God’s revealed religion.

Monogamy is the cultural practice of White races and somehow they

have given it a religious tint. It is impossible to prove Monogamy from
any of revealed scriptures.

The practice of Polygamy is widespread in almost every community of

the world…..In West it is still going on in the name of free sex….it is
not unusual to have one wife and one or more mistress.

The case of Prince Charles or Britain and Bill Clinton of USA are prime
examples of “Effective Polygamy at highest places”!!

What could you say about “effective Polygamy at Lower level”?

Q113 Kathy Daw (Jews don’t, 155)

God — The Koran asserts that the god of Islam is the God of Christians and Jews (Sura 29:46).
Nothing could be farther from the truth.7

The god of Islam, Allah, is most definitely not the God of the Bible. Allah is presented in the
Koran as an autocratic ruler who is aloof and arbitrary (Sura 5:40). Allah is unknowable whereas
the God of the Bible is knowable (2 Timothy 1:12). Allah is impersonal, unlike the personal God
the Scriptures reveal (1 Peter 5:6-7). Allah is Unitarian (Sura 4:48) whereas the God of the Bible
is Trinitarian (2 Corinthians 13:14). Here is what the Koran says about the God of the Bible (Sura
4:171):“Believe in Allah and say not ‘Trinity.’ Cease! It is better for you! Allah is only One God.
Far is it removed from his transcendent majesty that he should have a son.” …

ANS.

I can only say that Yours or rather “Dr. David R. Reagan’s” study of
comparing Quranic and Biblical concept of God was based on a very
shallow scale.

They equated all beliefs of St. Paul and his followers as beliefs of jesus
and past Prophets.

That is why he has used quotation from St. Paul as freely as were they
were Revelation coming from God almighty or coming from lips of
jesus himself.

Nothing could be farther than the truth.

The present Pauline Concept of God is Trinity….but in the end he also

is forced to say that God is One!!

God is one was the teachings of all prophets before Jesus and we have
no knowledge of Trinity in any of the books of OT or NT.

Even the word Trinity is not to be found in any book of the Bible OT or
NT.

Therefore your logic falls flat at the first hurdle itself. Separate
quotations of Paul from jesus and then present your case.
Q114 Lion of Judah (Messianic, 322)
I can explain opposite things for all of your claims. When jews came to Israel it was all
wilderness ruin. No one can make arable and build this land like jews.
After 2000 years exile that's our time and our place . Muslims have 22 countries - non of these
countries is democracy. The territory muslims owns all the world is million times bigger. Also
there are Israeli Arabs who live in peace and study and uses our institution . they don't want to
move into their 3rd world brothers in Syria or Lebanon.
There's another reason I can tell you it's all about: God gave and god took - god is the only who
can do this.
ANS.

This is another myth perpetuated by Zionists and Jews. That whole

land of Palestine was nothing but a sewer and desert and was largely
unpopulated.

It were jews, who came , cleared the land, made it into gardens and
now Palestinians want all that back!!

Perhaps they forgot that in their Scripture , Land of Palestine is

referred to as flowing with honey and milk. I do not know from where
honey and milk comes?

From sewers and deserts most likely?

Yes your logic that God took and God gave is correct. But how do you
know that God took from us permanently and gave to you
permanently?

By all reasons jews have been possessing whole land of Palestine for
lesser period than they are out of it.

God gave you land of Palestine for the first time….. but took it away
(since you were deemed unworthy of it).

Then God gave you again the land of Palestine …but took it away
(because you were deemed unworthy of it).

Now God has given you the land for the third time….again to see that
have you changed or improved (but by all means….you have not
changed a bit from your forefathers….the land has not seen a day of
peace since you have returned……It is very clear that your days are
counted).

How many they would be that is the question? When the jews would
be judged that is the question?

Q115 Lipush ( Jews Don’t, 83)

You forgot the fact that Jerusalem is where the western wall stand, and stood LOT BEFORE El
Aqsa was built, it belonged to David and his offerings lot before the first Muslim was born. you
forget that the entire None-Muslims world acknowledge the fact that Israel belonged to the
Israelites, beside those who believed the the new twist called "Palestine".
Other religious, no matter how they deny it, both Christianity and Islam, goes hand in hand with
the holiness of Jerusalem for the Jews. No matter how the Quran choose to name us, the western
wall stands, and while denying us the right to go and pray there, Islam angers God even more.
…..

ANS.

Can you say in any way that Muslims violated the holiness of city of
Jerusalem? Muslims maintained the holiness of Jerusalem and allowed
the working and maintenance of both Jewish and Christian place of
worship during their long 1300 years rule there.

Just go thru the history and find out what Christians did to the Jewish
places of worship there? Did they rebuilt the Holy Wall of David during
their 300 years of occupation of Jerusalem?

But you see the way in which Jews are trying to damage Muslim
Mosques and historical places in the city of Jerusalem and elsewhere.

The only argument in favor of Jews is that they have taken it by force
and will do as they wish. I do not deny this argument.... but I say, do
not try to justify your actions on the basis of history, morality or logic.

You simply say that Jews have taken the city by force and they will
change it by force.... but the way Jews and Israel are trying to mislead
the world and doing propaganda it seems that Muslims never had any
right over Jerusalem or Palestine.

What Jews are doing and trying to do to change the Arabian culture
and Arab outlook around Al Aqsa Mosque is known to any one who
goes and visits that area.

If you accuse me of pro Arab bias.....then you are also not free from Pro
Israel and Anti Arab bias. We should both try to be Pro Truth and Ant1
falsehood .

Q116 Lipush (Jews Don’t, 87)

You CHOOSE to relate any problem you have in the middle east to the Jews; Believe me that we
gain nothing from being involved in your inside problems, it's a headache and we can definitely
sleep at might without is. Even if the conflicts in the Arab world have nothing to do with us,
many of your people will find a way to enter the "The Jews are to blame" thing.
Just like Iraq, just like the violence between Algeria and Egypt, and who knows what's more.
ANS.

I would like to tell you a story which I read in my Childhood. It goes

like this:

" A small boy while walking to the School , met a strange looking man
standing on the roadside. The man hailed the boy and introduced
himself as The Satan.

"The boy was alarmed and read the Islamic formula "taking refuge with
Allah against accursed Satan". The Satan said that "people
unnecessarily blame me for their own faults. They do wrong and I get
the blame, Let me give you a demonstration. Come with me and
watch.

"They walked together, till they reached the shop of a sweetmeat

seller. It was calm and quite there, the sugar syrup was boiling in a pot,
a few customers with their pets were standing in a queue and buying
there things.

"Satan took a small amount of sugar syrup from the pot and smeared it
on the wall. Soon flies came to that spot....then a lizard appeared to
eat those flies...A cat with one of the customer jumped on the lizard....
seeing a loose cat, a dog with another customer jumped and
overturned some pots and pans.

"The shop owner got very upset and started beating the dog with a
stick, now the dog owner jumped into a the argument and soon a small
fight was initiated, some taking part of the Shop Owner and others with
the dog owner.

"Finally some one came and said that 'all this is handiwork of
Satan...let us forget and forgive and restore calm....So the fighting
subsided and people went to their ways cursing and abusing Satan.

"You saw" Satan said to the boy "They do the wrong and I get the
blame...what was my contribution in all this?"
The boy thought for some time and said "If you had not willingly
smeared the wall with sugar syrup....flies....lizard....cat...dog and
nothing would have resulted. So in reality you are the real cause of
the problem.

The same is the case with all problems in Iraq after US attacked it.
They are directly or indirectly responsible for all the clan fighting and
bloodshed there.

The same holds good for All Problems in Afghanistan and Pakistan after
US attacked it in 2001.

And by same logic.... Israel is directly or indirectly responsible for most

of the problems in ME and their rift with USA and Europe. The things
are indeed complicated, but if you link all the dots...they would lead to
the formation of Israel.

As to who owns the media in US, I have written a monologue on that

topic. I would give you the address.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/80o4976/

Just go thru it and then let me see your answer.

Q117 Lipush ( Jews don’t, 92)

By throwing stones and firing tires, Muslims not only violated their holy place, but entire
Jerusalem in general.
You say you gave us permission to pray there for years. First, we never ASKED for Muslim
permission, Jerusalem is still the capital of Israel, the western wall is there and therefore we have
the natural right to pray there, no permission needed. Second, i wasn't talking about history, but
on what's happening nowadays…..

ANS.

Your post is the perfect example of double standard. On one hand you
say that we Jews do not demolish or damage holy places of other
religions, while on the other hand you say that Jews have RIGHT to
worship in the Al Aqsa mosque.
How this thing is possible. Your claim to Jerusalem is only hypothetical.
You might have sentiments that Jerusalem is eternal capital of Israel,
but for past 2000 years Jews have had no presence there.

As regarding Jews hate of Al Aqsa mosque, you have seen the

comments of Mr. Honestly and others preaching against it.

You harp so much about Jews occupying Jerusalem by force, but do you
not know that as per various UN resolutions, Israel has to vacate all
those areas captured during 1967 war. So your occupation of
Jerusalem is illegal in the eyes of world body.

In no way Jews have been proved to be a better ruler that the Muslims
have had for past 1300 years.

Q118 Lipush (Jews don’t, 98)

The validity is based on Jewish history in Israel, that is. You cannot seriously expect me to
answer you about Muslims hypothetically "claiming" Spain.
Cause, not HYPOTHETICALLLY at all, we sense Muslims want to claim many states in Europe,
in General. You want to evict the "bees" that came to Israel.
We don't separate old Jews from new ones. the Jews will not let other Jews be expelled and will
sit quiet. you're hallucination if you think that will come to pass…..

ANS.

60 Years is a very short time in history of nations and races… so do not

feel too much boastful about that period. Learn from you history:

A. Jews were first evicted from Palestine after ruling there for close to
500 years (By Nebuchadnezzar).

B. Jews were once again evicted and expelled from Palestine after
ruling there for around 500 years (By Titus).

How do you think that these 60 years existence will guarantee you a
perpetual presence in Palestine? (Muslims ruled there for more than
1200 years).

Only thing that could guarantee you a reasonable chance of survival is

to make peace with your neighbors at any cost.

If you fail to do so and always try to intimidate your neighbors by your

military might… your chances of survival will keep on decreasing .
Right now your neighbors will agree for your return to 1948 borders
and allow those Palestinians to settle back in their land.

This is really a bargain price!! I would take it…. Because it allows you
to take the 50 % of loot you did between 1917 & 1948!!

But I know that in their haughtiness…. Nations do commit mistakes…

they think that they will be ever powerful and their opponents will
always be weak and dis-united .

History tells us that this is not the case. For survival every nation has
to have peace with its neighbors.

Since Israel was Created with Hatred between itself and its neighbors…
It was Created by importing its population and evicting those living
there since generations… So it must try to squeeze thru and make
peace with its neighbors at any price.

The price I mentioned are too attractive… But I am sure , you and bulk
of your countrymen will out rightly reject it. For them going back to
19148 boundaries is a four letter word and national abuse.

Well, one day, Jews will beg for going back to 1948 borders or even
1917 type situation…. But that would have become too late. The same
Palestinians whom they curse, whom they kill, whom they persecute
will have the fate of Jews in their hand…

Some thing like Nebuchadnezzar and Titus like situation … Once

again…. I am told that you are OUT on Strike Three!!!

Q119 Lipush (Jews don’t, 143)

1. By the way you say it, it sounds like that for 1200 years Arab villages in Israel were covering
the land, and we came, destroyed the places, killed every man woman and child, and "took over".
We all know it's not true. they opened a war, they realized they could not win, then they escaped
with the tail between their legs out to the PLACES THEY CAME FROM, their real homeland,
Egypt, Jordan, Lebanon. And we helped them, that's true,…

ANS.

The Jews and Arabs and Christians were living peacefully under Islamic
and Muslim rules for past 1200 years , and there was no problem in
that area.
All that changed when Britain got its toe hold in Palestine at the end of
WW-1, it allowed millions of European and other Jews to migrate to the
and of Palestine and that was the starting point of tensions and blood
shed between the two groups.

That action of Britain was wrong and was against justice equity and
even International Law. You cannot change the demography of any
country by importing bulk of its population from outside.

Only the Jews living in Palestine had right to demand separation from
Arab and they should have been given land according to their
population before 1917, which was not more than 10 %. But instead
they were given more than 50 % of the land, which in itself was against
justice.

I agree that it is wrong to blame Israel for EVERY Crime, but at least it
should be blamed for the Crime that it DID. The way US has used its
veto and the way US and Europe always support jews and Israel, shows
that Jews living in Israel are like angels and Palestinians are just like
devils. That bias should also be removed if we are going to have any
equitable solution to this problem.

Q120 Lipush (Israel, 674)

The only justification for Israel's existence if pure justice and willpower. that's also what it takes
to make peace with the Palestinian, but nobody holds their breaths anymore, i'm afraid. THAT is
going to take time.
2.Force is the only power that WORKS IN THE MIDDLE EAST. when we wty to speak, you
guys ignore in the good way, or simply attack back. we only "speak Arabic" or playing the
"Palestinian game"- on their level.
Why do we speak? because at the end, no matter how long it takes, that will be the EPILOGUE of
all this. no matter how much the Palestinians will talk about destroying Israel, at the end we will
have to sit and talk, the question is how much blood will it take until then…..
3
ANS.

Despite the “tough” tone and “extreme confidence” that you show in
your post, I could detect the “mortal fear” and “extreme danger” in
which a Typical Israeli Jewish man or woman finds them in the country
of Israel today.

1. You post as if you are full of power and energy and ready to take on
the whole world, let anyone come and confront us, you boast. Any
bully on the street acts in the similar manner,, he poses very tough an
talks very rough, so that people might fear him. But in reality he is
“frightened” to his core and fears every one and is not sure when some
one more powerful than him will bring his downfall.

2. That is the “Bully mentality” which every psychologist will be able to

detect very easily. The same mentality I could detect in your post that
we will rule for ever and ever in Israel and there is no force on earth
which will make us vacate or take away any portion of that land. This
is the fear which is speaking thru your tongues.

3. The condition of Jews is really pitiable, they have burned all their
boats and are now concentrated in one particular geographical
location. While Muslims are migrating and increasing their presence in
all parts of the world, Jews are vacating the world and getting
concentrated in a small geographical land. Should any calamity was to
befall on this land, they would become extinct!!

4. In my views Jews did a grave mistake when they selected Palestine

as a place for their homeland. How can you feel safe while surrounded
in a sea of your enemies? That is the reason they portray themselves
as Super Powerful and Super Capable and every thing else that a bully
does.

5. If you look thru a bird’s eye, Jews from all corners of the world are
getting “cooped up” in a pen, like the sheep are gathered for
slaughter. They think that they are getting united, but in reality they
are getting prepared for a great feast!!

6. No one could imagine even 100 years ago, how every Jew from the
world could be brought back to one location….. the “bait” of homeland
acted like a magnet and by their own will they descended in hoards on
the land of Palestine.

7. They could have prolonged their stay be “befriending” their

neighbours and paying whatever prices they had to pay for that. But
true to their history, they can never remain at peace with their
neighbours. Their neighbours have become their mortal enemies.

8. So really I can see no solution in which the Jews have put

themselves into, they cannot make Friends with their neighbours,
because of the “Bully mentality”. They feel that every “concession” is
like a nail in their coffin and would dilute their “Superman” status.

9. If some one things that God is on the side of Jews and Happy to see
the Modern state of Israel run by Zionist Atheists, then let them answer
who God did destroy the old Jewish empire and caused their
dispersion. If God caused the dispersion of Jews because they did not
follow His Laws and Commandments, then how can He be happy
seeing the Jews in Israel doing the same?

10. So by all accounts the presence of Jews in Palestine is a test and

punishment for Muslims for their infighting and dis-unity and not living
their lives according to Islam. It is a slap on the face of Islamic
nations, that Jews, whom no one liked in the world are acting as rulers
and bullies on them.

11. Unless Muslims as a whole repent of their sins and come back to
Islam, this “test and curse” of Israel will not leave them. And that is
going to happen sooner or later. The Jews are given respite till that
happens.

12. This in my view is the logical explanation of what is happening in

Palestine particular and in the world generally against Islam and
Muslims.

Q121 Lipush (Israel, 674)

Almost everything you write is twisted. You think we act like big bullies, but that is mostly how
we see the radical Muslims and Arabs worldwide act. poteto potato.
In case you don't know, but i think you do know, Israel is isolated. When it calls for self
protection, people are blaming it for war crimes. when Israel tries to show the truth, they yell that
it's poor "Hasbara" and contempt. When we show the truth of Arab war crimes, they ignore or
bury it under the rug.
So thought you believe we think we are powerful, it's the other way around. Israel's power is
mostly it's ability to stand up high and saying the truth the way it really is, with no fear.
That's not being bully, that's pure heroism…..

ANS.

You misunderstood the essence of my message. I asked you, that if

God has brought Jews from all corners of the world to one common
place, what is the purpose?

If the purpose of God is to re-establish the Jewish nation, so that they

can put into practice His Laws and Commandments and lead a pious
life…then it is very commendable.

But when we see that the present Jewish state of Israel is like any other
Modern Atheist Materialistic country, so we can see that Jews have not
gathered here for any religious purpose or for establishing a society
built on Laws and Commandments of God…. Then we can deduce that
this gathering is not for a good purpose but has some serious
repercussion.
I gave my opinion that this state of Israel is a test and trial for Muslims
for ignoring to live our lives in accordance with Islamic laws and
commandments.

There is no fight between Islam and Judaism as such, there is no

equality at all!! Israel and Jews are only a “minor” irritants to Islam and
Muslims at large.

Q122 Lipush (Israel, 676)

Did you read the Old testament? Exodus tells us about the death of Kind of Egypt, and the rise of
the New one. And the Israelites cried under slavery and God took notice of them.
God therefore called to Moses and told him " I have heard their cry and have come down to
deliver them from the Egyptians to bring them up out of that land to a good and broad land."
He told Moses that he heard the cries and known the suffering. that is why he chose to bring the
Jews to one place where they will be gathered and protected from the "Egyptians" of modern life-
….

ANS.

Yes I have read the OT, NT and also Quran carefully and that is why I
wrote what I wrote.

1. When Egyptians persecuted Jews, God heard their cries and freed
them from the bondage and settled them into the land of Palestine…a
land flowing with milk and honey. For what purpose?

Just to enjoy that Milk and Honey? No….. To walk in the ways of life
and live according to God’ Laws and Commandments, and set an
example for other nations.

2. But when the same Jews rebelled against God and killed prophets,
and did mischief in the land, the same Merciful God punished them and
allowed Jerusalem Temple to be destroyed and Jews to be taken into
captivity to Babylon for 70 years.

3. After 70 years of captivity, God again had mercy on Jews and freed
them from captivity and settled them once more into Palestine and the
Temple to be rebuilt. For what purpose? … That Jews should go back
to their earlier ways? … No….So that Jews could once again walk into
ways of God.

4. Then God sent Jesus as final Jewish prophet to Jews, to simplify their
religion for them, but they behaved exactly in the same way, as their
forefathers had, they not only rejected his message, but even tried to
kill him.
A prophet like John the Baptist was killed in cold blood and no one from
the population said a word about it.

5. Because of these crimes, God again punished Jews and once again
caused the Jerusalem to be invaded, the temple to be destroyed and
Jews to be evicted from the Land of Palestine, this time for 2000 years.

6. Jews had one more chance to come back to the mercy of God, this
time by accepting the Last and Final prophet Mohammad, if they would
have believed in him, they would have got back every thing, the land
would have been theirs for ever, but as usual they behaved again as
their forefathers had. From day one they became avowed enemy of
the last prophet and tried every thing in their power to derail his
message, and continue till this day.

7. If we assume you saying that God wanted to protect Jews from the
persecution of Nazis and Christians and wanted to provide them a safe
place to live, then once again I ask, for what purpose?

8. Is God only interested that Jews should eat, drink and enjoy the good
things of this life, or does God want some thing else? Obviously God
would want that Jews should correct their ways and live according to
His Laws and Commandments.

9. The present state of Israel is in no manner a state which follows

God’ laws and commandments. It is a materialistic state like any other
European state, run by Atheists Zionists. Why would God be happy to
establish such a nation and such a state run by Jews?

10. There are indeed innocent persons in Israel, there are indeed some
good persons in Israel, there are religious persons in Israel…. but as a
whole the country is not run according to Laws and Commandments of
God.

11. That is why I concluded that only purpose for this is either a test
and trial of Muslims or gathering Jews from all corners of the world to
await their Final Judgment.

12. The only option open to Jews (and Muslims too) is to repent, turn
back and establish a just and law abiding state in Israel. They should
prove to be better than Muslims in following God’s Laws and
Commandments.

13. Let me also mention that God has given no Blank Check to Muslims
either. He is a Just God and He judges impartially between people and
nations. If Muslims do evil in the eyes of God, they will also face
punishment of God, just like Jews.

PS:

- your statement that Arabs also persecuted Jews is not correct, before
1917, there was no Arabs – Jews problem in the world
- The movement for Jewish Homeland in Palestine has nothing to do
with Holocaust; the Zionist movement started in 1899, when there was
no existence of Nazi party.
- Since 1899 Zionists were trying to claim Palestine on one pretext or
other, they helped in the allied victory over Turkish Empire and were
rewarded for that by Britain to migrate to land of Palestine in droves.

Q123 Lipush (Israel, 677)

Hard to follow, thought I'll do my best. God brought us to this land, in order to protect us from
the nemesis.

When the golden calf was built, God punished the people for 40 years in the deathly desert,
instead of 11, so that the entire generation that sinned will not enter the promised land.

Moses himself, was one of being punished……

ANS.

The sum total of your arguments (as for as I can decipher ) is this:

a. Whenever Jews disobeyed God and created mischief on the earth,

God did chastise them with painful penalty.

b. However when they promised to God that they will walk in His ways,
He gave them another chance.

c. When any one wanted to exterminate whole Jewish race, God made
their plans to go astray and instead punished these people.

d. God does not want that Jews should be exterminated as a race, but
that they should survive and live, but should always be kept on a tight
leash.

That is what I could decipher from the examples you have given.

Now coming to the present state of Israel, you said that it is God who
ordered Jews to fight for Israel…. This is not entirely correct…. Because
the Zionist movement was not a religious movement….it was a Racial
Movement….to settle Jews in the land of Palestine…. Irrespective of
how much blood shed it causes…. Irrespective of how many Human
Rights Violations take place…. Irrespective of how much innocent blood
is shed in the process.

God never condones oppression, tyranny and mischief to be dome on

the earth….How much more He will be angered when His name is used
for such acts!!

In my views Jews have taken upon themselves another great

responsibility, to walk in the way of God once more…. So far the results
are disappointing for the past 62 years.

They have established a Jewish country in the world…. But they have
not yet made it to run according to God’s laws and Commandments.

Q124 Lipush (Israel, 679)

Not exactly. The Zionist movement is departed on many levels, International Zionism as well as
religious Zionism.
The vision Hertzl and many others have had was based on the Jewish ethos of "right of returning"
to Israel, which meant that we adopted the undeniable right of homecoming to the land we
deserved and saw as ours based on history and belief. No other nation had anytime on those days
had our "right of return", this was something that we claimed only, a right that later was taken by
the Arabs.

ANS.

So the Zionists movement was only for “right to return” and not to
establish “ a Jewish state based on laws of God”.

If “right of Return” was that important to God, then why did He allowed
Jews to be evicted from that land at all!!

That is why I said, Jews have never reflected on why they were brought
and why they were evicted from Palestine. If they knew real reasons,
they would have taken lessons from them and avoided committing the
same mistakes.

To establish “their right of return”….they make another “law of

eviction” on people who were living there for last 1200 years.

I do not know that in any society or any country…”laws of return” are

formulated on 2000 years of absence.

It is strange for you to say that “no one objected” on your “right of
return”…. Why would Christian world object? And you never took into
account the views of Muslim world, the Arab world, the people who
were to be affected directly.

By the way it were not Arabs that evicted Jews from Palestine… it were
Romans and then Christians did not allow you to return Jews for
another 300 odd years. Muslims took that land from Christians and
allowed any one who was living there to continue to live there.

What ever you say about the “religious” nature of state of Israel, it is
not run according to Laws and Commandments of God.

Survival is not that a strange thing. Muslims are also surviving. Lions
are also surviving…so are weasels and rats and other lower animals.

It is your imagination what you want to live like.

Q125 Lipush (Israel, 687)

hate to be the one to inform you (ummm, actually, no i don't), but it really does not matter to
Israel if the Arabs think it was made by deceit or power, so was made the so caled "Palestinian"
nation, which is not really a nation;
The bottom line is, we are here to stay, and that's what counts at the end of the day.

ANS.

I summarize points mentioned in your many posts:

A. Israel does not care what Arabs think about it:

1. No one expects that Jews would consent with views of Arabs and
vacate land of Israel voluntarily.

2. It is like thieves and robbers will see the light and return the wealth
they have taken by the way of theft and robbery.

3. It is the common practice in law abiding societies that thieves and

robbers are not given any legal or moral protection and are forced to
submit themselves to the law and face punishment.

4. The same course awaits Israel and Jews also, who have stolen Arab
land and homes and properties.

B. Jihad is to kill all KAFIRS and all unbelievers

1. This is your own definition of Islamic Jihad, There is no supporting

evidence from Quran and Hadith that Jihad is to kill all KAFIRS and
unbelievers.

2. In no case, this “advise” was acted upon by Muslims … .whereas in

case of Jews and Christians, I can show many such evidences

3. It is like pot calling kettle black.

C. It is US and Israel that are fighting to end oppression and injustice

from the world.

1. This is another of your fantastic theory…. that US and Israel… the

two most Terrorist countries and societies in the world are really
spreading peace and justice in the world.

2. The purpose of US “Jihad” is to exploit the wealth and resources of

other countries and the purpose of Israel’s “Jihad” is to gobble more
and more of Arab lands by any means foul or fair.

3. Whatever else might be the purpose of these “Jihads”, they have no

commonality with Islamic Jihad.

D. Who are Martyrs

1. Regarding Martyrs , we already have had a long discussion n the

past, and I told you that Martyrs are those who lay down their lives in
the cause of God.

2. It is God, who knows who is a martyr or SHAHEED, we humans can

only guess and judge by outside evidence.

Q126 Lipush (Israel, 725)

The sense we base on at leased exists in history. What we know is that a group of Arabs from
Egypt and Jordan came into a land they had no connection with, a land that belonged to the Jews
and then invented for themselves a new nation called "Falastin"! The Israelites didn't invent their
nation. it always existed. Moses brought the Israelites under will of great Hashem, to the
promised land. We cannot occupy what's have been given us. that's right is saved for the
"Palestinian" people.

ANS.

The way you “accuse” that “Egyptians and Arabs” came into a land
where they had no “connection” could very well be applied to Jews as
well!!
They were not “original inhabitants” of the lands of Canaan.

Arabs and Jews are related thru Abraham…. So what rights Jews claim
can very well be claimed by the Arabs also.

Mind you Arabs never claim that Jews have no share in that land. At no
place in History did Arabs evicted Jews from the land of Canaan. It is
only Jews who claim exclusive right to that land and that claim is
neither proven by history, scripture or by logic.

Under Muslim rule, Muslims, Christians and Jews were living side by
side in peace and tranquility for 1200 years.

Jews have only brought misery and fighting and eviction and mischief
to that land of peace, the land of prophets.

Q127 Lipush (Jews don’t, 1097)

Again, your way of thinking is questionable. I said we fight for Jerusalem since it was ours from
old times, and since we fought for religious and historical right to the western wall.
That is not the case with the Palestinians. They came to what they believe is "Palestine" and
emended a state from where the Jews were evicted.
You had and have no right to this place more then we did. even less. you fight in order to take
from the Jews a right that is ours under faith and under JUSTICE. since they fight against
JUSTICE, those Muslims who want to evict the Jews from Jerusalem AGAIN and rule it with
hard hand will never succeed doing so.
It's not like in Germany, when we were minority and didn't have power or voice to speak.
You want to take the one place when we actually feel belonged. you have the entire mid east, but
you choose to fight the Jew and take his only homeland…..

ANS.

What do you mean by historical right? What is its validity?

Before Jews came to land of Canaan, people were living in it and they
have a better claim that Jews for that land. If they put their claim how
would Jews react?

Can Muslims also put their claim on Spain, since they also ruled that
country for 700 years?
Muslims do not want to evict Jews that were living in Palestine for more
than 1200 years. Muslims only want to evict those Jews who swarmed
like a pack of bees in Palestine, following British foot hold there in
1917. Those Jews have no right on the land of Palestine.

The same goes for Jews RIGHT of worship on the west wall. Any thing
which was followed before 1917 must be followed , since that was the
law of land.

As regards God hiding His face from Jews….the simile you said could
be true. But Jews living n land of Palestine should show some signs of
remorse and some pledge to walk in ways of God. All these are
missing in the present Zionist state of land. They just want to acquire a
piece of real estate, irrespective of how much cunning, blood shed,
oppression and tyranny is needed for that.

These are not the signs for God to Reveal His face and turn towards
Jews, unless it be another test and trial (and a Final Trial in my view)
for Present Generation of Jews.

Allah Knows Best.

Q128 Mary (Jews Don’t, 86)

Hi MUQ,
you didn't get it did you? the poor innocent jews are the victim of Europe, they are using the Jews
to destroy Muslim . Don't you get it? There is a saying. if you can't do it yourself...let others do it
for you .hhehehehehehe
ANS.

I wish you were true and Jews were being used by European to destroy
Muslims...

The things are not like that... It is Jews and Zionists who have US and
Europe in their Vice Like Grips....

Politicians and common people of these countries want to break these

shackles but they cannot.
Jewish controlled Print and Electronic Media is too powerful....they try
to brainwash common people against Islam.... Financial institutions,
banks, stock brokers, insurance firms, lawyers....all these are
dominated by Jews.

So the Christians are like a "virtual slaves" of these wealthy and

scheming Jews.... they toil hard to fill the tills of their employers....they
get basic necessities of life and a supposed "freedom" to do any
immoral deeds and acts.

So it is Jews who are controlling Christians and not the other way
round. Christianity has been neutralized in West by Jews. There is no
Christian left. who can stand up to Jews and their "Logic". They think
that it is God' command to help Jews and Zionists.

Q129 Mary (Jews Don’t, 88)

MUQ,

Those who are against Muslims and Arabs are not Jews but Western. Jews have nothing against
Islam/Arabs.....in Jerusalem, the Mosques, the Churches, have been there for centuries...if Jews
hate Arabs and Muslims, those Mosques wouldn't have been there at first place and Muslims
wouldn't have worshipped in Jerusalem......there would be Jewish Temple instead...and
second....the only people that hate Arab and Muslim is mostly West....because they just want to
destroy the Muslim religion so they will just want to monopolize. but since Arab Muslim is not
monopolized… they just hate it. Here the victim is Jewish community because of the fact that
they are the middle person in the dispute between arab and west..... justmy02cents.

ANS.

I think you forget that Jerusalem was under control of Muslims for past
1400 years!! Except for a 99 years break, Muslims were always ruling
in Jerusalem.

The reason that Mosques, Churches and Synagogues exist side by side
in Jerusalem speaks about the broadmindedness of Muslims for these
1400 years.

Jews got control of Jerusalem only in 1967.... and in this brief 42 years
period they have made many attempts to demolish the Al Aqsa
Mosque there.
In 1969 they put the mosque on fire.... then they forcibly took
possession of one portion of mosque.... now they are excavating near
the mosque and doing every thing in their power to weaken the
structure of Al Aqsa Mosque. That speaks for their "Intolerance" to
other faiths.

If Muslims and world was not watching their every move, they would
have demolished Al Aqsa mosque long back.

I do not blame all Jews for being so intolerant.... but there is a strong
element amongst them who do that and that party has the support of
Government and Western Media..

It was only under Muslim rule that Arabs, Christians and Jews lived side
by side peacefully for more than 1200 years. This is the nature of
Islam and Muslims, that when they are ruler of any nation, they show
utmost regard and give maximum freedom to followers of other
religions.

I do not say that Western powers should not help Israel...but their
support should not be blind and one sided. They should at least keep
Israel in check when it is wrong on any issue. What we see is that
Western powers support Israel on every issue, irrespective of whether
it is right or wrong. And this escalates the tensions.

Q130 Maverick (Messianic, 323)

Muq,
Genesis chapter 17 is pertaining to our previous discussion in regards to Isaac, Judah, Jews,
Israelites.

18 And Abraham said unto G-d:'Oh that Ishmael might live before Thee!'

19 And G-d said:'Nay, but Sarah thy wife shall bear thee a son; and thou shalt call his name Isaac;
and I will establish My covenant with him for an EVERLASTING covenant for his seed after
him.

20 And as for Ishmael, I have heard thee; behold, I have blessed him, and will make him fruitful,
and will multiply him exceedingly; twelve princes shall he beget, and I will make him a great
nation.

21 But My covenant will I establish with Isaac, whom Sarah shall bear unto thee at this set time
in the next year.'

There is an everlasting covenant that pertains to Isaac and his seed.

ANS.

I have no objection that an “everlasting” covenant was made with

Isaac and his progeny….. the question is “What was that everlasting
covenant”?

Was it other than “You walk in My way and I will Bless you and multiply
you and give you to live in peaceful dwellings”?

So long as Jews did their part of covenant , The God was with them, but
when they forgot their part of Covenant, God punished them.

The whole history of Jewish people (as recorded in the Books of Kings-1
& 2 and Chronicles -1 & 2) is open commentary to this observation.

This “everlasting” covenant is still open!!! Let jews and Christians

come back to their Lord and Follow His Ways…. God will again have
Mercy on them!!

But it is wrong to say that “Everlasting” covenant is one sided…. Jews

and Christians can keep on doing what they wish. They ridicule the
Name of God….they nullify God’s Laws with Laws of their Parliaments
and assemblies and Senates….

They legalize Homosexuality, free sex, pornography, Gambling ,

Interest and every evil on this planet……and God is still “Bound by that
Everlasting Covenant” to keep on supporting them?

Then there is nothing bad regarding Ishmael in those paragraphs. God

promised to Bless him and make Great nation out of him.

Great nation does not mean only physical lands….it also includes gift of
prophet hood.

If later God send His Last and Final Prophet in the Ishmael branch….
That does not mean that He nullified “everlasting” covenant to Isaac
Branch.

But Jews and Christians have to follow the Last Prophet (about whom
they find clear prophesies both in OT and NT books), if they want to
continue their “everlasting covenant”.!!

Q131 MEHS (Israel, 682)

""My comment was that Jews are no match to Muslims, neither in numbers, nor in followers, nor
in territories they control. They have never been a match for Muslim armies in 1400 years of
history of Islam.""
Seems clear to everyone on earth that muslims have started every war with Israel and LOST
EVERY ONE! Pretty obvious that Islamic countries combined are no match for Israel. Now,
before you start the silliness that Israel relies on the USA for weapons, check your facts. Israel
has an incredible indigenous weapons industry that is the envy of the world. The USA even
occasionally benefits from indigenous Israeli programs. Can Israel soundly defeat any Islamic
nation without US help? Of course. ….

ANS.

I took into account the whole 1400 years history of Muslims and not
only for past 62 years.

You consider the past 62 years as the “whole history” of Muslim- Jewish
relations.

Do you know that Christians also controlled Jerusalem for 99 years

Between 1000-1099 CE. Does any one remembers that period now? It
was for 99 years, compared to that Jews have partial control of
Jerusalem for past 32 years only.

So you should have a broader outlook of history and not a narrow one.

Israel “might have every thing in the world”, I do not question

that….but Israel is not known worldwide as mass scale producer of any
thing and is not known world ever for any other thing…as for its
violations of human rights, its brutalities and killings of Palestinians.

I do not know of any other country, which had so many UN resolutions

passed against it and so many VETOS used by US to protect it.

That is the benefit US gets out of this “close friendship” between “two
Truly Great Nations”!!!

One is like a 50 feet giant trailer and another a manual push bike!!

I think people convert to Islam in US or Europe for fear of death….in

countries where even the mosques re under surveillance of Govt.
agencies…. US and European are in mortal fear to accept Islam to save
their necks from noose blades of sword?

Nice try, huh

Q132 MKOT ( Jews Don’t, 83)

-Jews "got control" after Israel was ATTACKED by Jordan...Jerusalem was WON IN
WAR...how do you think Muslims gained control of anything? So, Muslims can win wars and
land but Jews can't? Ridiculous magical thinking.
-Jews were banned from worshipping at their most sacred site-the Wailing Wall. Today there is
open worship at all religious places. So, how are Jews "destroying the Temple Mount?" if THEY
RESPECT OTHER RELIGIONS?
You want to pray at the hundreds of sites you call Holy but want to deny Jews their rights IN
THEIR OWN COUNTRY? Magical thinking. -Excavating a site is not BLOWING IT UP, …

ANS.

What Jews would learn by excavations which is not known and

recognized already?

- Who denies that David founded the city of Jerusalem and Solomon
built the First Temple there?

- Who denies the fact that this temple was razed to ground by
Nebuchadnezzar and Jews were taken to Babylon as captives for 70
odd years?

- Who denies the fact that Jews re-built the Temple after release from
captivity and that temple was also razed to ground in 70 CE and Jews
were evicted from Jerusalem and most of Palestine and scattered thru
our Europe?

- Now it is Jews who deny that Muslims took the land of Palestine from
ROMAN EMPIRE (and not from Jews).... they allowed people of all
religions to live side by side and pray in their own places of worship.
By owning the land for more than 1200 years , Muslims became the de
facto ruler and owner of the land. The claims of Jews and Christians if
any stand dissolved and not maintainable in any court of law.

- The only way, in which Jews and Christians can claim any ownership
is by force and that they did. But they did not do it in straightforward
manner , but by intrigue and secret planning and cunning diplomacy.

- But if you say that Jews won the Jerusalem by force and can do any
thing they like there.... So Muslims also have a RIGHT to take back
their land by force and use what ever means they can to get their goal.
- So why should there be so much Anti Muslim propaganda by Jewish
and Christian lobby?

- If we accept your logic, then can we say that for past 2000 years Jews
have had no history, no civilization, no religion, no leadership and
nothing? Just because they were ruled by Arabs or Christians, they lost
their identity altogether.

- Jews and Jewish nation was born only when the state of Israel was
declared in 1948 and issued its own currency?

- Your logic recoils on you, if you apply it honestly on Arabs and Jews
alike!!!

Q133 MKOT (Jews don’t, 83)

"Jewish Controlled Media?" Who owns CNN? A Christian. Who owns ABC? Disney -which is
NOT a Jewish Company. I am sure if I were a Brit you'd call that media, "controlled" as well.
Right?
Who owns the BBC? Who owns Al Jezeera -a partner with BBC. It is so easy, isn't it, to just fall
back on your same old refrain...if anything is wrong, just blame others-mainly Jews. Right…..

ANS.

The “beauty and effectiveness” of “Brainwashing” is when the victim

becomes die hard supporter of the Theory!!

Now my remarks that US Print Media, Electronic Media, Film Media and
Financial Institutions are in “vice Like Grips” of Jews and Zionists,
looked so offensive to you that you have posted a long reply.

There is a simple test to verify the truth of it:

A. Right a very nasty letter criticizing Islam, Arabs, Muslims, and

everything Islamic and send it for publication to any of the Leading
News Papers and TV News Channels in USA.

B. Now send the same letter replacing Islam and Muslims with Jews
and Judaism and send it to same News papers and Media Channels.
Just wait and see in “How many News papers and Media channels”
your views are published.

You can repeat the same exercise by posing as “expert” in ancient

civilizations and write whatever comes in your mind criticizing Islam,
Arab and Muslim civilizations and then do the same with posing as
“expert” on Jewish and Zionist civilization.

Just see how fast your views are published in leading “Unbiased” US
Print and Electronic Media.

What else proofs you need!!

You have prepared the list of “Islamic Terrorist attacks” with lot of
pain….. now do the same listing what “Israel and Jews” have done to
Palestinians over the same period.

Compare the number of casualties on both sides and then verify who
are the biggest terrorists.

If Americans do not back down from the war, why do you expect that
Muslims will back down?

Q134 MKOT (Jews Don’t, 89)

Then, who are the Jordanians? Where did the Ruling Hashemits comes from and when? The
"present generation" of Arabs living in Gaza are Egyptians, just like Arafat...or are you claiming
Arafat, was "Palestinian??????" And what would you call the Jews who never left the Middle
East? To try to claim a people called Palestinian existed since 650 AD is ludicrous.

ANS.

It does not depend who rules a country or what is the current name of
a country, so long as its indigenous population continue to live there.

The country which is now called Saudi Arabia was named earlier by
many names, like Hejaz, Najd, Tihama, Arabian Peninsula etc. But the
people living there remained the same. No one was turned out from
their houses.
Same is the case with Palestine, when Muslims took it from Roman
Empire in 650 CE, they did not removed the original inhabitants from
their houses. The sovereignty of the land was transferred to Arabs and
it became a part of Islamic nation.

Over the years many Arabs migrated to the land and settles there,
many Jews and Christians accepted Islam and a mixed Arab, Christian
and Jewish people lived there. The people who were living in that land
since generations have a right to live there and no one should uproot
them.

No separate Capitol, or coins were needed for that land, as no state in

USA has its own currency or own defense force.

But the Jewish propaganda that Land of Palestine belongs to jews and
every Jew, irrespective of where he lives is a citizen of that land and
those Non jews living there are to be uprooted etc....this is wrong and
cannot be accepted.

So in the end, I think you still need a lesson in history!!

Q135 MKOT ( Jews Don’t, 91)

1) Who says Jews are trying to harm/deface/destroy the Al Aqusa Mosque? Muslims. Why? As a
pretext to take back Jerusalem.
2) Who prevented Jews from worshipping at the Wailing Wall for decades? Same answer as
above.
3)Israel was not "plotted" into existence any more than Jordan, Syria or Lebanon were "plotted"
They were all created the same way. To deny Israel's creation is to void those Arab Nations…..

ANS.

1. If you think that Jews have no "eye" on Al Aqsa Mosque, then you
must be blind. You have never heard the inflammatory speeches given
by the Rightist Extremists of Jews, on which the "Secular Israeli
Government" always turns a blind eye. The burning of mosque in
1969, various restrictions in and around mosque areas, excavations, all
are tell tale sign of Jewish plans on Al Aqsa mosque.
2. Israel was definitely "plotted" because bulk of its population was
"imported" from outside to settle there. The name Jordan, Kuwait ,
UAE or Saudi Arabia were only political realignment which have been
going on as part of human history.
3. Jerusalem was not liberated , it was taken by force and it is no more
any International city as it was under Muslim control. There were no
daily killing, violence and curfews during 1300 years of Muslim rules
there as is seen for past "42 years of Liberation"
4. Jews nation was created by a conspiracy of Zionists and their
Christian supporters. The rules which have made yourself to deny a
Palestinian state and culture recoil back on yourself, because Jews also
did not had any country, army, coinage, foreign relation etc during
past 2000 years.
5. You should use the same logic for Jews and Non Jews. I see all your
logics are partial....all tilted in favor of Jews and Zionists and this
approach will only leave to more blood shed, more hate and less
accommodation. So you should talk about ways to solve the problem
and not increase it.

Q136 MKOT ( Jews don’t, 92)

1) Jews have an "eye" on history and show no plan to destroy the Mosque. Jews have never been
known for defacing sacred places or forced conversion.
Speech is widespread in a democracy-the Government controls its extremists. This is impossible
to believe in an Islamic culture focused on dominance.
The "burning?" You mean the fighting-as in warfare...initiated by Arabs.
…5) My logic is "tilted" toward reality. There may well be more bloodshed, but it will not
rewrite the map the way extremists prefer. If the people now calling themselves Palestinian tried
diplomacy it would force Israel's hand and create an environment of prosperity and assistance.
Stop the violence, recognize Israel and wait...peace will do what killing can't. But, make no
mistake, Israel is not going to be toppled ….

ANS.

1. Just read the post of “Mr. Honestly” below and see how much hatred
and “eye” typical Jews have on Al Aqsa Mosque. Why should you need
any more proof?

2. When Jews can evict 40th Palestinian Generations as “outsiders”,

compared to that 4th Generation of Israeli Jews is nothing. When Titus
evicted the Jews in 70 CE, did he check how many generations of Jews
were living there?

3. I know the “present state of brotherly love” between Jews and

Christians. But this love is really one sided. It is Christians who are
doing “everything” to please Jews, while Jews have not changed their
stand towards Jesus and Christianity a bit. Let us see, how much this
“one sided love affair” holds. In fact it is the mutual hate of Islam and
Muslims that has made Jews and Christians as this unnatural
bedfellow!!

3A. After 2000 Years of “true love” between Jews and Christians, we
can watch how this “imaginary love” relations last!! 60-100 years are a
very short period to judge these things.

4. Winning or loosing battles and wars are phases in nation’s lives.

Many victorious nations of Yesteryears are no where to be found to
day. So the present conditions also shall not last for ever.

5. What will be the fate of Israel and Jews shall be seen by the people
who will be living at that time. What I know is that any regime based
on racism, intrigues, aggression, oppression, tyranny and injustice
does not last for very long time. The present Zionist and terrorist state
of Israel is a prime example of all these. How could is survive for a
very long time?

5A. Did you not learn any lesson from fall of USSR? How that mighty
empire crumbled on itself without any one even firing a shot!!!.

5B. But the problem with Jews and Israel is that they have to fall back
on the mercy of the same Palestinians whom they treat as dirt today….
How could they expect any mercy after what they have done to them
for so many years.

Q137MKOT (Jews don’t , 92)

Why would God's plan not include Jews in their own nation in the Middle East? The "exclusive
possession" you speak of is in the hearts of Muslims who want to deny even a tiny corner of the
land to Jews while they already have "exclusive possession" of 98% of the Middle East. Do Jews
want to "liberate" the entire Middle East of Arabs? Do Jews want to deny Muslims their holy
places? And, if it is not apparent to you that the return of a people after 2,000 years to their
homeland is nothing short of a miracle, one that could only have been achieved with God's
blessing, then you must open your eyes and truly see the Universe you claim to understand. A
handful of Arabs-some Muslim, some just thugs, will not be able to shake their fist at God. Israel
exists. There ARE many occupants of the ME...and all of them belong…..

ANS.

1. God’s plan did “Include” Jews in ME plans!!! In fact God did gave
Jews every opportunity to “improve themselves and be worthy” of
receiving and maintaining their inheritance.

2. When they were found to be incapable of doing that, did God gave
that job to others. First to Christians and then to Muslims.

3. Muslims did not expelled Jews from all Palestine during their 1200
years rule. Under Muslim rule, Arabs, Jews and Christians all were
living in peace. It is Jews who came with idea that “Palestine belongs
to Jews only” ands expelled Arabs living there for more than 1300
years. You can see the contrast.

4. Jews set fire to Al Aqsa mosque in 1969, they did and doing so many
excavations around the mosque area to damage its foundations. They
are stopping Muslims from repairing the old mosque. All these are tell
tale signs of Jews “eyes” on the mosque.

4a. There is no shortage of right wing extremists in Israel preaching

against the mosque and their plans to destroy it built Jewish Temple at
that location. Israeli Government by being a moot spectator is directly
or indirectly supporting those extremists.

5. I do not know what you mean by asking how many generations of

people are living in each country. No country has expelled people of
other faiths living in their midst for generations. Only exception is
Israel.

6. I have no intention to comment on Israeli society and their customs.

I comment only when they interfere and persecute our Muslim brothers
in Palestine. Under Islamic rule, Muslims never interfered in the
religious and private matters of other faiths.

7. The lesion from USSR failure is that material and military power is
not which binds a nation. If any society is discriminatory and
oppressive , its days are limited. And that is a lesson which Israel
should take from it and do not persecute and do injustice in their lands.
The same advise is for all other nation too.

Q138 MKOT (Jews don’t, 105)

am no fan of GWB or Hitler. Why aren't you actively engaged in pursuing your training as an
engineer? You are wrong about Jews and theories that America dominated by that group. We are
not. If anything, we are still dominated by White, Anglo-Saxon males. Not that we can't be
swayed on certain topics, open societies are very nimble. But, your perceptions are
way off when it comes to a lobby group like AIPAC. We are dominated by NRA(national rifle
assoc) Sugar Lobby, AARP (senior citizens) and big business, which means Oil. No secret as to
why America is interested in the ME. Israel is a strategic partner....and we have few to rely on in
that region.

ANS.

Thanks for advice to pursue my engineering career. I surf these

threads on my spare time and still full time engaged on my job.

You have tried to down play the Jewish control over US…. Just look at
the proprietor of the major News Paper, Film Companies and TV News
channels. They have a very high percentage of Jewish ownership….
Then look at the heads of Financial institutions like Stock Brokers,
banks, Insurance companies…. You will find very high percentage of
Jews there.

How could a minority , such small as Jews could become so powerful

and influential. Have you not seen ha every US Presidential candidate
growls before Jewish lobby and each tries to be better than the other
for Jews and Israel….

Do they do that for other “Strategic Partners” and “other minorities”?

You remember the hue and cry made in media when some Dubai
based firm won the contract to manage some US Ports. How much
Media cried that US is under attack now by Arabs?

All this show that Jews hold US as ransom and take US for granted.
They do not give anything to US but only take it from US. It is one
sided and weird “friendship” between US and Israel.

If you have Israel as your strategic partner, why do you need any
enemy!!

Q1139 MKOT (Jews don’t, )

The Lord has give all peoples a "rope" as you say. A very long one. Jews have refused to bow
down to another God for over 5,000 years. Their contributions to humanity are unparalleled.
Perhaps it is Muslims who should start to examine their "rope" and how they have "used" it.

ANS.

Jews have not bowed to any other God in 5000 years you say…. But
they worship their own self…their own pride in being a super race.
That one crime has removed them from the obedient servant of their
Lord and Master to that of a rebellious servant.

That racism overshadows all their “good deeds”.

Muslims are no exception, we shall also be judged by the same

standards. From what I know, Muslims are the least of racist nations in
the world.

We have our faults too and we try to correct them and plead for God’
mercy… We are not an arrogant nation.

Q140 MKOT (Jews Don’t, 143)

Is there any other group that REFUSED land and the chance to create their own nation?
"Palestine" was a territory...Gazans were controlled by Egypt but not give citizenship by Egypt,
not educated by Egypt, not developed by Egypt. It was a pit. Be honest. The West Bank WAS
TRANSJORDAN. Jordan didn't want them. Egypt didn't want them. And, if you think the
unorganized villages who did not own the land under the Ottomans were as well off as the
CITIZENS of Egypt and Trans Jordan, then you have very low expectations for that group.

ANS.

Thank you for providing “Low Down” for the Palestinians. It might be
news to you, but before 1917 there was no term like Palestinians in
existence.

These people were same as other Muslims living in the area, it is only
after Jews started coming there after 1917 (When Britain allowed their
large scale migration) that we heard such words like Palestinians.

They are indistinguishable from the surrounding people, all are from
same stock. These were the people whose lands and homes were
usurped by the Jewish migrants to the “promised lands”.

Perhaps you need a lesson in Islamic history and Islamic views of

nations and people.
Q141 MKOT (Jews Don’t, 144)
The Prophets were Jewish that you claim as MUSLIM. The holy city, Jerusalem was a Jewish
City-the name is Hebrew-as are the other city names that dot the area-the place Muslims call holy
was sanctified by JEWS centuries earlier. For Muslims Jerusalem was a backwater, a
deteriorating city-5th or 6th in a LONG list of holy sites...Hebron was the place Jews buried their
revered patriarchs and matriarchs.. the Wall is THE MOST HOLY SITE in Judaism. The Dome
covers a JEWISH…..

ANS.

To us Muslims, are prophets were Muslim. There was not a single

prophet who was not a Muslim (they all submitted themselves before
their Lord and Creator).

So Jerusalem is as holy to us and to any Jew. By the way we are also

linked to Prophet Abraham as Jews are linked to them.

We took care of Holy Site for 1400 years when there was not a Jew
there. We kept it holy and reserved the site for prayers and singing
the praise of Lord Almighty. What are Jews doing there that Muslims
did not do there?

Can they teach Muslims how to revere a site and how to prey and
weep?

Under Muslim rules, Jews and Christians were allowed to live and
worship in their religious places. There was no discrimination.

All this bad blood is due to the hands of Zionists, who are the cause of
this problem.

The land can only see peace only if these Zionists and these Extremists
of the Jews are removed permanently from the holy land and holy
places.

Q142 MKOT (Jews don’t, 145)

Then let the Muslims content themselves for 1400 years as the Jews did.No one is preventing
Muslims from praying. The bombing, hijacking,
kidnapping, beheadings, stonings have been the issue. Let the Jews rule their city. It is there city
now. Your holy places are defiled by Islamic extremists, no one else. As others have suggested,
you are not going to get your wish to return to a vanished era. It is over. Move on.

ANS.

You seem to have different standards, one for Jews and another for
Non Jews.

For those Jews who are born in Israel it is “inhuman” to turn them out,
because they know no other country….

But it is perfectly “logical” to turn out Palestinians who were living in

the land for generations to make way for “Jews returning tot heir land
of Promise”!!

What sort of logic is this?

That is the twisted sort of logic on which all your arguments are based.

Only truth in your argument is that Israel exists there by force!! I

accept that logic and then let force decide the final outcome of this
conflict.

Q143 MKOT (Israel, 685)

Well if Jews are doing all the brainwashing then I will have to believe what I see ( which isnt
CNN) that Muslims/Islam are nothing but murders as a whole religion, You can blame jews for
everything then I can blame Muslims as well. So if your a Muslim I see you as NO DIFFERENT
than the Muslims who MURDERED thousands of AMERICANS.. And funny thing is, As a Jew I
taught my son different, That Muslims are not all evil and teach him tolerance and respect for
every religion but after what YOU said I don’t think I have that anymore.
ANS.

What else a brainwashed person does than to “Generalize and

categorize” his opponents into fixed groups……your saying that what
Muslims are but a bunch of Terrorists proves that you are indeed
brainwashed!!

We do not blame Jews for EVERY problem of the world and Muslims…. I
said that Jews and Israel are the Main cause of mistrust between
Muslims and Christians. I said that Present state of Israel is the root
cause of Most Terrorism related problem in ME and in most parts of the
world.

If Muslims murdered thousands of Americans (as you claim), then

Americans have murdered Millions of Muslims in Iraq and
Afghanistan….who is aggressor now by any standard?

How much a life of American is worth in relation to life of a Muslim?

Q144MKOT (Israel, 701)

By any means-that is what you said Arabs should be allowed. When Israel starts to slice off the
heads of people on video, when Israel kidnaps Arab athletes, when Israel hijacks commercial jets,
when Israel raises children to become human bombs, when Israel attacks trains, busses,
embassies, cafes and office towers in other nations-THEN
you might have an argument. When was the last time Israel did any other these things? You have
no pity for the zombies who are reared to strap themselves with explosives...what about them?
Who cause those deaths?

ANS.

What Israel has done to those hapless Palestinians is nothing

compared to what a few retaliatory actions have been taken by the
Palestinians.

1. Israel has forced hundreds of thousands of Palestinians to be

uprooted and flee from their homes and they are living in tents for past
62 years.

2. Israeli planes keep bombarding these civilian populations with

bombs and missiles killing so many hundred of thousands of
Palestinians for past 60 years.

3. Israel imposes economic sanctions and economic blockade on these

Palestinians so that they are forced to live in very unhygienic
conditions.

4. Israeli army and polices uses very cruel and stringent tactics even
for minor crimes by these Palestinians, how many children below the
age of 5 or 6 have been shot to death by Jewish army and police.

5. The list of crime of Jews against these people is very long and every
independent enquiry has indicted Jews and Israelis in these acts.

People like you turn blind eyes over the crimes of Jews and Israel and
only report one sided violence thereby polluting the minds of common
people.
The cause of Palestinians is a just one and it will indeed prevail,
because injustice and tyranny and oppression are only given a short
leash by the Creator of this Universe.

In His eyes there is no inherent superiority of a Jew over a non Jew or a

Non Jew over a Jew. He dispenses justice without any bias and pre-
condition.

Every nation will be called to account to answer for its inequities and
misdeeds.

Q145 MKOT (Israel, 704)

You accuse India of a "land grab?" What about Jordan-that is where over 80% of the "displaced"
people lived. Why can't Palestinians own property anymore in Jordan? Lebanon? Why didn't
Egypt ever grant the people of Gaza citizenship?

You talk about a "moral" solution? Defend the unwillingness of Arabs to absorb the now
"Palestinians" (really just tribes in Gaza under Egypt and tribes in Tran Jordan that became
Jordan)? THAT IS THE ROOT…..

ANS.

What is this type of justice… to leave the thief and ask the victims to
share the property with neighbors?

The recompense is to be provided by the Israel which evicted these

Palestinians living in their homes for centuries. Why should they move
to neighboring countries?

Instead of criticizing Jordan, Egypt, Lebanon and many other

countries… we should try a simpler solution. To ask Israel to take back
these refugees .

What about Millions of Jews who came to Israel from Europe? Whose
land they got?

Do not lecture people as to how to behave when they are living in

tents for 60 years. Perhaps if you live in those conditions…you will
also start behaving in the same way.

Instead of solving the “Suicide Bomber” problem…try to solve the

mistakes committed 62 years ago and then all these problems will be
solved.
Q146 MKOT (Israel, 705)
Wrong. The "simpler" solution would have been and continues to be why doesn't the Arab World
accepts its brethren who, in Jordan, were the MAJORITY before the Hashemites fled from Saudi
Arabia. Why didn't Egypt do ANYTHING for the people most closely related in language,
custom and blood to them all those years...and especially after 1948. The "SIMPLE SOLUTON"
would be to admit Arabs to Arab lands. Why not? What is the problem

ANS.

Charity begins at home, so instead of preaching what Jordan, Egypt or

Lebanon should you, why not concentrate on what Israel MUST do!!

It has to return all lands captured by it between 1914-1967 and take

back all Palestinian refugees..
This is the most just and practical solution and does not involve any
other country to make any sacrifice.

The land grabbed by Israel between 1948-1967 does not belong to it

and the Palestinian refugees were indeed living in the land of Israel
before 1948.

This is the best “Starting Point” for any “Permanent Peace” in Middle
East. Is it not?

Q147 MKOT (Israel, 707)

Quoting the bible are we? Yes, the "mills of justice" do grind slow and exceeding fine. That is
how Israel was reborn. LOL. Not by Power, Not by Might, but By My Spirit...no power on earth
could have stopped what happened in 1948. You will not stop it now. Accept life and let
Palestinians prosper the way a select few in the Arab ME have profited ALL
THESE CENTURIES.
ANS.

If Israel was reborn as a Righteous State, walking in the ways of God

and implementing the Laws and Commandments of God… we would
have reason to believe that it is indeed a gift from God All Mighty and
Jews are resettled here for any good cause.

But when we see that the present Zionist state of Israel is no different
than hundreds of other Materialistic European states. When we see
that it is controlled by Atheists and materialists. Its parliament is
sovereign and has allowed Homosexuality, lesbianism and every other
inequity, we come to conclusion that God is not pleased to see the
actions of Jews in their inheritance.
And we know very well , what happens to Jews and Israel when their
God and Lord in not pleased with their actions!! They await a grievous
chastisement , inflicted directly or indirectly by God.

God does not condone injustice, oppression, tyranny and shedding

innocent blood. The present state of Israel is prime example of all this
and therefore must have a limited leash of life.

I do have sympathy with those innocent Jews who migrated there

hoping that they will live in a country, governed according to God’
Laws and Commandments and not by Materialists and Atheists, no
different from the countries they migrated from.
Q148 MKOT (Israel, 729)
Who attacked Jerusalem? If Jews "lived and died by the sword" then who had the other swords?
And I do love it when one needs to retreat more than 6 centuries back to find peace and
tranquility in the Arab/ Muslim World. Apparently you have a fairly large gap in your timeline...
a few things have happened since then. Islam is not in its Golden Age any longer. You should do
some reading...viewing or watch some beheadings on You Tube.

Bin Laden isn't too happy with the way Islam is being practiced.
ANS.

Who else had the sword? Ask the Jews or read in the Bible?
Arab and Muslim world was no better and worse than Europeans and
other nations even one hundred years back.

Europeans have shed more human blood than all other nations of the
world combined. Human loss during WW-1 and WW-2 itself is more
than enough to compensate for centuries of loss of life by other
people.

We do not need any lecture or advise from your kinds as to how to live
peacefully.

Bin Laden could be a role model for you, but he is not for us.
Apparently he was OK to you when he was fighting against Russia, but
became Devil the day, Russians were out of Afghanistan.

Q149 MKOT (Israel, 730, )

If the Pogroms, Holocaust and persecution did not drive the Jews to seek their old homeland,
what did? Why would Jews not settle in their revered land? If Jews "could have settled in any
remote and unpopulated area" then WHY NOT PALESTINIANS? After all, you've said ALL
ARABS ARE PRETTY MUCH THE SAME. Mecca is Mecca, right? Sand is sand.
Why are Jews so "portable" yet Arabs can't move even 50 miles?...

ANS.

Your whole post indicates that “Charity should be done at other’s

expenses not on your own”.

Why did European Christians persecuted jews? Why they cannot live
together like Brothers?

Why Jews should be removed from Europe and settled else where?

Why Cant Christians be taught to live in peace with their “superiors”?

The Race of their Savior? The race of their Lord and Master?

Why you are sending these brotherly advice to Arabs, Muslims and
Palestinians?
Q150 MKOT (Israel, 734)
And why do you make of the conquest of the Crusaders? What about the Ottoman Empire? You
try to use OUR BIBLE to explain your hatred? Your ego? Why not quote your KORAN to
explain the rise of Israel once again? "INVINCIBLE?" No human is invincible. But, Jews have
returned to their spiritual home after thousands of years. I would call that blessed…and very
disturbing for those who think Islam should rule ALL.
.
ANS.

Let me touch the main points of your argument and post by brief
replies

A. What are my views on Crusaders and Ottoman Empire?

The Crusaders had no right to be there. They were a “foreign element”

and their only justification was their force. They occupied Jerusalem in
year 1000 CE but were thrown out after 99 years.

Ottoman Empire was the continuation of Muslim rule. There were

many before them. They held the Islamic Caliphate and had legal right
to rule Islamic lands. They had the support and consent of majority of
Muslims of their time.

B. Is Islam Invincible?

Islam as an ideology is indeed invincible. There is no one to defeat any

of Islamic ideologies and bring a better one.

However Muslims as a fighting force are not invincible. They win wars
and they loose wars. They are not super humans.

However if they adhere to Islamic beliefs and show perseverance and

constancy, they will win any war in the end.

The aim of Islamic Jihad is to continue fight against oppression, tyranny

, injustice and mischief in the world. Winning or losing are left to Allah.
He decides as He sees fit and Muslims get their reward for trying.

C. Jews do not do forced conversions but Muslims do.

Quran and prophetic traditions discourage forced conversions and

forced conversions do not mean or achieve any thing. Because being
muslim involves sacrifices and perseverance during hardships.

Under those circumstances , how could those who were forced to

become muslims behave?

Jews on the other hand, do not welcome people converting to their

faith. They want it to be exclusive racial type of religion.

However if some one is bent upon accepting their religion (usually due
to matrimonial reasons), they allow it reluctantly after many rituals.
That is why their faith is not expanding.

D. Why I cannot accept two state solution?

I am not against two state theory. But I feel that only Jews who were
residing in Palestine before 1917, should be eligible to get land and
that too in proportion of their population pre-1917.

European and Jews from all over the land, have no claim on the land of
Palestine, except to be invited by their Brethren living in their own
portion of land.

They cannot be allowed to feast on lands and homes of Palestinians

living there for generations.
Q151 My Kind of town (Israel, 678)
but they are no match for us..." This is your most telling comment. What is the contest?
Numbers? Domination? The extinction of a religion or a people? You are an extremist.
You are also a fundamentalist if you support Sharia its brutality against women. Judge not other
societies or faiths until you have perfected your own.... Islam is flawed, violent and has spawned
international terrorism-you have much work to do and should follow the example of the Jews
who do not look to you for anything.
ANS.

It seems that I have touched one of your sensitive nerves!! Your post
is full on invectives against Islam and Muslims and your bias is self
evident.

My comment was that Jews are no match to Muslims, neither in

numbers, nor in followers, nor in territories they control. They have
never been a match for Muslim armies in 1400 years of history of
Islam.

There has never taken a major battle between Jews and Muslims in
1400 years of history of Islam.

In modern age also, Jews are no match for entire Muslim nations…. But
they have “ears” of their “Christian friends” for past 60 to 80 years. It
is only on these crutches that they pose as “goliath” in the land of
Palestine…which is a very insignificant percentage of all Muslim lands.

So they should “self evaluate” their greatness, why should they need
outside help?

As for your comments on islam, despite all these defects, it is still the
fastest growing religion in the world, in USA and in Europe also.

How come Jews are not able to attract converts from other faiths,
despite they being the “Super Power and Super Brains of the World”?

Q152 My kind of town (Israel, 684)

The "big achievement’s that Israel exists and expands...what have you "won" beyond was offered
in Partition? nothing...you continue to lose Jerusalem. Egypt won how many wars with Israel?
And what did they do? They signed a treaty. Jordan won how many wars? They have relations
with Israel. Syria? Only a matter of time.

Who is rushing in to "officially" declare war on Israel? Any legitimate government interested in
world trade? Who keeps trying to rewrite the map? Those without power who resort to
invention and denial. Europe and the US are vital to the future of the Middle East...

ANS.
You are right…we continue to loose Jerusalem …and that is eight in the
front of whole eye…Right in front of those nations who “continue to
preach” about the rights of Palestinian…

These are infact the “self convicting “ evidences…. The Examples

galore in the world of such type of acts.

In India we also have many such example. A 450 years old mosque in
Ayodhya was “shut down” in 1949 when some idols were fraudulently
placed into the mosque.

The court issued “status Quo” order… banning Muslims from the
Mosque while allowing Hindus to visit the mosque to offer puja….the
civil case continued….then the gates were opened for Hindus
only….then the Mosque was demolished in broad daylight and make
shift temple was constructed in its place…

But the real beauty in the whole case is that “In the Eyes of Court
Status Quo is still in force”!!! That is called Judicial Fraud.

Israel’s grabbing of Palestinian land since 1948 also comes under the
same category. They are stealing land right in front of every one…and
UNO, US and Europe…the self claimed champions of “Human Rights
and Fair Treatment” continue to look other way and only protect the
thief.

These things are not unique…many examples can be found in every

age.

But like any falsehood, these would also be removed…suffice is to say

that Israel is doing such acts, so that when the time will come for it to
pay back for its crimes, there will be no one to show any mercy to it.

So you excel in the “false glory” of Israel’ invincibility …. We have faith

is God’ justice system….falsehood, tyranny and oppression do meet
their end sooner or later.

Current state of Israel is one prime example of all such things. How
can it survive for long?

Q153 Northern Light ( Jews don’t, 62)

Yes "MUQ", the Israeli's that believed and encouraged this evilness on these poor meek
Palestinians Farmers are nothings, but these mutated little racist devils nobbit's, are going to be
wailing and gnashing their teeth, because they are going to Reap what they have Sown.
And nobody knows when the Grand Creator of All will come, but it will be like a thief in the
night.

ANS.

You are right, any one who does wrong has to pay the penalty, God is
the creator of whole Universe, He is not partial to one race over other
or one nation above other.

The way Jews describe their rights above and over all nations does not
meet with the impartiality of God.

Every tyrant and aggressor has to pay the fruits of his crimes, in this
world or hereafter,
.
Q154 PJAM 2825 (Israel, 745)
You are crazy, a Jew that lives in Australia is no less a Jew then one that lives in Israel Jewish
people don’t just need protection in one tiny spot in the ME Jewish people need to be protected
and respected around the globe. The criminal actions of the Zionists have a detrimental effect on
The Jewish diaspora’s relations with people of there home country. Jews were cast from Israel to
show the world that to be a strong people you don’t need a land.
Zionism is destroying Judaism not protecting it.

ANS.

I think you are the same guy, with whom I had exchange of posts many
months ago.

Your post is very reasonable and logical.

By gathering all jews in one place is indeed detrimental to the survival

of Jews as a race!!

If you put all your eggs in one basket, and the basket is destroyed, you
would have left with no eggs!!

By bringing all jews to one place, these Zionists are indeed doing a
disservice to Jews as a race!!
Q155 Rama fuchus (Holocaust, 77)
As long as India and Israel are allowed to save their countries with the worst nonsensical WMD
Iran is also entitled to have the same barbaric WMD.
No ifs and buts. None of the rascals can preach sermons . Let their be a befitting war to uphold
decency so that barbarism prevails.

ANS.

I hope you will not mind, if some one other than OBAMA commented on
your post!!

Let me amend your statement as follows “As long as WMD s are used
as threats and browbeat other nations…… every nation has right to get
and manufacture their own WMD s”.

It is not logical to give rights to some nations to make and stockpile

WMD s and preach to others to not acquire them…”because they are
not good for your health”!!

This NPT is discriminatory, that is why more and more nations are
getting into Nuclear Club…slowly but surely.

Why world should make so much hue and cry over Iran’s Nuclear
Program at the same time keeping Tight Lipped Silence over Israel’s
Nuclear Program?

Q156 Ramafuchs (Jews don’t, 154)

Jews deserve a shelter or country as in the case of Palestine. Projecting jews problems will never
solve the problems of palestine people. As a German citizen i keep aloof from this topic with my
last comment in this thread. Jews need a better leader to avoid war. Most of the jews in Köln are
blindly, acidly, unconditionally support my critical views.
ANS.

I am sorry to hear that you want to leave this thread. I acknowledge

that people are too biased and too absorbed in their own views than to
consider any one else’.

I do not deny that Jews should have a land of their own. But that could
have been anywhere in the world.

Selecting the site of Palestine was not a very good suggestion, as the
area was already populated and occupied by Muslims and Arabs and all
around that were Arab and Muslim states.

They should have got the acceptance of these people before bringing
Jews there. And in any case, Military might of Israel was to be
controlled so that it cannot become a bully in the region (you can see,
how western powers control the military might of every Arab state, so
that it cannot become too powerful in the area).

German Jews know better than any one else, what it means to be
hated by majority of people around you.

The present “Rambo like” attitude of Israel and US has to end, before
there can be any peace in that region and in the world as a
consequence.

Q157 Reality (Jews don’t, 84)

Then why did every country expel them.
1816 Jews are expelled from Free city of Lubeck Germany
1797 1st U.S. senator, William Blount of Tennessee, expelled by impeachment
1784 Jews are expelled from Warsaw by Marshall Mniszek
1775 Jews expelled from outskirts of Warsaw Poland
1745 Jews are expelled from Prague
1740 Jews are expelled from Little Russia by order of Czarina Anne
1738 Jews are expelled from Breslau Silesia
1727 Jews are expelled from Ukraine by Empress Catherine I of Russia
1716 Decree orders all Jews expelled from Brussels
1699 Jews are expelled from Lubeck Germany
1683 Expelled Polish and Lotharings reach Wienerwald
1670 Jews expelled from Austria by order of Leopold I
1654 Jews are expelled from Brazil
1638 Religious dissident Anne Hutchinson expelled from Mass Bay Colony
1598 Jews are expelled from Genoa Italy
1567 Jews are expelled from Brazil by order of regent Don Henrique
1563 Jewish community of Neutitschlin Moravia expelled
1563 Jews are expelled from France by order of Charles VI
1550 Jews are expelled from Genoa Italy
1549 Jews are expelled from Ghent Belgium
1539 Jews of Tyrnau Hungary (then Trnava, Czechoslovakia), expelled
1526 Jews are expelled from Pressburg Hungary by Maria of Hapsburg
1515 Jews are expelled from Laibach Austria
1510 Jews are expelled from Colmar Germany
1505 Jews are expelled from Orange Burgandy by Philibert of Luxembourg
1498 Jews are expelled from Nurenberg Bavaria by Emperor Maximillian
1497 Jews are expelled from Graz (Syria)
1496 Jews are expelled from Portugal by order of King Manuel I
1496 Jews are expelled from Syria
1496 Jews are expelled from Carintha Austria
1492 100,000 Jews expelled from Sicily
1492 All Jews are expelled from Spain
1492 Jews are expelled from Spain by King Ferdinand and Queen Isabella
1479 Jews are expelled from Schlettstadt Alsace
by Emperor Frederick III
1454 Jews are expelled from Brunn Moravia by order of King Ladislaus
1452 Ferdinand II, the Catholic
, King of Aragon/Sicily, expelled Jews
1450 Jews are expelled from Lower Bavaria by order of Ludwig IX
1430 Jews are expelled from Eger Bohemia
1430 Jews are expelled from Speyer Germany
1427 Jews are expelled from Berne Switzerland
1421 Jews of Austria imprisoned and expelled
1421 Jews are expelled from Styria Austria
1420 Jews of Syria and Austria expelled
1394 Jews are expelled from France by Charles VI
1394 Jews are expelled from France by order of King Charles VI
1370 Jews are expelled/massacred from Brussels Belgium
1360 Jews are expelled from Breslau Silesia
1349 Jews are expelled from Zurich Switzerland
1349 Jews are expelled from Burgsordf Switzerland
1322 Jews are expelled from France for 3rd time
1294 Jews are expelled from Berne Switzerland
1290 Last of 16,000 English Jews expelled by King Edward I, leaves
1290 Jews are expelled from England by order of King Edward I
1253 Jews are expelled from Vienne France by order of Pope Innocent III
1253 Jews are expelled from Vienne France by order of Pope Innocent III
1250 Pope Innoncent III refuses Jews of Cordova Spain to build a synagogue
1239 Edward I, King of England, 1272-1307, chased Jews out of England
1235 Emperor Joseph II orders Jews of Galicia Austria to adopt family names
1210 King John of England begins imprisoning Jews
1205 Pope Innocent III states Jews are doomed to perpetual servitude and subjugation due to
crucifixion of Jesus
1190 Crusaders kill 57 Jews in Bury St. Edmonds England
1190 Crusades complete massacre of Jews of York England
1190 Crusades begin massacre of Jews of York England
1189 30 Jews are mnassacred at King Richard I (lion hearted) coronation
1099 Crusaders herd Jews of Jerusalem into a synagogue and set it afire
1096 1st Crusade slaughter Jews of Werelinghofen Germany
1096 Crusaders massacre Jews of Worm
694 Spanish King Egica accuses Jews of aiding Moslems/sentenced to slavery
418 Jews are excluded from public office in the Roman Empire
335 Constantinople emperor Constantine the Great rules laws against Jews
70 "2nd Temple" of Jews is set aflame (approx)
65 Jews revolt against Rome, capturing fortress of Antonia in Jerusalem

Q158 Rick Moss (Messianic, 324)

Arabs are welcome to live in Israel. They aren't "ruled" by Jews -- Jews, Xtians and Muslims are
all elected officials in Israel.

If any Muslim/Arab isn't happy with their elected leaders, they may work to elect different
leaders or move. Those are the choices given to ANY free people.

People who are familiar with democratic government understand the difference between leaders
and rulers.

ANS.

Only advise that I can give you is to change your name to an Arab and
Muslim and live in gaza for one month!!! That will show what “normal
and unbiased” treatment means!!

Democracy is not the wonder wand that solves all problems of any
nation.

Nations based on hate and prejudice are as democratic as any other,

but that does not mean that they are right.

Hitler was elected by Overwhelming Democratic Majority by Germans…

By the way, Iran holds regular election every four years….but their
elected leaders are not acceptable to US and Israel? Why?

In Algeria Islamic front won the Election by democratic means but were
denied power. Why?

HAMAS won the election by democratic means, but were not

recognized by US and Israel. Why?

That shows, your meaning of democracy. You want only THAT

democracy that works to your interest.

Q159 Rick Moss (Israel, 764)

For the record -- it wasn't Jews who coined the term "Anti-Semitism" it was a 19th Century
Prussian Author who used the term "Semite" to be synonymous with Jew. The expression caught
on and became the defacto term for discrimination against Jews only.

Jews don't refer to ourselves as Semites -- we merely use a term created by non-Jews.

ANS.

I said that it could have been an “Honest Mistake” to equate Semites

with jews….. But since it has been found that it is misnomer, why not
change it?

Then why only Jews should be protected against hate? Why it should
not be illegal to hate Arabs? Africans ? and any other race, religion, or
nation for that respect?

The law is arbitrary, discriminatory and against rules of Justice.

The law should be Universal that no one is allowed to spread hate

against any group, religion, or nation.

Universal Brotherhood is our slogan.

Q160 The Hell Rider (Jews don’t, 78)

WHAT MUST BE DONE'IS TO UNITE ALL 12 TRIBE'S OF ISRAEL. AND WE WILL
REALIZE WE WERE OF OLD.EVEN TO THE CREATION OF ADAM AND EVE.THE
FIRST TWO HUMANS CREATED OF [GOD ALLMIGTHY] WE ARE ALL THIER
DECENDANT'S AND WE ARE ALL' LIKE IT OR NOT [BROTHER'S AND SISTER'S].
WELL SO MUCH FOR THAT

ANS.

Want to hear what Quran (the Final Revelation from God to Humanity)
has to say on the subject of Universal Brotherhood:

" O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of male and female
and made you into tribes and nations, so that you may know each
other (not that you may despise each other). Most Certainly the Most
honorable amongst you (in the eyes of God) is the one who is Most
Righteous, and Allah is all Knowing and all Seeing (He knows who is
most righteous".

Can any thing be more direct and more practical than this Quranic
verse to create Universal Human brotherhood and remove all this false
distinction of superiority based on Color, Creeds, Nationality and
Language!!

And in one saying the Last and Final Prophet said "There is no
superiority of an Arab over a Non Arab…a Black over a white or white
over a black...except on the basis of righteousness...All humans are
descendants of Adam and Adam was created from Dust!!!"

What better way to remove all these false senses and standards of
superiority by man made standards.

Q161 Unknown (Jews don’t, 155)

Are you Jew hater?

ANS.

No I am never a rabid hater of Jews and Israel either!! Our religion

prohibits us from doing it.

I am not against every Jew, just because he or she is Jew.... I am

against those Jews who have harmed us...taken our lands and driven
out our brothers from the land they were living in for centuries...

I am also against those Jews, whose only job is to spread hate against
Islam and Muslim, by dishonest use of media and available
information.

I am not against Jews living in Palestine or ME getting a separate piece

of land to make their own country.....but I am against this Idea of
"Palestine belongs to Jews only" and "Jews from every corner of the
world to be brought to Palestine and turn out people living there since
centuries".

My opposition to Jews and Israel is based on issues and is not rabid

hate for jews in general, as I see against Islam and Muslim on this
forum.

Whenever I criticize jews as people as having control of Media and

financial institution in USA, that is also based on facts and is not an
empty statement.

I once again Thank Allah, that He Has placed us on a middle

path....both in love and hate...
On the other hand....Extremism is the second nature of White people in
general.....that always go to extreme in every thing...as can be seen
from their history and their culture....

More so now, because they have broken the link which they had with
Creator of Universe.....their own Creator!!

Any one familiar with posts on this thread can verify what sort of words
they use for Him....I need not elaborate.

Q162 WW Man (Israel, 682)

Once again-your true "religion" is showing. Strange measurements for "faith".....

"no match" -in what arena? contributions to the arts, science, medicine?

"never a major battle..in 1400 years.." sounds like you want a rematch because you don't like the
score.....now what would that be about? Jews surpassed you when they continued
to progress in real time with the world. Islam wants a "battle" to turn back time. Lunacy.
ANS.

Please refer to my earlier answer, where I have told that “history” is

not 62 years or so period but a span of many centuries.

May be Jews have forgotten their centuries of living in ghettos and as

outlaws and persecutions and pogroms etc…. they think that past 62
years are the “only period “ of history that is relevant.

When Jews and Christians Popes and Priests had powers they indeed
killed, burned and did all those unspeakable things to whom they
suspected of hypocrisy, heretics etc. Now he power has been taken
form them and they are “forced” to preach the “religion of peace and
tolerance”.

If Arabs are going to US and European Universities for higher

educations…then those people were also coming to Arab lands for
getting higher educations in the past.

But Arabs are paying full cost of this education, while Muslims provided
education to Christians and Jews for free!!

There is nothing hidden in Islamic religion…it is an open book. Any one

can read it.
Muslims do not have to apologies to anyone as Popes and other priests
have to do for their mistakes of the past.
Q163 WW Man (Israel, )96
Like it or loath it the land belongs to the Jews by the laws of conquest and prescription. The
Arabs all ganged up out numbered the Israeli forces thinking they were all muslim brothers
together and that they were going to destroy the Jewish state its end is near the Arabs cried. But
they forgot what a gutless undisplined bunch their forces were it turned out to be the end for
them. Now we here the cries of the fool ahmadinejad Israel end is near. They lost they always
will the truth hurts …

ANS.

1. You are true in a sense, Jews occupied the land of Palestine thru the
force and thru the support and help (morally, politically, financially,
Militarily) from their “Christian Friends”. So the only justification is the
Military victory.

2. So Jews should stop babbling about historical claims to the lands of

Palestine.

3. If Military might is the only solution, then Arabs also have a right to
fight back and take back the land from Jews. Why should one party
then cry foul, when Arab use force? Arabs can use any type of force,
Gorilla Warfare, Suicide Bombing and any other way to expel Jews from
Palestine.

4. Yes it is a fact that US and NATO forces took casualties in saving

Muslims of Bosnia. But they more than enough compensated for that
kindness by their killings of Muslims in Afghanistan and Iraq.

5. You say that you do not hate Muslims, but your post shows exactly
the opposite. So it would be better for you to think calmly and do not
generalize things, using that logic, any community can be painted in
the worst colors.

Q164 WW Man (Israel, 707)

What price should the Israeli pay for winning a wars started by Arabs .What price for not laying
down and taking it up the arse from the Arabs. Should they lay down like the Arabs did with the
Turks for 600 years. If you teach your children your muslin nonsense they will pay the price
especially the girls(that is if you don’t kill them at birth)!!! Remember the biggest killer today of
the muslim is the muslim!!

ANS.

The war was not started by Arabs, It is Israel who started the war by
unilaterally declaring formation of Israel on the lands of Palestinians.
So it is Israel who has to take initiative to make permanent peace with
its Arab neighbors and the first step is to g back to pre-1948
boundaries and take back the Palestinian refugees.

You call it non sense, but the Jews living for 2000 years in exile and
teaching and coaching their progeny to take control of Palestine makes
perfect sense to you.

Muslims will never end their claim on the lands occupied by them for
past 1300 years.

Muslims are divided today because they are coached and guided and
have taken advise and instructions from Jews and Christians, but this
condition shall not last for ever.

It is going to change and that will be a sad day for Israel.

Q165 Y Adam ( Jews Don’t, 91)

rabbee: well it was given to TheYehoodah, who were there for 1948 years prior to any, roman,
muslem, or moors theft of the land. if you don't really believe in TheG-D of TheTorah, here
actually in TheStory. then you coveted it for yourself(stole). and besides the land was given to
Yeetzak by Avraham.

Eeshmael got the other side of the river north of the dead sea. and the families of Lot inhabited
from the the other side of the river with the dead sea, south to about egypt, aka the philistines, etc.

and HaShem G-D promised TheYehoodah would be returned. and any muslem or anyone else
who does not believe this. does not believe in TheG-D of TheTorah here in TheOnly Physical
Story, TheG-D of Only TheTorah is going to give. this no matter what illegal law you pass, to put
someone in my back yard, you don't want in yours. shalomcha vshalomech???,?...

ANS.

Now to support your false logic, you try to implicate God of the
Universe also in your plot.

If God did give Plaestine to jews for an everlasting possession, then

how come any Christian, Muslims or Arabs be able to stael that land
from them?

That proves that the Vwery Idea that God gave All Areas of Palestine to
Jews for ever and ever as an exclusive inheritance is false and
fabriction against God.

It is reasonable and stands to logic that Jews were given the land of
Palestine on a conditional basis to do good and walk in the ways of
God. So long as Jews stood to this , they were kept there.

But when their mischief’s increased beyond the limit set by God, they
were killed, persecuted and even evicted from the land, first for 70
years then for 2000 years.

Their return to Palestine in 1948 is not for any noble cause. They have
not returned to repent and do all so that they can walk in the ways of
God. They have returned as a bully, as a cruel people, as a racist
people and what they are doing in planning death and destruction of
their neighbors.

Do you mean to say that God is a party to all their cruelty, boasts and
their intrigues and secret plans? No God is watching when their
rebellion and mischief’s once again cross the limit, so they be ready to
receive another painful Chastisement.

Jews in my views are walking on very thin ice, so they should be

extremely careful!!

Q166 Y. Adam ( Jews Don’t, 92)

well your first mistake, is attempting to qualify anything on the west side of TheYordan as
palestine. and anyone can see in TheTorah, the land that is awarded, to TheYehoodah designated
as Ysrael. and do not expect me to do, the work that is required for you to do. and that they never
occupied, all the land that was designated as part of Ysrael. and no! you can't call Yeroosalem,
palestine errantly. and you can read also in scripture, that during the phase of the final
ingathering, they won't be true to TheG-D of TheTorah here in IT. and that is to be remedied,
after the ingathering has taken place. and it is not my responsibility, to read TheTorah Scroll i
have been given with, to any of you. or to verify what is written, that is actually your job to do.
what man would do the work of his ox, so the ox can screw off all day long? shalomcha
vshalomech???,?...

ANS.

No matter is whatever way you read or interpret Torah, it is fact that

Jews have had total control of their Inheritance for not more than 100-
200 Years in the past 5000 Years!!
If some thing is not confirmed on ground, how can we say that God had
decreed it as an everlasting possession.

The only way, in which the God’s promise to Abraham was fulfilled, was
when we take the combined possessions of Progeny of Isaac AND the
progeny of Ishmael!!!

Combined control of Isaac and Ishmael’s progeny has had full control
of land of Inheritance for a much longer period. than the progeny of
Isaac alone.

You should interpret scriptures in light of actual world history and

should not live in an imaginary world.

Q167 Zainfab (Jews don’t, 100)

No. I have never read any Jewish messages against the Al Aqsa Mosque. I have never seen any
Jewish plans to re-construct the Temple other than models made for archeological/educational
purposes.

I have no idea where or if the Temple will ever be rebuilt. I have no site plans or maps. I don't see
any evidence the Israeli government is part of anything...except allowing the Al Awsa Mosque to
remain under Muslim control. The incident in 1969 seems to have been the actions of a lone
crazy person. Given the importance of the site to Judaism, Islam and Christianity, frankly I'm
surprised there have not been more incidents. The Babri Mosque in India, dude, that was a mob
of tens of thousands of Indian people. Are you seriously suggesting it was a Zionist conspiracy?!!

ANS.

You need to keep your eyes open and read Newspapers which are not
controlled by Jews…. You should also watch TV News Channels which
are not directly or indirectly under control of Jews, then you may see
the “Jewish eyes on Al Aqsa Mosque”.

Right now your condition is that of a brainwashed and blind folded

man, who only sees what he is shown by Jewish controlled media.

I know how Jews downplay any event which shown them in any bad
light….

Well the growing “friendship” between extremist Hindus and extremist

Jews is no more a secret. Hindus have to learn many things from Jews
as they might be novice in this field.

Babri Mosque demolition in 1992 could well be a joint plan by

Extremist Hindus and Extremist Jews to gauge the Muslim World’s
reaction to such events.

The Mosque Demolition Enquiry commission has found that there was
a very deep and thorough conspiracy by RSS and its affiliates to
demolish the mosque. It was very well planned… the sympathy of RSS
with Jews and Israel is an open secret. The hate of Islam and Muslims
have found them an ideal partner in the shape of Zionist state of Israel.

So I will not be surprised if RSS got some help from Extremists Jews…

Q168 Zinfab (Jews don’t, 98)

Jews did what...?!

I'm aware of an event in August 1969 when a deranged Australian Christian named Michael
Dennis Rohan tried to do that, was there a different event?

And didn't that event lead to the Israelis putting the Al Aqsa Mosque under Arab control?

ANS.

Do you not read hate messages against Al Aqsa mosque in Jewish

literature?

Don’t you read Jewish plans to re-construct Solomon's Temple in

Jerusalem?

Where do you think that Jewish Temple will be constructed?

Do you have the map and site plan for that structure?

What does all that indicate? Israeli Government is part of all these
things.

The incident in 1969 was a trial.... pulling down a 450 years old
mosque in Ayodhya India was another trial to judge Muslim world's
reaction to such events....

Unless one is totally blind or biased.... the designs of Jews are very
clear and unambiguous.
Chpater-3 Islam-1 (Topics related to Islam, Quran, Prophet and others)

Q. Rocket Queen (Afghan, 6)

Problem is the religion. If there is no religion country will be very peaceful. How many millions
of people died due to religion islam. Afghan people do not send their kids to religion school. Send
them to good schools. May be everything will change near future.
ANS.

Religion is not the problem.

It is personal greed and show off and expand their empire that is the
problem.

Most wars in the world were and are being fought not because of any
religion or religious issues.

Which religion caused WW-1 and WW-2 , the two deadliest wars in
human history?

Which religious issue caused Vietnam War, Korean War, USSR invasion
of Kuwait, Iran Iraq War, Gulf War, 2003 Invasion of Iraq?

So please correct your mistake that it is religions which are reason of

war.

Q. RLH (Afghans, 6)
You are as wrong as you could ever be; it is on account of political ideologies; and in regarding
Islam, all the chiefs of the ‘Muslim world’ have brought back to Islam its fundamental and core
purpose: political ideology, with an intention to inflict it upon the world. Islam has been at war
with every neighbor it ever had. Are Jihads and suicide bombers are motivated by money and
greed? No they are not. Jihads is now the operating force behind Islam.

ANS

You mean to say that it is alright to do wars based on political

ideologies,

It is Ok to make war on economical reasons…

It is OK to make war on the basis of race, color, language and

ethnicity….

When all these wars are OK, then why wars on religious ideologies only
should be banned?
Your logic is not correct.

Islam does not want world domination. Islam only reserves its right to
be preached to every corner of the world, no one should put hurdles in
its peaceful propagation.

Who comes to fold of Islam or rejects it, is left to individual’s judgment.

Suicide Bombers are a legacy to the Creation of Terrorist state of Israel

in Palestine. Unless that basic problem is solved, there can be no
peace in the world.

If this message is not clear to you yet….then no one can help you.

Q. Monk (Elite, 24)

You in no way speak for Islam. Muslims around the world want to live in peace and achieve
what all people want- a better life for their children and a
decent life for their families. American Muslims are some of our best citizens. They are
hardworking patriotic Americans. They live around us.
Al-Qaeda and other Muslim extremists are a plague on Islam. They kill innocent Muslims in Iraq
and Pakistan. They are evil fanatics who have declared war on the world. They are serial killers
and war criminals…

ANS

I know most of Muslims living in USA and in every part of world are
peace loving.

But it is media which is the garb of fighting terrorism is trying to malign

the image of all Muslims and also the image of Islam.

I have no authority to speak on behalf of all Muslims, but as a Muslim, I

have a right to defend Islamic teachings and Islamic principles.

If I have any time outside these limits, then you have a right to correct
me.

I do not defend any act of Terrorism by Muslims or by any one else.

But I consider all acts of Terrorism in the same way.

For me any act of terrorism carried out by Al Qaeda, Hamas or any

other Muslims has the same value as acts of Terrorism done by Israeli
Army, US Army, or any other army.

But you want to be selective in your definition of Terrorism and

terrorists.

You do not see Israeli army , Jews of Israel or US army atrocities in Iraq,
Afghanistan, Palestine and elsewhere as acts of Terror.

This is the basic problem that terrorism is on the rise, despite best
efforts of those fighting it.

You cannot fight Terrorism by your own acts of terrorism.

You cannot fight terrorism by branding all 1500 Million Muslims as

terrorists.

This attitude must end.

I have no connection with House of Saud. I am not for or against them.

Allah will punish EVERY one who kills an innocent human soul. Whether
in Palestine, in Iraq, in Iran or in Afghanistan or in Pakistan.

Allah will not condone acts of Terrorism by so called Muslims or so

called jews or so called Christians. He is a just God and God of every
one.

Q. RLH (Elite, 18)

Here is a "core issue" for you then; explain to us the exact scenario/situation, on a global scale,
that would make the jihadist lay down their weapons, cease all political aggression and love their
neighbors worldwide; tell us what the world would look like for that to happen. No more mass
murder of innocents, no more bombings, hijackings and kidnappings and no more “kill the
infidels”. No more Sunni planting bombs in the Shiite masque or vice-versa then somehow blame
the US. Paint for us that picture. Don’t drag it out with nonsense, just a nice crisp picture of such
a world. Maybe we have it all wrong, so run it past us again please. Tell us how, worldwide, the
'Muslims' will love the rest of the world and be nice. Tell us what it would take for a world where
the people of Islam will collectively hunt down and punish one of their own whom has used terror
and violence in the name of Islam.

ANS

From your post, it is clear that you have only one sided agenda to end
all acts of “terrorism” and have no real intention in solving the
problem.

I would present my agenda , that deals with root cause of spread of

Terrorism, here is my solution:

1. Remove the root cause of All Terrorism in the World:

a. Dismantle the terrorist state of Israel at once. If that is not possible,

ask it to return to 1948 borders and take back all Arab refugees that
were made homeless then.

b. Seriously restrict Military Power of Israel, so that it does not act a

Bully in the religion.

c. It could have guaranteed borders, but its offensive forces have to be

restricted and it could have International Guarantee for Borders.

2. Stop Meddling into the affairs of other Nations:

a. Let every country be run according to the desire and culture and
social needs of its population.

b. No one should force or coerce any nation to work according to its

own version of Democracy, social justice and cultural freedom.

3. Bring Armed Forces and police of Every Country under Judicial

Review:

a. Armed forces and police of every country are the biggest source of
Terrorist activities .

b. At present they have immunities from justice system. Security and

Safety of state and country, often allow them to get away with virtually
every crime.

c. The soldiers and Police force could be liable to even death penalty if
they killed any innocent person knowingly.

4. Persons responsible for killing Innocent Persons, should be executed

thru Judicial system.

5. Only the Criminal should be punished not his tribe or his country:

a. It is not correct if we kill 10 or 100 of “enemy” for killing one of us.

b. This type of Rambo type of revenge only escalate the problem and
never solves it.

c. So only the Criminal should be traced and punished. If any one was
supporting that person, he should also be tried and punished. But that
should be done by courts and not by Military or Police.

6. There should be Universal Actions against those convicted of

carrying out Terrorist activities:

a. This could also be arranged thru UNO and other International

agencies that those who are actually involved in terrorist activities ,
should not get any safe heaven.

b. But as usual, it should not be a targeted action, only against certain

nations or communities.

c. Islamic Laws are very effective and very practical in such cases and
they should be used more and more. Not in any religious sense, but as
best means to remove crimes from the area.

7. Strengthen UNO:

a. The worst thing of our time is the demise of UNO. Due to high
handedness of so called Super Powers, this prime institution has been
reduced to only ceremonial role. It needs to be strengthened.

b. All International issues must be solved only thru UNO. No one

should by pass UNO to get their agenda done. The defaulters should
be punished only thru UNO.

c. The power of general assembly in UNO should be increased.

Security Council Veto could be turned down by two third majority of
General Assembly. In that case no nation would make UN ransom to
its demands.

8. Time Frame:

You asked for Time frame, it depends how serious you are in solving
it!!

But why not start at Number 1, you tell me any time frame to
Dismantle or Curb Powers of Israel….It is in Your hands and not Mine!!
Q. RLH (Elite, 21)

Finally we have it very clear for all to see; allow you to destroy and enslave the 'Jews' and
summit America and the rest of the free world to Islamic control. Islamic domination over the
world. Well, good luck with that, and in the mean time, try not to whine so much as we hunt
down the Jihadist who are attempting to carry out terrorism in the name of this cause.

ANS

You are wrong; we do not want to destroy Jews. If we wanted, then we

could have done it when Jews were being persecuted thru out Europe
and they had no support whatsoever from any one.

It was in those dark ages that we muslims gave them shelter and they
were treated with kindness and tolerance in Islamic countries.

Our dispute with them is only when they did wrong to our brothers in
Palestine and turned them out of their houses and lands in which they
were living for past 1200 years.

We have no dispute per see with USA. It is USA which has taken upon
itself the enmity of whole Muslim world by blindly and one sided
supporting Israel and jews in every dispute.

It is USA which is to blamed for this state of affairs and not Muslims.

Then there is nothing wrong, if we wish that Islam grows and

propagates to all corners of the world. But we do not force any one to
our religion.

Don’t you know there are thousands of Christian missionaries working

round the clock in many Muslim countries to bring them into
Christianity. Why are they doing it.

Finally I wish you and your army all luck is tracking down all Jihadis!!

Is it not a paradox….that you re-elect Biggest terrorist of our time

(GWB the Great and his crony Dick Cheney for a second term) and
hunt down these “poor jihadis”!!

I think being cohots with jews and Zionists have turned your scales
upside down!!
Q. RLH (Elite,23

From all you have said in the past, which is a matter of record, in this post you lie; every sentence
is a lie and contrary to what you have always said, as it is also a lie by way of historical fact. The
reason for you thinking through what you have recently posted and making an attempt to clean it
up is twofold: one, you understand the ‘propaganda value’ your prior post have given Americans
as well as the rest of the free world…, giving them a clear view of what the current status of
Islam is all about, and two, you have become worried you may be hunted by non-American
agents, by those who do not extend you the same rights as we Americans would extend our own
citizens; in other words, you have only a few computers to post from while in Saudi Arabia, as
they can locate you from the IP number and other means. They may well take issue with
foreigners calling for death of the West and the genocide of Israel from within their own
boarders. This recent post of yours fly’s in the face of all you have promoted in the past and this
turnaround of yours is for a reason. You are indeed backing away for a reason. You have called
for the death of American troops, called for the death of the West itself and have called for the
death of Israel. Your verbal Jihad has been splashed across many pages and it cannot be undone
by changing your tune now.

ANS

You accuse me of lying, while you own post is full of lies!!

I never called for genocide of Jews. I never said that Jews should be
exterminated, I never said that USA should be finished.

I never said any thing against Jews just because they are Jews.

I said that I am against those Jews who have done atrocities against
our brothers and have driven them out from their homes and lands in
which they were living since generations.

I also said that Jews living in Palestine before 1917, have right to
demand their separate state.

But I denied this injustice that Palestine should be divided in two

halves (jews were less that 10 % of population before 1917) and
millions of Jews living in Europe and any part of world have “birth
right” to come and occupy that land.

If you think that this is spreading hatred against jews and this is reason
for High treason against USA…..well then you can have your opinion.

I know the powers of US army and their intelligence!!

Event of 9/11 proved their inefficiency in first place.

Their failure to capture Osama , despite more that 8 years of war in

Afghanistan shower their cowardice and inefficiency is second place.

Their bungling on WMD issue in Iraq and failure to gauge Iraqi

resistance showed their stupidity in the third place.

Their defeat in Vietnam at the hand of puny Vietnamese army, really

showed how Super Human they are.

Now if they want to put all CIA, FBI might to track me down (which is
already displayed on Topix page), I shall not be surprised in the least,
at least they will win this time!!

Q. Ron in FL (Elite, 31)

have given you several opportunities and waited patiently for you to engage me. You have failed
to do so. This post of yours is so full of lies I wait for you no longer. You are clearly a spreader
of Muslim and Arab propaganda lies, but not a very good one. I have followed your posts for a
few days now. They have gotten worse as you have continued with your lying and pitiful attempts
at deception. Go to your handlers, tell them you have failed and beg them for more training for
you.
I have corrected your quote above, not misquoted you, but corrected your quote to reflect what
you really mean but are afraid to say here. You twist truth 180 degrees at least most of the time
and take half truths to make them your whole truths, which are blatant propaganda lies.
I have studied Islam, primarily with Muslims for 45 years now and never been in an argument
with a Muslim.

ANS

Is it not strange that you want to engage a “real Muslim” for the first
time in a dialog, and you start with so much accusations and negative
bias!!

With that attitude how could a meaningful dialogue be carried out?

It is strange that you have studied Islam for 45 Years along with
Muslims and reached to such a wrong conclusion!!

And then you challenge that if I do not agree with you, then I am not a
true Muslim!!
Where then is a need for dialogue? You have taken the place of
Prosecutor, Jury and Judge yourself?

Do you think that this is the right attitude for carrying out nay
discussion?

According to you the aim of Islam are:

A. Take over the World for Allah.

B. Establish a Worldwide Caliphate with Shariah Law

C. Convert or subjugate in some form or Dhimmi

D. Kill all infidels – unbelievers in Islam and those who have left Islam.

And as per you these are incorporated in Islamic Shahadah!!

Now many of your assumptions are very wrong and I will show you
how:

1. Meaning of Shahadah:

- Shahadah or the declaration of Faith of Islam is “I bear witness that

there is no deity of worship except Allah and Mohammad is His
messenger”

- The Simple meaning of this is that all false gods which people worship
or seem to worship are not to be worshipped. We should worship only
one true God of Universe.

- And Mohammad is his messenger. It means that we should look for

guidance only thru messenger of Allah.

2. Islam the only religion for Mankind:

- Quran claims that Islam is the only true religion of God for humanity.

- And any one not having Islam as religion shall be looser in the last
day.

3. Islam is not a new religion introduced by Prophet Mohammad:

- Quran also claims that Islam is not a new religion. It is the same
religion which was preached by all prophets of the world.
- Islam means submitting oneself to Allah’s will. All past prophets were
therefore Muslims and they preached the same religion.

4. Mohammad is only the Last prophet in the long chain of prophets:

- As per Quran , Mohammad is only the last and final prophet in the
long chains of prophets. Which started from Adam and included Noah,
Abraham, Moses, David, Solomon and Jesus and many more.

- As per Quran, the messengers came in all parts of the worlds. There
was no region where no prophet came.

- So when one becomes Muslim, he in fact recognizes all past prophets.

He respects automatically all of these prophets.

5. It is duty of Muslims to propagate this Final message to all

humankind:

- Since no new prophet is to come into the world, it is duty of Muslims

to propagate and preach the last and final message of God to whole
world.

- Since many people are now aware of advent of last prophet, so they
must be educated .

6. No one should be compelled to Accept Islam:

- As per Quran there should be no compulsion in religion and no one

should be forced or coerced into accepting Islam.

- People should be preached the message of Islam and then they

should be given free will to either accept it or reject it. (Contd.)

7. Why Fighting or Jihad is ordained in Islam:

- While it is very good to talk about faith and peace and love, but there
shall always be people who will plot and try to finish the truth by any
means.

- The history of past prophets is proof that, those with worldly power
persecuted them or even killed them and extinguished their message
by force.

- To avoid similar situation, Quran asks its followers to be not easy

fodder to such people. They should unite and fight against these
people so that the banner of truth is floating in the world.
- So Muslims should fight to defend themselves and to break hold of
such people and forces who will not allow preaching of Islam to their
people and stop them by force in accepting Islam.

8. Establish rule of Allah is all areas where Muslims live:

- Islam means to surrender our wills to our Creator, so we should live

our lives as desired and directed by our Creator. This is both logical
and natural.

- Doing otherwise is pure and simple hypocrisy.

- Islamic Shariah is for Muslims and not for others. What is wrong in
saying that Muslims should follow their laws?

9 Future of Islam:

- Finally in Quran, Allah has stated very clearly that Islam will
supersede all other ways of life.

- It is recorded in three places in Quran “It is He (i.e. Allah), who has

sent His Messenger (i.e. Mohammad) with Guidance (i.e. Quran) and
with a way of life (i.e. Islam) to supersede all other ways of life”.

- We can see the truth of this prophesy for past 1400 years. Islam is
always on the growth. Number of Muslims are always increasing.
Islam is the fastest growing religion on this planet.

- Its growth is not only because of only biological reproduction, every

day more and more people are coming into the fold of Islam.

- But this growth is by peaceful means.

Islam means peace….peace of heart, peace of mind….peace to be in

harmony with nature.

Now you see, what you understood, and what is the reality?

Q. Ron in FL (Elite, 34)

MUQ, finally you dare to engage me, and I thank you for it. You have given to me exactly what I
need. You have shared your opinions of me and your faith belief. So now I share mine with you.
First, I stand on my initial post to you, every word of it. In your response to me you prove what I
said to and about you. You start with a lie and try to turn the tables by calling me a liar. You are
by far not the first Muslim I have engaged in dialogue. It was foolish for you to say that after I
told you,“I have studied Islam, primarily with Muslims for 45 years now and never been in an
argument with a Muslim.
You are not a real Muslim here but rather a cyber Muslim. So my record stands of never having
been in an argument with a Muslim. I do not even argue with you here. I share my faith belief
with you as you share yours with me and others….

ANS

Your post (I should say a very long post) is a strong mixture of boasts,
overconfidence, . .Denunciation , name calling and one way
preaching…

I don not know how to respond to you…..I think you were trying for 45
years to engage any Real Muslim (you have cut off my name from your
Real Muslim list….unless I abide by your decision) in any form of
debate and fortunately or unfortunately (for me!!) , I got into your
trap!! Now all your built up energy of 45 years is bursting out at
seems.

Coming to the childish part of your post…. You want to discuss with me
face to face at some location in Florida… You know I am based in Saudi
Arabia…would you arrange for my Visa and Air Ticket and boarding
and lodging for the trip? And why should I take that long Trip? To
convince some one who has one track mind? What purpose such a
meeting will serve? ( I am sure it will end in fist fight at the least!! You
trying to throw down your Bible in my throat and I resisting it!!)

You accuse me of hiding behind Internet….. now considering that this

IS A FORUM ON INTERNET….where else we could hide? !!

You believe in Jesus, I find no fault in it (We Muslims also believe in

Jesus for your information), but as a follower of Jesus, you should do
what he taught you to do.

First lesson that you should learn from jesus is about humility…. He
praised meek and humble people.

But I am sure that you will not recognize meekness and humbleness,
even if they were presented to you on a plate!!

What I see, (from your writing) is an Over bearing Bible

Thumper…..who has very superficial knowledge about his own religion
and less than superficial knowledge about other’s religion.
I cannot respond to hundreds of points raised in your post. The best
thing is to restrict ourselves to one subject at a time.

You select one topic and then let us have our views on that, when we
finish it, we move to next topic.

But seeing the tone of your post and your unplaced overconfidence, I
doubt that serious, meaningful and civil discussion is possible for you
and people like you.

In that case, I will say, May peace be with you and terminate our
dialogue.

Q. 666 (Herald, 40)

Why should I running away from the issue that you’ve propose. Hurmmm .. May be you
misunderstood with that sarcasm.

By the way, you do not end that overall sentence .. yah that true Allah did mention :

'Say,'O people of the book'(a term which particularly refers to Jews and Christians)'come to
common terms as between us and you:

that we worship none but Allah; that we associate no partners with Him (in His powers and divine
attributes); that we erect not from among ourselves lords and patrons other than Allah.'….

ANS

I think we are just splitting hairs. We are arguing on something which I

never said.

I never said that Judaism and Christianity are true religions and we
should accept whatever they say.

I only said that Jews, Christians and Muslims believe in and worship in
the same Deity which is called Allah in Arabic.

Jews have deviated from the straight path and made their God into a
racial god, Christians have deviated from the straight path and made
their God into a triune God and called Jesus as Son of God.

In the same way Pagan Arabs during the time of our Prophet had also
deviated from the true path and had introduced many superstitions
into the pure concept of Allah and said that angels are daughters of
God etc.

But at no juncture Quran or prophet said that these people were

worshipping a separate deity. He argued with them to correct their
concept of God of Universe.

You are unnecessarily dragging me into corner that by just saying that
Jews and Christians also worship Allah, I endorse all their false beliefs.

This I never said or meant.

PS: By completing last portion of 3:64, what part of my argument I

missed?

Q. Disguise (Herald, 47)

To MUQ

This is my last post, I has become bored through opinion conflict with other people .. For your
understanding .. Personally I’m not against that Allah is God for humanity, for all mankind ..
However, at the same time I feel odium when our god dignity has degraded solely to supply heart
' will of a few parties.

I already tired and want to retired from writing any post in here.:D Enough so far. Safe upon you
broe ..

Salam ..

ANS

I am sorry to hear that your LAST post on this thread should be

addressed to me.

I believe that Allah or God is the Common Creator of all humans living
on this earth, irrespective of whichever religion they might believe in.

Allah or God has created and sustains and cherishes every one on this
earth irrespective of whichever religion they might believe in.

I believe that this period of life, which every one of us has on this
earth, is for testing, each one of us, how much we have lived our life in
accordance with the Instructions and Commands which Allah or God
gave us.

Based on our results, we shall be judged in our next life.

I agree with you, that many people have distorted the concept of God
or Allah for their personal or ethnic interests and fight and argue with
each other, not to learn or teach any thing, but to prove somehow that
they are right and their opponents are wrong.

I do not want to make any personal comment to any one in this or on

other threads.

May peace be with you and accept my best Regards.

Q. Malaysian (Herald, 47)

Waalaikum assalam.
My dear Muslim brother MUQ,
I understand your viewpoint but u seem not to understand mine. firstly, we r Malays. not Arabs.
we don’t speak arab, we speak Malay. both Christian Arabs and muslim Arabs may be calling
God as Allah, due to similarities in language, or their background. but one party (muslims) is
talking about the One True n Only God, which is really meant by that term. whereas the other
(Christians n jews) only blindly say Allah without actually worshipping Him. they worship fake
deities and idols together with the true ALLAH or regard Allah as any god, or they may not
worship Allah at all, only that they want to use this term to downgrade Islam to the same level of
their deviated beliefs, or try to make Islam n other religions as same, no differences.

ANS

Walakum Assalam
For your information, I am an Indian and not an Arab. I also do not
speak Arabic, nor do most people in India speak Arabic.
In India people speak hundreds of different languages and thousands
of different dialects.
So you do not start posing as if Malaysia is some very special and
some very peculiar country in this world.
In India we have all type of religions and every time of sects and
disputes that can be imagined!!
I have become immune to living in such type of atmosphere.
The issue I raised is the basic and fundamental issue. That basically
Muslims, Jews and Christians worship the same God, which in Arabic is
known as Allah, in Hebrew Yahweh, or Elohim, in Aramaic Eli, and
might have hundreds of different names in hundreds of different
languages.
They all point to same personality, the Lone Creator of This Universe!!
It is correct that some religions have got wrong concept of god and
have corrupted it to suit their own interests.
It is our duty and job to correct these mistakes and deviations from the
true meaning and original concept of God.
But we have NO AUTHORITY to restrict or FORCE any one to use a
PARTICULAR word for God.
This is the simple message which is supported by Quran and Prophetic
sayings, I feel sorry that I have to debate this simple issue with our
Muslim brothers in Malaysia.
Q. Malaysian (Herald, 49)

HAHAHAHAHA! clearly u r unable to tolerate others' views, my bro...:-) because u refused to

understand....

firstly, Allah is not a Malay word! u understand me??? Allah is Arabic. Quran is in Arabic. now,
what is the basis of Malaysian Christians eager to translate God in English into Allah in Malay
when Allah is not even a Malay word???? In Malay, there's a word for God.= TUHAN!!! u
understand me??????

original language of bibles is either Hebrew or Aramaic. but not Arabic! so where the goodness
these Christians think they derive the word Allah from??? shouldn't it then, much much better for
them to use yahwehh??? or eloh, elohim???? because these r the words present in their bibles
before it was translated into English as God, into Malay as Tuhan or into any other languages. if
muslims, we can understand. because Allah is an Arabic word. Quran was revealed in Arabic.

ANS

You are accusing me, of which you are guilty yourself.

I Know Quran is in Arabic and Allah is in Arabic and in that Arabic

Quran, Allah says to Jews and Christians “Our God and Your God is
One….”

And now you Malaysian people have Cheek to say that NO, We believe
in Allah, but Jews and Christians believe in TUHAN and not Allah…..
Whose words I should take?

Allah has most beautiful names in all languages of the world. YHWH,
Elohim, Eli, God…Ishwar and many others…they all point to Him.

It seems that without understanding the basic issues involved you are
getting emotional.

Most religions of the word believe in One God…the Supreme Power the
Only True Creator…. We should understand that and then bring them
around to our concept of That Creator…. How perfect it is and how
defective is their concept of that creator.

We can enter into debates and dialogues with them …… but if we shut
the door at the first instance itself and say, No we Worship Allah and
you Worship TUHAN…. How can we have dialogue?

How can we invite them to the true path? Apparently you have no
experience in Dawah activities….
Read Quran, carefully, …. The Best book of Dawah…. Always searching
for common ground….to ease tension and not to create tensions.

We have limited vision, our Creator has much larger vision….after all
He is common Creator all humans!!!
Q. Rex (Herald, 54)

You are right good BMZ. Muslims have stolen the word "Allah" from Arabic Christians.

ANS

This is another MASTERPIECE!!

Do you know there is another thread on Topix "Who is Allah" that

claims that Allah was a moon god which pagan Arabs worshipped
before our prophet and Quran stole that and changed it into Creator of
Universe!!

And here are you claiming that Muslims stole this verse from Arab
Christians!!

Was Makkah populated by Arab Christians?

In Quran we see that pagan Makkan asking prophet "Who is

Rahman’"....but no one asking him "Who is Allah"!!

But how can I argue with you.......you have little knowledge about your
own religion...what to say about Islam's

Q. Sawngrkp (Herald, 40)

Where is the spirit of universal brotherhood we are trying to convey just like you mentioned
earlier. Why can't they perform public prayers since you are saying they are praying to the same
Allah. Why not even can't showing their religious symbol ?

ANS

Every thing has a limit. Universal Brotherhood does not mean that you
violate instructions of your religion.

Universal Brotherhood means you deal justly with other people. You
respect other people and their religious personalities.

Do not abuse, criticize or lampoon religion and religious personalities

of other faith.
That is the type of Tolerance and Universal brotherhood that we are
doing and you will see that our opponents are not doing it.

The first thing they do is to criticize, lampoon and make fun of our
religion and our prophet, and then they expect that Muslims should
keep quite and say or do nothing.

By not allowing Public Prayers of other faiths for "guest workers" Saudi
Arabia is not doing injustice to them.

No one is forced to come and work here. If they do not like it, do not
come here.

Q. Smelly Cross (Herald, 44)

Errr .. Maybe you’ve just misunderstood with my quote recently. I’m not concentrate on tiny and
unimportant details to find fault with something .. I’m just stress that if they true worship Allah,
why should them combine Allah with its own creation creature ..

They still have other alternative to name their God right ? Why not stick with Yahweh or Elohim
or Aloha or whatever ? Even they use Yahweh or Elohim or Aloha word to refer to their god, We
still can understand that they still refer to their God as one right ?(One but not Oneness)…

ANS

I think , I should remind of some basic facts:

1. Islam is a Universal religion. Its terminology and its rules are same
for every society and for every country.
2. We cannot make some special rules for Malaysia and some one else
for Arabia and some thing else for India or China.
3. In the same way terms used in Quran Like Allah, Rasool, Nabi, Kitab
etc. have Universal meaning. We have no power to restrict ourselves
usage of some or other.
After saying all this ,let me tell you that just by saying that Muslims
and Christian worship same God or Allah, we in no way agree to
whatever Christians believe or what are their practices.
Quran says to Jews and Christians “Our God and your God is one”
( 48:46)….. so that is the end of argument.
We have no reason to force them to use Yahweh, Elohim or Aloha or
anything. Infact all these words denote to no one but Allah.
How illogical is that Christians in Arab countries and Egypt are free to
use Allah for God and not allowed to use the same term in Malaysia or
Indonesia or India!!
Your thinking is very narrow that by just using the word Allah they
would weaken the faith of Malaysian Muslims.
You should educate Malaysian Muslims instead of fighting and arguing
with Christians.
We cannot use our ignorance as base for some wrong concept to be
followed.
In my view this issue has unnecessarily been dragged on and it will
only harm Muslims and not Christians.
They would point out the paradox, that Christians in Egypt, Syria,
Lebanon, Jordan, Palestine , Morocco, Tunisia etc are allowed and
using Allah for God frequently, while their brothers in Malaysia are
being denied its use.
Allah’s wisdom is superior to ours. We should bow ourselves to His
wishes and not force our wishes on Him.
I hope you understand the issues involved here.
You are unnecessary dragging me into what Christians believe and
what they do not believe. That is not the topic of our discussion.

Q. Smelly Cross (Herald, 35)

Waalaikumussalam ..

From my point of view, I’m actually not against them from using the Allah word except that
disappointed when they say Allah word but on the other hand against its by way associated him.

You can see how they insult Muslim by insulting Allah and the last prophet for Islamic people.
What mostly Muslim in Malaysia doing here was actually to remind them that in case if they
want to use Allah word, do not them insult Islamic people apostle and abuse that word to damage
people's faith like how it been committed by colonist once upon a time.

If you understand political scenario in here, mostly a huge mess, which arise, was the result from
politician action in attract popularity among their supporter. So I’m not taking side which party to
in describing my hidden feeling on Christian, on the other hand it is only my personal opinion ..

ANS

Assalam Alaykum

I tried to find out the reason for this mayhem from your post, but to me
it seems that real issues are only trivial which have been blown out of
proportion by Media and politicians.

A. Local versus International issues:

1. Just to say that this problem is local to Malaysia is not enough.

Because there are fundamental issues involved there.
2. How can Malaysian Muslims claim that Allah is unique to them? Or
no Non Muslim can use this word. This goes against the very Idea of
Islam which wants Universal brother hood.

3. How can Christians abuse this word Allah, when they use it for their
own God?

4. Christians have been insulting our prophet and that is why we have
laws to protect that in Islamic countries. No one should be allow to
abuse or insult religious personalities of another faith.

5. It is duty of Muslim scholars in Malaysia to educate and tell Muslims

correct things. They should not allow a basic misunderstanding like
this to be propagated that Muslim Allah and Christian God are different
things.

6. That high court gave its ruling in favor of Muslims is all the way
astonishing. It shows their lack of Islamic knowledge and they decided
the issue in favor of local color without thinking about long term
problems.

7. I advise that Muslims should stop these protests on this issue and
concentrate on propagating their faith to Non Muslims and invite them
to correct path.

Q. Starsky & Hutch (Herald, 49)

Why you still behaving as such. Your attitude that refuses to confess on your misunderstanding is
the main cause.

Because of that ---- > why until these days, you still confused although you were given the
information.

The conflict is simple, but you twist the word.

Try ask to Hindu religion devotee whom their God/Tuhan.

ANS

I am not surprised at your ignorance!! The pseudo name that you

have chosen speaks for your selves.

The common Hindu or a common Muslim may think that Hindus

worship in many gods, but Hindus with knowledge KNOW that they
worship only one God!!
The names that you have mentioned are deities , which denote
different attributes of God, like KHALIQ, MALIK, RAZIQ, GIVER OF LIFE,
GIVER OF DEATH ETC..

In their ignorance Hindus have given each attribute a different shape.

This is not my view, but views of those who have studied Hinduism in
deep.

As for what TUHAN means, let me give you a quotation from your own
Malaysian brother, who is also named as Malaysian!!

“Tuhan can mean anything that humans regard as their god. could
mean anything, including spirits, money, or St.s..... common, brother..”

Is that what Allah means? Because Your constitution says that WE ALL
BELIVE IN TUHAN?

Q. Swangrakp (Herald, 47)

Because we also have Buddhist and Hindus here in Malaysia, they don't call their God Allah that
is why we have in our constitution every Malaysian should believe in TUHAN. That is the reason
we objected when they want to use, because they are referring to Allah with a son while Muslims
says that Allah has no son. Logically, are we referring to the same Allah here.

ANS

You know brother, I am from India and there is no country in the world
which has more religions and sects than India!!

We all live together and worship our own version of God. In our
constitution it is not written whether we have to Worship, Allah, God,
Ishwar or TUHAN etc.

Even if the word God is used in any Legal or official document, it is not
used in any specific term, but in generic sense.

The more you restrict use of terminology, the more problems it would
cause.

Hindus call their Prayers PUJA and we call ourselves as NAMAZ. But
there is no Dogma attached to it. Hindus tell Muslims that it is not
time for your PUJA, and we do not object to it in the least.

That is why, I said that in multi cultural society, we have to be less

dogmatic and use things in general sense.
Muslims are only 15 %in India and we have not become Hindus, in fact
more Hindus have accepted Islam than Muslims who have become
Hindus.

Some time in our narrow logic and our narrow thinking we decide some
thing, which is actually wrong in the long run.

That is why I think that issue of God, Allah, or TUHAN is taken out of
proportion in Malaysia. A non Issue has been made into a public
dispute and when public is involved in any dispute, it results in
violence, blood shed and mayhem as we saw in your country.

Now coming back to the topic, Muslims, Jews and Christians worship in
the same God or Allah, who was God of Abraham, God of Ishmael, God
of Isaac, God of Jacob, God of Moses, David, Solomon, Jesus and God of
Mohammad (may peace and mercy of Allah be on all His Prophets and
messengers)

Q. Unknown (Herald, 26)

ANS

Now this is strange!!

Muslims saying that there is no such verse in Quran that says to jews
and Christians that "Our God and Your God is one...."!!

I did not know that Muslims are so ignorant and they put their views for
public display.

Please refer to Surah ANKABOOT, Chapter 45, Verse 46:

"And dispute not with the people of book (i.e. Jews and Christians)
except in the best ways, unless it be with those of them who do wrong.
But say "we believe in the revelation which has come down to us and
in that which came down to you; OUR GOD AND YOUR GOD IS ONE;
and it is to Him we submit (in Islam)"

Now what will these people say?

Please stay with the logic.

It is not logical that Arab Christians can use Allah and Malaysian
Christians cannot do so!!
Keep out these petty thoughts from your mind.

Just by saying that we believe in same God , does not mean that we
justify false teachings of Jews and Christians.

What if Christians demand that Muslims do not use word God in

English? What would you people say then?

Be reasonable, be logical and stay with truth and true path.

EVEN IF IT HURTS YOUR NARROW THINKING!!

Q. Rocket Queen (Afghan, 6)

Problem is the religion. If there is no religion country will be very peaceful. How many millions
of people died due to religion islam. Afghan people do not send their kids to religion school. Send
them to good schools. May be everything will change near future.

ANS.

Religion is not the problem.

It is personal greed and show off and expand their empire that is the
problem.

Most wars in the world were and are being fought not because of any
religion or religious issues.

Which religion caused WW-1 and WW-2 , the two deadliest wars in
human history?

Which religious issue caused Vietnam War, Korean War, USSR invasion
of Kuwait, Iran Iraq War, Gulf War, 2003 Invasion of Iraq?

So please correct your mistake that it is religions which are reason of

war.

Q. RLH (Afghans, 6)
You are as wrong as you could ever be; it is on account of political ideologies; and in regarding
Islam, all the chiefs of the ‘Muslim world’ have brought back to Islam its fundamental and core
purpose: political ideology, with an intention to inflict it upon the world. Islam has been at war
with every neighbor it ever had. Are Jihadist and sucicide bombers are motivated by money and
greed? No they are not. Jihadism is now the operating force behind Islam.
ANS

You mean to say that it is alright to do wars based on political

ideologies,

It is Ok to make war on economical reasons…

It is OK to make war on the basis of race, color, language and

ethnicity….

When all these wars are OK, then why wars on religious ideologies only
should be banned?

Your logic is not correct.

Islam does not want world domination. Islam only reserves its right to
be preached to every corner of the world, no one should put hurdles in
its peaceful propagation.

Who comes to fold of Islam or rejects it, is left to individual’s judgment.

Suicide Bombers are a legacy to the Creation of Terrorist state of Israel

in Palestine. Unless that basic problem is solved, there can be no
peace in the world.

If this message is not clear to you yet….then no one can help you.

Q. Monk (Elite, 24)

You in no way speak for Islam. Muslims around the world want to live in peace and achieve
what all people want- a better life for their children and a
decent life for their families. American Muslims are some of our best citizens. They are
hardworking patriotic Americans. They live around us.
Al-Qaeda and other Muslim extremists are a plague on Islam. They kill innocent Muslims in Iraq
and Pakistan. They are evil fanatics who have declared war on the world. They are serial killers
and war criminals…

ANS

I know most of Muslims living in USA and in every part of world are
peace loving.

But it is media which is the garb of fighting terrorism is trying to malign

the image of all Muslims and also the image of Islam.

I have no authority to speak on behalf of all Muslims, but as a Muslim, I

have a right to defend Islamic teachings and Islamic principles.

If I have any time outside these limits, then you have a right to correct
me.

I do not defend any act of Terrorism by Muslims or by any one else.

But I consider all acts of Terrorism in the same way.

For me any act of terrorism carried out by Al Qaeda, Hamas or any

other Muslims has the same value as acts of Terrorism done by Israeli
Army, US Army, or any other army.

But you want to be selective in your definition of Terrorism and

terrorists.

You do not see Israeli army , Jews of Israel or US army atrocities in Iraq,
Afghanistan, Palestine and elsewhere as acts of Terror.

This is the basic problem that terrorism is on the rise, despite best
efforts of those fighting it.

You cannot fight Terrorism by your own acts of terrorism.

You cannot fight terrorism by branding all 1500 Million Muslims as

terrorists.

This attitude must end.

I have no connection with House of Saud. I am not for or against them.

Allah will punish EVERY one who kills an innocent human soul. Whether
in Palestine, in Iraq, in Iran or in Afghanistan or in Pakistan.

Allah will not condone acts of Terrorism by so called Muslims or so

called jews or so called Christians. He is a just God and God of every
one.

Q. RLH (Elite, 18)

Here is a "core issue" for you then; explain to us the exact scenario/situation, on a global scale,
that would make the jihadist lay down their weapons, cease all political aggression and love their
neighbors worldwide; tell us what the world would look like for that to happen. No more mass
murder of innocents, no more bombings, hijackings and kidnappings and no more “kill the
infidels”. No more Sunni planting bombs in the Shiite masque or vice-versa then somehow blame
the US. Paint for us that picture. Don’t drag it out with nonsense, just a nice crisp picture of such
a world. Maybe we have it all wrong, so run it past us again please. Tell us how, worldwide, the
'Muslims' will love the rest of the world and be nice. Tell us what it would take for a world where
the people of Islam will collectivly hunt down and punish one of their own whom has used terror
and violence in the name of Islam.

ANS

From your post, it is clear that you have only one sided agenda to end
all acts of “terrorism” and have no real intention in solving the
problem.

I would present my agenda , that deals with root cause of spread of

Terrorism, here is my solution:

1. Remove the root cause of All Terrorism in the World:

a. Dismantle the terrorist state of Israel at once. If that is not possible,

ask it to return to 1948 borders and take back all Arab refugees that
were made homeless then.

b. Seriously restrict Military Power of Israel, so that it does not act a

Bully in the religion.

c. It could have guaranteed borders, but its offensive forces have to be

restricted and it could have International Guarantee for Borders.

2. Stop Meddling into the affairs of other Nations:

a. Let every country be run according to the desire and culture and
social needs of its population.

b. No one should force or coerce any nation to work according to its

own version of Democracy, social justice and cultural freedom.

3. Bring Armed Forces and police of Every Country under Judicial

Review:

a. Armed forces and police of every country are the biggest source of
Terrorist activities .

b. At present they have immunities from justice system. Security and

Safety of state and country, often allow them to get away with virtually
every crime.

c. The soldiers and Police force could be liable to even death penalty if
they killed any innocent person knowingly.

4. Persons responsible for killing Innocent Persons, should be executed

thru Judicial system.

5. Only the Criminal should be punished not his tribe or his country:

a. It is not correct if we kill 10 or 100 of “enemy” for killing one of us.

b. This type of Rambo type of revenge only escalate the problem and
never solves it.

c. So only the Criminal should be traced and punished. If any one was
supporting that person, he should also be tried and punished. But that
should be done by courts and not by Military or Police.

6. There should be Universal Actions against those convicted of

carrying out Terrorist activities:

a. This could also be arranged thru UNO and other International

agencies that those who are actually involved in terrorist activities ,
should not get any safe heaven.

b. But as usual, it should not be a targeted action, only against certain

nations or communities.

c. Islamic Laws are very effective and very practical in such cases and
they should be used more and more. Not in any religious sense, but as
best means to remove crimes from the area.

7. Strengthen UNO:

a. The worst thing of our time is the demise of UNO. Due to high
handedness of so called Super Powers, this prime institution has been
reduced to only ceremonial role. It needs to be strengthened.

b. All International issues must be solved only thru UNO. No one

should by pass UNO to get their agenda done. The defaulters should
be punished only thru UNO.

c. The power of general assembly in UNO should be increased.

Security Council Veto could be turned down by two third majority of
General Assembly. In that case no nation would make UN ransom to
its demands.

8. Time Frame:

You asked for Time frame, it depends how serious you are in solving
it!!

But why not start at Number 1, you tell me any time frame to
Dismantle or Curb Powers of Israel….It is in Your hands and not Mine!!

Q. RLH (Elite, 21)

Finally we have it very clear for all to see; allow you to destroy and enslave the 'Jews' and
summit America and the rest of the free world to Islamic control. Islamic domination over the
world. Well, good luck with that, and in the mean time, try not to whine so much as we hunt
down the Jihadist who are attempting to carry out terrorism in the name of this cause.

ANS

You are wrong; we do not want to destroy Jews. If we wanted, then we

could have done it when Jews were being persecuted thru out Europe
and they had no support whatsoever from any one.

It was in those dark ages that we muslims gave them shelter and they
were treated with kindness and tolerance in Islamic countries.

Our dispute with them is only when they did wrong to our brothers in
Palestine and turned them out of their houses and lands in which they
were living for past 1200 years.

We have no dispute per see with USA. It is USA which has taken upon
itself the enmity of whole Muslim world by blindly and one sided
supporting Israel and jews in every dispute.

It is USA which is to blamed for this state of affairs and not Muslims.

Then there is nothing wrong, if we wish that Islam grows and

propagates to all corners of the world. But we do not force any one to
our religion.

Don’t you know there are thousands of Christian missionaries working

round the clock in many Muslim countries to bring them into
Christianity. Why are they doing it.

Finally I wish you and your army all luck is tracking down all Jihadis!!
Is it not a paradox….that you re-elect Biggest terrorist of our time
(GWB the Great and his crony Dick Cheney for a second term) and
hunt down these “poor jihadis”!!

I think being cohots with jews and Zionists have turned your scales
upside down!!

Q. RLH (Elite,23

From all you have said in the past, which is a matter of record, in this post you lie; every sentence
is a lie and contrary to what you have always said, as it is also a lie by way of historical fact. The
reason for you thinking through what you have recently posted and making an attempt to clean it
up is twofold: one, you understand the ‘propaganda value’ your prior post have given Americans
as well as the rest of the free world…, giving them a clear view of what the current status of
Islam is all about, and two, you have become worried you may be hunted by non-American
agents, by those who do not extend you the same rights as we Americans would extend our own
citizens; in other words, you have only a few computers to post from while in Saudi Arabia, as
they can locate you from the IP number and other means. They may well take issue with
foreigners calling for death of the West and the genocide of Israel from within their own
boarders. This recent post of yours fly’s in the face of all you have promoted in the past and this
turnaround of yours is for a reason. You are indeed backing away for a reason. You have called
for the death of American troops, called for the death of the West itself and have called for the
death of Israel. Your verbal Jihad has been splashed across many pages and it cannot be undone
by changing your tune now.

ANS

You accuse me of lying, while you own post is full of lies!!

I never called for genocide of Jews. I never said that Jews should be
exterminated, I never said that USA should be finished.

I never said any thing against Jews just because they are Jews.

I said that I am against those Jews who have done atrocities against
our brothers and have driven them out from their homes and lands in
which they were living since generations.

I also said that Jews living in Palestine before 1917, have right to
demand their separate state.

But I denied this injustice that Palestine should be divided in two

halves (jews were less that 10 % of population before 1917) and
millions of Jews living in Europe and any part of world have “birth
right” to come and occupy that land.

If you think that this is spreading hatred against jews and this is reason
for High treason against USA…..well then you can have your opinion.

I know the powers of US army and their intelligence!!

Event of 9/11 proved their inefficiency in first place.

Their failure to capture Osama , despite more that 8 years of war in

Afghanistan shower their cowardice and inefficiency is second place.

Their bungling on WMD issue in Iraq and failure to gauge Iraqi

resistance showed their stupidity in the third place.

Their defeat in Vietnam at the hand of puny Vietnamese army, really

showed how Super Human they are.

Now if they want to put all CIA, FBI might to track me down (which is
already displayed on Topix page), I shall not be surprised in the least,
at least they will win this time!!

Q. New Muslim (Holocaust, 76)

Anti-Semitism!
Yes, started by CHRISTIANS 1700+ years ago and exploited by JEWS today. To be fair the Jews
did suffer under Christians and were subjected to dreadful treatment under Christians for more
than 1700 years. Sadly both have come to a deal that harms the Muslims.

The Christians, for their sins against millions of INNOCENT Jews over 1700 years have agreed
to pump money into a Zionist state in return for ending up with a land for return of "Christ". They
Jews (who "think" that they know better than Christians about Jesus) believe that Jesus is NOT
the Messiah and also BELIVE that Jesus is DEAD and will NEVER return. What have the Jews
got to lose? They get all the Christian money and pretend to help the Christians get ready for their
Messiah who is not the Messiah of Jews!

ANS

I appreciate your post on Anti Semitism!!

A brilliant write up on a very burning topic of today!!

Both Jews and Christians have their outer plan and an inner plan
regarding Anti Semitism…

The stage is set up for a big Drama…..that is to unfold!!

Christians think that return of Jews to Palestine and re-building of

Jewish Temple there is Pre-requisite for second coming of Jesus…..so
they help Jews in their task to establish their homeland there and built
their temple!!

Jews think that by gathering from all corners to their “inheritance” is a

big boon for them…..because it means that God is on their side.

The stage is set for a big drama now (as our Prophetic traditions inform
us)….. The Jews are there (which no one could think possible 1400
years back)…. Jews and Christians are United!! (no one could think
either 1400 years back and even 200 years back!!)……Muslims are on
the receiving end from both Jews and Christians….

Persecution of Muslims is a world wide phenomenon…. There is no

restriction on shedding of Muslim’s blood in any country of the world
(by the hands of Muslims themselves or by Non muslims)!! All parts of
the Jig saw puzzle are coming into place.

The stage is all set for second coming of Jesus….what we need is

advent of a Great deceiver….Anti Christ….DAJJAL to unite Most of Jews
and Christians against Islam…..

That Universal trial of Muslims is any where round the corner and that
will put all parts of Jig saw puzzle into their proper place….and now is
the time for jesus to return….

But Jesus returns as a Muslim!!! The tides are turned!! Christians at

hordes comes to join Jesus as Muslims!! The Anti Christ is killed by
Jesus…

Now it is Jews who are left holding the bag!!! Now it is THEY who have
to answer for their CRIMES against Muslims and against Christians!!

Can any one guess what is the justifiable price for all their secret
planning, their double talks, their intrigues, their atrocities, their
brutalities and their mischief on the earth?

I know the answer, I want people to guess it!!

Q. Trisha (Holocaust, 77)

You stated this:
"You should only hate those who do bad deeds...." Yes, you stated your Islamic religion teaches
you 'should hate' human beings. Now provide the proof of your claim.

ANS

Let us forget what Quran teaches for the time being…..let me ask you
one simple question, Please answer honestly without any fear or bias

“Do you Love or hate Osama Bin Laden?”

Then answer another question:

“Is Osama bin laden” a human?

Then from where you got this teaching that you should hate a human?

Q. Ehav (Israel, 674)

yet "BRUTE FORCE" is acceptable to promote Islam? Some believe so. Jesus is indeed the
Messiah. The King of all Kings. The Lord of all Lords. For without the blessed Messiah-Jesus,
one can do nothing.

ANS

Force or coercion is never to be used for anybody to accept Islam. In

reality any conversion brought about in this way has no real value and
a person such converted will always be a broken reed during any
period of need or adversity.

We believe that Jesus was the Messiah, but Messiah is not such a
unique or strange title in the idiom of Jews. It only meant a person
appointed to any post by God. Jesus was the last of such Messiah from
Jews.

King of Kings and Lord of Lords are the attributes fit for God, the
Creator and sustainer of this Universe alone. We do not use them for
any human beings.

Why only Jesus, by not believing in any true prophet of God, one
cannot have any position in they eyes of God.

So we believe in all of God’ prophets, starting from Adam, Noah,

Abraham, Isaac, Ishmael, Jacob,. Joseph, Moses, David, Solomon…..
Jesus and finally Mohammad (Peace and Mercy of God be on all of His
Prophets and Messengers).
Q. Fredrick Nobel (Israel, 675)

We all know that islam is a worst and violent religion, do the search in Google images islam the
first image you will get is a gun with a the worst book ie Quran, try this. Jesus is king of king and
is lord of lord remember the word "is" Jesus was an angel before he came down to earth he was
one of the morning star.

He knew he would be crucified it was pre planned by god. so you ugly muslims question god's
plan very good. I know you ugly muslims worship Satan who only never accept the defeat and
spread lies All the prophets will serve jesus on resurrection and jesus will serve the most high
hope you read some real Christian docs not the Corrupted RC s and Protestant docs. He will rule
the earth in the near future

ANS

It is clear that your knowledge about Islam is very poor and is not even
first hand. You have picked these epithet from some Anti Islamic sites
and use them as fruits of your own research.

If Muslims worship Satan, then how come they seek protection from
God against the accursed Satan, every time they read Quran!! Will
Satan teach his followers to do that?

If Jesus knew that he will be crucified…then why did he begged God to

“remove this cup from me” (as recorded in the Gospel according to
Luke). Was that scene a mere drama?

On the day of Resurrection, all the prophets will be in the ranks of

those who are nearest to God… no prophet wills serve any one…they
all will enjoy the bounties and grace of God Almighty. It does not
benefit you to belittle all prophets of God….that too to just raise the
level of you prophet.

Jesus will indeed come back on this Earth before the End of Times and
he will indeed rule on earth as a righteous prophet. That is our belief
too.

Q. Fredrick Nobel (Israel, 677)

if truth is said about islam then its anti Islamic sites. Very good judgment i should say.

Islam was created on the dead bodies of Mecca’s by the so called prophet Mohammad then the
jihads with killed many raped and divided the loot, and the only chat they did was convert or die.
this is how islam expanded. islam was built on swords and dead bodies hope u also know the
black history of islam.

jesus was a 100% human when on earth he was asked in that manner he was an angel in heaven
he was created first before all the creations but on earth he was just human. he was comforted by
god and gave his life for the sin of Adam from him death came to all people.

through resurrection death will be abolished.

Jesus was more than any prophets his birth was miracles one not any prophet had the privilege he
will rule all the earth including the earlier prophet as we all know jesus was

ANS

How are you "sure" that "truth" is being said at those Anti Islamic
sites? You have to hear the other side also and make your own
research and then make your judgment.

If courts would have given their judgment only after hearing one party,
you know how much injustice would have been done in this world.

You said Islam was created on the dead bodies of Makkah people,
while the fact is that Makkah people persecuted our Prophet and his
followers for 13 long years. He and his followers had to fled Makkah to
save their lives…. Even in Medina they did not allow him to leave in
peace…

Do you know what happened when the Prophet Captured Makkah?

How a blood thirsty man would have done?

He forgave every one in Makkah!! Can you give any more example of
this type of behaviour from Tyrants and Oppressors of the world? The
best time of pardon is when you have the enemy in your power and
that is what our prophet showed in that moment.

Then total number of casualties in his ten years of warfare do not even
reach 1000 counting on both side!! And what were the results?
Compare that with the bloodshed which Joshua and David etc did in the
small area of Palestine and what results did they got?

No doubt Encyclopedia Britannica recognizes our prophet as the Most

Successful of all religious personalities.
Yes, Jesus birth was miraculous, that shows the power of God and not
of Jesus. Did Jesus created himself? What hand had he in his own
creation?

Adam and Eve also had miraculous creation, did they became god or
superhuman?

Jesus was what he was, a righteous prophet of God, Born without

human father, endowed with many miracles by God, and his mission
was reforming the religion of Jews. Jesus' gave good news (Gospel) of
coming Kingdom of God…. Jesus did nor establish it. He left it to some
one else, to the Last and Final prophet of God, Mohammad (May peace
and mercy of God be on all His prophets and messengers)

Q. Maverick (Israel, 707)

What is your take on Ishmael's descendants and the covenants?

ANS

We Muslims are not dogmatic about Ishmael and his inheritance. But it
is an historical fact that descendants of Ishmael have had full control
of their original inheritance (the land of Arabia) for continuous
possession of more than 4000 years.

I do not know of any other piece of land which has been in control of its
original inhabitance for such a long period of time.

Not only that descendants of Ishmael have got full control of each and
every piece of land where Abraham,. Isaac, Ishmael, and Jacob ever set
foot in their combined life time.

So if the promise of God to Abraham that he will give him possession of

all lands where he set food was true, then its fulfillment was done only
thru Ishmael and his descendants.

Isaac , the second son of Abraham and his descendants were not able
to hold on to their inheritance and never were complete master of their
lands, except for short period of time not exceeding 100-150 years in
past 4000 years.

This is the judgment given by history, without going into any dogma.

As per Quran, righteous servants of God shall inherit this earth. That is
God’ gift to His Righteous Servants.

Q. MEHS (Israel, 674)

Interesting. If the numbers you assert were true and accurate, I figure you can link to some
empirical data somewhere to substantiate your figures right? Otherwise, I question your data.
Additionally, Islam forces converts and murders those that want to leave the cult.

Of course Islam is on the rise, why wouldn't be ? Women love the fact they must be covered head
to toe, are not allowed education, forced into slavery , bigamy is practiced, publicly whipped,
stoned to death if they are raped; simply viewed as chattel. I'm sure women are simply flocking to
the cult in droves. …
ANS

You self contradict yourself, when you justify the rise of Islam on all
those negative points that you have mentioned. How can a religion
grow globally and in all parts of the worlds, and have all those negative
qualities.

Who is forcing Islam down the throats of new converts to Islam in USA,
Europe and Asia?

To call Islam a cult, is your mistake, every fifth member of human race
in the world is a Muslims, how it could be a “Little Cult”? That
definition fits on a small band of Jews and Zionists that number less
than 1 % in the world, yet try to exploit and usurp the land and
resources of other people.

Q. MEHS (Israel, 677)

Did the Virginia Tech Killer shout Christian phrases associated with murderous suicide ?
Attempting to draw moral equivalency for the horror perpetrated by your cult while invoking the
name of your cult during the heinous acts, is despicable. Over 14300 innocents slaughtered
around the globe , in the name of islam, since 9/11 and you sir want to deny its happening. Again,
despicable….

ANS

How many millions were killed by “your Non Slogan shouting Army” in
the lands of Iraq and Afghanistan?

Does it matters really what you shout when you kill innocent people?

How your “Non slogan shouting soldiers’ treated Quran and dealt with
Islamic scripture in Gitmo and other prisons!!

So there is no aces if you try to paint one side as black and another as
white.You should see both sides of the story before commenting on
them

Q. MEHS (Israel, 677)

Again, interesting . I have extensive experience in the Philippines. The muslim population is
heavily concentrated in Mindanao not Luzon. The muslims are actively engaged in subversive
activities to cause harm to the Philippines and are fully committed to the establishment of an
Islamic nation in the southern Philippines. See Abu Sayyaf and Moro Islamic Liberation Front
aka MILF. These groups perpetrate heinous crimes on innocents everyday, they are especially
fond of spontaneous beheadings. You are quite wrong, these muslim populations discriminate and
commit atrocities against non-muslims without provocation. Simply being Christian and living in
the southern PI places one at extreme risk. Simply check the travel advisories issued by the US
DOS.

.
ANS

Your post shows that what I was saying about you, that your Eyes only
See, What you Want to see!!

It is this one sided bigoted views of events that is the cause of all
problems in the present times.

If you are unable to or don’t want to analyze the problems which

Muslims have in Philippines or Kashmir or in India or elsewhere, then
there is no use arguing with you.

So I should leave you to your world of half truth and bigotry.

But whatever you say or do will not change the growth of Islam in the
world. It will keep on growing no longer how much it pains you or
demoralizes you and persons like you.

Q. MEHS (Israel, 678)

Since you are unable to refute facts, let the ad homenim attacks begin. You obviously have no
first hand experience with the horrors perpetrated by Islam and refuse to educate yourself relative
to ahy. Fell free to stumbly blindly through life, I encourage you to continue to martyr yourself
and sacrifice your intelligence for Islam. The cult of death.

I'm actually quite excited that you concede the debate relative to the horrible nature of Islam ,
most are exactly like you and unable to defend the horror it perpetrates on mankind.

ANS

You are wrong in your analysis. Islam has never perpetrated any
horror on any one.

Islam is not a cult of death….Islam is a religion of peace…

If some Muslims misuse the name of Islam and do some bad deeds it is
the fault of these Muslims and Not that of Islam.

You had right to say that, if Islamic teachings were silent or ambiguous
on the subject of shedding innocent blood.
In Islam it is one Great of the Greatest sin to shed innocent blood. So
Islam has no role if some one kills any innocent person, whatever may
be the reason.

But people like you, use a double standard…when Muslims are

persecuted…you turn your face the other way…and if by chance
Muslims seem to retaliate or do some thing….you start blowing your
trumpet.

The biggest source of Terrorism and root cause of most of the present
problem is the State of Israel…. But you turn your face other way when
it does all those brutalities and cruelty on the Palestinians.

Double standards never solve any problem…So if people want to solve

the problem of Terrorism…they have to remove the root cause of all
problem. They have to SOLVE the Palestinian problem first and
foremost.

Q. MKOT (Israel, 684

Right. Israel is the cause. In Afghanistan, Pakistan, Sudan.. And, Egypt kicked out the
Brotherhood because of Israel...Iraq invaded Kuwait because of Israel. .Iran vs Iraq-again, Israel.
In Lebanon,
terrorists are building an underground government...why? Must be Israel. Honor Killings -Israel.
Malaysia -Israel. Bombings in India-Chechnya-Africa....Sunni versus Shite...Israel. Taliban
brutality -Israel....

ANS

While it is not correct to say that all problems faced by Muslims in the
world today are because of Israel.

But most of the terrorist related problems that the world is facing
today are direct or indirectly related to Israel.

Israel is like a root of evil tree….when it grows up, many branches and
sub branches shoot from that tree.

Frictions between most ME states originate and fanned by that tree.

US, UK and other powers try to divide Muslim nations on behest of that
country.

Even the breakup of Ottoman Empire was planned by Jews planning

and serving at that time.
Their roots are very deep and they have been planning for now more
than a century now.

But it does not absolve Muslims and their leaders to share equal
blames for what is going on in their countries.

But in any Final Solution, that evil tree has to be uprooted from its
roots, rather than pruning branches, side branches, or leaves.

Remember GWB the Great’ War on Terror was to get Rid of Terror from
all parts of the world…..It should have started from Israel the root of
terrorism and not Afghanistan or Iraq….sub-sub branches of the tree.

Q. MKOT (Israel, 686)

Answer following questions:

ANS

Here are the answers for your questions, for whom you were so
Impatient:

1) Do you believe in multiple wives?

MUQ:

YES and NO!!

A. There is no reveled religion in the world which does not believe or

sanction multiple wives.

B. Having Multiple wives is a social necessity, there has never been a

True Monogamist Society in any part of the world. There have been
many claims though, but they are only superficial. Modern Monogamy
based society in west is prime example….you can have only “one
Wife” …but there is no restriction on “Girl Friends and Mistresses”!!

C. I believe in controlled Polygamy as advocated by Islam. Not

compulsory, nor criticized or looked down. Using when there is need,
but proving equal facilities and means to all wives.

2) Do you agree with Honor Killings as the right of men?

A. There is “No Honor or Un Honor Killings in Islam. It is only state

which has power to execute death penalty. No Individual has “right” to
kill another individual per see.
B. So no man or woman has right in Islam to kill anyone.

3) Do you recognize the sacredness of Christianity, Judaism, Ba'hai and

other faiths?

YES and NO!!

A. The prophets who came before our prophet (Adam, Noah, Abraham,
Moses, David, Solomon…..Jesus) are all honored prophets of Islam. We
revere and we respect them and the words spoken by them.

B. However those who claimed prophet hood after Prophet Mohammad

are deemed as “False Prophets” and that include persons like
Bahaullah, Mirza Qadiyani etc.

C. Our approach is based on decency and reasonableness. We do not

speak foul language any leader of any faith. Even if we believe that
they are not on the correct path.

4) Do you believe in Israel's right to exist?

YES and NO!!

A. I think that Modern Atheist Materialistic and Zionist state of Israel,

has nothing to do with Either Biblical prophesies or in any way shows
the Pleasure or Favor of God on Jews in general.

B. This state has been created by deceit, mischief and intrigues of

Zionist leaders who got the support of Western Nations somehow.

C. This Zionist and Materialistic Israel is the source of mischief, terror

and tyranny in ME and whole world.

D. This state has to be dismantled, if true peace has to survive in this

religion.

E. Jews who were living in Palestine and elsewhere in ME however have

a right to live in those lands and their homes. But Jews living in other
part of world, Europe, Africa, America etc have no “birthright” to come
and claim their “Inheritance” left by their forefathers 2000 years ago.

These are the answers, I tried to be brief, but I cannot provide one line
Yes and No Answers for these “tricky” questions.
Q. MKOT (Israel, 691)

Whereas the "proper" place for terrorists is ruling countries, controlling the Holy City, calling the
shots at the UN, helping to stabilize the world economy, assisting nations trying to cope with
disaster relief, maintaining world heritage sites, working to protect the environment, leading
major laboratories for cures of deadly disease, expanding our knowledge of space

ANS

I do not deny that US and Europe have done many things for the
benefit of human kind….. But at the same time they have been the
main source for creating and spreading terrorism in the world.

Their blind support to Israel and every thing it does has been the main
and root cause of all the terrorism related problems in the world.

Just because they do some thing right in one field…makes them error
free or dictate their terms in every field.

Islamic Jihad is fight against Oppression, Tyranny, Aggression and in

Justice in the world. If you are against Islamic Jihad….then it implies
that you support Oppression, Tyranny, Aggression and Injustice !!! You
can take your choice.

I know the world will not bow down to Islam and Muslims…. How can it,
when it is crawling in front of 15-20 Million Jews who are calling the
shots!!! They have brainwashed and controlled their “Christian
friends” to do all the dirty work for them!!

Q. MKOT (Israel, 700)

If you are going to call another man's holy texts "babble" then you are not acting as the "good
muslim" as you claim the Koran instructs. Yours is not the voice of tolerance, acceptance or
morality you have tried to pretend. What I have always read behind your words is finally proven-
you are just a garden variety terror supporter. So, stop all this pretext
and what you consider intellectual banter. You are no intellectual….

ANS

I do not degrade the scriptures of old. At most I say what scholars who
have analyzed those texts say (and mostly they are Jews and
Christians themselves, I do not take the words of Hindus against OT or
NT books….

I condemn every type of actions where innocent people are being

killed…. But what I find strange is that you keep mum on innocent
civilians being killed as the result of Bombs, and Missiles dropped on
civilian areas by the Military Aircrafts and Ships…

Such loss of innocent human blood ahs no value in your eyes… you
blame these civilians themselves … But on the other hand you shed
tons of tears on innocent victims who die as the result of a suicide
attack.

This is hypocrisy and double standards. You should use the same
standards for shedding innocent blood.

You do not want to analyze or think why people turn into suicide
bombers…what is the reason for such a desperate step?

You just satisfy your conscience by saying that all Arabs, All Muslims
and All Palestinians are Terrorist by nature… that seems to answer our
conscience and you start killing Arabs, Muslims and Palestinians as
usual

That is the bias I read in your posts and posts of people like you.

Q. MKOT (Israel, 708)

Let me tell you what I "know."
I know Shariah is an evil domination system designed by men and NOT a spiritual call to live a
better life. I know any culture that spawns suicides is a culture of death. I know that Israel
produces men and women who contribute to the world and not koranic zombies who have no
further mission in life than to try to degrade Jews and Israel.

Fortunately the world is not going to assist terrorists in your quest. You will not defeat the entire
world...but fanatics always think they can.

ANS

If you think that Shariah is an evil system….. then it shows that you no
knowledge about Shariah at all….. your knowledge is based on hearsay
and surfing thru Anti Islamic sites.

People are biased when they think about themselves and about others.
So I do not take your words seriously.

But the fact that Israel’s foundation are based on intrigue, deceit,
secret planning and hypocrisy are known to any one who has any
knowledge about Jews and Zionists movement starting from 1900
onwards.

That after its creation, its existence is based on oppression, tyranny

and injustice is also very clear tot hose who study News Papers and TV
Broadcasts (minus the propaganda and views mixed with news).

No such nation has a very long leash of life as for as my knowledge of

history goes.

That is why I feel pity on those honest Jews who immigrated to Israel
from all corners of the world thinking that they are going to God’
Promised Land where they will be allowed to live in God’ ways.

Q. MKOT (Israel, 708)

You are a sexist. Anyone who defends punishing rape victims on the testimony of MEN or Honor
Killings committed by MEN or burying women alive, burning them, torturing them, throwing
acid in little girls faces to keep them away from school is someone who does not value women's
lives. Why can't women leave their homes unescorted? Shariah. Why can't women drive?
Shariah…

ANS

Who told you that acts which you have mentioned are approved by
Islamic Shriah?

Your post shows that you have no knowledge whatsoever about Islamic
Shriah!!

The best thing is to ask someone, if you do not know.

You have raised so many issues in one post, so I cannot answer them
all.

You raise your objections one point at a time, may be then I will give
you the correct Islamic Shariah position on each of them.

It is better to know small amount of TRUTH, than to amass a lot of

HEARSAY and Falsehood!!

Q. My kind of Town (Israel, 675)

You post this kind of ridiculous "logic" from Saudi Arabia -a place that stones rape victims, beats
elderly widowed women if they dare speak to a man, forbids women to drive and
allows most of the country to live in poverty while a handful of "holy" Sheiks live in
splendor? …

ANS
From your comments , it is evident that you have never visited Saudi
Arabia and all your knowledge about it is from the “Biased Western
Media”.

I am an Indian working in Saudi Arabia…. And I am one of the millions

of workers of every nation of the earth, that come and work here.

Contrary to what you have written, Saudi Arabia is one of the calmest
and safest country in the world. Its crime rates are lowest in the world.

You with all of your civilization and with all of your freedoms, have the
highest crime rates in the world.

Osama Bin Laden is not the role model for us. I did not even heard the
name of Al Qaeda till after 9/11 events.

We do not hate every thing of Western origin. What we hate about

west is their Atheism, and their Materialism, and their falling moral
values. The things which are good in West (hard work, discipline, and
respect for knowledge) and we try to follow them.

But if you think that you become Western by Drinking Alcohol, Eating
Macdonald and drinking Pepsi, then these are false standards.

Jew’ only achievement is their survival…. But they are no match for
us!!. They started 3000 years before us, but they number only 15-20
Millions, most of them from the same race.

Islam on the other hand is a major world religion, its followers number
close to 1,5000 Millions and are from all nationalities , races, linguistic
and ethnic back ground.

How could you compare Apple with oranges?

Q. Truth (Israel, 678)

muq you talking wrong story about truth.. truth is hero....martyr ...in Muslim religion martyr have
believe under Muslim religion its mean have ''life''...I have life because I believed in Jesus ..he is
Son of God! Did I am against Israel ..not my friend why should be...but Israel is 12 tribe! Than
you have to know where is that 12 tribe! Jesus is from Israeli people from house of David from
Jacob...Yahweh say I am God of Isaac God OF Jacob and so on...Jesus is born from ''virgin
Mary'' its mean mystical...its mean where come from real Jesus seeds! Its perfection...because so
many don't like that don't you...o well in ''Holy Koran' 'they didn't denied Jesus and Mary but
describe differently.. As I told you I am ''prayer and believer''.. but I give you warning be honest
and tell me where is big and real historic Palestine!..

ANS

Your post is very incoherent, as if you are under strong emotion and
you have mixed so many issues together. How can I answer so many
things at one time?

1. In Islam martyr is one, who sacrifices his or her life “In the Way of
Allah”. It is only Allah who knows who dies in His ways. So no one
really knows who is martyr except Allah. If Allah gives martyr special
life, who are we to protest or reject it?

2. Then you said that Jesus because he was born out of virgin was
“Perfect”? What you mean by the word perfect? Jesus had all the
limitations of a normal human, he ate, he drank, he had, call of nature,
he wept, he cried, he felt pain, he was even killed on cross. …. So how
can you say that he was “perfect”?

3. Jesus did not like that some one call him “good” how he would have
reacted if some one called him “perfect”? But in a sense he was
“perfect”, he was a “perfect” example for his followers to emulate as
every prophet is in his time for their followers.

4. Then you have muddled the issues with Jews and Israel. You know
majority of Jews denied the message of Jesus and persecuted him and
his followers. How can God show mercy to them and reward them
while they continue to deny jesus and his message.

5. Do you mean to say that “message of Jesus was voluntary” ? You

will be showered with the mercy of God, irrespective of whether you
believe in Jesus or curse him?

6. The Christians in my view are contradicting themselves, when they

say that belief in jesus is must for salvation and then go and defend
those Jews, who reject Jesus and say all those bad words about him
and his mother.

Q. WW Man (Israel, 684)

History is written by the winners. Your critique of our religious leaders is absolute correct but
you have omitted the muslim priests mullahs. Look at the muslim scum that are running Iraq
afghan Pakistan Somalia hamas shite are all bastards tell me if you consider them you muslim
brothers

ANS
As for as I can remember, I have never praised any Muslim leader of
those countries you have named. I only defend teachings of Islam and
its principles.

I never said that Muslims are blameless or that they are angels. They
also have good and bad people against them.

But the way media presents Islam and Muslims as if it is all black and
there is no light in the house of Islam…..this attitude I criticize and
speak against it.

History is written by the winners, that is true…. But we should try our
reasons and logic to explore and research and listen to both sides of
the story before believing it..

Q. WW Man ( Israel, 693)

I really cant believe your post be true to yourself. You get out of line you question their power
you will soon find out all about hierarchy .Are you newly converted you appear to have the zeal
of a novice .So a fatwa is of no consequence just like breaking wind. Sorry we’ve done a
ridiculous fartwah dont be alarmed the smell will go away soon. l realy cant see how only a
thousand died from battle in mohamed time they killed thats an average of 100 a year.Of coarse
the jews killed everyone millions did the iman give you those numbers ? Oh l forgot you were
there it must be fact not fiction!! Dont trust the forkin priests you believe that which you have
posted you will be as bad or worse than them!!

ANS

If you do not believe that only a thousands people died in ten years of
warfare of our prophet, Then I will give you a casualty list of few Major
battles, you can add them up:

1. Battle of Badr, fought in 2 AH: Muslims 14, Non Muslims : 70, Total
84

2. Battle of Ohad, fought in 3 AH: Muslims 70, Non Muslims ~20, Total
90

3. Battle of Trenches: fought in 5 AH, Muslims :3, Non Muslims 12,

Total 15

4. Battle for Makkah, fought in 8 AH, Muslims 2, Non Muslims 17, Total
19
5. Battle of Hunain, fought in 8 AH, Muslims 20, Non Muslims, 50 or so,
Total 70.

6. Battle of Tabuk, fought in 9 AH, Muslims Nil, Non Muslims, Nil: Total
0.

7. Wars with Jews in Medina and Khaibar: Muslims: 20, Jews 580 Total
600

How much they add up to? You can have some more for minor wars
and clashes, the figure shall not exceed 1000, and the Results?

Outstanding by any standard. Our prophet was the Most Peaceful of all
known Warriors known to human history.

About Fatwas, I told you what is the position of them, you can cross
check with any other Muslim scholar as to what is a Fatwa and what
Executive Authority it has,

If you do not want to be reasonable, then I cannot help you.

Q. WW Man (Israel, 693)

Well by you own admission the muslim leadership are examples to be followed. It is apparent
now why you follow you lying priests if they say jehad you say jehad. Bet you havent voiced this
disrespectful opinion or you would get stoned. I should give the muslim thing up the last decent
ruler you had was Saladin and he must be spining in his grave. Some call mohemead the butcher
of islam the faith and people who worship it have been sliding down the slipery slope for
centuries.

ANS

You have a very wrong idea of relationship between Muslims and their
religious scholars.

In Islam there is no hierarchical leadership of religious leaders so there

is no "official" ruling on any religious matters.

Islamic scholars gave their view point in light of their own study and
knowledge and these are called 'Fatwas". But these Fatwas have no
executive power in themselves. It is only the religious opinion of that
particular scholars.

Other scholars may challenge that ruling..... But the most important
teachings of islam are given in Quran and Prophetic sayings and no
"Fatwa" can openly challenge these. So the scope of these Fatwa is
not that large as some non Muslims would like to assign them.

If some people call Mohammad as Butcher of Islam.... I do not know

what Title would they give to Moses....Joshua....David or Solomon!!!!

The total loss of human lives (0n both sides) during 10 years of
continuous warfare during the time of our prophet did not reach even
1000....!!! If you can call some one butcher for that....then what Title
would you give to those Jewish warriors who killed in hundreds of
thousands if not in millions!!

Q. WW Man (Israel, 700)

Its been a very black day in iraq same old story muslims killing muslins men women and
children. Where did the explosives come from ? muslims? who did the filthy deed ? muslims ?
Wheres the genralisation in that .You are condemed as a jehadist Rotten to the centre.

ANS

Whatever is happening in Iraq today is the direct result of US invasion

there in 2003, on the order of GWB the Great.

Once you smash up a country and breakup its Military, Police and Civil
Administration and fan sect based divisions….anarchy is the logical
outcome and that is what we are seeing in Iraq and Afghanistan and
elsewhere where US and NATO are operating.

Islamic Jihad is a fight against oppression, Tyranny and Injustice. Every

war and every fight of Muslim is not Islamic Jihad… I support Islamic
Jihad and not every fights of Muslims.

You prove to me that Islamic Jihad is evil and I will accept your plea.

Q. WW Man (Israel, 708)

So you are saying if the jews told the muslims to put their heads in a gas oven they would ??
What’s is the problem with islam and free will?? Why since mohamed have the muslims gone
backwards is it his guidance and the coaching of the imams??

Wrong Truth depend on where you are standing. It like the dopler effect the pasts truths are not
always going to be true to the future. The future truths will not be proved till they are past.

ANS

Who told you that Muslims are doing what Jews are telling them? It is
Christians who are taking lessons from Jews and not Muslims.
Islam allows maximum free will than all other religions combined.

If you feel that truth changes with time, then you have wrong notions
about the concept of truth. Neither truths contradict each other nor
they change with time.

What changes are peoples opinion and peoples knowledge and people’
understanding.

Q. WW Man UK (Israel, 678)

Is that not the case with the Quran there are no eyewitness the word like all religious texts were
written and manipulated by priests. Bent on advancing their power controlling the masses.
Religion is a good thing as a hobby but when taken it to seriously and the corpses just keep
mounting up. The values of religion are a different matter how you treat your fellows whether
they be man woman or child is so very important.

We have a debate about woman not being able to hold high office in certain churches. We have
only a short time on this earth the priests waste time bickering among them selves over the gender
of bishops…

ANS

Your post is based on number of generalization and assumptions.

Quran says that people like Jews and Christians corrupted and changed
their scriptures and that is evident by innumerable versions of Bible we
have today with us. In light of this evidence what other eyewitness we
need?

Whether women should become priests and hold high Church offices is
an internal matter of Church and I do not want to comment on it. But
when they are having Homosexual and Gay priests, what will matter if
they have Woman priests.

Islam does not degrade the personality of women. It says that sphere
of activities of both are different. Man is created to do outside work
and woman to take care of house. Taking care of house is not a mean
job and to have a healthy society we need a strong family life.

In Islam man and woman re not competitor, but they compliment each
other and make a unit, which is Family and on which civilization is
bases.

On the issue of marriage, Muslim men are allowed to marry upto four
wives, provided they can do justice (economic and sexual) between
them. This may seem discriminatory but it has lots and lots of benefits
for both men and woman.

Islam does not pose any restriction on the differences of age between
husband and wife, its only restriction is that Marriage should be with
free choice of both parties and both parties have attained the age of
marriage.

If any woman wants to refuse her marriage because of age difference ,

she has full right to reject it.

No man can stone his wife at his will….he has to produce four eye
witness who have seen with their own eyes woman committing
adultery with another man….then both man and woman shall be
stoned to death. The punishment is not only for women.

You need some more knowledge about Islam , in my view.

Q. Zoilus (Israel, 691)

Let me shed some light on the Islamic Jihad for you, since you mentioned that you are a novice.
In 1979, the Islamic Revolution unleashed upon humanity unbridled evil in the form of cold-
blooded, ruthless killers who feast on death, who are aroused and energized by the thought and
sight of human blood, and who privately-and getting quite publicly by the minute-dream about
creating another Holocaust. For them, murdering hundreds or even thousands no longer quenches
their unholy lust. Three decades later, unfortunately, this evil has not been stopped and has not
gone down either. On the contrary, it has only gotten worse.
…..

ANS

I might be a novice... but you seem to be totally ignorant of ancient or

even modern history.

You start your argument from 1979.... whereas it should have been
started from 1917....When Britain got their toe hold in Palestine and
allowed large scale Jewish Migration to Palestine against the wishes of
local population there.

That was the root cause of the problem which resulted in Creation of
Israel in 1948 and all of our modern day problems.

We infact want to avoid another Holocaust....that is why we say that

Those jews who are not residents of Palestine (i.e. those who came
there after 1917) should vacate the land and return to their Native
countries
Q Alex. (Jews don’t, 112)

42% are living in Israel maybe gods plan was to get the whole western world angry about the
muslims so they could be punished for their sins and vile ways.
Europe is starting to wake up ...

ANS

Slowly, those 42 % will also be gathered in Israel..

I do not know what is God’ plan, but the way Islam is spreading in the
west and Europe and in other parts of the world, very soon the world
will come under the peaceful protection of Islam.

A few Die Hard Islam haters including Jews and their Zionist Christians
Friends may brace themselves for some real trouble!!

Q. Bach7 (Jews don’t, 71)

Every desire? So it is a desire of a Muslim man to have a 'forever youthful boy' to serve him too?

According to the Quran Paradise will be some big orgie and every man wants 72 girls bound and
confined so he can have his way with them all?

What about your women? do they get 72 Guys as well?

Having 72 women is to have sex with is not about forming a loving relationship- it's not about
getting close to a person- it is just about getting all the sex in the world. Do you think that it is
possible that the prophet Mohammad just made it up so that he can get people who really liked to
have sex to follow him- raiding villages, killing all the men and taking the women as sex-slaves
or extra wives?

It seems that to Muslims eternal happiness is Just heaps of women to have sex with- do what ever
he wants with- fulfill his every desire.

Also, why did Mohammad (peace be upon him) have sex with his brother-in-laws wife? And why
did he force a 6 year old girl to marry him?

ANS

I was speaking about people who will be in Paradise!! And not about
people who are or will be in Hell!!

Persons who want to have Homosexual relationships will be separated

and shown the path of Hell for doing that abominable act.
I told you about the issue of companionship and sex in Paradise
between males and females. If God provides 72 Females or more to
humans in Paradise , then it is His wish and mercy.

David also had many wives even on this earth…and God promised to
give him more!! As recorded in the book of Samuel. Solomon had 700
wives and 300 concubines on this earth and that was Ok for God and
all you Bible thumpers. Why you find fault that Allah will provide 72 or
more virgins to every man in Paradise?

Our prophet never had sex with any one, who was not his wife or Slave
girl, under his control. His sexual life was best and above all blames.
Between the age of 25-50 (which is the best period for humans to fall
astray in sexual manners) he was calmly married to a woman which
was 15 years his senior.

After her death, prophet did marry many women, but all in most
honorable way and according to the recognized customs and with
Allah’s consent.

He did perfect justice between all his wives, till the very day he did. He
has shown us a shining example as to how to live a pious, pure and
healthy life.

Q. Big Joe (Jews Don’t, 71)

In 1929 Albert Einstein told rabbi Herbert S Golstein "i believe in Spinoza's God who reveals
himself in the lawful harmony of the world, not in a God who concerns himself with the fate and
doings of mankind"

ANS

I commented earlier that Einstein was not an Atheist. His concept of

God did not match with orthodox Jewish and Christian concept.

Any right thinking man could be excused if he did not accept verbatim
the concept of God as preached by Church and by Talmudists.

I feel sorry that these great scientists look like small babies when they
open their mouth on the concept of God… all their reasoning and logic
seem to deserve them when they open their mouth on this subject.

They want God to follow their whims and fancies and be what they
want or wish Him to be…. They want to dictate their wishes on God’s
personalities and His attributes.
God is what He is…and what He says He is…. Not what we humans
think what He should be!!

Q. Big Joe (Jews don’t, 71)

You are not providing the Islamic point of view you are providing your own point of view just
like everyone else. Jihadists against peace treaties supporting never ending war are who i find a
fanatic you fill the label well nothing more. Many scientists support the Big Bang Theory speak
of the world being 13 billion years old. Dinosaurs ruled the earth for hundreds of millions of
years we know this as a fact.
Man just showed up a million or 2 years ago flying in the face of most religion creation stories.
Evolution is certainly a possibility like numerous scientists claim.
The Greeks and Romans had numerous God's they are beliefs the fact is nobody really knows so
don't bother claiming you do because you don't.

ANS

While I do not claim to be an Expert On Islam, what I point out are

Islamic view points to the best of my knowledge and ability.

If you find that any of my argument is against Islam, you may question
it.

If some Muslims feel fanatic to you, you do not have any right to label
every one and each one, who dos not support your vies as fanatic.

How man evolved is an altogether separate Topic, all religions believe

that man was special creation of God. The evolutionists believe that
he came thru animal line. So far scientists have not been able to prove
their case. It is a bunch of theories only and not proofs. If you are a
blind follower of TOE then you are as fanatic as any one else.

Why only Romans and Greeks, in this age there are millions of Hindus
who believe there are hundreds nay thousands of gods, their temples
are filled with idols and statues of these gods. Every one is entitled to
his or her beliefs, but there is no harm, if you call people to true path.

The True Path of Worship only the True Creator of this Universe. The
path of all past prophets and messengers, the path of Islam!!

Q. Big Joe (Jews Don’t, 71)

Your fanatical Muslim religious opinions aren't truths they are fanatical Muslim religious
opinions and nothing more. tephen Hawking and Albert Einstein likely the two greatest scientists
in near recent history were basically atheists. Galileo Galilei had to stand trial for religious
heresy. Beliefs are just that and nothing more your poor attempts at brainwashing aren't working
this is not one of your madrasses.
ANS

You call me Fanatic, but the language and the words you have used,
prove that you are a Bigger Fanatic than me!!

You are a Fanatic Islam and Muslim Hater!!

Albert Einstein was for sure not an Atheist. He never denied the
presence of Creator. He had a different concept of Creator from the
Traditional Jewish and Christian concept and that is not strange.

I cannot comment about Mr. Hopkins, because I do not know about him
and his beliefs. May be no one told him about Islamic Concept of
Creator and he also denies this Jewish and Christian concepts of
Creator.

Galileo had to face the persecution of Church of his time , and this is a
blot on Christian Church, about which Pope has now Opologized, How
can Muslims and Islam be responsible for his persecution?

Islam and Muslims never persecuted scientists and mathematicians or

astronomers for their views. They were Muslims and they were
scientists and astronomers.

I am not trying to brainwash any one, I am providing Islamic point of

view on issues raised on this thread.

As to whether they are working or not, I or you cannot be the judge.

Q. Concerned Citizen (Jews Don’t, 87)

Brainwash people against Islam?

Smoke some more of that Indian peace pipe. 9/11 and endless killing and hijackings is what
turns people against Islam, the religion of peace.

Try leaving Israel alone, maybe peace can be had if Israelis felt safe from their neighbors. Stop
firing rockets then crying to the UN. Looks like IRAN is gonna get hit now. You should have
supported Israel’s right to exist. They will protect themselves whether you like it or not.
ANS

I think you do not know what really happened on 9/11. Just search on
the Internet for "9/11 Truth" and you will see what really happened
that fateful day on 9/11/2001. How the Two WTC Towers and Third
Tower WTC-7 collapsed. It was indeed a deep conpiracy and it was
covered up by 9/11 commission report.
No peace can prevail in ME and Palestine, unless and untill the wrongs
done to Palestinians in 1948 are undone. If you think that using force
you can silence the legitimate right of Palestinians, then it is your pipe
dream.

I know the war mongers in your country are dieing to have a go at

Iran...the same urgency was seen when they 'Wanted to have ago at
Iraq...as a dog trying to get loose from its leash".... The same was seen
during Afghanistan war.

I think the lessons of Vietnam, Iraq, and Afghanistan are not enough
and you are craving for more and more human blood.

If you have Israel as your best friend..., why you need any more
enemies!!! I only feel pity on common US citizen who has to pay thru
his nose for all these Military adventures!!

Q. Concerned Citizen (Jews Don’t, 143

It's funny to read all the scripture from both the quran and the bible. But it still does not answer
the question.
Is it ok to bring down civilian airliners yelling allah akbar? Is it ok to hijack a cruise ship and
brutally murder a defenseless man in a wheelchair?
Is it ok to send a young boy into a crowded market and blow it up? You folks can quote scripture
till the cows come home and it still does NOT answer this modern day question.
Don't be coy now, just answer the questions.

ANS

Before WE answer these questions, let us see can YOU answer these
questions:

Is it OK to evict people living in a land for 1200 years to make room for
some people who lived there once 2000 years ago?

Is it OK for people to blindly support Israel and all its actions and Veto
each and every resolution in UNO that forces Israel to stop its
brutalization of those people rendered homeless?

Once you answer these questions, perhaps you will find answers to the
questions raised by you.
If you do not solve any problem at its proper time and allow it to
simmer on and think that time will solve it, may be it would create
some unpleasant memories.

How old is the suicide bomber problem and how old is the Arab Israel
problem?

Q. Fredrick Nobel (Jews don’t, 86)

even before all these religious group started to take the swords your dammed evil satanic prophet
Mohammad took sword and spread terror in Mecca killing raping and coveting all the people into
his new found evil religion called as islam

Islamic aggression spread throughout the world from late 600AD to 1100AD the longest any
religious aggression ever recorded.

if the other religion had not taken sword then other religion would have been vanished by
2000AD

so the root cause of the spread of violence is islam. i am waitng for your so called justification of
your evil prophets actions

ANS

It seems that you have never read the biography of our prophet at all,
and your 'Knowledge base" is limited to what you see on Anti Islamic
site. It will do you a lot of good to read authentic biography of our
prophet. Their are gaping holes in your post, I will point out a few:

1. Our prophet did not take a sword in hand and started killing and
threatening and maiming each one and every one... the day he started
his mission.

2. First 40 years of his life in Makkah were spent in most peaceful

manner. He was given the title of Trustworthy and True by the same
Makkan people.

3. When he declared his mission at the age of 40, he and his small
band of followers had to suffer every kind of hardship, ridicule, and
insults at the hands of Pagan Makkan. They had to leave their homes
and belongings and migrate twice to Abyssinia and then to Medina.

4. Prophet himself had to fled Makkah during night , with only one
companion for fear of his life to Median.
5. It were the Makkans who first opened fight with Muslims of
Medina.... The prophet and his followers had to take up arms in self
defense.

6. During eight years of these wars... Muslim armies were always

outnumbered by pagan armies by three or four to one.... The total
amount of casualties (on both sides) during this "blood bath"
"Massacre" and "Killing each and every one of his enemy" does not
even reach 1000 !!!

7. Finally when prophet captured Makkah after 8 Years...do you know

what he did to those people?...... He pardoned all of them!!! No one
was forced to accept Islam at all.

7A. Since then Makkah has been a city of peace till eternity. No
fighting is allowed in Holy Makkah on any ground. Any one who deos
so is universally condemned by all Muslims.

8. I wish that Muslims were following the path set by their prophet.

9. Compared to the record of our prophet, just check the Biblical record
for number of casualties during wars of Moses...Joshua.... David and
Solomon in the land of Palestine. How many hundreds of thousands of
persons were killed and what were the actual results?

Q. Honestly ( Jews don’t, 92)

Moslems are funny creatures. they will say that Allah is responsible for everything...except of
course the things they don't like.
it looks like through the millennia there have been many invaders and occupiers of Israel, the
Arabs being the most recent (and indeed the current OCCUPATION force on Israeli land)
Allah stated that the land belongs to the jews, and he has given it back to them. the only ones
rejecting the WIOLL of ALLAH, are the muslims particularly the bloody arab Moslems.

the bloody mosque is built squarely on top of the Temple. The only claim that Moslems have to
Jerusalem, is a false one, based on an interpretation of a dream that mohamed had. Mo never
made it to Jerusalem.

ANS

I do not know of any Muslim, who thinks that things can happen in
Universe, without God’s consent. If any one thinks that anything can
happen in this Universe, even though God does not like it, then such a
person is not true Muslim.
If there have been many occupants of the land of Palestine thru out
ages, then one thing is sure, that God does not want that Jews should
have exclusive possession of that land for eternity!!

Arabs being the most recent and longest occupants of Palestine have
the strongest and boldest claim for Palestine.

Your hate for Arabs, Muslims and Islam is evident from every word of
your post, If people of Israel are as intolerant as you, then what they
are doing to Palestinians should not come as surprise to any one.

It seems that you have no knowledge about Islam at all. Al Aqsa was
made holy when the prophet was in Makkah itself and there was no
idea that Muslims would take possession of Palestine one day.

Your wishes are for you only, God is not bound by your bad wishes to
Muslims and Islam.

I know how much pain and jealousy is your hearts to see the spread of
Islam to all corners of the world and Jews population is constant or
even going down.

This is what happens to every one who is racist and bigot.

Q. Just Fred (Jews Don’t, 87)

I suggest you are mistaken. The West has been fighting off Muslim hordes for several thousand
years. And you seem to forget that it was the Muslims who invaded Israel during biblical times.
Furthermore, the Palestinians have broken every peace treaty made with Israel. So, who is the
major disease?
ANS

Considering that 1t is less than 1400 years (As per English Calendar)
when our prophet started his preaching, your assertion that Muslims
and Christians are fighting since thousands of years is not correct
historically.

Same is the case with your assertion that Palestinians and Jews have
been fighting each other since Biblical times. It is not correct also.

The Biblical Philistine have been exterminated by victories Jews long

back. The present generation of Palestinians are mostly arabs who
settled there when Arabian armies captured Palestine from Byzantine
Empire somewhere in 650 CE.
So I think that you need a lesson in history.

Q. Lipush (Jews don’t, 79)

No matter if the Jews have sinned or not, any holy book cannot call people "Pigs" and "apes" and
say, "And the rock called, there is a Jew behind me, kill him" (which proves Koran called to Kill
ALL THE JEWS) as i said, nobody can follow the Koran as it's written and stay healthy in mind.
Simply impossible.

ANS

I think you forger that Jesus called Non Jews as “Pigs and Dogs”. It is
recorded in Gospels.

Even if you do not consider Jesus as a prophet…but indeed he was a

Jew….there is no doubt in it.

Quran does not call all Jews as Pigs and Apes….It says that some Jews
were changed into Apes and Pigs for their misdeeds. There is big
difference between the two.

Quran never calls Muslims to kill all Jews….In a prophetic tradition it is

recorded that near End of Time, when Jesus shall return back and will
kill Anti Christ…in that fight Jews shall be in the army of Anti Christ…
and they shall be killed and exterminated. This is a prophesy which
shall take place at its appointed time.

If Muslims acted on your “supposed Quranic order to kill every Jew”,

why so many Jews still survive in Islamic countries between 650 CE –
1917 CE, when they had no support from any one!!

About Jews gathering in Palestine from all parts of the world, I have
made known my stand….may be it is a rehearsal for End of Time
battle!!

Jews should walk and act very carefully now.!!

Q. Lipush (Jews don’t, 85)

Any time Muslims are bring proven to do something which is not "peaceful" you blame the Jews.

Would you care to explain why your religion believes the Jews are to blame when Muslims hurt
each other?

ANS

No we do not blame Jews for ALL the problems which Muslims face in
the world today.

But most of the problems that Muslims are facing in the world today
are directly or indirectly related by the Jews and their propaganda and
mischief that they do thru the Jewish Controlled Media.

It is like if you have a major disease then so many minor ones will also
grow up on that major disease.

Most terrorism related problems in the world and that involving

Muslims and the west have their root cause in Israel and Jewish
conspiracy.

Q. Lipush (Jews Don’t, 89)

Let me ask you this-
As a Muslim, how do you see the world works in say like, 50 years from now? How Islam will
help the world to achieve advanced technology?
do you see the Arab community helping to develop the world more then western countries? How
do you wish for Islam to be in the eyes of the world?
What do you see as the treatment to women? to gays, to strangers? to those at risk?
Is your culture the one helping to do that, in the future, or damaging it? Since you're 'unbiased'
muslim i would really thank you if you answer me personally those questions, thank you.
ANS

You have asked very good questions and I will try to provide honest
answers.

1. There is no doubt that Muslims lag behind in areas of Science and

Technology today. But that was not their conditions for most of the
past 1400 years.

2. Muslims were at par or better than most countries of the world 300
or so years before. It was the Industrial revolution in Europe and use
of Steam Power that was the main reason for technological gap
between Muslims and Europe.

3. That is not unique with Islam and Muslims. Every nation has had a
rise and fall in leading the world. Indians, Chinese, Egyptians etc all
old civilizations has had their rise and fall. The same Europeans were
Barbarians a few hundred years back and did not know even the most
basic facts of science, mathematics and philosophy.

4. What I want to say, is that we should not link the present condition
of Muslims with Islam, that because of Islam, Muslims are lagging
behind in the fields of science and technology. Islam never puts a
barrier for learning science and technology. Islam in fact encourages
Muslims to ponder on nature and find hidden causes of natural
phenomenon..

5. So Islam as a religion and as a way of life, is a very powerful force

and I see that it will continue to influence and attract all those who are
reasonable, logical and unbiased and in search of truth. from all
nations to accept Islam. It will continue to grow and get converts from
all nations.

6. It is this resilience of Islam, which is so dangerous of those people

who do not want that Islam should progress in the world. It is such
people who scheme and try to invent faults in Islam and its way of
thinking.

7. These are the persons that try to create rift between Muslims and
jews and Christians on one pretext or other, so that climate of peaceful
co-existence and frank exchange of views does not take place.

8. I am not an astrologer, nor a day dreamer. I think that ultimately

the Western People will come to the fold of Islam, when they would
have exhausted experimenting with all other "isms" and find that they
do not lead to anything else but falsehood.

9. None of God' work is without reason and plan and Wisdom. So the
current surge of Science and Technology by West is for the benefit of
mankind, and that is the reason why they are given time. But
Excellence in science and technology is not the Goal for human Kind.
Walking in the ways of God is the Goal.

Q. Mary (Jews Don’t, 78)

MUQ, the Islamic scholars, which I don't see many Islamic scholars (not to many are educated or
know what Almighty say except bring their own teaching and say it is Prophet Muhammad
saying...) They are corrupted as many victims of this fake teaching which have put many
Muslims in danger.

Well, places like ksa, where Hadith is the main teaching and practice of everyday activity proves
to the point why hatred, killings and so on is happening. well, they say Quran comes before
Hadith but their day-to-day activity is going on with the teaching of Hadith....and people who
come from less-fortunate country like you always been the victim of these barbaric teaching
called Hadith.

ANS

I told you repeatedly, that your knowledge about Islam and its
teachings are very superficial and you should at least read some more
or ask Muslims before you put down your objections.
But you continue your objections on Islam and its teaching without
knowing in the least what are you saying.

You mention Hadith and KSA as if it is only in KSA, that Hadith are
followed and given preference. The fact is in every part of Islamic
world, Hadith (sayings and actions of prophet) are given equal
weightage. There is a very small minority amongst Muslims (a deviant
sect, really) who deny the authority of Prophetic sayings.

Then you did another stupid thing, when you said that Prophet himself
would complain as to why Muslims followed Hadith and not Quran. As if
Quran and Hadith contradict each other!!

In fact it is Quran which says at many places , Follows Allah and Follow
the Messenger of Allah. How could one follow messenger of Allah
without following his teachings?

What was the need to send a prophet, if his words and actions were
not to be followed by his followers?

That men and woman should cover their bodies is mentioned also in
Quran.

So I say that you need basic knowledge about Islam, how its rules are
derived. What pains Muslims have taken to preserve each and every
word of their prophet and his actions…and how much they contrast
with the followers of other religions…

Q. Mary (Jews Don’t, 80)

lol@hadith. it is nothing but written by people for people, don't waste your time trying to say
hadith is written to support Quran, it is deceiving people. that is why you see many many Muslim
practicing hadith more than the Holy Quran. If Muslims stop following hadith and learn how to
follow Quran, they just be fine...

I hope you get it .anyway peace

ANS

I told you before that your knowledge about Islam and its teachings are
very limited.

Hadith is nothing but the record of Prophet’s sayings, actions and

instructions during 23 years of his mission. These are recorded in
many volumes and are rated by Islamic scholars based on their
authenticity.

There is no other religious group who has so diligently recorded and

analyzed sayings and teachings of their Prophets and religious leaders.

By Universal consent of Islamic Scholars, Hadith come after Quran in

ranking. In most cases they explain meanings of Quranic verses.

If Muslims had only to follow Quran and leave Hadith (as you advised)
then what was the need for sending Prophet?

God could very well had send entire Quran in a book form and in hand
of every individual and let him follow it!!!

By the way, what else are present day Gospels than an inferior form of
Hadith of Jesus?

Q. MKOT (Jews Don’t, 78)

Here are more "peaceful" commands from the Quran--- the ones that explain flying jets into
towers, beheadings,
fatwahs, hijackings, bombings and opening fire on your
fellow soliders.
* Koran Sura 5:51 commands Muslims not to take Jews and Christians (infidels) as friends
* Koran Sura 9:29 commands Muslims to fight against Jews and Christians until they either
submit to Allah or die by the sword.
*Make war on them [non-Muslims] until idolatry shall cease and God's religion shall reign
supreme.(8:40)
* Koran Sura 2:65-66 and Sura 5:60 contain references to Jews as “apes and swine to be despised
and rejected.”
*The unbelievers among the people of the book and the pagans shall burn forever in the fire of
Hell. They are the vilest of all creatures.(98.6).
*Mohammed is God's apostle. Those who follow him are ruthless to the unbelievers but merciful
to one another.(48:29).

ANS

I thank you for the “research” finding about the “Intolerance “ and
hateful nature of Islam and Muslims.

I do not know where you did the same exercise for OT and NT books
and found out what are their teachings?

But I am sure that you did not “discover” these “gems” by your own
research into the vast Islamic literature. You have “borrowed” them
from some Anti Islamic Site.
However I will provide brief answers to these accusations. It would
have been better if you had raised one objection at a time.

A. Koran Sura 5:51 commands Muslims not to take Jews and Christians
(infidels) as friends:

MUQ: Arabic term used in Quran is AULIA, which means Bosom Friend
or Protectors. If Muslims have heeded to this advise of Quran 1400
years back, they would have been in a different situation altogether.

B. Koran Surah 9:29 commands Muslims to fight against Jews and

Christians until they either submit to Allah or die by the sword.

MUQ: Quran 9:29 shows that when war is to stop. Either the enemy
sues for peace and is ready to pay JIZYA or one of the party is finished.
How else can war end?

C. Make war on them [non-Muslims] until idolatry shall cease and God's
religion shall reign supreme.(8:40)

MUQ: This is a special instruction to deal with the particular Makkan

situation. Just compare it with what Bible says in Deut. Ch7 & Ch20 as
to how to deal with similar situations.

D. Koran Sura 2:65-66 and Sura 5:60 contain references to Jews as

“apes and swine to be despised and rejected.”

MUQ. This does not describe all Jews, but about a particular group
amongst them who faced the God’s wrath.

E.*The unbelievers among the people of the book and the pagans shall
burn forever in the fire of Hell. They are the vilest of all creatures.
(98.6).

MUQ: What else should in your view is the “Just” punishment for those
who deny the message of God?

What is the Church’ teachings about the fate of those who do not
accept Jesus as their personal savior?

F. Mohammed is God's apostle. Those who follow him are ruthless to

the unbelievers but merciful to one another.(48:29)
MUQ: Ruthless is not the correct translation of the Arabic Word
ASHIDDA’. The correct translation is that they are hard against
unbelievers and soft towards Muslims…..what is objectionable in it?.

Hadith:

G. Abu Dawud (14:2526)- The Prophet said: Three things are the roots
of faith: to refrain from a person who utters, "There is no god but Allah"
and not to declare him unbeliever whatever sin he commits, and not to
excommunicate him from Islam for his any action; and jihad will be
performed continuously since the day Allah sent me as a prophet until
the day the last member of my community will fight with the Dajjal.

MUQ: I do not know what is objection on this Hadith? The struggle

against injustice and oppression (Islamic Jihad) shall continue till the
end of this world.

H. Abu Dawud (14:2527) the Messenger of Allah said: I have been

commanded to fight against people till they testify that there is no god
but Allah, that Muhammad is the messenger of Allah

MUQ: That was the mission of prophet which he completed. In his life
time whole Arabia became Muslim with a loss of even less than 1000
human lives on both sides!!! Just compare this with the achievement
of any other religious personality!!

J. Bukhari (8:387)- Allah's Apostle said, "I have been ordered to fight
the people till they say:' None has the right to be worshipped but Allah

MUQ: Answer is the same as above.

K. Muslim (1:149)- "Abu Dharr reported: I said: Messenger of Allah,

which of the deeds is the best? He replied: Belief in Allah and Jihad in
His cause."

MUQ: What is objectionable part in it? Islamic Jihad is fight against

oppression, tyranny and injustice, do you want them to continue?

L. But Allah desires killing them to manifest the religion.

Ibn Ishaq: 990 Lest anyone think that cutting off someone's head while
screaming 'Allah Akbar

MUQ: I fail to understand, which part you want to condemn and what is
your real objection?

Koran:
M. The true believers fight for the cause of God, but the infidels fight
for the devil. Fight then against the friends of Satan.(4:76)

MUQ: What portion of this you want to object? In which party you want
to include yourself? Supporter of God or Supporter of Satan?

N. We will put terror into the hearts of the unbelievers.(3:150)

MUQ: What is wrong in it? Should God be “neutral” in fight between

supporters of God and supporters of Satan?

O. Fight against them until idolatry is no more and God's religion reigns
supreme.(2:193)

MUQ : This has also been explained above.

All in all, there is nothing against humanity or cruelty in all what you
have reproduced.

However if you think that the word, Fighting, War, Killing etc are taboo
in a “religious book” then it is your wrong assumption. You should first
expunge all those words from your scriptures too!!

Q. MKOT (Jews Don’t, 9)

:) Again, you evade. YOU cite selected passages from the Koran to "prove" peace and ignore the
actions of killers who use other passages o spread terror. Then you try to cite the old Testament
and New Testament language as "proof" of the same tactics. But, the difference is in the
CTIONS OF BELIEVERS and the ACTIONS OF RELIGIOUS LEADERS WHO COMMAND
THEM. orced conversions, death to "others" are not central to mainstream faiths.

ANS

Your words are mere accusations, I did indeed provide answers for “all”
the “killer verses” in Quran and Hadith literature which you quoted.

If you have some more such verses, please post it and I will answer
them.

I do not want to take part in empty accusations and bandying words

with you.

I am not here to answer deeds and actions of every Muslim individual

or every group.
I am here to answer about Islamic teachings and Islamic Principles, if
you have anything , come forward.

Q. MKOT (Jews don’t, 81)

MUQ-read the above, again. Words mean actions when held up as "holy" or inspired. You
content yourself in the vagaries of words and ignore the actions taken in the name of Allah. You
do not condemn terror but choose to launch verbal rockets at other religions and their ancient
texts. But, those religions do not produce such vile
behavior in modern man. It is a small, old world in the madrassa -

ANS

I think you have forgotten your own history as to how much Terror in
the world is caused by the followers of these “peaceful” religions like
Judaism, Christianity, Hinduism and Buddhism etc.

What crimes did “Buddhist” regime of Japan did during WW-2 is clearly
forgotten.

How much terror was caused by “Christian nations” right up to the

WW-2 is all forgotten.

The Biggest Terror strike in Human History was dropping of Atomic

Bombs on Civilian targets by the “Christian Army” of USA is also
forgotten.

What else crimes were done by these “Christian” nations during middle
ages and during colonization of Asia, Africa, America, Australia etc are
all forgotten….so are the “fair” treatment given to hundreds of
thousands of Black slaves in US and Europe.

What the “Christians army did in Vietnam, Koreas, Iraq and

Afghanistan is all forgotten”

What the Jewish and Zionist army of Israel is doing in past 62 years in
Palestine is all forgotten.

What you remember is Muslim Children without any arms and

ammunitions learning about Islam and Quran in Madarsas ….

That is the BIGGEST threat to world peace and your own peace as per
you.
I do not want to comment anything more but to remind you that before
accusing others, you should first check your own records and not
religion’s record and you nation’s records.

The Pots should not call Kettles Black!!

US and Israel are the biggest terrorist nations of our time.

Q. MKOT (Jews Don’t, 84)

Sorry chief, this concept is going to shock you. Not only can people writes letters, they can
appear on programs in the radio and TV, they can write newspaper articles, they can write plays,
novels and draw cartoons...people can speak and think here without getting a fatwah called by
"holy" leaders. Remember Theo VanGogh- the filmmaker who dared to do a documentary about
women under Sharia
Law? He was stabbed to death on the street with the "holy death order "stuck on the knife blade.
Now, that's freedom.

This was European in his own country and he was killed for making a short film, "Submission"
that allowed women to tell their own stories. It takes no effort to recall the horrors of Islamic
extremism because they are so vile and outrageous that most

ANS

Your post shows that you did not even try my suggestion… you just
decided about the “fairness and impartiality of your Print and
Electronic Media” from the rave reviews it gives to itself.

Did you see what happened to the Grandson of Mahatma Gandhi when
he made an innocent remarks regarding Jews? Do you think he would
have faced the same flak had he used the same remarks about Iran,
Muslims and Islam?

No public official in USA and Europe can survive for a day after saying
any bad word about Jews or Israel…..while they do not feel any
consequences for saying worse things about Islam and Muslim
countries.

That is the type of freedom your media enjoys and gives you…. People
are programmed from a very young age that Jews are chosen people
and Jews are persecuted people….that they are innocent and that they
need our help and support to survive…. When they grow up, they
behave exactly as you have shown so far.

So long as present Zionist state of Israel survives, there shall be no end

to Terrorism…. Let us see if you people are sincere in removing the
root cause of all terrorism or will continue to prune leaves, branches
and off shots of these branches!!

Q. MKOT (Jews don’t, 86)

More importantly for the safety and sanity of mankind...let us see if people like you will admit
what the problem is instead of deciding the world is not to YOUR liking if Jews are thriving in it.
The shame of Islamic is on exceeded by the utter lack of conscience demonstrated by its
followers. As long as blind and unyielding hatred survives, the
civilized world will fight it. How ironic that you point the finger at other societies about a
"controlled media" or people "programmed from

ANS

We are not jealous of Jews and their achievements and we hold no

grudge against them.

You can shower any amount of praise on them if you want. Our
problem is with the Jews who have done wrong against us and
occupied our land and homes and done speakable crimes against our
Palestinian brothers.

We have right to fight and expel these jews from our lands. If you love
jews that much, you are most welcome to give them shelters in your
homes and in your countries.

You can even worship them and wash their hands and feet for all we
concern. We will never complain why you worship these jews.

But you have got rid of your own quota of Jews and exported them to
our lands.

If you are not able to see the jewish bias in your Media and its
reporting, then it is high time, you get your eyes operated and your
ears cleaned.

Q. MKOT (Jews don’t, 97)

1&4) Quite interesting bookends. You criticize Israel by saying Jews are not following their
religion and say basically the same thing about most Muslims. I am not the judge of how ones
follows their own religion. But, we can look at the behavior of the faithful to see the fruit...Jews
in Israel and worldwide are much greater contributors to mankind. YOU claim
that does not matter in God's eyes. YOU are not the judge of that. What man can judge is which
group makes life more livable for human beings.

YOU cannot ignore history nor hold it back-mankind is bigger than you are...

Iran is trying to deny history by using a club on the orders of "holy men."
How is that working?

ANS

1. You are right in a sense, Muslims are not following Islam with
devotion and sincerity that is required, that explains the present
condition of Muslims. Benefit to human kind is a commendable thing,
but you should also do your duty to your Lord and Creator to be really
successful in both lives.

2. As we already have proofs of Jews actually setting fire to the al Aqsa

mosque.. .and the firebrand right wing Jewish hate mongers’ resolve to
demolish the mosque…. And Israeli Government’ discreet silence on
these things…. We cannot take mere words from you that Jews do not
demolish places of worship of other people…. I do not know what
happened to all those places of worship of original Philistines when
Jews took possession of that land 3000 years ago?

3. I do not condone any injustice or crime committed any where in the

world , by Muslims or by Non Muslims. If any one did commit any
crime in Darfur or Somalia, he should be punished. But I do not
support the West idea of singling out these areas and ignoring all the
other places where Muslims are being killed or persecuted just for their
faith. You should follow the same standard for every one, should you
not?

Q. MKOT (Jews don’t, 97)

1&4) Quite interesting bookends. You criticize Israel by saying Jews are not following their
religion and say basically the same thing about most Muslims. I am not the judge of how ones
follows their own religion. But, we can look at the behavior of the faithful to see the fruit...Jews
in Israel and worldwide are much greater contributors to mankind. YOU claim
that does not matter in God's eyes. YOU are not the judge of that. What man can judge is which
group makes life more livable for human beings.

YOU cannot ignore history nor hold it back-mankind is bigger than you are...

Iran is trying to deny history by using a club on the orders of "holy men."
How is that working?

ANS

1. You are right in a sense, Muslims are not following Islam with
devotion and sincerity that is required, that explains the present
condition of Muslims. Benefit to human kind is a commendable thing,
but you should also do your duty to your Lord and Creator to be really
successful in both lives.

2. As we already have proofs of Jews actually setting fire to the al Aqsa

mosque.. .and the firebrand right wing Jewish hate mongers’ resolve to
demolish the mosque…. And Israeli Government’ discreet silence on
these things…. We cannot take mere words from you that Jews do not
demolish places of worship of other people…. I do not know what
happened to all those places of worship of original Philistines when
Jews took possession of that land 3000 years ago?

3. I do not condone any injustice or crime committed any where in the

world , by Muslims or by Non Muslims. If any one did commit any
crime in Darfur or Somalia, he should be punished. But I do not
support the West idea of singling out these areas and ignoring all the
other places where Muslims are being killed or persecuted just for their
faith. You should follow the same standard for every one, should you
not?

Q. MKOT (Jews don’t, 113)

You may judge whether an entire group of people's "good deeds" are over shadowed? You think
Muslim are, "the least racist nation?" How about "sexist?" Which is the greater offense in your
judgment?

ANS

Thanks for you sticking up to Jews like that…. But your sales pitch does
not match with their historical records.

Why were they evicted from one European country to another during
these 2000 years? For believing in one God and walking in His ways?
Or exploiting economies of their neighbors and practicing extreme
racism?

Q. Salt Dome (Jews Don’t, 78)

MUQ,Isn't that true, the main ibadah in Islam is Salat? How do you Salat was written in Hadith
but not in Qur'an?,like when,how many rakaat,what you have to read in Shalat etc? MUQ,tell me
about Hadith according to Abu Hurairah ,I emphasize this because so many 'controversial' Hadith
is according to Him and Folks love thumping this one.

Thak You

You are right after declaration of faith, the most important act of
ritualistic worship is regular prayer, which is called as Salaat in Arabic.

You are right when you say that exact manner in which Salaat is to be
offered is not mentioned in Quran, but Muslims derive that from
Hadith, i.e. sayings and actins of the prophet.
But let me say this, that most actions and details we fins in Hadith are
also mentioned in Quran. These are distributed in pages of Quran, let
me show you some of these:

1. Ablution before Salaat is mentioned in Quran.

2. Call for prayer is mentioned in Quran.

3. That we turn our faces towards Kabaa is mentioned in Quran.

4. That we should offer in congregation, and Imam should stand is

mentioned in Quran.

5. The timings of prayers, Fajr, Dhuhar, Asr, and Isha is mentioned in

Quran, Maghrib Prayer and Friday prayer and Friday Sermon is
mentioned in Quran.

6. All important parts of Salaat, Standing, Bending, Prostration, sitting

are mentioned in Quran.

There are many other details which are mentioned in Quran, so it is not
correct to say that Quran does not give details and it is only Hadith
which provide these details. In fact if all books of Hadith get lost,
Muslims can derive these details from Quran also.

But Hadith provide more details and correct way of performing Salaat.
The same applies to other acts of Ritualistic worship, Fasts, Charity,
Pilgrimage eyc.

That is probably the purpose for sending a Human Messenger, so that

he could show and guide practical applications of Quranic teachings.

I hope I am able to answer your query.

Allah Knows Best.

Q. THR (Jews Don’t, 78)

VERY WELL INSPIRED. I DO NOT ARGUE.SURELY [ALLAH] HAS INLIGTHEN YOUR

PATH.IF ONLY EVERY BROTHER AND SISTER BEGOTTEN OF OUR HEAVENLY
FATHER WOULD COMMUNE IN THIER HEART'S AND PUT AWAY ALL THESE
INDIFERENCE OF HISTORY AND CULTURAL GENEOLOGY. OF POWER AND GLORY
OF OWNERSHIP OF THING'S OBJECT'S AND LAND'S. AND REALIZE IT WAS GIVEN
TO US AS A GIFT OF [ALLAH] TO BE INJOYED AND BE FRUITFULL.WE WOULD
HAVE LESS WAR'S AND MORE PEACE' HERE ON THIS EARTH THAT THE
ALLMIGTHY CREATOR HAS GIVEN US.BUT LET US NOT LOSE HOPE.FOR BETTER IS
A LIVE DOG THAN A DEAD LION.QOUTE[SOLOMON]EVIL MAY GAIN STRENGTH AS
A LION' BUT AS YOU WROTE SUCH WISDOM; WITH MORE LOVE AND HOPE 'GOOD
MAY BE CONSIDERED A DOG. BUT STRENGTH LIE'S IN HOPE AND LOVE AND SOON
SURE ENOUGTH WILL DEVOUR THE LION. SAHLEHWALECOM.TO YOU AND ALL
YOUR HOUSE HOLD.AND MAY THE WISDOM OF THE ALLMIGTHY [ALLAH] REST
UPON YOU ALLWAY'S.[AS THEY SAY IN ENGLISH.[GOD SPEED].

ANS

I appreciate your sentiments and your hopes. It is correct that if

instead of highlighting our differences, we concentrate on our
similarities and equalities, the present climate of hate and mutual
suspicions would be blown away.

Every one who is learned and has thinking power should contribute
towards this goal.

We can follow paths of our choice, but let that not become a stumbling
block for our duties to others.

Dealing with Justice and Equity between different groups is the thing
that is most lacking in our world to today.

So I would like to thank again and endorse your views.

Q. YAM (Jews Don’t, 146)

rabbee: ok then show me the words muslem and koran in TheTorah. since all the prophets in
TheTorah, say for one, are the grandchildren of Avraham, Sarah and Yeetzak, because Sarah
laughed.

and why are muslems, as false prophets demanding that Ysrael not exist? when HaShem G-D
promised their return, to the land. and that is is muslem resistance to G-D, that is the worse of two
evils here. and indiscriminate firing of rockets, do not constitute removal of the zionist or
extreemists. since you are definatly murdering more of the ones, you only say have a right to be
there. even detonating one's self in a crowd, does not discriminate between zionist/extreemists or
non-zionist/extreemists. shalomcha vshalomech???,?...
ANS

I don’t know, but I find it extremely difficult to decode your message.

From what I could decipher, I say that your post is based on number of
assumptions, which are mostly wrong.

1. Muslims want to destroy Israel:

As such we do not want every Jew killed. We are also not against that
jews which were living in Palestine since generations should not have
their own state.
But we are against Jews in millions coming from Europe and elsewhere
and uprooting people who were living these since generations.

2. All prophets are grandchildren of Abraham:

We Muslims also believe in this. We respect and Jewish prophets and

many of them are mentioned in Quran.

3. The world Muslim is not present in Torah:

Muslim in Arabic means one who submits himself and his wishes to his
Creator , The God Almighty. Do you think that Jewish prophets were
other than that?

The change in language cannot change the original concept.

4. Fight against Jews is fight against God:

This is your mistake. In no way Jews are to be taken as God’s own

people as a whole. Those Jews who are working in cause of God are
His people and so are Muslims who work in His cause.

But most of jews living in Israel are Atheist, Materialists and Secularist.
They do not act or implement God’s Laws and Commandments. How
can they we called as God’s own people?

Q. Yeshooa Adama (Jews don’t, 79)

those who harken not unto HaShem G-D, are the terrorists of other g-ds against us. other g-ds are
the causes of all, pestilences, plagues and famines always and forever. the crimes are of your own
doing, for the causes other false g-ds.

there is but one true race, that G-D created from the grandson and grandaughter of Avraham, as
verified in the always and forever, twice comming of Benee Adam. and if your grandfather and
grandmother adam n chaooah are both 'jews' then what are all of you alien non 'jews' doing on
this planet, of only The Yehoodah, that G-D divided into Yahoo and Yahee?

ANS

You are very incoherent in your writings. It is very difficult to decipher

your message.

What I could understand was that All humans are children of Adam and
Eve. That is correct.
It is wrong for you to say that Adam and Eve were Jews. In the same
way it is wrong for you to say that Abraham was a Jew. None of these
prophets were Jews in racial sense. They were forefathers of Jews.

Jews trace their genealogy to Jacob and his 12 Children… that is a very
narrow classification of humanity.

God did chose Jacob and his children to propagate His religion and
send many prophets and messengers to them. God did send Torah to
Moses (in written form) as a special favor.

Jews should have been thankful to God for all the favors they received
from God….. but instead of that they became rebellious and killed
many messengers of God.

God did give them ample time and ample warnings to correct their
ways, but they remained adamant.

So finally God took the leadership of world from them and gave it to
another nation….Arabs who are descendants of Abraham thru
Ishmael…… by raising Last and Final Prophet from amongst
themselves.

Not it is duty of Muslims to propagate God’s religion in the world and

do not behave in arrogance and cruelty as those did before them.

We all are under test and our actions are watched and we will receive
our reward or punishment on the last day.

So instead of doing down each other, all of us must try our nest to
excel in doing good deeds and service to the humanity and promote
peace , justice and equity in the world.

This in my view is summary of teachings of Torah, Gospel and Quran!!

Q. Big Joe (Jews Don’t, 88)

Hold on oh radical one did you not say us infidels were in league with Satan? Were you Muslims
not to smite us unbelievers or some nonsense you quoted it yourself.
Now you come up with some more anti-Jewish propaganda claiming everything is there fault
again. ace the facts terror attacks worldwide and 90% of terror groups are Muslim. Your home
nation India is consistently being struck by radical Muslims.
Radical Islam is a very serious problem. And you can take your wicked Sharia law and shove it
where the sun don't shine.

ANS
Why are you so much pissed up. There are only two parties in this
world.... One is God's party and another is Satan's party, there is no
third party.

Now it is the duty of each and every individual to verify in which party
he or she belongs. That is the decision which Individuals have to take
themselves and it is that choice which will form the basis of their
judgment on the last day.

Now it is for you to prove that your religion or party is really God's
party and not the Satan.

You posted that India is repeatedly targeted by Radical Muslims, but

you forgot to mention that how many Anti Muslims riots take place in
India every year and this practice is continuing for how many decades
and every year how many Muslims are killed in these riots.

When commenting on these matters, you should at least be aware of

both sides of the story. This one sided judgments are always wrong
and biased.

Q. Big Joe (Jews Don’t, 89)

Muhammad was the owner of slaves, including concubines and had a dozen wives what kind of
path is this to follow? Apparently his wives complained about his sleeping around a lot especially
Mary the Copt a slave girl. Muhammad also consummated his marriage to Aisha when she was
only nine. llah even permitted Muhammad and his men to have sex with married slaves, such as
those captured in battle. It was a total free for all sounds kind of like the Roman orgy days.

ANS

Can you tell me which was the religious scripture that banned Poly
Gamy and Keeping the Slaves?

Keeping Slaves was the Economical need of the past age and Poly
Gamy is the social need for all ages.

It was Islam, which gave RIGHTS to slaves and women and improved
their conditions.

Just go thru the laws of old nations like Greek, Romans, Egyptians,
Indian and Chinese etc. and then compare their laws on Slaves and
Women with what Islam gave them.

There never was a sexual orgy with female slaves in Islam. The
females were collected and brought before the leader. Those who
could buy their freedom were set free. Those who could not were
allotted to individual soldiers.

Those who were pregnant were to be kept as such, till they deliver the
babies. Those who were not, were free to have sex with.

Slavery by itself dissolved the earlier marriage.... The female slaves

were the ones who came to battlefield to fight against the Muslims and
they should know their fate, should there army be defeated.

By the way, do you have any idea, how Muslim women were treated by
their captors during those days? What RIGHTS they had and what
were the restrictions on their captors?

Islam is a practical religion and not those for a select few or hermits.

It has checks and balances in every situation. Read Islamic laws and
then compare it with any other law and you will see the difference and
moderation of Islam

Q. Alex (Messianic, 324)

if you want people not to fear islam you shouldn't preach for islam to dominate the world and say
things like this "Which ever Jews and Christians are living in Muslim countries they are all living
in peace. I never hear that they are brutalized and victimized.
You can say that Jews are the WORST Rulers and the BEST Subjects, while we can say that
MUSLIMS are the BEST rulers and the WORST subjects. So why not change the roles, so that
world can live in peace!! Let every one do the role, he or she is BEST in it?"

ANS

We preach about the truth of Islam and truth has its power of own. It
is Islam’s destiny to rise and no one can stop it.

Even in the present condition, when Muslim countries are not a strong
force in world affairs, Islam is growing at a steady pace in almost ALL
countries of west. You like it or not.

How Jews and treating their “Arab citizens” is shown to us every day
on TV. If you think that this a “Good Treatment”, then apparently you
have a wrong meaning of the word “Good”.

Israelis living in Muslim countries are living like any other citizen, I
never heard of them being arrested on suspicion, searched at airports
or any rioting and killing against them.
Q. Anilkitos (Messianic, 324)

This would have made sense IF there was a single Arab country that was a democracy. The way I
see Arabs is that they absolutely must be ruled by an iron fist and a whip. That is the only way
they have been ruled in the past 1400 years, they only understand a whip.

You cannot be a ruler if you are not rule yourself. By definition, Arabs are the perfect subjects.
Israelis - a population of 4 million are controlling middle east. The only reason Saudii Arabia has
any say in world affairs is because of its oil reserves, when that dries up, it will turn into another
Yemen.
.
ANS

Just the POSSIBILITY of becoming President and prime Minister is no

enough. Any one knows that for an average American to become
President of USA the chance is 1 in 250 Millions!!

However, if you become a Billionaire or a member of Political mafia ,

your chances would become very high .

So do not post that crap of your children becoming President of USA or

Prime Minister of Israel.

I was commenting about the roles of Jews and Arabs as rulers and as
subjects.

History has shown that Muslims have ALWAYS been a better ruler and
gave much more freedom to jews than Jews have done to Muslims.

That is reason that Jews were not persecuted in any Muslim country
like they were persecuted by Christians of Europe.

These are hard facts of history and you should and must know them.

Just increase of Science and technology is not the standard to judge

any society.

Muslims are not united, it is our misfortune (and for that you also must
take some credit…always playing one country against another, divide
and rule).

Q. Barbara (Messianic, 321)

Are you saying that MUQ who restarted this discussion is Jewish?
ANS
If Jews relate themselves to Prophet Abraham and those who followed
him, then I am Jewish.

However if By Jew, it means that one who has blood relation with
Jacob, the son of Isaac, the son of Abraham, then most probably I am
not Jewish!!

If by Jews, it means who recognizes all prophets mentioned in the

books of OT, then yes I am Jewish.

If by Jews, it means some one who has come to reside by force in

Palestine and kicked out , people living there for centuries, then I am
not Jewish.

If by Jew, it means to uphold the banner of truth, justice and

Monotheism, then I am Jewish.

However if by Jews it means, some one who deals in Usury,

Pornography and hate literature against a major world religion, then I
am not Jewish.

Now you tell me , what do you mean by the word Jew and Jewish!!

Q. Eric (Messianic, 319)

Now I understand. Everyone else has to act civilized. Muslim countries don't. May I ask who
granted special status to the Muslim countries?
ANS

That special status was granted by Muslims themselves!! Saudi Arabia

is 100 % Muslim country since generations. There is not a single Non
Muslim citizen in it for centuries.

Certainly it can make such rule. It is the center place for 1500 Million
Muslims who gather there every year for pilgrimage.

Before oil was discovered there, no Non Muslim was willing to go there
even if you pay them!!! Now after Oil is discovered every one is
making a bee line to it to get some easy money there.

Saudi Arabia asks every one to abide by its rules and culture for every
new comer. Unless they agree, they may not enter the country.
The case of Israel is totally different. It calls itself a 'Secular" country. It
has many many Non Jews as its "citizen" from the day it was created.

How could it discriminate and persecute a section of its own citizens?

Q. Eric (Messianic, 320)

And how did the number of Jews and Christians become very much less. You speak of those that
left after the death. What of those who were no longer in Arabia prior to the death

ANS

I told you most of Arabia was pagan during the time of our prophet.

Jews and Christians were scattered here and there. Christians had
their presence in more numbers in the region of Najran. They agreed
to pay Jizya and were allowed to stay there by the prophet.

But Caliph Omar acting on the death bed advice of prophet, asked
these people to migrate (giving them alternate land, safe passage and
all other facilities as I mentioned.)

Jews had there three tribes in Medina itself who were dealt with during
the life of prophet itself.

Jews which lived in Khaibar and one or two other settlements had paid
Jizya and were allowed to live there by prophet. They were also told to
migrate during Omar time (with the same concessions as given to
Christians).

That made Arabia free from any other religion. Individual jews and
Christians living here and there either accepted Islam or moved with
their fellow religionists.

All that happened 1400 years ago and not in recent past. But our
records show all these details.

You can compare the way Muslims treated other people and the way
they were treated by the same people.
Q. Eric (Messianic, 321)
To love all human beings
• Not to stand by idly when a human life is in danger
• Not to wrong any one in speech
• Not to carry tales.
• Not to cherish hatred in one's heart.
• Not to take revenge.
• Not to bear a grudge.
• Not to put any anyone to shame.
• Not to give occasion to the simple-minded to stumble on the road.
• To relieve a neighbor of his burden and help to unload his beast.
ANS

To you last post:

. To love all human beings

• Not to stand by idly when a human life is in danger
• Not to wrong any one in speech
• Not to carry tales.
• Not to cherish hatred in one's heart.
• Not to take revenge.
• Not to bear a grudge.
• Not to put any anyone to shame.
• Not to give occasion to the simple-minded to stumble on the road.
• To relieve a neighbor of his burden and help to unload his beast.

Yes we accept and try our level best to do each of the things you have
mentioned in your post.

Q. Maverick (Messianic, 322)

I personally do not have a problem with the majority of Muslims.

IMO a lot of them are trying to do what is right for their families, obey the commandments that
they believe they are to obey from the Quran, not hurt others, etc.

Of course there are extremists in every religion IMO. I do have a problem with folks harming
others whether it is physical, mental, etc regardless of gender, race, religious preference, etc. My
desire for all humans is to obey G-d and His Torah. I truly believe that this world would be better
place if that was the case.

ANS

I thank you for your post.

It may come as surprise to you, but that was the solution which was
proposed by Quran to Jews and Christians 1400 years back!!

Listen to this:

“O people of the Book (i.e. Jews and Christians), let us come to

common terms between you and us: (what are these terms)

- That we worship None but Allah (True God of Universe)

- That we associate no Partners with Him.

- That we not take from amongst ourselves Lords and Patrons other
than Him..” (3:64)

And at another place Quran says

“Say O people of Book (i.e. jews and Christians) you have no ground to
stand upon unless you stand fast by the Torah, the Gospel and all the
revelation that has come to you from your Lord…” (5:68)

And at another place Quran says:

“…Strive as in a race in all virtues…” (5:48)

You cannot find a better book that Quran for reconciliation and
peaceful co-existence!!

It is based on principles and not on intrigues, secret planning and day

to day politics.

Your post was one step in right direction and I thank you for that.

Q. Savior Self (Messianic , 320)

And I think both your knowledge of history and your own religion is pathetic. It is obvious that
you have never actually read the story written in your own ku-ran, but when Mohamed decided
that the Jews had betrayed him, he offered them the opportunity to choose their own judge. When
the choice of their judge was found unsatisfactory to him, he informed his subordinates to fetch
Sa'd b. Mu'adh, a judge that had already sworn loyalty to Muhammad…

ANS

First of all, I should correct your mistake. It is not mentioned in Quran

that Prophet offered Jews the choice of selecting their Judge!!

Show me the chapter and verse of Quran where it is mentioned!!

The story is mentioned in the book of Hadîth (i.e. sayings and actions
of prophet).

Jews asked that their fate should be left to the decision of an arbitrator.

It were Jews who selected Saad bib Mu’aadh. They selected him,
because he was their ally in the days prior to Islam. They thought that
hw will do some favor to them.
But what Saad did, was to implement on them the rule of their own
Bible!! Why should Jews complain if they are judged according to their
own book?

Or do you mean that when Jews deal with other people, they should
follow one law, but when it is their turn, they should be treated
differently?

Now you are trying to lessen the guilt of Bani Quraizah…. Whether
there was fighting with Makkan or not, s beside the point.

Their crime was that they broke their treaty unilaterally…when whole
Muslim army was engaged in the defense of Median against a Much
Larger army of enemies.

By their treachery they made the back of Muslims unsafe and their
forces were to be divided in tow directions.

The time was most critical for the safety of nascent state of Islam and
the treachery most dastardly.

If they would have treated in any other way, it would have given a very
wrong signal to enemies of Islam.

If you want to shed tears for the loss of BANI QURAIZAH, go thru the
books of Bible and see how Moses and Joshua did with people of fallen
nations.

Of all the Jews of Arabia only BANI QURAIZAH were punished like
that….there has to be some thing special in their crime and there
certainly was!!.

Just see USA killed 200,000 Japanese in Hiroshima and Nagasaki, to

save more lives!! Do you object.

USA have killed thousands of Iraqis and Afghani to capture Saddam

and Osama, do you object?

Your prophet Moses and Joshua killed close to half million people in
Palestine (according to your books), do you object?

But a few hundred criminal souls of BANI QURAIZAH have become your
basis of judging prophet hood of our prophet.

Why cant you give him the benefit of doubt? Why should you have a
separate standard for him and another for Jewish prophets?
Q. Savior Self (Messianic, 320)
hmmm... and yet according to the Banu Qurayza and Ibn Ishaq, there was never such a place as
Saudi Arabia, only a land that was called Yathrib that was made inhabitable by people that were
in turn slaughtered by the throat-cutting, woman-stoning apostates who lived there before the
civilized human folk arrived. Now what exactly is Saudi Arabia like nowadays? How many
women get stoned to death while animals scream "God is Great" as the crime is occurring?

ANS

I think your knowledge of History is very poor. I told in advance that

there was no Saudi Arabia then, the whole region was known as Arabia.

1. Yathrib was name for Medina, before the prophet flew to it, a small
city (by any means) that gave shelter to prophet and his companions
when the fled from the persecution of Makkan. Its majority population
was Arab, but it had three smaller Jewish tribes living there.

They were knows as BANI QAINUQAH, BANI NADHEER AND BANI

QURAIZAH. The prophet made treaty with them to live in peace and
harmony and fixed duties and responsibilities on each side.

True to their nature, Jews broke their treaty one after the other. The
first two tribes were only punished with their banishment from Medina.

2. But the third tribe, BANU QURIAZAH, broke their treaty and wanted
to attack Muslims from behind, when All Muslims were defending their
small city from hosts of Entire Arabia that had laid siege to that city in
5 AH.

That treachery was too serious and punishable by any code on

conduct. Many cities and nations have been exterminated on much
smaller reasons.

But prophet agreed to abide by the decision of arbitrator, chosen by

Jew. His decision was implemented by the prophet and it was none
other than mentioned in the Book of Deuteronomy Chapter 20! Jews
were judged as per their own scripture and they have nothing to
complain of!!

But if you only look at the punishment and forget the crime and the
circumstances, then you can reach any decision. In the same way we
can say that Americans killed 200000 Japanese in Hiroshima and
another 200000 in Nagasaki. And US soldiers killed hundreds of
thousands in Iraq and Afghanistan.
3. Saudi Arabia is fine and still the safest place on this earth. Any
adulterer (male or female), provided the charges are proven by four
eye witnesses, are lashed with hundred stripes.

However if any party is already married (irrespective if it be male or

female), the punishment is stoning to death.

Thanks to that Saudi Arabia is so safe, I would suggest that you also
adopt the same law, if you want to eradicate crimes against woman
from your society.

But with more than 50 % of its population born out of wedlock, I doubt
if this solution will appeal to you.

Q. Savior Self (Messianic, 321)

said the Quran states Allah's wind turned the invaders back, I did'nt say that the Quran stated the
full story of Quray'za. If you wish to mix and match hadith versus quran to your liking and trash
everything you dislike about the hadith versus the quran, you should throw in the thighing of
Ayisha, which is gospel amongst your kind when appropriate, as the slaughter is. Now just so I
am clear on your assertation here, …
ANS

I think your needle is stuck with BANI QURAIZAH and you want to
derive your own results from it…

So I will try once again to put the whole case in front of you, with all its
perspectives and leave you to draw your own conclusion. If you are
not satisfied, then I will leave you to your conclusion and this will be
my final post on this episode.

1. Why BANI QURAIZAH were treated differently?

a. First thing, which you must keep in mind, is that our prophet had
many fights, and battles with Pagans, Jewish tribes, and Christians
during his ten year of struggle.

b. In none of these battles, wars and fights we find a single example

that matches with BANI QURAIZAH, so there must be some thing there,
which was not with others.

c. There have been many fighters and warriors in human history who
are known for their brutality, cruelty and blood shed and massacres of
the fallen nations.. Genghis Khan, Halagu Khan, Alexander the Great
are many such warriors. So if we hear that they murdered all people of
a city, or made every one slave, or committed any other such acts, we
treat them as normal.
d. Why our prophet, who was always forgiving his opponents, Who was
never known for brutality or general massacre, total number of whose
casualties do not even reach 1,000 (on both side) implemented such
harsh penalty on BANI QURAIZAH, so there must be some special
reason.

2. Circumstances make Crimes Special.

a. People say that BANI QURAIZAH were guilty of breaking their treaty
with prophet, this was not a crime to be punished like this.

b. They fail to realize that circumstances make crime special in many

cases.

2A. A Hypothetical Example:

a. I give you a hypothetical example, USA and Canada have peace and
friendship treaty and US- Canadian Border is very safe and peaceful.
No US army is stationed along it.

b. Suppose Canada breaks its peace treaty with USA in normal

situations, when there is no outside danger to US security, this action
will be taken lightly by US and its population. They will try to negotiate
and reason it out with them, in extreme case, they may put some army
at strategic locations.

c. But suppose USA is under attack by combined forces of USSR, China,

India and most of Europe. There are army ships all along its long
coasts. All of US army and most of its male population is posted along,
its west, east and southern coasts. Most of its females, children and
old people are stationed near its northern border along Canada as the
safest place.

d. In this mortal danger, when every member of US army and its male
population is busy on borders, suppose Canada breaks the peace
treaty and threatens to attack from North side and endanger Female,
Children and old people of USA, what will be reaction of US people?

e. Even if the outside siege ends with no actual warfare and outsiders
are repulsed without a single casualty, will US treat the treachery of
Canada as normal and will let bygones be bygones?

3. Special Situation of Muslim Nation during War of Trench:

a. Similar situation existed in Medina during the Trench war.

b. Medina which was not a very big town, was under siege from a much
larger army of its opponents.

c. Muslims had dug a Trench around Medina (first time in Arabian

History) and ALL of its males were busy round the clock in protecting it.

d. It was the time of extreme danger for Muslim nation. Quran which is
always economical in its words, describes the situation like this:

“Behold! They (enemy) came to you from above you and from below
you, and behold the eyes became dim and the hearts gaped up to the
throats, and you imagined various (vain) thoughts about Allah. In that
situation were the believers tried: they were shaken as by a
tremendous shaking ( 23-10, 11)

Such long passage from Quran paints the actual picture better than
any one else. (Contd.)

e. In that situation, BANI QURAIZAH broke their treaty unilaterally

(without slightest provocation from Muslims) and threatened Muslim
armies from rear, where women and children were stationed.

f. If that crime was ordinary in your view then I do not want to

comment any thing on it. Whether there was actual fighting with
Pagans is also not here or there. It was a very serious treachery and it
deserved exemplary punishment.

4. Jews themselves asked Saad Bib Mua’d as Arbitrator:

a. When Muslim armies laid a siege to BANI QURAIZAH and they

surrendered after ten or fifteen days, it were Jews who proposed that
they will abide by the decision of the Arbitrator.

b. It were Jews who suggested the name of Arbitrator and so they

should not complain about his decision.

c. I think that, even in that situation, if Jews would have entrusted

their fate to the Mercy and Compassion of prophet, the results might
have been different. It was their fate which confounded them.

5. Was the Decision really Hard and Cruel?

a. This is the crux of the matter. In our modern days we may talk what
we want, but in those days, people stood by their own books, their own
scriptures.
b. So let us see, what Jews own scriptures say about situations like this.

c. We read in Deut. Chapter 7 Verses 16: 26

“So destroy all the people which Yahweh your God will put in your
power. Do not have pity on them or serve their gods….do not be afraid
of them because Yahweh your God is your midst. He is a great and
terrible God…. Yahweh will give their kings in your hand so that you
may strike out their name from under heaven and nothing will stand
before you until you have destroyed them….”

d. And we see more instruction in Deut. Ch 20 V 1: 19, some of which I

will record:

“When you draw near a city to lay siege to it, you shall first offer
peace. If it accepts your proposal and opens the gates to you, all the
people found in it shall become your slaves and serve you” (10:11)

“If they do not accept the peace that you offer them and declare war
against you, you shall lay siege to the city. And when Yahweh your God
gives it into your hands, you shall kill by sword all the men, but the
women and children the livestock and all the other things which you
find there shall be your booty..” (12:14)

“But in the cities which Yahweh gives you as inheritance, you shall not
leave anything that lives. You must destroy them all according to laws
of Anathema , The Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzets, Hivites and
Jebusites as Yahweh your God has commanded you (16:18)

5. What was Arbitrators decision on BANI QURAIZAH?

a. It is very clear that their case exactly matches with the situation as
mentioned in Deut. Ch 20 Verse 12:14. And that was what they
received.

b. So the arbitrator’s decision was neither cruel, nor exemplary and it

was according to Jews own scripture. That is why prophet said (in one
saying) “Saad has decided as per the Book of God..”

6. Jews have no ground to complain:

a. From the above it is clear, that Jews have no ground to complain

against the decision because it is mentioned in their own book.

b. Their only complain could be that this punishment is for others and
not for us. We should be treated differently than other people.

c. We should have a different law when we are victorious and different

law when we are defeated.

d. I have no comment to make on this plea.

So this, my dear, is the whole story of BANI QURAIZAH and what they
got as the result of their treachery.

If you do not like it, then you are entitled to your opinion.

I am sorry if my post became a bit large; I wanted to clear this matter

for once and all.

Q. Savior Self (Messianic, 323)

that's an interesting question. Who is the hypocrite, you with your potentates and their harems of
women, or us, who view sexuality as a private matter and consider it vulgar and classless to
discuss such things, much less actually kill people over private matters that are between
themselves, their spouses, and God? I think it's you.
ANS

It was very interesting for you to say that “we view sexuality as a
private matter and consider it vulgar to discuss such things…..”!!

With your films, music, dance clubs, strip tease joints, Live shown,
Pornography and Display of naked or Semi Naked woman body on
every product…… it is OK for you to say that we consider sexuality as a
Private matter and consider it vulgar to discuss it openly!!

Perhaps by Private you mean Open Spaces ?

And you accuse us of Hypocrisy? Or you got your logic reversed? As

usual!!

Q. Messianic (Savior Self, 326)

Your lies and spin get very boring, I don't know if it's just the way you've been taught to think
(i.e. nothing is ever wrong in the Muslim world and everything is just America and the west's
fault) or if you truly believe this garbage. But here are the FACTS. Fact 1. The storyu about the
woman being lashed was broken by Al-Jazeera. Not Fox news, not Cnn, not the New York
Times, not BBC. Al-Jazeera. … We are not perfect, not by a long shot, and we're never going to
be. Guess how many gang-rape victims in America have EVER been sentenced to being publicly
lashed though? ZERO.
ANS
Who told you that Al Jazeera news channel is as pure as snow? And
each story and every story it broadcasts are nothing but pure truth?

But the story was picked up by Western Media as a “proof” of Islamic

Injustice and used extensively.

In Islamic justice system, confession before judge is acceptable

evidence and can be punished.

A. The girl “confessed” to having an illicit relation ship with man and
going to a secluded place to meet him. She received 200 lashes for
both charges.

B. However her “confession” is not binding on the other party and he

cannot be punished, unless she provides corroborative evidence, which
she failed to provide.

c. In the same way, the Girl could not provide any proof or witness for
abduction and rape. Otherwise all the boys involved would have faced
capital punishment. They were only convicted for what was proved
thru “admission and evidence” that they met that girl at a secluded
spot, so each of them was given punishment according to that crime.

d. The western media projected the girl as “martyr” to Islamic Criminal

system and made all that din.

e. I call to your account, once more the case of O.J. Simpson. He was
not guilty of the crime…then who killed those two persons? Was there
not any miscarriage of justice there?

Q. (Should, 1563)

ANS

Now the "Learned Lady" with "Foul Mouth" has published the List!!
(Despite my BEGGING not to do so!!!).

I wonder that she understands a word of Arabic!! To substantiate these

charges!!!

She would only refer to some Translations done by Muslims and Non
Muslims.

Every one knows that Translations are only the efforts and
understanding of the person who is translating them.
They cannot take replace actual text.

If some commentator took, one meaning for a particular Arabic word,

that will not become Dogma!!

Arabic words used in Quran have so many hue of meaning. Some

particular meaning have been taken by some translator at some
particular time.

However when our knowledge progressed, we found that , the old hue
was not correct, so another interpretation is needed.

It is the fault of translators and not of God Almighty, whose knowledge

is perfect and free from all defects.

Q. Chimney (Should, 1486)

False.

Different scientists, peers, and BTOE followers have different views as to whether there is a plan,
design, or creator. As many have pointed out to you 1000s of times. Are you really this stupid?

Another potentially good brain, obviously destroyed by Islamic brainwashing. No wonder only 2
Nobel prizes ever in science, and those two Muslims were working in the West! It is apparent
why, to everyone but you - you are merely a showcase for the reason why!

Riddle? Proteins are simply long chains of amino acids and can form from non-biological
precursors.

ANS

1. “Someone” is trying to educate me about these protein molecules,

saying that these are just a long string of Amino acids and nothing
else!!

Does he want to say that any combination of Amino Acids becomes a

protein? If that was the case, then there was no problem…

but the problem is that not every combination of Amino Acids is a

protein….they have to be certain specific combinations of certain
specific polarity!! Out of Billions upon Billions of such possible
combinations, only a few thousands are only correct and rest have to
be discarded.
That was not possible by mere permutation and combination… he tries
to override this difficulty by saying over millions of years…as if the
millions of years are a helping factor!!

Any thing done idly over millions or billions of years would only add to
the confusion and would make the choice difficult

2. As to his comment that opinion is divided between “peers, Scientists

and BTOE followers” that if indeed there is a Purpose, Design or
Creator behind all this….speaks more than these words can convey.

3. It means that you can go on believing in what you want, so long as

you do not contradict us and allow us to lead the way..

4. The success of your life will not be calculated as to how many Nobel
Prize you have won….. no one can even say that all these Nobel Prize
Winners were really successful and fulfilled the mission of their lives.
Their answer book is in the hands of their Creator and He will decide if
they deserve any prize or not.

5. Nobel Prize and all such prizes are only recognition by humans that
they did some thing remarkable in their lives. The standard by which
God judges and by which humans judge are different from ach other.

6. I want to pose one question to such type of people.

Who is successful in this life, A CEO of a Multinational Company or a

mere Janitor who sweeps the floor of the same Multinational Company?
Please reply with justification. (this is not a Multiple Choice type of
question)

Q. Chimney (Should, 1491)

There was indeed a golden age for Islamic civilisation.

But consider your correct comment that "Muslims should not live in past". It is the past you want
to take them to! The Golden Age of your culture was famously shut down when clerics decided
enough was known and "closed the doors of enquiry".

The Golden Age was NOT a period of close following of Sharia and Koran, but a loose period.
Knowledge flowed in from all corners from the conquests and was reformulated and improved.
But by whom?

ANS

Now “Somebody” is trying to teach me about “Golden age of Islam”.

The Golden age of Islam was when the Prophet was alive and leading
the Muslims….then the Silver age came when his Companions were
leading the Islamic nation…..then the Bronze age came when those
who followed companions ruled the Islamic Nation.

That was the period when Islam was the Growing at the fastest pace
seen in human history!!

After these ages came the “Iron, copper, Tin and Nickel” ages when
Muslims took to consolidate and care about the pleasure of this earth.

You call Civilization as beautiful buildings, gardens and flowers,

fountains and hot baths…..these were not the standards by which
Islamic Civilization is measured.

But even in those frivolities Muslims excelled and fared far better than
those nations who came before them.

But too much indulgence in the pleasures of this world…take them

away from the “hard path” of being a warrior nation and keep the task
of propagating Islam to all human population.

That was the point from which decline of Islamic Civilization started….
And they can not re-kindle it by just copying the West in every thing.

You cannot be Leader in any field, if you just follow some one. If
Muslims want to rise again, they will have to start from the beginning
once again.

Islam is not a “religion” in the western sense of the word. It is a way of

life, it is a state of belief. If you are not true to it, then you are a
hypocrite and no hypocrite person or nation or civilization ever reached
to the top of world.

Q. Chimney (Should, 1516)

Why Should God insist that humans Worship Him? What benefits He shall get?

ANS

Now “Someone” has commented that why God wants humans to

worship Him, what benefit shall God get out of it?
This seems to be a very good question and is a common
misunderstanding about religion, prayers and acts of ritualistic worship
prescribed in revealed religion.

A. What would God benefit:

1. Some people think that God wants an army of “dedicated salves”

types of persons, who shall always pray before Him and continue
singing His praises, so that Stature of God may rise in the world!!

2. They fail to realize that God is no need to for human efforts to

increase His status….. He is already far above these “petty needs” and
He is no need for such Help.

3. The worship and praise for God is for the benefit of humans
themselves, and not that God would derive something out of it.

A. Worship:

1. Then there is a misconception about the act of worship itself.

Worship is not the name of some rituals that people do at some
appointed times.

2. The real meaning of worship is to make proper use of any thing for
its appointed use.

3. For example, the Sun, The Moon and all the stars etc. are
worshipping their Creator all the time. They cannot have any authority
to change their appointed duties and the orbits fixed for the,

4. In the same way, every tree, and every living thing in this Universe
is worshipping their Creator.

5. In human body itself, our nervous system, our digestive system, our
respiratory system, our eyes and our ears …. All are doing their
appointed tasks. They do exactly as have been “programmed” by
their wise and merciful Creator.

6. It is only in thoughts and actions that humans have been given

some sort of freedom. If they use that also for their appointed work,
they too would be worshipping their Creator.

7. That is why God says in Quran, that “We have Created Humans and
Jinns for (no other purposes than) worship”. The worship here is in its
broadest sense, that is to use our thoughts and our actions and our
lives in accordance with the God’ wish.
8. By doing that, we will pass the test, which our present life is.

9. Already more than 99% of our body is “Muslims” (we like it or not!!),
let us make the remaining 1% also a Muslim by willfully submitting
ourselves.

Q. Chimney (Should, 1536,)

What is beauty of Quran?

ANS

The beauty of Quran is that it is fully preserved in its Original Arabic

Language.

We can always refer to original Arabic Literature when there is any

dispute as regards to the meaning of a particular Arabic Word.

The translation by any Scholar are based on their own understandings

of a particular Arabic Word.

It is not unfamiliar to have many translations of the same Arabic Word

from different translators.

The Original Arabic words used in Quran have many shades of

meanings, so a particular shade once thought to be "very scientific" at
some age, looses its authenticity with the passage of time and another
shade proves to be more correct with the advancement of Modern
Science.

That is why Quran and its words are same for past 1400 years, how
many twists and turns every branch of science has taken in these 1400
years is known to every one.

Yet the Quran was as "scientific" 1400 years ago as it is now and as it
will be 1000 years from now on!!

That is the beauty of Original Revelation of God!!!

The Arabic Word used in Quran for creation of mankind is NUTFAH....

which people have translated as sperm or fluid or other shades.

But NUTFAH in Arabic also means a very small portion of any liquid, a
last drop from a vessel full of water.... So Nutfah can also mean a very
small portion of the sperm which is ejaculated.... and it perfectly
matches with the Modern Science!!!

How funny it feels when people who do not know a word of Arabic start
comparing Abdullah Yusuf Ali's Translation and Pikthal's translation etc.

We do not consider that any of the translator of Quran is infallible. We

have no Dogma about any other translation.

That is why Quran has to be the guidance for humanity till the end of
world. It will never become obsolete, it will never become impractical.
It will never have any teaching that will be against human nature or
harmful to human society.

It is indeed a Mercy from Lord God, the Creator and sustainer of this
Universe!!

Q. Chimney (Should, 1562)

Marriage with Aiyesha

ANS

Now let me make one more final attempt to sort out this age problem.

There is a nature’s way to announce when a man has become adult

and when a women has become adult.

In the case of men it is the growth of under navel airs or starting of wet
dreams and in the case of women it is starting of her monthly period.

These are nature’s signs and it would be best for us not to sit with
calendar and decide on our own ideas.

Then the culture of each society is different. In many societies it is the

custom to marry boy and girl as soon they reach the age of marriage.

In one saying, prophet also has recommended early marriage for boys
and girls and it saves them from many problems and complications.

Now the question is when does the girl actually starts her period…. It is
the subject for medical doctors…. But I have definitely seen in papers
school girls getting pregnant at ages 11 or 12 (the “Modern” schools
do provide “opportunities and means” for student to get such relations
at that early age, so it is not surprising).

When we consider the marriage of Lady Aiyesha to our prophet, there

are all signs for her to each the age of marriage.

She was daughter of his best friend, her father willfully agreed to the
marriage…..there was no scandal or murmuring by any one…even his
bitter critics to this marriage. There is not an iota of proof that any one
objected to this marriage.

There was lot of scandal, when prophet married the wife of his adopted
son…. How could enemies of prophet would have kept quiet of this
“god send” opportunity to tarnish his character.

And the best sign is three years gap between marriage and its
consummation. If her father was ready to marry his daughter at such
an early age….why did he wait for three years to send her with
prophet? The best explanation that suits is that the delay was for Lady
Aiyesha to reach her woman hood. A woman reaching the age of
puberty in hot climate of Arabia is not such a “miracle” of God!!

Now the only objection remains is that why did prophet married an
woman immediately when she had reached the age of marriage?

But that act was not a crime or any thing for which we start pasting our
own designated title of his personality.

This is my last attempt to look at things without bias and without

prejudice. How for it goes down the throats of these BTOE followers is
to be seen.

Q. Chimney (Should, 1563)

Did prophet like Child marriage

ANS

Now the “learned Lady with Foul Mouth” and her “Blind BTOE”
supporters “Both” claim that “pedophile” is an honorable title
amongst Muslims because of the actions of their prophet.

Now let us analyze “objectively and without bias” the married life of
our prophet and determine if this charge is true:

1. The first wife of our prophet was KHADIJA daughter of KHUWAILID, A

TWICE WIDOW WITH ISSUES from earlier marriages. Prophet was 25
years old and she was 40 years of age.

They lived happily for 25 years and prophet had many issues with her.
His first wife died when prophet was 50 years old (and his mission of
prophet hood was 10 years in the offing).

2. The second wife of prophet WAS SAUDAH daughter OF ZAM’AH , A

WIDOW WITH ISSUE. she remained with prophet till his death. She dies
in year 54 Ah

3. The third wife of prophet was AIYESHA, A VIRGIN, daughter of his

best friend Abu Baker. The marriage was contracted in Makkah but
consummated in Medina, after a three year wait (so that she could
attain the age of puberty). She remained with prophet till his death
and lived almost 47 years after his death.

4. The forth wife of prophet was HAFSA , A CHILDLESS WIDOW. She

was daughter of Omar another of his best friend and staunch
supporter. She remained with prophet till his death. She died in 45 AH

5. Fifth wife of prophet was UMME SALMAH, A WIDOW WITH ISSUES.

She also remained with prophet till his death . She died in 61 AH and
was the last of all wives to die.

6. Sixth wife of prophet was ZAINAB daughter OF KHAZIMA, A

CHILDLESS WIDOW. She dies within three months of marriage and was
buried in Medina.

7. Seventh wife of prophet was ZAINAB daughter OF JAHSH, A

CHILDLESS WIDOW. She was with prophet till his death. She died in 20
AH and she was the first of his wives to die in Medina.

8. Eighth wife of prophet was UMME HABIBAH. A WIDOW WITH ISSUE.

She was the daughter of Abu SUFIAN, Makkah leader and staunch
enemy of Prophet. She was in Abyssinia as an immigrant at that time.
She also remained with prophet till his death. She died in 44 AH

9. Ninth wife of prophet was JUWAIRIYAH daughter of HARITH,

CHILDLESS WIDOW and slave girl. She was daughter of a clan chief
and was captured during a war. Prophet set her free and married her.
Because of this marriage all slaves from her tribe were set free by
Muslims. She died in 50 AH

10. Tenth wife of prophet was MAIMUNAH daughter of HARITH , A

CHILDLESS WIDOW. She also remained with prophet till his death. She
died in 51 AH

11. Eleventh wife of prophet was SAFIA daughter of HUUE. A

CHILDLESS WIDOW. She was Jewess and daughter of head of a clan.
She was captured during a war with Jews. She accepted Islam, Prophet
set her free and married her. She died in 50 AH (contd.)

12 There was one girl MARIYA of Egypt, a slave girl whish was sent as a
Gift to Prophet by the Ruler of Egypt. Prophet had a son named
Ibrahim with her. He died 16 - 18 months after birth

The day he died, there came a solar eclipse, people started saying that
it is because of prophet’s son’s death. Even the sun is mourning.
When prophet heard it, he went to pulpit and said “O People, Solar and
Lunar Eclipse are two signs of Allah. They do not occur because of
birth or death of any one” (A most “scientific” statement to make 1400
years ago. Who made him say it? If he was an imposter or crazy, why
did he miss this “golden” opportunity to show off?)

a. This is the list of all of prophets’ wives. He had eleven wives in all
and he had nine at one time living with him. For most of his married
life, he had only one wife ,one who was twice widow and had two
issues from her last two marriages.

b. Then Out of 11, 10 of his wives were widows and at least 4 had
issues with previous marriages. 4 were Widows without any issue and
two were slave girls whom prophet set free and took them as wives.

c. That lives only 1 a virgin and the girl in question.

d. When we see that AIYESHA was treated just like any other wife, she
had similar accommodation, same provision for household expenses
and prophet used to visit her sequentially as other wives, how can we
say that prophet had special tendency towards children to justify the
title given by “Learned lady and seconded by her BTOE follower”.

e. Prophet married eight more women after Aiyesha, and guess what?
ALL of them were divorcee or widowed and many were with issues.
Had there suddenly became shortage of none years old in Arabia or
people were shielding their nine years old girls from Prophet?

f.. We should decide on the basis of majority. Considering the

available evidences The marriage with Aiyesha was only an exception.

g. Any title which can be found worthy on the basis of evidence is that
“Prophet liked Widows for marriage. Whether they had issues or no
did not matter much”.

h. It can be shown that, In fact most of his marriages were political and
social in nature rather than because of sexual lust.
This should be the conclusion of every one who has free mind and no
bias.

But do these BTOE followers have this quality? Apparently they have
only their “Concise Oxford Dictionary” under their arms and rabid hate
for any thing to de with religions and religious personalities in their
heart!! (specially where Islam and Muslims are concerned)

And unfortunately these are the fellows who control these threads and
do the work of prosecution, jury, judge and executioner at the same
time!!

How can one get justice and unbiased trail at the hands of these
fellows?
Chpater-4 Islam-1 (Topics related to Islam, Quran, Prophet and others)

Q. Chimney (Should, 1577)

Are great philosophers “Paper Tigers”?

ANS

Some people have taken exception of my calling these "great

Philosophers" like Hume, Locke, Marx etc as 'Paper Tigers"....

Perhaps these people do not understand what a "Paper tiger" is?

None of these people were men of action themselves....they proposed

some theories with "others" put into practice....some times decades or
centuries after their demise.

Prophets of God on the other hand were not 'Paper tigers". They put
into actions what they preached.

They gathered people around then, influenced the society in which

they were living and left "Human models" for guidance.

I know it may hurt some people to compare their “heroes” with paper
tigers and Drawing room philosophers…..but I see that they are equally
insensitive to hurt feelings of “others” and have no regard for their
heroes.

What words I have used are at least Civil and not abusive nor in
appropriate.

Q. Chimney (Should, 1578)

ANS

Yes Sir, you are very Right!!

That is the basic difference between a Prophet and a Philosopher!!

Prophet KNOWS that he is right!! He has that connection with the Lord
and Creator of Universe!!

While the Philosopher starts with doubts and ends with doubts. They
are never SURE of their hypothesis and that is why they DO NOT put
that into practice.
Prophets are not mere theorists.... they are people of action....

(If some one refers to some of the "minor prophets" mentioned in

Bible, then let me say that we do not have their full life histories before
us).

Prophets come for the guidance of people and their system always
help the society they are living in.

Philosophers have mixed results....

Some like Karl Mark gave a philosophy which was against human
nature and when put into practice...caused untold suffering to
humanity and was thrown away....but at what cost?

How many human lives were lost in that EXPERIMENT?

Then there were Philosophers as Action Boys!! Like Hitler and

Mussolini....they also theorized some thing and then put that also in
practice!!

We all know how much humanity suffered at the hands of these men of
actions!! and got rid of them after loss of how many human lives.

In short there can be no comparison between a Prophet ( people with

correct source of knowledge) and Philosophers (with doubtful source of
knowledge).

Are we ready to take chance and tie our destiny with something or
some one who is not sure of his own proposed theories?

Q. Chimney (Should, 1580)

Between your moderate words, you sometimes forget yourself and it reveals a lot.

At times you have made comments against Jews that run far deeper than the Palestinian debate.

Then there is this pearl: "Extremism is the second nature of White people in general"

Tell that to the 50 million victims of Chinese extremism under Mao, or the 800,000 slaughtered
with machetes and clubs in Rwanda by Black people, or your own civilization’s excesses in the
past such as the mass slaughter of the Hindu Kush. That is just to name a few "extreme"
behaviors.

Its an absurd statement. Extremism appears at any time in any group - it is the second nature of
all people under the right circumstances, not "white people".
Right now, today in 2010, extremism is the specialty of extreme followers of your religion, more
than any other group in the world. ..

ANS

Now “someone” has taken exception to my posts and say that my

claim of being a “Moderate” is only skin deep and inside I am a hate
monger and hate preacher.

He has also quoted certain “excerpts” from my posts to prove his

point.

If I want, I can also take certain “lines” from HIS POSTS and “prove”
that is as biased and as hate monger as myself or any one else.

General tone of my post is always moderate and I clarify many times

that I am not against a particular race or particular community, my
criticisms are for people who wrong us.

I never justified Terrorism, but I do not consider that one type of

Terrorism should be allowed and the other type should be denounced.

In my definition of Terrorism it is “shedding of Innocent blood

knowingly”…..done by Muslim, Non Muslim, Jew , US army, Israeli Army
or any one…. I do not differentiate.

Our correspondents on the other hand, have dual standards…no one

will say that “Iraq war was an act of Terrorism” …or ‘Taliban were
unjustifiably linked with 9/11 events” so this Whole War on Terror is
nothing but a Terrorism of Higher Order.

You cannot fight Terrorism with Terrorism of your own…one Wrong

cannot be set right with a Higher Wrong.

That is what our religion teaches us and that is what I stand for.

Now let me pick up “gems” from his posts to show how “moderate and
unbiased” he has been in his posts.

A. “History is often written in Blood, its true, and your favorite prophet
was no worse than others at the time or since.”

1. Does he know that total loss of human lives (on both side) during
ten year of warfare by our prophet do not even reach 1,000!!
2. Is that you mean by writing history in Blood?

3. Have you looked at the results what this loss of 1,000 lives
achieved?

4. Is there any comparable example in whole world’s history that any

one achieved such spectacular and permanent result with so less loss
of human lives?

5. Compare that with 10 years of “War on terror” going on in Iraq and

Afghanistan. How many lives have been lost and what are the results?

6. Who was more “peaceful and humane” is his warfare’s? Our

prophet or yours GWB the Great and his cronies?

B. “And right there in the Quran, references to Jews as "the sons of

apes and pigs".”

1. This is an INVENTION from Quran!!

2. Quran never calls Jews as “Sons of apes and pigs”….let me quote

the Quranic verse and then see the “caliber” of our correspondent:

“ Say: O people of book! Do you disapprove of us for no other reason

that we believe in Allah and the revelation that has come to us and
that which came before us…

Say: shall I point out to you something much worse than this, (as
judged) by the treatment it received from Allah? Those who incurred
the Curse of Allah and His Wrath, those of whom some He transformed
into apes and swine, those who worshipped Evil, these are many times
worse in rank and far more astray from the even path” (5:59-60)

3. Here Quran mentions that Some of the jews were Cursed by God,
some were tuned into Apes and Swine…

4. Where does it say that jews and children of Ape and Swine?

5. Then our BTOE writer goes into his BTOE Trans and starts explaining
link between humans and Ape and Swine!!

C. “…Senior Egyptian Cleric, who says every last Jew shall be

murdered, they should be found and killed "whatever rock they hide
behind"
1. Looks very Horrible, does it not? Full on Anti Semitism Venom, is it
not? A Senior Egyptian Muslim Clergy calling for killing Each and Every
Jew….Total Extermination of Jewish Race….the guy must be a Bigger
jew hater than even Hitler….

2. But Relax!! The clergy is talking about what will happen when Jesus
returns in his second coming!!

3. During that time, there will rise a Great Deceiver (called Anti Christ
in Christian literature and DAJJAL in Islamic literature)…..that will be a
great time of tribulation, mischief and misery for believers.

4. Majority of followers of that Anti Christ shall be Jews….when jesus

shall come back on the earth (as a Muslim)…he will fight with Muslims
and he will kill Anti Christ and then in the ensuing fight, Jews would be
exterminated as a race. No one will be left alive.

5. You may call it gruesome….but it refers to a future event!! A

prophesy …. By the way, if you feel horrified at the amount of blood
shed…then just read the book of Revelation (last book of Bible and
what it says about the blood shed then). When we talk about MAD
(Mutual Assured Destruction)…what we really mean?

6. So you see, how he has twisted the words of “Senior Egyptian

Clergy” to refer to our age and to Jews of our time…. If Muslims were
so much Jew hater…then why so many jews were living in Muslim
country when there was no israel?

7. These jews were taking refuge in Islamic countries to flee the

persecution they had from European Christians. They were given
protection by Muslims (and now they are paying that back with
interest!!).

8 Spanish Christians did not leave a Single Muslim when they took that
country from Muslims…..why Muslims did not do the same thing to
Jews? Who was holding their hand? I say the “Moderate” teachings of
Islam!!

9. Now coming to the question, why the hate of Muslims at that time
will boil over to not leave a Single Jew alive….. well you look at the
“treatment” which Palestinian Muslims are getting at the hands of Jews
in Palestine…..is it causing feelings of love and brotherhood between
them….if the same thing continues (or worse)….till the time jesus
comes back….can you understand the pent up anger in Muslim’s
heart?
10. Have you seen how much the loss of WTC Towers and Four Planes
and 2500 Lives…inflamed the “passion” in hearts of War Mongers in
USA….despite loss of more than 1 million lives….they still feel that
they have not avenged their losses!!
11. And These are the fellows who want to teach us meaning of
“peaceful living”, “Moderation” and “Brotherly Love”

Q. Christopher (Should, 1580)

Hey MUQ, when is Islam going to actually start acting like the 'Religion of Peace' the keep
claiming to be? The rest of the world has been waiting for over a thousand years for them to start
doing this.

wasn't complimenting Islam MUQ. With Europe's descent into feudal semi-barbarity, and the
Chinese squabbling amongst themselves, the placeholder for 'Pinnacle of Human Civilization' fell
to the Caliphate pretty much by default. The point I was making though, is 'what have they done
since then?' The answer is... nothing. The muslim world has been pining over and wailing about
the demise of their golden age (which ended when the Mongols sacked Baghdad), but have made
no effort in nearly 800 years towards getting back to that level. Instead, they have been
reluctantly riding on the coattails of Europe, being dragged into the modern era with their heels
dug in all the way.

ANS

I KNOW that you were not complimenting Islam….Pinnacle of

Civilization….it just slipped from your pen!!

Now you have given a clarification for that….it was because other’s
failed…so there was no one to take pole position except Barbaric Islam

So here goes your “Impartiality and Scholarship”

Anything “good” or “great” about Islam has to be on the cost of others

failures to deliver the good.

If I ask you what have been Europe’s Contribution in the Growth of

Human Civilization for the first 5000 years of human race…what will be
your answer?

The European Civilization and the things you boast of are not more
than 200 to 250 years old.

If you want to accuse Muslims of not doing any thing and sitting idle….I
am with you….

But when you take attack to Islam and accuse that present condition of
Muslims is due to islam and Islam is responsible for this condition, that
is where I take exception.
There is not a single teaching in islam, which asks Muslims to sit idle
and do nothing and do not participate in Learning and Growth of
Science and Technology.

But what is wants to emphasize is that “there is more to life than the
wealth and pleasures of this world”…. You seek pleasures of this
world….but do not forget your real duty and your aim and that is “Your
duty towards your Creator”.

During the rise of Islamic Civilization….that issue was at the top….but

the Present Atheistic and Materialistic Society has totally forgotten its
duty towards its Creator.

The rise in Science, Technology and Knowledge has not brought joys
and enjoyment to Human race….in fact it has brought more and more
cases of Depression, Mental Tension to people.

The cases of Mental Sickness, Depression, Suicide, Drug Addiction, Non

Natural Sex, Brutality, Rapes and crimes against women and
children….every thing is on the rise.

What is the SOLUTION for these sicknesses from the Atheist

Philosophers?

When we want to discuss these problems which are inherent in any

society that breaks its link with its Creator….you just gloss over and
instead of providing a solution…start criticizing Muslims for being idle,
backward in science and technology?

How you measure happiness in human society? What are symptoms of

a happy society and a non happy society?

Q. Christopher (Should, 1581)

To MUQ
Let's see if I can deal with your rant point for point. I did not include a copy of your rant as it ran
me over the character limit for entries.

Seeing as our species didn't leave Africa for the 130,000 years after they evolved, Europe wasn't
even involved in their first 5,000 years on this planet.
European Civilization is closer to 4000 years old if you date it back to the earliest stirrings of
civilization in Greece, maybe triple that if you start with the earliest identifiable villages. That
makes it of comparable age to anything found in the Middle East.
Again you missed my point, Islamic Culture was progressing rapidly prior to the Mongol
invasions of the 13th century. What have they done since then? Nothing except pine away
ANS

A. What European Did since the dawn of Human Civilization:

If you compare the contribution of Europe who are now leading the
world “Western Europe”, then you are right that their civilization is not
more that 500 years old.

And in that 500 years old, for first 250 years, there was no way in
which you can say that they were any way far ahead of Muslim
Civilization.

B. Muslims did nothing but felt sorry for Mongol Invasion?

I am not aware that Muslims always felt sorry for Mongol invasion and
did nothing. How it can be when within a century after Mongol
invasion, most of them came into Islam themselves!!

In same way Britain can weep about their loss of World’s Top Most
nation due to WW-1 and WW-2, but it will not change the reality.

These incidents do happen in the history of nations and civilization and

people move ahead.

C: Comparison of Muslim Versus European Position in Science and

Technology right upto 17 or 18th Century

You can see the monuments built in Muslim countries in 15-17th

Century (In India Taj Mahal, Agra’s Fort and Mosques and palaces in
many other Muslim countries) and compare it with monuments and
palaces built in Europe in those period, you will not see any much
advancement in European buildings.

In Water Power and Wind Powered Machines, you cannot say that
Muslim nations lagged any where behind European nations.

It was only the invention of Steam Power, that made a major shift in
this balance and from that time, Muslim nations always lagged behind
and then slowly most of them came under European dominance.

D. Believe in God and hereafter is Scape Goat

Believe in God and hereafter is not Scape Goat by any means. It has
been an integral part of Muslim beliefs and Islamic Civilization, when
Muslims were “at the Pinnacle of Human Civilization for 1000 years or
so”.

These tow beliefs keep our feet on ground and save us from boasting
about our power or feeling deep sorrow about our losses.

E. Organized religion is the root cause of human civilization’s failings:

Organized religion is not at all the cause of human civilization’s

failings. It has been proved during rise of Islamic Civilization and
growth of Science, Technology, Medicine , literature, architecture and
every thing during that period.

It is only Atheist’s propaganda to blame religion and nothing else.

F. Atheism is not the problem, but cure for illness.

What a truly Atheist society will be like, the world has yet to see.

There is no country which is on top of the world and is fully Atheist.

The closest example of an Atheist State was a Communist state which

was Rabid Anti Religion…..and we have seen the fruit of that state.

Total Atheism, makes humans cruel, selfish and purposeless. Mental

illness, suicide and violence become hall mark of such civilizations and
if Atheist get their way, that will be the condition of world under their
dominion.

Q. Christopher (Should, 1585)

So much epic wrongness, so little time.

European civilization dates back to before the Rise of Rome. That's a lot more that a piddling 500
years.

I mentioned in my previous post that by the 15th century, the Mongols had become Muslim.
Didn't stop them from ruining Iraq as a grain producing region. So it's largely Islam's own fault
that they are in terminal decline as a society and forced to ride the coattails of the west. They did
more damage to themselves than the Europeans ever did, and have made no attempt at repairing
the damages of either.
ANS

A. Re Old Civilization

Being Old Civilization is not enough, leading and influencing the world
is what we are after. Indian, Egyptian, Chinese civilizations are much
older than European civilization, but they were confined to within their
own geographical boundaries, so they did not influence or affected
other countries.

You are speaking so high of Greek Civilization, where is Greece today?

Is it leading world in any thing? Same holds true for Italy and Rome
today.

The countries I was referring to are those who these days are the
“leading light” of Modern Civilization. England, France, Germany,
Russia, Holland, Scandinavian countries…. How old is their civilization?

Want to listen to a Muslim historian and geography scholar of 16th

Century (almost 300 years after Mongol Invasion), IBN KHULDOON
(Father of Sociology) writes in his famous MUQADDAMA in 10th
Century H, 16th Century CE about Western European countries…

“These areas are extremely cold and have very less sunlight…due to
this their skin has become dull and their eyes have turned blue…..their
brains are almost frozen and they are incapable of understanding finer
issues of Math and Science…”

This is the Centers of Modern Civilizations (England, France and

Germany for you in 16th Century!!) in they eyes of a Muslim Scholar!!

English Delegations in Courts of Moghal Emperors of India:

What I have said can be verified when we read the accounts of details
of Englishmen Delegations that visited to India during Mughal Period,
we have details of their visits during reign of:

- Akbar (1550-1600 CE): When they “requested” to be allowed to open

trade with India. There was no superiority in their Science and
Technology at that time. Akbar addressed Queen Victoria as “My
Younger Sister”

- Jahangir (1600 ~ 1630): When the English delegation “requested”

some more facilities for trade between the two countries. They did not
appear as “coming from another planet”.

- Aurangzeb (1650 ~ 1700): When Englishmen violated some local

laws, Emperor ordered to confiscate their ships and their goods.
Englishmen “pleaded” guilty to the Emperor and agreed to abide all
laws in future!!

- Bahadur Shah , Last Mughal King (1857): He was “tried and

convicted” by British court for “Plotting against his own Kingdom”. He
also addressed Queen Victoria-2 of England as “My younger Sister”!!
But by that time, the tides were turned.

So the tale of Europe Rising and Islam falling was between 1700 – 1850
Period that coincides with Invention of Steam Power and subsequent
Industrial revolution

B. Mongol Invasion in right perspective:

I do not deny that Mongol Invasion had a devastating effect on Islamic

civilization, but are over estimating its effect.

Many important centres of Islamic world, India, Spain, Egypt, Iran etc
were not affected by the Mongol Invasion. It did damage to Iraq and
center of Caliphate, but by that time, this center was only name sake
and had no real power.

Then within one century after invasion, most of Mongols became

Muslims themselves.

But the decline was not so sudden….till 17 or 18th Century, Muslim

countries were not much behind their European counterparts in
science and technology.

It was the invention of Steam Power that turned the tide and
accounted for Exponential rise of Western nations and ultimate decline
of Islamic nations.

The death knell was the colonization of most Islamic countries by

European nations, lead by England, France, Italy and Dutch.

Q. Christopher Pearsol (Should, 1579)

There was a time when the Islamic World was the pinnacle of human civilization.

But then a few things happened.

The Mongols sacked Baghdad in 1258 and turned what is now Iraq from Islam's breadbasket into
what it is now. Genghis Khan's grandson Timurlane (despite being a Muslim himself) did even
more damage to the region around the year 1400. Islam has yet to recover from this.

There was an increasing lack of tolerance of intellectual debate and freedom of thought within the
Islamic World. Islam has yet to recover from this.(Europe went through a similar phase between
the fall of Rome in the 5th Century and the Fall of Constantinople in the 15th, but has (mostly)
matured enough to (finally) begin moving beyond that)

The destruction of the major Islamic Libraries by the Mongols and the Crusaders helped this
downfall along (but whose fault is it that these institutions of higher learning were not rebuilt?!?).

The Black Death swept through the Islamic World in the 14th Century.

The majority of these events happened centuries ago. What the heck are you waiting for on
recovering and getting over it?

ANS

I really appreciate your post giving the reason for Downfall of Islamic
Civilization.

I thank you for saying that “there was a time when Islamic World was
the Pinnacle of human Civilization”, I know it would not go well with
many of the Rabid Islamic haters on this thread, who consider advent
of Islam as the darkest moment in human history!!

But the truth must be told and anyone with even cursory knowledge of
world history, would come to the conclusion which you have arrived.

Rise and fall of nations and civilizations are subjects of history and if
you scan thru pages of history, you will see that being Top of the World
has been a sort of Rotating Baton thing so as to say.

Many nations and civilizations have taken that position at one time or
other in their history and then bitten the dust. I think that no nation
was given a second chance to be on Top Again.

What are the causes that effect rise and fall of nations from the
pinnacle of human civilization to the dust bin of history? I do not know
if any one can find it really, though many have tried it, let me give you
some example:

A. Amazing Rise and Sudden Fall of Britain:

1. If it was not confirmed by so recent past, many of us would not have

believed that it was Britain which gave birth to such “Giants” like USA,
Canada, Australia and New Zealand!!

2. Many of us would not have believed that it was Britain who ruled the
seas and had large colonies in every part of world such as India!!

3. But equally fast was the down fall of this huge British Empire. Just
two world wars in span of thirty years broke the spinal cord of this
huge empire and today, British Empire is reduced to its own
boundaries.
4. What was the reason for rise of Britain? Christianity? Democracy?
Separation of state and religion? Education? Science? Technology?
Population?

5. If these were reasons for its rise, then which of them are missing in
present day Britain?

6. Will Britain ever reach that Summit again? Probably never, its pole
position is gone for ever and it should content itself being a Yes Man of
USA?

B. Rise and Fall of USSR:

1. Equally spectacular was the rise and sudden fall of USSR and
communist ideology.

2. If some one would have “predicted” in 1975 that Communism would

be finished as an ideology in just 15 years, every one would have
laughed at him.

3. But we saw with our own rise the dramatic fall of USSR and
communist ideology. The protectors of Labor Class were found to be its
worst exploiters!!.

4. Now Russia, with 85 % of USSR Area, almost 90 % of USSR nuclear

arsenal and army, is a spent force in world affairs. No one gives a hoot
to what it says or believes.

5. What were the reason for such rise and fall of USSR? Military Power?
Science, Technology, Commerce? Education? And then which called its
sudden collapse?

C. What are the reasons for Rise and Downfall of Nations:

Urdu Poet Sir. Mohammad Iqbal has penned down a beautiful couplet
on this issue, which I will reproduce below:

AA TUJH TO BATAOON MAIN, TAQDEER E UMAMM KYA HAI

SHAMSHEER O SANA AWWAL, TAOOS O RUBAB AKHIR.

In English it means “Let me tell you what are the destinies of Nations

It is Sword and Spear (Military Might) in the Beginning and Musical

Instruments (Luxuries and pleasures of this world) in the end”
In this beautiful couplet, the poet has put his views on the factors
which are main reason for any nation for rise and which cause its down
fall. (Contd.)

D. Was Islam responsible for Decline of Islamic Civilization?

1. It can be seen that while Islam had every thing to do with the Rise of
Islamic Civilization, it has much less to do with its decline and fall

Decline and fall of Islamic civilization started with the Tartar Invasion
and was complete with European conquests of Major Islamic countries.

2. The reasons include, disunity amongst Muslims, their infighting,

lethargy, their aversion to learn Modern Science and Technology etc.

3. None of them are due to Islamic teachings or sayings of Prophet. He

advised us to learn knowledge wherever we find it, even we should
learn foreign languages for that.

4. You will not find anything in Quran and prophetic teachings that
encourage Muslims to be or remain downtrodden, or be mute spectator
for what is going around them.

E. What is Modern Civilization:

1. Modern Civilization is based on Materialistic outlook and draws its

strength from Atheist Philosophers and thinkers mostly Roman and
Greek.

2. This civilization is based upon negation of any Devine Guidance into

human affairs and at best relegates religions to the inside houses.
Once you are out at work place, you should leave your religion at
home!!

3. Despite its glamour and evident dazzle, it has given rise to many
problems in the past and many are current and many more are
expected in future, I will mention some of these problems:

a. Extreme Nationalism, we have already seen the devastation caused

by WW-1 & WW-2. These wars were due to extreme nationalism and
that threat has not ended

b. Man made theories have played havoc with human lives.

Communism, Fascism, Nazism and many Isms have played havoc with
human lives. How much humanity has suffered and at what cost it has
paid to prove their futility is known to every one.

c. Free sex, and so called equality of sexes and homosexuality have

created havoc in the family life and family structure. Its bad effects
are some what hidden at present, but will appear after some time.

d. Human society is getting more and more brutal. The crime graph is
on the rise. Racism and discrimination on the ground of race, color
and language is on the rise and there seems to be no solution for these
ills.

e. Extreme Materialism has made man hungrier to get rich at any cost.
Moral issues are given secondary preference, if given at all. This has
made man more selfish.

F. Islam has SOLUTION to all these problems:!!

1. Islam has practical and workable solution to ALL the problems that
humanity is suffering because of present Materialistic Society.

2. There is no other religion which can provide practical and workable

solution to these problems.

3. Islam holds the link which humanity has with its Creator. If we lose
this link also, then there will NEVER be a solution to humanity’s
problems.

4. That is why, we need Islam to save humanity from the hole it has
got into. Do not follow condition of present day Muslims, but take the
guidance from Quran and Prophet and solve your problem, which is my
advice.

Q. Darwin Step Child (Should, 1487)

But "Muslim mathematicians" were not the ones that came up with the concept of zero. The
concept of a symbol for zero had been around for centuries before Mohamed. Babylonians,
during a resurgence of the city's power had developed the concept previous to 300 BC.

Even the so-called "Arabic numerals" did not originate with the Arabs. Europeans merely
obtained them by way of the Arabs. The number system originated in India.

This is not to say that no advances in mathematics were made by the Arabs. They did make some
advances in algebra (the word is derived from Arabic) by building on concepts discovered by the
Greeks.

ANS
The growth of mathematics, science, medicine and technology has
been gradual and every nation and civilization has contributed towards
it.

Therefore we should have a big heart when analyzing contributions of

every civilization towards it. Showering unnecessary praises on any
one group or negating all contributions of any particular group are both
wrongs.

Arabs before Islam knew very little about Science and Mathematics,
but within a quarter century of Death of Prophet, they became the
Biggest Super Power of those days.

After the consolidation of Military victories, came the advances in

Science, Mathematics , Astronomy and other fields.

Ancient books of Science, Philosophy, Mathematics and all other

branches were translated into Arabic. Muslims learned these and then
added their own efforts and distributed this knowledge to all parts of
Muslim world.

The concept of Zero originated in India, but it was laying dormant

there, Muslims took it, added numerical to it and made in popular to
the whole world.

Why should we belittle the efforts of Muslim Scientists and

Mathematicians?

The original works of Muslims are still available in libraries around the
world and every one can see what they contain.

For many centuries , Muslims were the leading Scientists, Physicians

Astronomers and Mathematicians in the world.

It was Muslim Spain which was the source of distributing knowledge in

Europe in those centuries.

Europeans took over from Muslims and expanded the knowledge an a

much higher level. Why should they feel shy to accept the parts
played by Islam and Muslims in the advancement of Science, Medicine,
Mathematics and other field.

You should not compare the present condition of Muslims with the first
ten centuries of Islamic Civilizations. Nations have ups and downs in
their history.
Who could believe that mere ten centuries ago, most people in Europe
had no concept of personal hygiene , had never seen a Hot Steam Bath
, and did not have even rudimentary knowledge about Medicine. It
were Muslim cities of Baghdad, Granada and Others that had the Most
hygienic Hospitals in entire world!!

But Muslims should not live in past, if they are backward today, does
not mean that it was always the case.
Q. Darwin Step Child (Should, 1524)

Frankly, Muq, the way I see women treated in the Muslim Middle East does not impress me. If
that is your standard of how women are supposed to be treated under Islam, then Islam stinks.
It is bad enough here in the US how submissive many Muslim women are. Not all, but many are
still influenced by the mysogenistic philosophy flowing from your part of the world

ANS

ME or India or Pakistan is no standard how a Muslim woman should be

treated.

You should read Quran and prophetic teachings to know how a Muslim
Woman SHOULD be treated.

Once you know that, you will see how far Muslims have gone in
violating the guidelines of Quran and Prophetic teachings.

These Muslims violate Islamic Principles and Quran and Prophet have
to take the blame.

The position for other religions is different.... In their scriptures there

are gross violations of women's rights. They hide these facts and
mount tangent attack on Islam for misdeeds of these Muslims.

I do not approve or justify any Non Islamic act committed by any one,
be he an Arab, Indian or Pakistani etc.

Q. Dude (Should, 1494)

Two things MUQ.

Regarding your tirade above, is there anything of actual relevance to the ongoing discussion
contained within?

Second. Muhammad wasn't the last prophet. Even if you allow Joseph Smith of the Mormons or
L Ron Hubbard of the Scientology cult, there's also Bobby Henderson, who brought us the Flying
Spaghetti Monster.

There's also the anonymous prophet who brought our attention to the Invisible Pink Unicorn.

ANS
Mohammad was the "Last True Prophet of God"!!! After him there
came many "so called prophets in the world".....they were all
"prophets"....but prophets deceived by satan.

As Last prophet himself said....there shall be many who would claim

that they are prophet....but they all will be liars.

You have mentioned some names....I can also add some more...

Bahaullah.....Mirza Ghulam Ahmad Qadiyani....etc.

The conmclusion of my present "tirade" against BTOE and Atheism will

come in the end of this series.

There Mr. Harun Yahaya anayzes how come the scientific community
isbeing misled systematically by powerful people and what is their real
agenda.

Right now, you should feel content that BTOE is against reason , logic
and common sense!!

PS: The nobleness of our prophet is not a thing that needs

"confirmation" from "pigmies" like you.

Already his list of admirers include some of the Best, Thinkers,

Philosophers , Scientists and Leaders. That list has not ended yet, but
keeps on growing.

Any one criticizing the moral character and conduct of Prophet is now a
days considered "illiterate" in the learned circles.

but this is not unique with this age. When prophet was living and
walking...his uncle Abu Lahab called him a liar and lunatic and
insane....while others kept coming into his religion.

In a few years world saw what was the end of Abu Lahab and what was
the position of Prophet.

Abu Lahab died a most pathetic death...while his daughter and other
progeny accepted Islam.

I only feel pity on those people who criticize the moral and sexual
conduct of prophet. They think they are "genius" to "discover and
confirm" these allegations, while in reality they are mere "ignorant"
persons.
Q. Erasmus 5 (Should, 1529)

Hindu scripture is even older, and it is polytheistic. The Enuma Elis, which is also polytheistic, is
older than the Bible.

ANS

Ask any learned Hindu Scholar, he will tell you that original teachings
of Vedas were Monotheistic in nature. It was later that people
corrupted that and introduced polytheism into that.

I have no info regarding Enuma Elis, but any ancient religion which
claims divine origin has Monotheism as its basic teaching.

How could be any revealed religion polytheistic in nature, considering

that there is only One Lord and Creator of this Universe!!

Q. Lowell Guy (Should, 1589)

It is really interesting!!

I think Muslim as a whole do not accept this Blind Theory of Evolution, where man is said to be
descended from Apes....

Yet "Majority of Muslims in ME believe that Jews are descendants of Apes and Swine"....that is
marvelous.

First you tried your hand at Quran....that Quran calls Jews and Children of Apes and
Swine....when I showed you your mistake, you changed your stance.

So it is not only BTOE that you will go to ANY LENGTH to defend....

It is also ANTI ISLAMIC stance that also you will go tp ANY LENGTH to defend it!!

ANS

Very pertinent Questions indeed....and instead of wasting you time on

guitar or violin or whatever you are holding....you should ponder on
that.

Why EVERY molecule of water turns to ice at 32 D F and turns to vapor

at 212 D F.

Why EVERY single atom of Iron is attracted to a magnet?

Why SHOULD they obey these laws? Have they any choice?

Who Created these laws?

May be you will get a better kick than just playing on your musical
gadget.

And the same goes for that lady too....if instead of polishing her
nails...she should look at the color and shine and how they change
when some one becomes sick....

Why should be it so.....how come a blind and deaf TOE based on RM

and NS should have been so considerate to provide such easy
diagnostic tools...that every one can see!!

May be she can look beyond nails to the Creator of Nails.....and most
certainly he is not Charles Darwin and Blind BTOE guys!!

Q. Lowell Guy (Should, 1594

Quick quiz: Is the Qur'an the source of all knowledge and wisdom ?

ANS

Quran is the source of ALL Knowledge and Wisdom.....that is needed

for humans to fulfill their PRIMARY PURPOSE on this earth....that is to
know their Lord and Creator and live their lives in accordance with it.

To explore nature and grow in science , technology is the SECONDARY

purpose of their existence.

Best are those who fulfill both PRIMARY and Secondary purposes.

Then come those who fulfill Primary purpose but are weak in secondary
purposes.

Those who are involved only in secondary purpose and deny their
PRIMARY purpose....they certainly fail the test.

Worst of course are those who fail both PRIMARY and SECONDARY
purpose of their lives.

Q. Mike F (Should, Mike –F)

Perfectly vague. How about 'How women should be treated' in your own words?
And please lay off the Mr Yo-Yo stuff.

ANS

It seems some people are very eager to know Islamic position

regarding women. Let me point out some basic teachings:

1. Allah is the Creator of both Males and Females:

Allah is the creator of both species, so as Creator, He knows which the

best path of each of the species is. He is unbiased and guides to the
best possible course.

2. Men and Woman are not created as Direst Competitors of each other
but as Complimentary to each other:

There is no direct competition between man and woman in any field.

God has created them as complimentary to each other and not as
direct competitors. They have differences physically, psychologically
and emotionally.

If someone wants to create perfect equality between the sexes, he or

she will be wrong.

That is why we see in sports and races men and women do not
compete against each other. I think every one knows what will be the
result if women competed against men in races, gymnastics, boxing,
and wrestling and in other sports. So generally people do recognize
women as a weaker sex. “Ladies First” is to confirm that.

3. Man and Women have some “equality” in the eyes of God:

However, there are many things in which man and women hold
equality. The lives of man and woman are equally sacred. If any one
kills an innocent man or woman, he will face equal punishment.

Likewise in rewards for good deeds and in faith, both men and women
earn equal rewards and pleasure of their Lord and Master.

4. Family is the basic unit of Human Civilization:

Man and women by coming close together by ties of marriage,

compliment each other and form the basic unit, which is called family
and the family is basic unit for human civilization.
One purpose of family is to preserve the continuity of human race,
quench the sexual desire of both man and women and provide an
healthy atmosphere for upbringing of children.

Islam is totally against the breakup of family system and discourages

that man or woman should live a single life. That type of living is
against human nature and opens the door of many evils.

That is why Islam bans all types of sexual connection between man
and woman except that under the marriage circle. (Contd.)

5. Man and Woman are assigned different roles in the Family System:

The difference between the physical, psychological and emotional

position of man and woman matches exactly with the roles they have
been assigned in the maintenance of family life.

It is not because of any insult to woman, that she was assigned the
roles inside the house and take care of house affairs and first teacher
and mentor of children. That role is built into her nature by her
Creator.

Man is responsible to earn the livelihood for the entire family. His
buildup is best suited for this role.

If both parties do their respective roles, the family will be a healthy and
happy family and the children shall have a good atmosphere for their
proper upbringing.

We see that thing clearly in single parent society, because the children
do not have the attention of both parents and there is some deficiency
in their emotional and psychological buildup.

6. There is no Economic Burden on Women at any stage:

Since the woman has to take care of Household affairs, there is no

burden on her to earn livelihood for the family. She is not the bread
earner for family at any stage.

However this does not mean that she is prohibited from working, if the
family is facing economical problems, or the husband is not capable for
earning, then woman can work and help to raise the economic
condition of family.

In normal circumstances, working of women is not encouraged,

because it shall put extra burden on her weaker personality and may
adversely affect the house front which was her main responsibility.

In that regard the condition of western woman is pitiable, she is

overburdened. She has to work in office or factory, take care of house
chores and also attend to children’ needs. She has to do double or
often triple roles.

These are some basic foundations of Islamic society regarding woman.

I think that answers how a Muslim woman should be treated in an
Islamic society.

This also answers the question, whether she MUST work in offices.

Now remains the question as to should she decide to have children or

not. This is a family decision and both husband and wife should decide
on that. It is man who has to earn livelihood for the child and take care
of his duties for the rest of his life. It is not a decision of woman alone.

Single parent family is highly discouraged in Islam (which is becoming

a NORM in western society due to break up of family and marriage
system there). Man or Woman should remarry when their spouses die,
if some one does not want to remarry, it will be his or her choice…..
but they will feel the disadvantage of living in this “non natural”
condition.

Q. Polymath 257 (Should, 1491)

I would encourage you to read 'The Rise of Early Modern Science' by Toby Huff. it points out
how the rise of doctrinaire Islam stopped the scientific developments in the Islamic world. In
particular, Al Ghazali was instrumental in changing the Moslem world's philosophy to the place
that real scientific innovation became more and more difficult. If you want to understand why the
Moslem world is behind in science today, you should look directly at Al-Ghazali.

ANS

Thanks for advising me to read the book of Toby Huff, If we have to

read books by others to know our internal problems, then it means we
have lost power of analysis.

There is no shortage of Islamic thinkers, who have analyzed the fall of

Islamic civilization.

Western writers over emphasize the position of Al Ghazali. He did not

have any official position or authority to propagate his views. He was a
learned scholar and respected by those close to him.
But it will be wrong to say that his books and thoughts put brakes on
the growth of Islamic civilization.

It is law of nature that no Civilization stays on top for ever. They come
and they go and that is for the faster growth of Science and
Technology of the world.

Muslims also rose to the top and stayed at top …perhaps more than
any other civilization…. There were many causes for their
downfall….some material and some non material.

Nonmaterial causes were their slackness in adhering to the Book of

God which was the prime reason for their rise to top.

Material reason was the Tartar attack in 7th Century, which destroyed
the Caliphate of Baghdad and Muslims were never united after that.

But the people who link the down fall of Muslims with down fall of Islam
are not correct.

Islam is still the correct path for humanity to follow and is the ticket for
their survival in the hereafter.

Q. 100 Kurav (Who is, 1079)

Btw, I used to live in Egypt and there's NO so called persecution or any BS that have been
boasted by Copts outside Egypt ,for example America. They've just bribed by Missionary to bad
mouth Moslem and gave some made up story, believe Me. Just see Boutros Ghali former
Secretary-General of the United Nations, He is one of perfect example of successful Copt.

ANS

Please see my response to Mary …. There could have been individual

cases of atrocities against Coptic Christians… No society is immune
from it and Egyptian Muslims are no angels…they are human beings.

But these people want to exaggerate these incidents and generalize

them for all Muslims and for all Egyptians.

While it is well known that Blacks, Hispanics, Asians and Muslims do

feel discrimination in US and Europe at every level.

But these “Champions of Equality and Human Rights” down play these
incidents , but never loose any opportunity to blame Islam and Muslims
for much smaller violations.
They always use double standard and double standards can never
solve any problem, it only increases it and that is what we see in the
present world of ours.

Q. BMZ (Who is, 1083)

Muhammad came out of nowhere and claimed that he's a Ishmaelite. that is ludicrous to say the
least. moreover, his family members were already circling the Kaaba like Muslims do Today,
literally

ANS

No, Mohammad did not came out of nowhere and claimed he was a
Ishmaelite..... Mohammad was already an Ishmaelite.... Most of Arabs
were already Ishmaelite...

What Mohammad claimed all of a sudden.....that he was appointed a

prophet of God (same thing that happened to Moses on that night near
the bush)..... Many have been appointed prophets all of a sudden the
case of Mohammad was not unique in religious history.

The Mohammad brought a most solid proof of his prophet hood.... he

brought a revelation which he challenged that no one can match in
eloquence, in truth , in beauty, in details , in effectiveness, in logic, in
reasoning.....

That revelation has become and still is the highest of the highest
example of Arabic Literature.... If ever any prophet brought any proof
of his prophet hood.... Mohammad's proof was best and longest lasting.

May peace and blessings of Allah be on to His Servant, Slave and

Prophet Mohammad and on to every other prophet of God

Q. Citizen (Who is, 1105)

Peace. The actions of Muhammad in his private life as recorded in history books reveal that every
thing he did on earth as being a model of what GOD approved.
Professor Eyed Hossein nasr-Vol111 no. 1 1397
…..Peace. From what year is dated-"ISLAM WHY WE ARE HERE"/ Since this is not in the
bible. This version of how the world began and original sin and Allah's plan is now where found
in the bible. As converted to Islam, you would have been taught this as a confirmation of Islam
faith. But you do not openly proclaim this to be true. Why

ANS
It is strange for you to take the wordings out of a Muslim Writer and
making it an article of faith for all Muslims!!

You have not understood the full meaning of what the learned
Professor is saying…..

He is saying that the Prophet presented himself as the role model for
God’s teachings. His every word and his every action was sanctified by
the God.

So at many time we see him as an emblem of mercy and kind words

and at other time we see him in wars and as a judge dispensing justice
and such things.

The former is the embodiment of Merciful Nature of God and another

as His Justice and Just ruler.

It does not mean that Allah consists of two gods!! Allah has many
qualities and attributes and all are His, Names, Attributes and
Qualities.

PS:

And what is this book you are talking about “Islam why we are here”?

I do not know about this book and how can I answer any question
regarding it?

From what I know, is that Biblical books are not reliable because they
have been corrupted. Things have been taken out and things have
been put in by unknown hands. There are errors, mistakes and
contradictions in all its forms.

Quran since its revelation has been preserved exactly as it was

revealed. So it is more authentic than Books of Bibles. Because it is
Word of God and nothing else but Word of God.

Q. Citizen (Who is, 1106)

Peace. I don't know if this will work, But this where.

http:/www.quran-islam.org/main
When I read what is written I study of what the writer is trying to tell me, so I can understand his
meaning. From Nasr writing he implies that like you understand The Prophet Spiritual and daily
life are seen by muslims representing Allah in real life. And it is his life that reflects the character
of muslims today. You you see that from studding the Prophet I know muslims. How they think
and react to situations. I know the from and why He did what He did. But I also know that even
though he accomplished what He did, all was not permissible from GOD.

ANS

I think your basic mistake (which you inherited from the writer) is that
“Muslims see daily behaviour of prophet as representing Allah in daily
life”!!

This in itself is wrong. Our prophet was the role model for us to show
as to how to live our lives in accordance with the “Will of Allah”.

No Muslims believes that Our Prophet was Allah in human form.

He lived his life in accordance with the Guidance which he received

from Allah.

There is a world of difference in the two approaches. The previous one

was taken from Christian analogy and the second one from Quran
itself!!

Whatever prophet did was permitted from Allah….whenever there was

even the minutest deviation, it was immediately corrected by Allah!!
That is why he was declared as a Role Model for all Muslims.

There are verses in Quran admonishing about these minutest

deviations…..the issues are so trivial, that if they were not specifically
mentioned in Quran, no one would have even noticed it.

But to Allah….the Ever Watcher over His servants…..even these were

to be corrected.

Q. Citizen (Who is, 1107)

Prophet and Sin:

ANS

You are getting carried away is that what I can say....where did I say
that prophet committed a sin?

I said whenever he deviated even slightly from the highest standard...

God corrected him.

That deviation does not mean that he committed any sin.

Sin is deliberately breaking any of the God's laws and Commandments

and our prophet never did that.

The examples mentioned in Quran are:

1. The prophet did not pay attention to the Blind man when he came to
him, while prophet was taking to the chiefs of Makkah. Is that a sin?
No by any standard.

2. The prophet took the ransom money for prisoners of war, without
express permission from God.. Was that a sin?

3. Prophet allowed some Hypocrites to sit at home and not go to war

with him....was that a sin?

4. Prophet promised his wives that he will not honey to please

them.....was that a sin?

There are one or more simple trivial examples in Quran where God
corrected the prophet.

None of them come under the category of sin.

All prophets of God are sinless and they are role models for their
followers.

Prophet hood is not a position that any one can reach by their studies
and good deeds. This is a position which is SELECCTED by God.

When we humans; while selecting any one to any post, make sure that
he has necessary qualities and free from bad habits and other defects
(even though our selection in never 100 % True)...

Then how come God selecting any one will not know that such and
such person has these moral defects?

So ALL prophets of God are free from Moral defects and never commit
any sin in its right interpretation of the word.

However, prophets are humans and not angels and some times may
commit any mistake of judgment....these mistakes are also corrected
by God so that their followers may not persist in the same errors.

Islamic and Quranic concept of prophet hood and prophets is far

superior to what we see in books of Bible.

You should study Quran to find out what office of prophet hood really
is!!
Q. Citizen (Who is, 1107)

TO MUQ_THE difference is other Prophets did not start a new religion. Muhammad did. The
Koran contradicts the QURAN. The Koran turns ALLAH in to two GOD'S where in the QURAN
Allah is only one GOD. You need to do more studying.
Peace.

ANS

I think you do not want to understand any thing and will go on

repeating your own views.

I told you that no where in Quran it is mentioned that Allah is two

gods…..but you keep on saying Koran contradicts Quran….

What is Koran and What is Quran …. Will you tell me the difference
please.

And for your information, our prophet did not start a NEW religion….
He only perfected the same Old religion which was religion of previous
prophets.

Can you tell me what was the religion of prophets before Moses? What
laws they followed?

Moses brought new set of Laws to modify some portion of that old
law……then Jesus came and modified some provisions of Moses’ law….

And in the end our prophet came and modified some more provision of
Moses Laws and perfected it as a common code of conduct for all
humanity, till the Final day.

Q. God s Seer (Who is, 1090)

Revealing in stages is not the same thing as doing a 180 On God's word. Why was the Satanic
verses removed from your SLOP book? No where ever did any prophet ever receive a revelation
from Satan and try to present it as from God. Mohammad could not tell the difference between
the voices he was receiving from could he? And no wonder, they are the same entity, SATAN.
Who disguised himself as an angel of light. 2Co 11:14 And no wonder! For Satan himself
transforms himself into an angel of light.

ANS

I would very much be interested to know what were those Satanic

verses in Quran? To my knowledge there are none… Hoe could it be
since Muslims are to take protection against accursed Satan even
before reciting Quran.

If you think that words recorded in OT or NT books are verbatim

revelation from God Almighty, then the burden of proof is on you and
not me.

God did not take responsibility to protect revelations given to earlier

prophets (since they were to be abrogated in His plans), that job was
given to the followers of those prophets and these followers botched
up the job. They forgot some parts, they added some words and they
removed some words and they played with the revealed text so as to
score some points over rival factions.

All these are evident to the scholars who study Purity of Biblical Text
thru out its history.

God did take responsibility to protect and guard only the Final
Revelation sent thru the Last and Final prophet (“We have Sent this
revelation and We shall guard it” 15:9). The purity of Quranic text is
unprecedented amongst all of the world’ scriptures.

Q. GOR ( Who is, 1087)

Since we Christians deem Christianity to be the true faith and we make up the majority of
Americans, we decide that we do not want Islam here as it is inferior. I am using your reasoning
here.

ANS

Such decisions are not decided based on Majority and Minority. If such
be the case , then no minority can ever live or survive in a
democratically controlled country.

That is where special rights are given to minorities in every democratic

country. US and Europe are no exception.

If Muslims also act on this principle, then they would expel all non
Muslims living in their lands….this would not be in the good of
world….as this would lead to 100 % polarization and intolerance.
Q. Hugh Be (Who is, 1025)

have said-- suppose I don’t care to follow the “right path” I enjoy the “wrong”, in my mind I
would have lost nothing because my soul will go back to the Eternal.

Therefore, suppose I enjoy giving the wives of my neighbours a “helping hand” and a “helping
foot” I see no reason to change because I like it and so what there is nothing to lose.

Now, Eric responded by saying “Christian mentality.”

I am asking BMZ, MUQ, an atheist or anyone to give me their comments on the above. In other
words, is it a Christian thing to argue the way that I have done if what I am saying is true? Would
you argue the same way if regardless of what you do your soul would go back to God?

ANS

You have posted a very thought provoking question. I can assure you
that there is no straight forward answer. Let me tell you what I think of
this:

1. Human being is made of two elements, one is this material, physical

body and another thing is soul, which is not a material thing.

2. When a man dies, the soul leaves the body. The body is buried or
cremated in the ground, but the soul is collected by the angels and is
held in custody, till the day of judgment.

3. On the last day, the soul and body shall be reunited and the humans
will have to give the account of their lives to their creator.

4. This life is a test for humans, they have been given the freedom to
choose between right and wrong path. If there was no freedom of
choice then there was really no test at all.

5. God has provided guidance to humans (in the form of scriptures and
messengers and prophets) and then given each individual a choice to
chose his or her path.

6. God does not force any human to accept a particular faith or do a

particular deed. Every one chooses his own path and line of action.

7. Outwardly there is no difference in the life of a believer or an

Atheist. Both enjoy the same bounties of God (sunshine, air, water and
sustenance etc). Both die in the same way.
8. but once they die, their courses become totally different. And this
difference shall continue till the last day.

9. Humans by nature are more attracted towards evil, because Satan

and their base self encourage them to follow the evil path, which
brings quick joy and temporary relief.

10. But those who have faith, fight against this and try to avoid to do
evil deeds. Even of they do some evil deed, they repent and ask
forgiveness from God and correct their actions.

11. So this life is a continuous struggle between right and wrong,

between flesh and spirit and between Satan and God’ teachings.

This is what I think on this matter, I await your response.

Q. Jar of Clay (Who is, 1092)

So is the name Muslim.. is it not. To be a muslim one has to accept Mohd. as prophet and no true
jew, Christian or hindu have such a prophet to speak of in their scriptures. They would not be
who they are if they do. So there is no point harping about GOB to win the day for ISLAM. It is a
mockery of ISLAM

ANS

A true Muslim (True Jew, True Christian, True Hindu....) will have no
hesitation to accept the command of His Lord and Creator of Universe.

If some one says that I will believe in this prophet and shall not believe
in that prophet, it shows that he is not a true Muslim... he has not
surrendered himself totally to God.... He wants to tell God that God
should not have made such and such a prophet.

God did announce in all previous scriptures that He will send a Last
Prophet and every one should follow that prophet.

Now if any "self claimed true Muslim" says that No, I will Never and
Ever believe in this last prophet. For me my old prophets are
enough.... then infact he is not Muslim at all... He is putting his own
logic and his own words against the logic and words of True God!!

PS: As regard whether Old Scriptures do claim the advent of last and
final prophet, we can have dialogs and debates. But once it is proved
that Mohammad indeed is the prophet foretold in old scriptures, "True
Muslims" must follow him!!
Q. Kozak (Who is, 1086)

How about the way Muslims treat their former co-religionists who choose to convert to
Christianity. At least we don't kill people like Antony who become Islamic. Personally, I am
Christian but don't care if someone wants to pray to a polka-dotted gorilla as long as that person
doesn't pose a threat to my church or
my people, then it becomes a different story. Muslims tend to attempt to make countries they
move into Islamic, such as Britain allowing Shariah law. Would Saudi Arabia allow Christian law
to be

ANS

If some one wants to leave the faith of Islam in an Islamic society... he

is to be punished with death. The only course open for such a person
is to leave Islamic country and settle in some Non Muslim society.

This is a law of islam.... but if you look thru Islamic history...you will
find that very few people have been killed on that account.

Compared to that reach Church History and find out how many Millions
have been killed by Church on charges of being heretic, Hypocrites and
Deviants.

In Islam there is nothing hidden, every thing is above board.

As to your question, why Islam does not want to give Non Muslims the
right to preach their religion in Islamic country...the answer is very
simple.... Islam considers itself True religion....so no one gives equal
right to truth and falsehood in any society.

If any one can prove that his or her faith is better than Islam, or is the
True faith practiced by any prophet of God...we have no hesitation to
accept that faith.

But instead of proving their case, such people want that truth and
falsehood be given the same right. This is illogical and not a
reasonable view point

Q. Mahmood (Who is, 1090)

Hi MUQ,
I have a question. 3:85 says whoever desires a religion other than Islam will face dire
consequences. Does this mean that all Hindus, Buddhists, Jews, & Christians will burn in hell for
rejecting Islam? I want to know your thoughts on this.
ANS

First you should know what is the meaning of Islam and what that word
denotes...before you jump to your own conclusions.

Islam (in Arabic) simply means to surrender yourselves to the will of

your Creator. To lead your life as per His Commandments.

So all past prophets and all old religions in origin were nothing but
Islam and all past prophets were Muslims.

The names like Judaism, Christianity, Hinduism, Buddhism etc are

given by the followers themselves and they are not given by the
Creator.

So a True Jew, a True Christian, a True Hindu is nothing but a

Muslim..... but they should also recognize the last and final prophet of
God (i.e prophet Mohammad) whom they do find mentioned in their
own scriptures too

Q. Mahmood (Who is, 1091)

First of all, no true Christian, Hindu, Jew, or Buddhist recognizes Mohammad as a final prophet
of god, let alone a messenger. I am not familiar with other scriptures, but muslims have started
this ruse that Mohammad is mentioned in the previous scripture.... a total lie confirmed by those
familiar with the Torah & Bible.

Secondly, many contemporary scholars questioning the existence of Moses. There is absolutely
no evidence that he even existed, nor are there any archeological evidence of the exodus. The
exodus which is confirmed by the Koran is enough to render the Koran null and void. There is
also a big debate on the existence of Jesus (Isa). There are no compelling evidence of his
existence either. I'd suggest you read the book by a renowned Canadian scholar called "The
Pagan Christ".

ANS

Now you are speaking in contradictory terms.

First you say that no True Jew, Christian or Hindu recognizes our
Prophet as the Last prophet…. Then you go one step and say that
existence of Moses, Jesus itself could be in doubt… What type of
talking is that?

Every old scripture has been foretelling the advent of one man as
forthcoming into the world:
A. In OT books he is mentioned as “prophet like Moses” in Deut. 18:18

b. In New Testament he is mentioned as “Comforter” in Gospel of John

Ch 14-16.

C. In Hindu scripture there is a mention of a Kaliki Avatar.

So no true Jew, Christian or Hindu can say that their prophets did not
foretold the advent of a future personality or that their prophet were
the last one…. So they must be on the look out for that personality…
so the reason for search is there.

What separates True Jews, True Christians and True Hindus from the
Common Jew, Christian and Hindu is that they have misjudged that
foretold personality as to one belonging to their own particular sects.

It can be shown thru logic and reason that “Prophet like Moses” of
Jews, “Comforter” of Christians and “Kaliki” of Hindus is no other than
the Last and Final prophet.

If even all these arguments, some one says No, I will still believe in my
own interpretation…. Then it means that he or she is not a True Jew…
Christian or Hindu etc.

Q. Mary (Who is, 1079)

MUQ, the Coptic Egyptian are abused and killed and the Church is destroyed and many are
forced to change their religion to Muslim in Egypt. As a human don't you think everybody have
right to exercise their religion, whether is it Buddhist, Hinduism, Christianity, Judaism, Muslim
and bla bla? Nobody have right to kill, abuse and hurt others because they don't follow what they
want?

ANS

If we accept your assumption that Coptic Christians are killed and

persecuted and forced to change their religion…..

Then this must have been going on for last 1400 years….how come
there are still 20 Million Coptic Christians still left in Egypt?

Can you tell me how many Muslims were left in Spain….after say 25
Years when the “peaceful and peace loving Christians” conquered that
nation from Muslims in 1492?
I told you, that you have to study Islam, its teachings and its history.

I think that every one has a right to preach his religion and every one
should have a right to freely choose his or her religion.

Then there should be justice and equity in dealing between different

religious groups and nations.

Unless uniform standards are used in the world….there is no hope for

real peace.

Q. Mary (Who is, 1079)

MUQ,

it is not assumption , it is the truth...that is why many Egyptian Copts Christians are spreading all
over the world because of the abuse by the Muslim Egyptians .....it is the truth. Make your
investigation or ask people about it that knows.....you just say coz you don't know. Egyptian
Copts Christians are the minorities ....and many are forced to leave because of abuse and a lot. I
do not know exactly how many Copts are living in Egypt but are very minorities......And about 90
percent of the population of Egypt is Muslim( most Sunnis) About 70 million are Muslims, and
you do the math 10 percent is Copts.

ANS

1. You have been ambiguous in your answers. I asked that if Coptic

Christians were murdered, tortured and forced to change their
religion…. And that is continuing for 1400 years, how come 20 Million
Coptic Christians are still left in Egypt?

2. I asked you how many Muslims were left in Spain after 25 years
when so called Christians took the possession of that country. You did
not post any reply….. That shows the difference of two religions.

3. Now I do not deny that some Muslims at individual levels might have
done some mistakes or harmed Coptic Christians, but that is against
Islamic teachings.

4. I give you one example…. You are in contact with that “Yogi Joel”….
Who seems to have mesmerized you with his sweet tongue. Do you
know how Muslims are persecuted and discriminated against in India….
How many Anti Muslim riots take place in India and how many Muslims
are killed in India every year. Ask this Yogi…. How many Hindus have
been convicted and punished for these riots….. He will put all the
blame for riots on Muslims….!!!
5. Now when the same thing appears on a much lower level in Egypt ,
the whole world starts blaming Egypt and Muslim nations.

6. That is the dual standard which world uses in dealing with Islam and
Muslims. That is the root cause of all problems.

Hope you get it now!!

Q. Mary (Who is, 1081

Is 20 million your mathematical calculation? I tell you , but you are not listening to me. Out of
the population of Egypt, only very very few percent is Copts Christians. The majority are Muslim
Sunnis.

I didn't read your question about Spain. what about Spain? If Christians do wrong on Muslims in
Spain then they wrong. It is wrong to abuse people because one is not following what they want
to follow.

Yes, I know it is against Islamic teaching, but then the one who support the wrong doing of these
is u. You support your Islamic fanatics, although they do wrong on others, because you have
same religion. it is sad:(

ANS

Go to any Church Web site and verify the number of Coptic Christians
in Egypt and other Arab states.

I do not want to harp on Spain, I just wanted to show the difference

between what Muslims do and what other nations do to Muslims when
they get upper hand. You could verify the History books How Muslims
captured Jerusalem and How Christians did it.

You will always find that Muslims are most tolerant in dealing with
people of other faiths and their behavior is most tolerant when they
are victorious , other people’ behavior is exactly opposite, they are
most cruel when they get upper hand. See what US soldiers did to
the Muslim prisoners in Aby Gharib and Gitmo camps. There are
endless examples of this kind.

Now you have seen the response of that Super Yogi Joel” about how
Muslims and Christians are treated in India. Instead of apologizing for
cruelty of Hindus, he started blaming Muslims and Christians instead.

The guy will speak and write as if the milk of human kindness is flowing
from his mouth. He feels sorry that so many goats and sheep shall be
slaughtered on the eve of Eid Al Azha festival….. one will think that his
aversion to shedding human blood would be at least 100 times
stronger.

But you prick these “super yogis” and you will see that their kindness
is only skin deep, inside they are hard core Hindus with extreme hatred
towards all non Hindus.

What else can you expect from the followers of a religion who
persecuted and brutalized majority of their own followers for thousands
of years. These people are known as SUDRAS and Untouchables in
India and they constitute majority of Hindus in India.

High caste Hindus (Brahmins and Others) to whom this “super Yogi”
belongs have been committing atrocities on these low caste Hindus for
centuries and the violence is still continuing in one form or other.

You read any Indian Newspaper and you will find at least ten news
every day, where low caste Hindus have suffered at the cost of High
caste Hindus. What you see in papers is only tip of the iceberg.

How could Muslims and Christians expect fair treatment from the
hands of such people who did not spare their own co-religionist.

Ask this “super Yogi” about caste problem in India, how did it start and
what solution has he abolish it. See the milk of human kindness
flowing from his lips once more.

I wrote you this because I feel that your knowledge about India and
Hindus are limited. You might be impressed by their sweet talking and
philosophical ideas.

What they practice and what they preach are two different things.

Q. Noetics (Who is, 533)

God NOT taking human shape is also a pagan myth. The Babylonian magi’s during
Nebuchadnezzar’s time thought so, still at a later time they did go to Jerusalem worship God in
human baby-form!!

ANS

If you think that those MAGIES are your teachers and guides... then
you are welcome to their action that they come to worship a baby
god!!!

You are then no pagan than those magies were...

However if you have Prophets of God and True Revelation as your
guide and master, then you are SURE that God does not take human
form.

The Infant Jesus that came out of womb of Mary was not the Creator,
Sustainer and Cherisher of this Uiverse. That babe was a sign of the
Power and Mercy of Lord and Creator of this Universe.

We should worship and praise God and should not worship a human
child which came out of the womb of a woman.

We should keep Jesus at the place which he deserves... neither raising

his status to equate him with God or saying bad things about him and
abusing him.

Middle course is the best and safest

Q. Noetics (Who is1106)

Why is it that MUQ version of Islamic Fundamentals are different from the later pronouncements
of the Prophet in the Koran?

I have only quoted the Koran, with no comments and a few (just two or three) of recent incidents
to confirm the Koran's fundamentals in practice.

If you stick with the Koran's fundamentals, it may be useful.

Noetics

ANS

It is not MUQ ‘s fundamentals , these are Quranic Fundamentals!!

You have not been HONEST in your Quotations, that is what I can say.

There is no Contradiction in Quran, in Makkah or Medina period.

In Makkah the emphasis was on the issues of faith and fundamental

beliefs (because Muslims had no power and no means to establish their
society). So the Makkah Surah s deal with the issues of faith.

When Prophet migrated to Medina, a Muslim state was formed and

then came the needs for instruction s that deal with the day to day
matters of state and establishment of Islamic society.
There is no contradiction in articles of faith during Makkah and Medina
periods.

So it is dishonest on the part of any one to keep on quoting “authentic

verses from Quran” on any one subject (Jihad and dealings with people
of other faith) and claim that these are Fundamentals of Islam.

If you are interested to know about the Fundamentals of Islam, I will be

glad to discuss them with you….but it should be point by point, not a
ten or twenty page document.

First Fundamental of Islam is Uniqueness of Creator and His Powers

and Attributes.

Are you interested to know more about it…or shall we pass to next
Fundamental?

Q. Salt Dome (Who is,1018)

[
True Mave !!!
There is nothing new in NT, we can found it all in Talmud. The Koran itself has so many
similarities with Talmud:
"Whoever kills an innocent soul, it is as if he killed the whole of mankind'' (the interesting thing
is that in the original Arabic, it is explicitly said that it is an Israelite commandment)
~The Qur'an 5:32
In The Talmud:
Whoever destroys a soul, it is considered as if he destroyed an entire world. And whoever saves a
life, it is considered as if he saved an entire world
God forbids Moshe from suckling from a foster mother in both the Qur'an and Talmud:
And We had already forbidden foster suckling mothers for him, until [his sister] said: Shall I
show you a household who will rear him for you and take care of him?
~The Qur'an 28:12
The Holy One, Blessed is He, said: "Shall the mouth that will one day speak to me suckle from
anything unclean?"
~The Talmud
Both the Qur'an and the Talmud tell the story of God raising a mountain over the Israelites:
"We raised the mountain over them as if it had been a canopy, and they thought that it was going
to fall on them. (We said): "Hold firmly to what We have given you."
~The Qur'an 7:171
The Holy One, blessed is He, raised a mountain over Israel as though it were a dome. And He
said to them: if you hold to the Torah all is well, but if not you will be buried here!
~The Talmud
And so many more, I could give anyone here more but it depends on request

ANS

Quran does not say that it has brought any "new" message!!
It is only confirmation of the "same age old" religion of all prophets of
all times.

It says that it "confirms" the previous scriptures and "Stands as a

protector" over them.

It confirms what is true in those scriptures and corrects where human

hands have corrupted the original message.

If you follow Islam and Quran, you indeed follow teachings of all past
prophets.

Q. Seeker (Who is, 1062)

Thank you for your words of insight. I would like to ask you a question. Do you believe as the
bible says that GOD is a spirit and by his word all things were made in the beginning?

ANS

You have asked a very good question.

1. We really can not say anything about the personality of God.

2. We only know and say, only what He says about Himself in His
revealed books.

3. In Quran God says “There is nothing (anywhere) like Him” and

‘There is no one even comparable to Him” and sentences like that.

4. So the words used by God to describe His Personality and Attributes

are allegorical and must not be taken in strict literal sense.

5. So the statements that God is a Spirit and must be worshipped in

spirit, is in contrast to people who make idols and images of God and
worship them.

6. Spirit of God is most unlike the Spirits of humans, who were Created
by God.

7. In the same way, we interpret the words which say that God, sees,
hears and does things with His hands….etc. We believe in these
words, but never try to find the real position, because our minds and
imaginations are limited and cannot fully comprehend the real
meanings.
8. This is the safest way, otherwise there is strong chances that we
may go off the right and straight path.

I hope that this serves your query, can I be on any further help?

Q. Shiela (Who is, 1084)

Let me know if I'm wrong on this point, ok? In the Muslim faith people of both genders are
supposed to be chaste before marriage, right? Or not?

ANS

You are very correct on this one… both Muslim men and women are
supposed to practice sexual morality both before and after the
marriage.
Sex and extra marital affairs for both men and women are not
permitted in Islam….. Sex is only permitted under the marriage
contract between husband and wife.

Sexual morality before and after marriage is hallmark of all revealed

religions, Judaism, Christianity, Islam and even in Hinduism to the best
of my knowledge.

Q. Unknown (Who is, 1107)

Burqa Ban in school? Mazgaon in Mumbai have an example !

Submitted by net news Saturday, 23 January 2010 00:00

Clad in a black burqa, the biology teacher walks briskly into a

classroom where seventh-graders greet her with a noisy chorus of
assalamu alaikum. The teacher, lifting her face veil, embarks on her
lecture on the food chain and regales her students with facts about the
predatory habits of different animals. After the class, she leaves the
room, vanishing into a group of identically dressed women teachers
relaxing in the common room downstairs.

This scene could well belong to any moribund Muslim-run madrassa or

maktab anywhere in the country, but it doesn't. The school in question
is the Al-Jamiatul Fikriya, an Islamic international school run from a
three-storied building at Mazgaon in Mumbai; more importantly, the
burqa-clad teacher is not a Muslim but a Maharashtrian Hindu called
Shefali Shirodkar. And Shirodkar isn't alone - she's one of half a dozen
Hindu teachers who observe full purdah while they are on the premises
of the school.
While liberal men and liberated women in the Muslim community
desperately want to tear off the custom of wearing the "oppressive"
burqa or hijab, these Hindu women seem to have no issues with it and
even claim they are "comfortable" in its voluminous folds. "As a
teacher, my job is to impart education. Why should a burqa be a
barrier in giving education?" asks Shirodkar, who joined the school in
2008 and claims that she immensely enjoys her job along with the
Islamic dress code. So does Rakhi Hawale, the school's librarian, who,
however , was a bit hesitant when she first donned the tent-like gown
five years ago. "I tripped a few times initially, but now I wear it with the
ease of my Muslim colleagues," says Hawale who is unmarried and
hasn't given a thought to whether her future spouse will object to her
wearing a burqa. "I convinced my parents and hopefully will be able to
convince my husband too," she smiles.

Suhail Sheikh, the school's founder, claims he is just following the

Islamic principle of justice which does not allow a Muslim to
discriminate against his or her non-Muslim employees. "These teachers
were recruited after rounds of interviews. We told them about the
Islamic dress code in advance. I think it's a healthy trend that non-
Muslims have started teaching in Islamic schools," explains 41-year-old
Sheikh, who himself is not highly educated but values education a lot.
"It's open to everyone," he says of his school. "I hope we'll soon have
non-Muslim students too."

It was this 'secular' approach of the school management that attracted

retired colonel N S Rawat to the administrator's job here a year ago. "I
have served in the army, which is one of the most secular institutions
in our country. I also saw this job as an opportunity to understand
Islam and Muslims better," he says. For the 30-odd faculty and other
staff and 300 students, from standard one to ten, studying Islam is part
of the ritual. So, from the morning assembly, when a hymn in Urdu is
chanted loudly, to the quotes from the Quran and the Hadith written
prominently on the walls, the school wears Islam as a mascot.

Both Hindu and Muslim teachers see their tenure here as a unique
opportunity to bridge the communal chasm. "I knew very little about
Islam and Muslims before I joined here," says Reema Dicholkar, who
teaches Marathi. Dicholkar says her students - boys in kurta-pyjama
and skullcaps and girls above the fifth standard in mandatory burqas -
are curious to know about Hinduism. "They listen to stories from the
Ramayana and the Mahabharata with rapt attention. Just as I like to
hear stories about the Prophet, they are interested in stories about
Hindu gods and goddesses," says Dicholkar, who was a little hesitant
about working in an Islamic school when she was offered the job a few
years ago. "For me it was an alien world. I never had a Muslim friend or
neighbour. I thought Muslims were angry and violent. Many of my
relatives didn't approve of it, but my father backed me, and now I
enjoy my job," says Dicholkar who lives in Lalbaug, a Maharashtrian
Hindu hub in Mumbai.

The first two hours of the day are devoted to Islamic teachings,
imparted by maulanas, most of them graduates of the Islamic
seminary Darul Uloom at Deoband (UP). The school, which follows two
syllabi - those of the Maharashtra Board and Cambridge University's
International General Certificate Education (IGCE) - despite its orthodox
discipline, has instilled modern ambitions in its students. Says Mehek
Beg, 9th-standard student: "I am interested in science and want to
become an astronaut." When asked if the burqa will be a barrier in
achieving her goal, she ripostes: "The burqa is not a barrier to my
Hindu teachers, who had never worn it before they stepped in here. It
should not be a hurdle on my way to becoming an astronaut,
Inshallah ." To which, everyone, including chinky-eyed Beg's Hindu
teachers, nod.

How the War Monger lobby Works in USA?

Manufacturing Consent For Attack On Iran:

How to Save the Obama Presidency: Bomb Iran

Circumstances are propitious, and the American people would

support it.

By Daniel Pipes

February 02, 2010 "National Review" -- I do not customarily offer

advice to a president whose election I opposed, whose goals I fear, and
whose policies I work against. But here is an idea for Barack Obama to
salvage his tottering administration by taking a step that protects the
United States and its allies.

If Obama’s personality, identity, and celebrity captivated a majority of

the American electorate in 2008, those qualities proved ruefully
deficient for governing in 2009. He failed to deliver on employment
and health care, he failed in foreign-policy forays small (e.g., landing
the 2016 Olympics) and large (relations with China and Japan). His
counterterrorism record barely passes the laugh test…

He needs a dramatic gesture to change the public perception of him as

a light-weight, bumbling ideologue, preferably in an arena where the
stakes are high, where he can take charge, and where he can trump
expectations.

Such an opportunity does exist: Obama can give orders for the U.S.
military to destroy Iran’s nuclear-weapon capacity.

Circumstances are propitious. First, U.S. intelligence agencies have

reversed their preposterous 2007 National Intelligence Estimate, the
one that claimed with “high confidence” that Tehran had “halted its
nuclear weapons program.” ..

Second, if the apocalyptic-minded leaders in Tehran get the Bomb,

they render the Middle East yet more volatile and dangerous. ..

Third, polling shows longstanding American support for an attack on

the Iranian nuclear infrastructure:

Los Angeles Times/Bloomberg, January 2006: 57 percent of Americans

favor military intervention if Tehran pursues a program that could
enable it to build nuclear arms.

Zogby International, October 2007: 52 percent of likely voters support

a U.S. military strike to prevent Iran from building a nuclear weapon;
29 percent oppose such a step.

McLaughlin & Associates, May 2009: When asked whether they would
support “using the [U.S.] military to attack and destroy the facilities in
Iran which are necessary to produce a nuclear weapon,” 58 percent of
600 likely voters supported the use of force and 30 percent opposed it.

Fox News, September 2009: When asked “Do you support or oppose
the United States taking military action to keep Iran from getting
nuclear weapons?” 61 percent of 900 registered voters supported
military action and 28 opposed it…

Not only does a strong majority — 57, 52, 58, 61, and 61 percent in
these five polls — already favor using force, but after a strike
Americans will presumably rally around the flag, sending that number
much higher.

Fourth, if the U.S .limited its strike to taking out Iran’s nuclear facilities
and did not attempt any regime change, it would require few “boots on
the ground” and entail relatively few casualties, making an attack
more politically palatable.

Just as 9/11 caused voters to forget George W. Bush’s meandering

early months, a strike on Iranian facilities would dispatch Obama’s
feckless first year down the memory hole and transform the domestic
political scene. It would sideline health care, prompt Republicans to
work with Democrats, and make the netroots squeal, independents
reconsider, and conservatives swoon….(Abridged)

— Daniel Pipes is director of the Middle East Forum and Taube

distinguished visiting fellow at the Hoover Institution of Stanford
University.

Q. Arnie (Who is 2, 479)

MUQ wrote :
"Ignorant" includes those people who have closed their minds to the truth.......
Our prophet also never engaged any one in long theological discussions splitting hairs and using
"yogically verifiable" proofs.
what you are saying is that your prophet, islam and the umma expect you muslims to close your
minds and be ignorant, stupid and idiotic. it is exactly what a ignorant, stupid and idiotic prophet
of islam is expected to be.

ANS

"Ignorant" includes those people who have closed their minds to the
truth.

They have "pre-conceived" stand that I will never accept the truth,
except what me and my forefathers believed in.

In the idiom of Quran, these people are also Ignorant, irrespective of

whatever knowledge they have gained.

The purpose of Islam, Muslims and Quran is to convey the true

message of Islam to these people.

If after this, they continue to argue and debate unnecessarily, then we

have to part company with such people saying "peace or Salaam" be
on to you.

And this is the practice I adopt in my discussions on this and other

threads.

At least I become sure that I have conveyed my message to that

person, and it is on he or she to accept or reject.

Our prophet also never engaged any one in long theological

discussions splitting hairs and using "yogically verifiable" proofs.

I try to follow his example to the best of my abilities.

Yes, God asks our prophet to convey the message.... and only
concentrate on those people who hearken to the message.

God tells His messenger to argue with people of book in best of

language and with wisdom.... but if they remain adamant... then he
should leave them to their ways.

God says that "it is not in your hand (O! Mohammad) to guide whom
you want, It is God who guides to whom He pleases"

God says "To whom God wants to show mercy, his (or her) breasts He
opens for Islam...."

That is the path Muslims should follow in preaching Islam.

We should deliver our message to all. If there are some genuine doubts
or some one needs some genuine clarification or has a valid objection,
we should try our utmost to provide assistance.

But those people who are adamant, use foul language and not ready to
accept truth at any level...they should be better left alone.
Regarding Islam being the True way and Path.... Muslims should not
have any doubt.
They are supposed to be the Leaders and not those who are Led by
others!!

Truth and falsehood are never given the same rights in any society.

Q. Aussie Boy (Who is 2, 1098)

And the teachings Jesus of according to the gospel of Barnabas proves that you have the wrong
Mohammed and your Quran is corrupted.

Im glad that you can say these things now that your out of KSA...finally you can seek the truth

ANS

No Gospel of Barnabas shows us the real teachings of Jesus. These are

not teachings of St. Paul but from the Jesus' own lips.

This Gospel has also suffered in preservation and transmission (as

have the other books of OT & NT), but it still retains some matter of
truth.

That is why We are not dogmatic about this gospel. We view it with
caution and reserve.

As regards you second remark, I am currently on vacations in my

native country India, and I will be back in KSA in the first week of Jan
Inshallah i.e. God willing.!!\

My stand inside or outside KSA has been same, to speak truth and be
with truth.

Q. Citizen (Who is 2, 557)

The problem is that the GOD Mohammed spoke of in the Koran, and the Quran is not the same
GOD that Jesus Christ believed in. Mohammed used the word ALLAH referring to the moon
GOD that the Arabs worshipped before he conquered and converted them to a new religion he
created from his own idea's. This is where Muslims are confused. Mohammed didn't tell them
that the Allah he was speaking of was the moon GOD.
Mohammed mentioned Jesus in the Koran to keep the Muslims confused. ….

ANS

Your post is based on multiple mistake and misconceptions.

1. First of that is that you say that God in which Mohammad believed in
was different from God of Jesus, Moses, Abraham and other Jewish
prophets. Just because in one language it is called Allah and in another
YHWH or Elohim or God would not make them different.

2. Second misconception is that Allah is moon god…. In Quran Allah is

described as Creator of Son, Moon, Stars and every thing in this
Universe, how can He be called as moon god? There is not the least
evidence that Arabs equated Allah with moon at any stage of their
lives.

3. Third misconception is that Mohammad did not believe in ten

commandments of Moses… he indeed believed in these 10
commandments and it can still be verified. The Sabbath Command
was only for jews and it was changed to Friday as Christians changed
their day to Sunday.

4. Fourth misconception is that Islamic law totally abrogates Jewish

law. If you look closely, you will find that in Principle both laws are
same. However Islamic law is a modified and better version of old
Jewish laws. Many provisions of that laws had become impracticable or
were very harsh. They were modified so as to be applicable for all
ages.

5. This is time to create bridge between three Monotheistic religions of

the world and not to create rift and fighting between them.

Your post therefore was lacking both in taste and was full of errors.

Q. Citizen (Who is 2, 558)

In reply to MUQ-It is by reason and logic that Mohammad is speaking of a different GOD in the
Koran then the GOd of Abraham. GOD does not change his laws to please certain groups of
people just to please them. THe one true GOD remains the same to all people. I read the Koran
and it did not mention GOD'S 10 Commandments as His law in the Koran. The Koran mentions
Jesus who worshipped the GOD of Abraham. ALLAH'S laws are different they are the laws
Mohammad wrote. You must understand if Mohammad wrote them then he himself declared that
he is the one true GOD and that the GOD of Jesus is a a different GOD. Do you understand now
who Mohammad is. When you follow the laws of the one that wrote them, then you are obeying
that person as your GOD. Do you understand that?
Peace be upon you and may the GOD of Abraham enlighten your mind.

ANS
I told you that Allah of Quran is none other that YWH, Elohim or God of
English people. But it seems that you will not understand that.

So let me point out to you some attributes of Allah as mentioned in

Quran, and then let us say that your YHWH, Elohim or God is any
different from that:

1. Allah is the sole Creator of Universe and every thing in it. He has
created, Sun, Moon, Stars, Galaxies, Plants, Animals and humans and
every thing known or not known to us in this Universe.

2. Allah is All Powerful, Almighty, Source of all knowledge, omniscient,

Merciful and Just.

3. Allah is Self living, Eternal, without beginning and without End. He

gives life and He gives death. He feeds every one and He does not
need to be fed. He never sleeps or slumbers. He has most beautiful
names to humans.

4. He is Merciful, Oft forgiving, His Mercy overshadows His anger. He is

a Just God, He likes all good deeds and talks. He detests all bad deeds
and vanity.

There are many such exalted qualities mentioned in Quran for Allah.
Now let me see in which way Allah is different from YHWH, Elohim or
God? Just because the other names are in Hebrew or English and Allah
is in Arabic will make them different?

Mohammad never said that he is worshipping a God different than that

of Jesus, Moses of Abraham. On the contrary, it is recorded in Quran
that our God and your God is one and the same. We also worship the
God of Abraham, Ishmael, Isaac , Jacob, Moses, David and Jesus.

Therefore I feel that your post is based on ignorance and insufficient

information.

May peace be on to you also.

Q. Citizen (Who is 2, 579)

How is that then that the sins of Islam prophets are corrected by Allah. Were the sins the Prophet
Muhammad committed corrected by Allah? Yes we know what the old testament GOD said about
sin and gave the 10 commandments to Moses, but why does Islam say their prophets sins are
corrected by Allah? When now where in the old testament there is no writing about that?
ANS

First of all you have to understand the meaning of word sin, when it is
applied to prophets.

Prophets by definition are humans chosen by God Almighty to serve as

Leader and Role Model for their followers.

So God’s choice has to be much superior than any human can choose.
(we have seen how GWB the Great , misused the trust, whole nation of
USA put in him not once but twice).

So prophets are free and protected by God from any crime that shows
moral deficiency. Like Stealing, Robbing, Raping, Killing Innocent and
worshipping false gods…

But prophets after all are humans, some times due to human nature
they commit some mistakes. And these mistakes are mostly errors of
judgment and not transgression or rebellion.

Since the Office of Prophet by very definition is a role model for heir
followers, so even this mistake, this error or judgment is immediately
corrected by God by sending him revelation.

These mistakes of prophets are all the sins that they have.

But in books of Bible we find many acts committed by prophets that

show moral defects of highest order like:

a. Noah drank wine, was lying naked in his tent.

b. Abraham and Isaac called their wives as their sisters just to save
their lives (an act which even a common man will not do).

c. Jacob cheated his Father in Law Laban and did so many acts which
do not befit a pius man, forget a prophet of God.

d. That Lot committed incest with his two daughters and got issues
from them.

e. That Judah, son of Jacob committed incest with his daughter in law,
Tamar and produced twins, one of which figures in the genealogy of
Jesus!!

f. That David had sex with Wife of Uriah , while she was married, then
got her husband killed thru deceit and then married her.
g. That Solomon worshipped false gods and even made temples for
them.

h. That Aaron, a prophet of God, made a golden calf, and worshipped it

and asked others to worship it.

(all these incidents are recorded in the books of Bible, I can give you
references if you wish).

These acts are beyond the dignity of a common pious man , what to
say about prophet of God.

That is where you need guidance from Quran. In Quran none of these
incidents are ever mentioned and many of them have been
condemned as lies against these prophets of God.

Quran only mentions some mistakes of prophets that pertain only to

error of Judgment and these were always corrected.

Now you tell me, how can I answer your question that How God deals
with sins of prophets.

The question itself is not correct because sins and prophets are poles
apart!!

Q. Citizen (Who is 2, 581)

This is confusing- If the old testament bible is not true then why do muslims repeat scripture from
it?
If it is corrupt then point out what is not true.
Seeking answers why muslims repeat scripture from the old testament then turn around and say it
is corrupted, with out pointing out what is corrupted by language dialect, and how its meaning is
different to muslims the to Jews and Christians. Their is no difference in meaning in the old
testament between Jews and Christians. Both accept that it refers to a coming messiah. Yet,
muslims repeat this scripture as true then say its wrong. That is what is confusing.

ANS

I do not blame you if you are confused. You have not understood the
methods of any debate.
When we quote any thing from Bible, it is an arguments against you.
That does not mean that we consider as Word of God.
In the same way, when you quote any verse from Quran or book of
Hadith, it is for Muslims who consider them as scriptures, not that you
also consider them as Scriptures.
I hope that I have made the matters clear to you. Now let me tell you
what are Muslims position regarding these Books of Bible:
1. Our position is that originally these books were based on revelation
from God and they contained nothing but Word of God.
2. But over the years, the originals books were corrupted by the
Learned men of Jews, by adding or by subtracting some thing.
3. Some times the original books were lost and spurious books by
similar names took their place.
4. Some times the books were translated into another language and
the originals were lost. What we have then are translations and not
original.
5. The books available with us today, bear but scant resemblance with
the books when they were written originally.
6. But inspite of all these defects, these books do contain some portion
of the original books and some portions of the original word of God.
7. What we need is a separation device, an standard by which these
books can be checked and verified. Such an standard is Quran which
contains nothing but pure revelation of God to Last and Final
messenger.
8. We Muslims use Quran as standard to check Bible, anything of Bible
which is confirmed by Quran, we also confirm it, any thing which Quran
rejects, we also reject and any thing on which Quran is Silent, we also
keep silence.
9. This is most logical and reasonable and broadminded view in such
cases.
In case you are in any doubt about what is the actual position of OT &
NT books, I will give you one sample. I have a Bible in front of me,
which was published in Philippine and is titled as “Christian Community
Bible”. The editors have put an introduction before each book, to
instruct readers how these books came to be written.
This is how they Introduced the Book of Genesis
“ There was not one author, but several. The people of Israel were
formed through time by the gathering of Nomadic tribes which neither
knew how to read nor write. They brought along with them the
memories of their forefathers and the signs God realized amongst
them…”
“When these tribes settled in Palestine, they slowly entered into a new
culture of writing. Scribes surrounding the King wrote the laws and the
beliefs of nation”

“During Solomon’s reign (10th Century BC) an UNKNOWN WRITER often

called the “YEHWIST” wrote a first history of God’s people. In doing so
he freely used Babylonian literature and poetry…”

“ Much Later when the Jews returned from the exile in Babylon (5th
Century BC) their priests added many paragraphs, which are indicated
in italics. The priests were authors of the poem about creation in
seven days…”

After reading the above passage, can any one still believe that Book of
Genesis was written by Moses or it is Word of God?

I can give you similar passages for EACH and EVERY book of OT and NT
and it will show that NONE of the Books of OT or NT (as we have today)
have been written by the AUTHORS WHOSE NAME APPEAR ON THE
COVER OF BOOKS!!

Q. Citizen (Who is 2 , 584)

Where the contradiction comes in then is that what Islam says in the article "QURAN-WHY WE
ARE HERE" is different then the old testament bible. The explanation of Islam-"WHY WERE
ARE HERE IS NOT INCLUDED IN THE BIBLE. If the Quran is correct that would have been
in genesis but it is not there. If genesis is wrong account then, why is it not publicly corrected by
Islam.

ANS

I think you need simple lessons in law courses.

When there are contradictions in two statements, only one of them can
be true or both can be wrong, there is no third option.

Now it is PROVEN By Jewish and Christian records that their Books have
been tempered with and have suffered in transmission and copying
thru many centuries.

So the books of Bible , have lost their credibility as a legal document.

Quran on the other hand is Preserved and Protected since the day it
was revealed, and it contains nothing else but the Pure Word of God.
So Quran is the standard by which Biblical statements have to be
judged.

That is why I said, that we confirm from the Bible what is confirmed in
the Quran.

We reject from the Bible what is rejected by Quran and

We keep silent where Quran is silent.

So if “Why we are here” is described in Quran in some way and in Bible

in some other way, and there is no way to correlate them . … then the
statement of Bible has simply to be rejected.

Where does contradiction come into the logic.

The Contradiction will come when you believe that BOTH Bible and
Quran have Equal status and BOTH are Words of God and BOTH are
preserved and authenticated to the same level.

I think you do not carefully read my posts.

Q. Citizen (Who is 2, 589)

Peace. I think you are having fun here. You know what the test is all about. Asking God is joke.
You are very well versed and educated, but are unwilling to explain the test as you know it to be.

ANS

Why asking God is a joke? Is there some one who can claim that he or
she will not die?

What happens when we die?

Modern People say: Nothing happens when we die.

If you ask the Source of This Knowledge: They say it is only our Guess
or Wish. We have no real knowledge about it.

Who should have Real knowledge? Only one who is the Creator of
Humans and no one!!

Thank you for considering me well versed and educated (it will not go
well with some people on this thread), but the Test is “Living our life to
best of our abilities in line with the instructions given by our
Creator….thru our prophets”.

I can explain more, if you seem interested. If you consider this also as
part of Joke, then I cannot help you.

Q. Garet (Who is 2, 475)

Maybe the humanity should indeed worship a single creator. No doubt about that. But the
majority on the earth hates your so called religion of Allah, because we know no creator would
call for the death of those who do no believe in him, nor ask for 'religious tax'. That's mighty silly
of a 'god'. What makes us laugh is only your funny attempts to defend such a religion, o Moslem
apologetic. You can indeed follow a universal religion, but unfortunately Islam can never be that.

ANS

I think that your desire that humanity should worship their Common
Creator is only a hollow wish and you are not ready to make any
adjustment and sacrifices for them.

If Islamic God was as you had described, how come it is spreading so

fast in all parts of the world?

Allah does not want all non Muslims to be Killed, it is no where

mentioned in Quran and Prophetic sayings that all non Muslims should
be killed. If that was the case how come Millions of Arab Christians and
Jews are still living in Arab countries despite 1400 years of Islamic rule?

So your objections are not based on real information but only hearsay.

Jizya is not “religious tax” , it is the money they give for their
“protection” and the peace they enjoy in Islamic lands while continue
to live in their own ways.

Islam and Muslims have no apology to make and, their dealings with
Non Muslims have been far superior than what they have received at
the hands of Non Muslims.

Q. Joel (Who is 2, 474)

By "divine origin", I guess you mean the mumbo jumbo theories of how an extra-cosmic,
anthropomorphic, creationist god who manufactured the cosmos out of nothing by saying "Be"
conveyed plagiarized, irrational, sectarian trash to an "invisible" angel who "flew" down through
a "gap" in the closed cosmic system and passed that on to a hallucinating fool who claimed to be
this fictitious god's chosen messenger !
 ! Some of these findings have shattered the so-called scientific claims about the age of humanity
!

ANS

Why you “Yogic manners” leave you, when you start discussing other
scriptures?

Does your “Yogic Teachings” not teach you to be polite and do not tell
lies?

From your description about Quran , one can guess the depth of your
“Yogic Realisation” and the level on which you operate.

How can any one have any confidence on any thing which you
“Yogically analyse” to be true?

My advise is that you need much more practice in Yoga, till you can
control your emotions and speak in civil language with those who are
of different faith than you.

Rock Records show that human civilization is not more than 50,000
years old. Before that humans and apes were indistinguishable from
each other.

May be Satyug, Treta and Dwapar refer to these ages…when no

humans were living on the earth. Only\ beasts and animals.

What your “Yogic Powers” say on this subject?

Q. Joel ( Who is 2, 513)

It’s irritating correcting you every time as it’s evident that you are not only scientifically illiterate
but that you’re also ignorant of the depth of inner knowledge that the Yogi gains through direct
experiences in the supraphysical states of consciousness from where he can unite his elevated
individual consciousness with any object of investigation and know firsthand what the inner
cause, nature and function of the phenomenon is all about and how it connects with the rest of the
cosmos…

Yes, the majority of the world's population is dysfunctional at the level of the cellular,
subconscient, vital and mind levels of consciousness due to hypogamy, inbreeding, demonic
possessions and non-vegetarian diet and I am not just saying this as a thought but as a matter of
direct experiences with the consciousness of people who the Yogi decides to investigate.....and
much more...
ANS

I must congratulate you for posting such a beautiful and totally non
intelligible post. The words and magnificent but there is no meaning or
purpose behind it.

That is what we also notice in the preaching and sermon of "thousands

of religious gurus" in India. They preach beautiful message of peace,
love and denying worldly pleasures, while each one is competing with
other to increase their followings, grabbing lands for their Ashrams and
living the most luxurious lives.

In fact their sayings and their doings are poles apart.... the same is the
case with you also. You are all love for the poor animals and how they
should be saved from being killed.... But you will not do anything to
help the cause and take care of at least a few old and sick animals
your selves.

I might or might not have taken my logic from Dr. Zakir Naik is not the
point. You should answer my question , just because Dr. Zakir Naik
also posed them would not make them null and void.

If Yogic science does not recommend eating of every thing that is

pleasing and nutritious, no doubt the Yogis have very negative concept
of life and the world. No doubt they thing that a cave, or a remote
hilltop or an isolated place is the best place to increase and develop
their Yogic Powers. They might live even a thousand years.... I do not
argue.... but what sort of life will be that?

That is why I said that there are two type of Hinduism.... one for select
Yogis like you and another for common folks which we see in hundreds
and thousands of temples scattered thru out India.

Q. Joel (Who is 2, 533)

Then what is it, if it is not paganism?

Muhammad whimsically destroyed all the other images and icons in the Kaaba but for no valid
reason retained the dumb black Kaaba stone and moreover kissed, hugged and wept over it.

How paradoxical and hypocritical !

ANS
1. Paganism is to assign by themselves names, attributes, figures,
statues , rituals etc for worship of God All Mighty…. Without the
guidance of revelation and without the authority and example of True
prophets of God.

2. Our prophet cleansed Kaaba and restored it to the original condition

and original purpose for which it was built by the Prophet Abraham.

3. We know that Abraham built the Kaaba , the same way as you
KNOW that Ram was born in Ayodhya and Krishna was born in Mathura
and so many other beliefs of Hinduism.

4. Kaaba is not a Sanskrit word at all…. Sanskrit is derived from old

Persian while Arabic and Hebrew re sister language. So you leave all
your linguistic expertise with you and save it for simple folks like Mary
etc , who seem to hang to your every word.

5. What pagans do or seem to do is on their own authority and that has

no authority in any religion. They do as they see their fathers and
forefathers doing, and that is the best of logic for them.

Q. Joel (Who is 2, 549)

If Muhammad claimed that "invisible" angels visited him and that

during the Meraj he met the old prophets and god then why is it
impossible for a great Yogi like Aurobindo to maintain contact with
those who know how to communicate with him? And if you dent this
then you'll also have to deny Muhammad's claims in order to be fair
minded. [/QUOTE]

ANS

There is no comparison between a prophet of God and a Yogi at all.

The prophets are humans selected by God to guide a nation. They
receive direct inspiration from God and they are able to see Angels and
God performs miracles (some time ) on their hands.

The teachings of prophets are 100 % from God and they are perfect
role models for their followers.

Yogis, scholars, pious persons etc are normal human beings. Most of
yogis and so called spiritual teachers control their senses by exercise
and self control. They develop some mental powers thru which they
can influence others.
The teachings are wordings of these people can be right or can be
wrong.
There is no guarantee for that from God. People may or may not follow
these yogis and teachers without any warnings from God.

Therefore it is not even possible to compare a Prophet like Mohammad

with a yogi like Sri Aurobondo or people from the same category. It is
like comparing apples against oranges.

Q. Joel (Who is 2, 558)

But your god is fictional as he is extra-cosmic, anthropomorphic and SOMEHOW creates out of
nothing.

Reason, intuition, experience and experiment prove that the Cause has to inhere within the system
and that the Effect is nothing else but the Cause in manifestation.

ANS

It is not for us to say what God should be and what He should not be.
W e do not have any authority to say that. Only one who can speak on
any authority on this subject is God Himself!!

You do not understand what is Creation. If every cause has to be

within the system, then how did it start al all? There has to be an
outside agency to begin the act of Creation and that agency cannot be
the part of system which was created.

This is simple logic which is beyond your “yogic Perception”. This is

not my fault.

Now it seems that in addition to Yoga, you have become an expert in

Bible also. To say that Comforter promised by Jesus was to come at
the end of time indicates that you have never read or pondered on the
Bible at all. Jesus was speaking of a Comforter (another, like him) who
will guide them into ALL TRUTH. What help is that guidance if it comes
at the End of Time?

It seems you “Yogic Powers” leave you when you deal with books that
are outside your narrow thinking.

If you need any proof for that, just look at your comment about Quran!!

Q. Joel (Who is 2, 558)

But your god is fictional as he is extra-cosmic, anthropomorphic and SOMEHOW creates out of
nothing.

Reason, intuition, experience and experiment prove that the Cause has to inhere within the system
and that the Effect is nothing else but the Cause in manifestation.

So, the cosmic manifestation is the result of a self-existent IMMANENT Cause and not due to
some fake extra-cosmic, anthropomoprhic scriptural god who creates the primal energy, matter,
consciousness, mind, life and emotions out of nothing by saying "Be".
The biblical Comforter refers to the prophet of the End Times and not to Muhammad.

But where content is concerned the Quran preaches bull shit !

ANS

It is not for us to say what God should be and what He should not be.
W e do not have any authority to say that. Only one who can speak on
any authority on this subject is God Himself!!

You do not understand what is Creation. If every cause has to be

within the system, then how did it start al all? There has to be an
outside agency to begin the act of Creation and that agency cannot be
the part of system which was created.

This is simple logic which is beyond your “yogic Perception”. This is

not my fault.

Now it seems that in addition to Yoga, you have become an expert in

Bible also. To say that Comforter promised by Jesus was to come at
the end of time indicates that you have never read or pondered on the
Bible at all. Jesus was speaking of a Comforter (another, like him) who
will guide them into ALL TRUTH. What help is that guidance if it comes
at the End of Time?

It seems you “Yogic Powers” leave you when you deal with books that
are outside your narrow thinking.

If you need any proof for that, just look at your comment about Quran!!

Q. Joel (Who is 2, 561)

Cause and Effect have to essentially arise within the same system - in fact, the Effect is nothing
else but the Cause in manifestation !

Only this explanation that is supported by reason, experience and experiment stands, all else is
fiction.
If there exists an "outside" agency that SOMEHOW manufactured the cosmos (primal energy,
matter, consciousness, mind, life and emotions) from nothing, then tell me what connects the
extra-cosmic creator with his creation? Can two singularities co-exist without there existing a
causal link between them?

ANS

The only “self Existent” thing is the Creator and every thing else is
Created by Him.
All theories that try to justify self existence of matter, energy or space
are all faulty and not logical.
But the same rules we apply to creations cannot be applied to their
Creator, this is so simple and so logical that it is nothing strange if a
“yogi” like you cannot understand it!!
You are “trained” to look for crookedness where none exists, so I am
not in the least surprised at your lack of understanding!!!
How God controls and plans and executes His design on this Universe
is beyond our knowledge or understanding. Because it is a unique
thing and no model like that exists, so we can experiment and verify.
Most of your philosophy is the result of your own confusion and no one
can help you, if you look for twists and crookedness in every thing.

Q. Joel (Who is 2 , 570)

Quranic Teachings, Prayer

.
ANS

I think, I have heard enough boasts from you about Superhuman ship
of Sri Aurobindo and superiority of his teachings above and over Quran
and prophetic sayings.

It is you who is to be blamed, because I am sure that Sri Aurobindo, If

he was a great thinker, would never have boasted about his superiority
in the way you do.

So let us put you to test and see, the actual comparison.

The first topic I have selected is Prayer, which no doubt is a very

efficient means of concentrating thoughts and brings humans closer to
their Creator.
I would give here the modalities and the methods which our Prophet
gave and practiced and which Muslims all over the world are practicing
for past 1400 years.

Let us see what Sri Aurobindo has to offer in this regard for his
followers.

Since the topic is very big I will break it down into sections, for ease of
comparison.

1. Importance of Prayer:

Quran and prophetic sayings have laid extreme importance to the

performance of Regular Prayers. Those who willfully reject it are no
longer considered as true Muslims.

2. To whom it is Obligatory:

Prayer is obligatory for every male and female who is above the age of
adulthood. Women under period and after childbirth are exempted
from prayers till the days are over.

3. Timings:

Prayers are obligatory five times during day and night.

These are

-Before Sunrise,
- Noon,
- After Noon,
- After Sun Set
- Night, when it gets dark.

Voluntary prayers are recommended any number of times, especially

during last part of night.

Prayers are banned at three timings, when Sun is Rising, When it is at

exact Midday and when it is setting (because sun worshippers pray to
sun during these timings!)

4. Call for Prayer:

When it is time for prayer, A Muslim with a loud voice gives the call for
Prayer (This human touch is much superior to lifeless things like
blowing Conch, Ringing Bells, Set up Fires etc).

The man calls with a loud Voice:

a. Allah is the Greatest (4 Times)

b. I bear Witness that only Allah is to be worshipped (2 Times).

c. I bear Witness that Mohammad is messenger of Allah (2 Times).

d. Come to Prayer ( 2 Times).

e. Come to Success (2 Times).

f. Allah is the Greatest (2 Times).

g. There is no one worthy of worship except Allah (1 Time).

5. Muslims gather for Prayer:

hearing the call, Muslims leave their work and gather in the mosque for
prayer.

6. Cleaning before Prayer:

Before Muslims enter Mosque, they make sure that there clothes are
clean , then they further clean themselves in following manner:

a. They wash their hands.( 3 Times)

b. They wash their mouth, gargle and clean their nose (3 Times)

c. They wash their full face. (3 Times)

d. They wash their both hands upto elbow joint.(three times)

e. They clean their hairs with wet hands.(Once)

f. They wash both feet upto ankles.(Once)

The place they perform prayers must also be clean. So with clean
body, clean clothes and with pure intentions they come to offer their
prayers before their Creator.
They enter mosque, perform voluntary prayers and wait for the main
congregational prayers.

7. Congregational Prayers:
When sufficient Muslims gather, the prayers are held . Here is how it
goes:
8. Direction for Prayers:
a. All Muslims line up in rows facing Makkah. They face towards
Kaabah, the House constructed by Prophet Abraham 4000 years ago,
for worship of One True God of Universe.
b. They stand in rows, shoulder to shoulder; there is no distinction of
race, color or wealth. The man coming late stands in the following
rows, all are equal before their Creator.
c. First there are rows for men and then for women.
9. Leader or Imam:
a. When the rows are formed. One of the congregations; who is more
learned, more pious, and has more knowledge of Quran comes forward
as Imam and leads the prayers.
b. This post is not hereditary, nor it gives any special position to Imam,
he is just like other Muslims following him.
10. Act of Prayer:
The prayer is divided into Units (RAKAT). It varies between two to four
depending upon time of prayer. Each Unit is almost identical and
consists of:
a. Standing:
Muslims lower their gaze to in front of them and stand in meditation
listening to the recital of Quran by the Imam.
The recital begins with the opening chapter of Quran which is
“All praise is to Allah, the Cherisher of Universe, Most Gracious, Most
Merciful, Owner of the Last Day.”
“To You only we worship and from You only we ask for assistance,
Guide us unto right path. The path of those on whom was Your
bounties and not the path of those who were under Your wrath or
those who went astray”
Then Imam reads some other portion from Quran and people listen and
ponder on the meaning.
b. RUKOO or Bending:
Once the recital is over, Imam says Allah Akbar, i.e. Allah is the
Greatest and every one bows down before their Creator, chanting “our
Lord You are Great” (three times, or more,)
Then they stand up saying “Allah hears who praises Him” and “ Our
Lord, for You is all the praise”.
c. Prostration:
Then Imam and all Muslims perform prostration to show their
humbleness before their Creator.
They put their face, their nose, both hands, both knees and feet on
ground and chant “Our Lord, You are Highest” three times or more and
people may add some other supplication.
They perform prostration two times in each prayer unit.
After Prostration they stand up and that completes One Unit of Prayer.
They perform the other unit exactly as the first one. After completing
two units they sit down and offer following supplication
“all Good things and all salutations are for Allah. May peace and
blessings be to you O prophet and mercy be on to you. Peace be on to
us and all other righteous persons”
Then at the end of prayer, they send their salutations to Prophet
Mohammad and his progeny.
The prayer ends with “Salam Alaykum” meaning peace be on to you.
I gave you all these details, to show how our prophet arranged and
organized this practical system for every muslim.
He did it single handedly and it is still being followed by Millions upon
Millions of Muslims in every part of the world.
Now let us see how your Sri Aurobindo has done in this regard. Please
tell us how he has organized congregational prayers for his followers
and what improvements he has carried out in this field.
I have examples in many fields like that, let us see, how your Yogic
Powers match with these simple and practical guidelines

Q. Joel (Who is 2, 589)

To: Joel

I am now taking another “down to earth” topic this time and it is

instructions regarding “Taking Food or Drinks” by our prophet.

You may think it is trivial, but it shows to how much depth our prophet
went to instruct and train his followers.

That may be reason why Muslims love their prophet unlike any other
followers of other prophet.
They make fun of their prophets in public, make caricatures of them
and laugh on their account. Any such act by any Muslim or others shall
evoke a universal condemnation.

1. What to Eat and what not to eat:

a. Islam does not give a long list of what to eat and what not to eat, it
fact it gives a small list of what “Not tot eat” and then leaves choice for
all other things to eater.

b. The thing which are prohibited to eat are:

- Dead animal, that include those who were strangulated, gored to

death, or fell from gorge etc.
- Blood
- Swine’s flesh
- Any thing which is dedicated to idols or other gods than Allah (its
various forms and variations included)

c. There is no stigma attached to Non Vegetarian food or Vegetarian

food. Any one can eat as per his desire, but no one should argue about
superiority of one above other.

2. How to eat:

a. One should wash his or her hands before eating

b. One should eat with his or her right hand.

c. One should take the name of Allah before eating.

d. One should eat from his front, if eating jointly from one large tray.

e. One should eat only 1/3rd stomach full, leave 1/3rd space for Water
and another third for air.

f. If eating jointly, one should finish with others.

g. After eating, one should wash his or her hand and should thank Allah
for the food He has provided.

3. Gold and Silver Utensils prohibited::

a. The simple man, our prophet was, he prohibited the use of utensils
and eating plates and spoons etc made of Gold or Silver.
b. These metals are a source of trade and wealth and should not be
brandished as house hold utensils, was probably his logic and how
prudent it was.

4. Instructions during drinking:

a. Prophet told that one should not drink water or other liquid in one
large gulp.

b. One should hold the glass or cup in right hand, say the name of
Allah and drink in three or more gulps.

c. One should not breath into the cup or glass from where he is
drinking.

d. At the end, one should thank Allah for the gift of water or other drink
that He provided.

5. Sitting postures:

a. Prophet always are sitting on earth. He was simple and flowing with
humility. I am a servant of Allah and I eat as any servant should Eat,
was his logic.

b. He used to pick up any think which fell to ground and eat it after
removing the dirt.

c. When eating cooked food at home or in one of his follower’s house,

he never criticized any preparation. If he liked it, he ate , otherwise he
left it.

d. He used to wipe clean his plate, so that no crumb of food was left on
it. Food is a gift of Allah, we should not waste it, was his logic.

e. He taught moderation in every thing and in every matter.

Now Mr. Joel, let us see what your Sri Aurobindo instructed you and his
followers about this “Mumbo Jumbo”!!

More on Apes and Swine:

After disproving the “Myth” that Quean calls Jews as “Children of Apes
and Swine”, let us follow this matter in some more detail:
Let us see how our “Anti-Semite, Jew Hater, Foul Mouthed, Illiterate,
Barbarous, Murderous, Imposter of a Prophet; these are not mine, but
picked up from these threads ” addressed in “His Book” Quran his
bitterest enemies Jews and Christians:

The names and titles by which they are addressed in Quran are:

1. AHAL AL KITAB : People of Book (Combined Title for Jews and

Christians) , used 12 Times

2. BANI ISRAEL: Children of Israel i.e. Jacob, used 11 times

3. YAHUD : Arabic word for Jews: used 6 times.

4. HADU: i.e. those who call themselves Jews: used 9 Times

5. NASARA: Used for Christians , Arabic for Nazarene or Helpers of God,

used 9 times.

Let us see , what Quran says about Torah, the revelation given to
Moses:

1. It contained Law of God.

2. It was Guidance from God.

3. It was Light send from God

4. Guidance and Light are also used for Good News (Gospel) preached
by Jesus Christ.

4A. In fact, Every epithet used for Quran as Word of God is also used
for Torah, the revelation given to Moses.

5. It says that God chose Children of Israel above all nations of the
earth and gave them which was not given to any other nations.

6. It says that Mary the Mother of Jesus was chosen by God above the
women of all Nations.

Now let us see how “the Messenger of Peace, Lamb of God , Prophet of
Love and Mercy” Jesus Christ addresses the learned men of Jews of his
times (if the wordings of Gospel are indeed Jesus’, that is to say):
1 Evil and Adulterous Generation (If that was the condition at the time
of Jesus, how much they would have “progressed” in 600 years, the
time of our prophet).

2. You Hypocrites!

3. You of Little Faith

4. Blind Guides

5. Fools and Blind Fools

6. White Washed Sepultures

7. Race of Wipers

8. Children of Satan

9 He refers to all Non Jews as Dogs (Matthew 15:27).

Is it difficult to guess from where each group gets its vocabulary?

We Muslims use language which is used in Quran and our opponents

use language which they find in their scriptures.

Q. Joel 523 (Who is 2, 533)

And what about the case of Muhammad kissing, hugging and shedding tears over the dumb
Kaaba stone? Isn't this paganism?

And how intelligent or civilized is it to worship an extra-cosmic, anthropomorphic, creationist

god?

ANS

Kissing the black stone of going round Kaaba are not rites of Paganism.

Kaaba was erected by that most famous monotheist of all times… the
prophet Abraham… He made that house for glorifying and giving the
thanks to Lord and Creator of Universe.

Monotheism and rejection of Paganism is built into each and every

ritual of Hajj and UMRAH pilgrimage.

Kissing black stone and going round Kaabah was part of that ritual.
Black stone is nothing but a stone, it has not been shaped into
anything discreet. It is the point from where one starts his going
round that Kaaba. It is believed to be the only surviving stone of the
original Kaaba erected by prophet Abraham.

By kissing that stone, we do not worship that stone and do not do any
act of paganism….

Q. John (Who is 2, 486)

Your big problem is that you base everything on the Koran. But it is full of contradictions and
some downright superstition. There are even different versions such as the one discovered in
1974 in Sanaa in yemen which differed from the official version. Bible only protestants have the
same problems with the bible. Catholics dont because for them the Church is what Christ
established and its authority guarantees the bible and interprets it infallibly as Christ said.

ANS

If some one wants to see the “reverse logic”, he should read your
posts.

The charges you have laid against Quran are more suited for Bible than
Quran, but you have deduced entirely different conclusions.

For reasons quoted by you, Quran becomes very unreliable….yet Bible

because of same reasons becomes more verifiable, less contradictory
and more reliable!!

You speak as if Roman Catholic Church was founded by Jesus himself

and continued unbroken in the same form since then. It seems it was
Jesus who appointed the first Pope.

You call the God of Quran cruel and harsh….while every chapter in it
begins with the formula “in the name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most
Merciful”….!! Perhaps “another” of your self-discovered contradiction?

It is interesting question, why Alcohol should be banned in this world

and allowed in the next world? Who told you that in the next world it
would have same formula CH3OH as we have in this world.

Quran describes the Drink of hereafter as “Pure, that will not cloud the
reasoning power of drinker….nor will have any hangover….”

So you cannot compare it at all with the Rum and Whisky’s of this
earth.
By the way, we Muslims do not question God to explain His every
Command…. We listen and we obey….that is why we are called
Muslims….the one who surrenders to God.

Q. Mahmood (Who is 2, 540)

Since you are the one of the few level headed muslims left in this forum, I will leave you to solve
this contradiction:

2:62 - "Surely those who believe, and those who are Jews, and the f Christians, and the Sabians,
whoever believes in Allah and the Last day and does good, they shall have their reward from their
Lord, and there is no fear for them, nor shall they grieve"…

ANS

Even though you have addressed your post to BMZ considering him a
“more level headed” than other Muslims on this thread, I would like to
post my opinion which you may consider as “More Orthodox” view:

1. There is indeed no contradiction between Verse 2:62 and 48: 13.

The misconception is in people’s mind who think that Prophet
Mohammad brought a new religion, and Islam is a distinct religion from
Judaism and Christianity.

2. There is another misconception in some people’s mind, that if you

accept Mohammad as a prophet, then it means that you reject the
prophet hood of Moses, Jesus and other past prophets.

3. There is a third misconception in people’s mind that Moses brought

a separate religion than Jesus or vice versa. Or that followers of each
prophet are a separate nation by themselves.

4. There is a fourth misconception in some people’s mind that followers

of prophet Moses and Jesus, who passed away before advent of our
prophet are unbelievers and are doomed for hell.

5. Verse 2:62 is to remove all these misconceptions. It says that True

followers of Moses, Jesus or other past prophets have the same
position in the eyes of God as the followers of prophet Mohammad
(Peace of God be on all His prophets). God does not distinguish
between true followers of one prophet and another.

6. Verse 2:62 also means that true followers of Moses, Jesus and past
prophets, to whom the message and teachings of Last prophet has not
yet reached, are having an exalted position before God and they will
be rewarded.

7. However so called Jews and Christians and followers of other

prophets, who have received the message and teachings of Last
Prophet, deny his prophet hood and his message are not to be included
in the former category. That is the meaning of verse 48:13 and many
such verses in Quran.

Therefore there is no contradiction in the two verses. At many places

Quran asks Jews and Christians to at least follow their own scripture, so
they have at least some leg to stand on before God. It calls Jews and
Christians to come to at least a common platform with Muslims (3:64).

See this broadmindedness of Islam in dealing with other faiths and see
the narrow attitude of Jews and Christians towards the Last Prophet
and his followers!!

Q. MEE (Who is 2, 600)

Every one has a theory right ... and Christianity gave all it followers to outright insult non
Christians and there beliefs? and then all this chaos about freedom of speech, freedom of thought
and all that bullshit. you will never find any Muslim go to a Christian and tell them all they
believe is bullshit, cuz Muslims believe in the same beliefs as Christians besides the fact Jesus
was a son of god. Now because Islam is the fastest growing religion of the world are Christians
feeling insecure?
One day we will all return to our Creator, well that day we will know for sure, and then you had
wished you had accepted the signs, I can only wish that God will have mercy on you all that
criticize, insult, conspire, spread rumours or infest people with hatred with false theories.

ANS

I thank you for your honest and unbiased post. I specially like your bit
about ‘Muslims believe in every thing as Christians believe , except
that Jesus is God”.

It is in Quran where it is told that closest to love and understanding to

Muslims are those who call themselves as Christians and it provides
the reason for that also. Listen to this Quranic verse:

“Strongest among men in enmity to Believers (Muslims) will you find

the jews and pagans: and nearest amongst them in love to the
Believers (Muslims) will you find those who say “We are Christians”
“ Because amongst these are men devoted to learning and men who
have renounced the world and they are not arrogant” (5:82)

This verse was revealed 1400 years ago and we can see its truth even
now. Compared to Jews, Christians are not that much hater of Islam
and Muslims and Quran gives three reasons for that:

1. They are not arrogant.

2. Amongst them are men devoted to learning. And\

3. Amongst them are people who have renounced the world.

Christendom is never devoid of all these three categories of people

thru out their 2000 Years old History!!

Coming to Common Terms:

Then Quran invites Jews, Christians and Muslims to come to a common

platform and this is:

a. That they will worship only One God.

b. That they will not take any partners to God.

c. That they will not choose amongst themselves any one who has
powers like God.

d. Then Quran calls Jews and Christians to stand by their Torah and
Gospel and compete each other in good deeds.

So you can see that there is every conciliation in Quran for jews and
Christians to co-exist peacefully with Muslims.

And Quran also says (which you also have said) that in the end we will
all return to our Creator and He will judge between us as to who was
right and who was wrong and who committed excess against whom
and to what degree.

We must live and coexist on as best terms as we can.

In the end I thank you for a very good post!!

Q. Mohammad (Who is 2, 484)

Muhammad posed as an apostle of God. Yet his life is filled with lustfulness (12 marriages and
sex with a child, slaves and concubines), rapes, warfare, conquests, and unmerciful butcheries.
The infinitely good, just and all holy God simply cannot tolerate anything in the least unjust or
sinful. What Muhammad produced in the Qur'an is simply a book of gibberish consisting of later
evil verses abrogating (superseding) earlier peaceful verses. These verses in Arabic poetically
"tickle" the ears of Arab listeners. Islam is a caustic blend of paganism and twisted Bible stories.
Muhammad, its lone "prophet", who made no prophecies, conceived his religion to satiate his lust
for power, sex, and money."

ANS

This description of Islam and Prophet could be excused during Dark

Ages.... because Christians knew next to nothing about Islam and the
life of Prophet.

But in 21st century this description is inexcusable. Now we have well

written biographies of Prophet and Quranic Translations by Muslims in
all major world languages.

Now there is no excuse for any one to say that he or she could not get
access to true Islamic teachings or the life of Prophet.

It is very sad that even in this people try to pose as if they are still in
those dark centuries and these posts only show their ignorance and
nothing else.

The list of admirers of the Prophet include some of the best thinkers,
philosophers, scientists, writers and pioneers in their field. So his
reputation shall not diminish by an Iota by such posts.

Q. Naman (Who is 2, 473)

The word Allah - related to the old El - was made by Muhammad from the name of the pagan
Arab main god al-Lah. Al-Lah means "the god", not "God".

http://www.1000mistakes.com

ANS

First of all, you do not know Arabic language at all. Allah is composed
of two words, Al and Ilah…when combining the two, “I” got dropped
and we are left with Allah.

The objective “Al” in Arabic is to make an improper noun into a proper

noun, and this is known to even a child who has any knowledge about
Arabic Grammar.
So Al Ilah is nothing but “The god” of “God” with Capital G.

Any one reading Quran in Arabic has not the slightest doubt that pagan
of Makkah were very much familiar with the word Allah. It was not a
new word for them.

It is Non Arab people who get foxed by these so called “Scholars” who
deceive them by propounding most fantastic theories.

Every Arab Christian and Jew (and they number in millions, they follow
their religion since generations) know no other word for God in Arabic
except Allah.

There is no Arabic Bible, irrespective of its date of writing that does not
has the word Allah in it.

In light of above, just see how childish is your inference.

Q. Noatics (Who is 2, 594)

Noetics

Oh, yes. If you want to discuss the Koranic fundamentals by all means do so. Of the four pages of
quatations I gave you DIRECTLY from the Koran which one is the DISHONEST quote? Sine
they are so many discuss 4 or five at a time. Here are four of them:

Muslims must fight" (Surat Al-Anfal 8:65).

"Jihad (holy fighting in Allah's cause) is ordained for you" (Surat Al-Baqarah 2:216).
Do not befriend Jews or Christians. "O ye who believe (Muslims) take not the Jews or the
Christians for your friends and protectors. They are but friends and protectors to each other. And
he among you that turns to them (for friendship) is of them" (Surat Al-Maidah 5:51).

Fight against those who believe not in Allah, nor in the Last Day, nor forbid that which has been
forbidden by Allah and His Messenger (Muhammad) and those who acknowledge not the religion
of truth (Islam) among the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians) until they pay the Jizyah
with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued" (Surah At-Taubah 9:29).

"And fight the infidels until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and worshipping of others along
with Allah) and (all and every kind of) worship is for Allah (alone). But if they cease, let there be
no transgression except against As-Zatimun (the polytheists and wrong doers)" (Surat Al-Baqarah
2:193), Surat Al-Anfal 8:39.

Do not indulge in the "Five Pillars". They are not Fundamentals, they are certain principles which
motivate the devotees! They are the front for the Jehad you say is a dishonest quatation.

Noetics
ANS

I think your needle is stick with “Jihad” and you think that there is no
other teaching in Islam except Jihad and rules for fighting!!

I told you that this is a wrong approach. If I copy all the “fighting
verses” from Bible and start saying that these are the “Fundamentals
of Bible”….every one will say that my approach is wrong.

Fighting in the way of God and defending our faith is no doubt very
important and some time becomes paramount…..but this is not
Fundamental Teaching of Islam.

Fundamentals of any religion are the basic articles of faith of that

religion and not the issues of trade and war etc.

For example the Fundamentals of Christianity are Trinity, Divinity of

Jesus, Original Sin and Vicarious Atonement. Other details like wearing
cross, X-Mass, Easter etc are not fundamentals of Christianity.

I told you that I am not ashamed of or shying away from discussing

concept of Islamic Jihad with you, but I want to discuss it after we have
discussed the fundamental of Islam, which are articles of faiths.

Somehow you want to avoid discussing any thing in logical manner.

I had hoped that you would be more reasonable than Sound Doc and
others and would follow a proper course for discussion.

But it seems that when you accept Christianity, you leave reason and
logic behind you and only want to achieve your aim by any means, fair
or foul.

So my dear the First Fundamental of Islam is Absolute Uniqueness of

Lord and Creator of this Universe. He is absolute in Power and He is
Creator of Every thing in this Universe.

He is a Just and Merciful God… He is much exalted beyond our

understandings…..we only know about Him, what He Himself says
about Him….

If you have some comments on this First Fundamental of Islam, then

please post it, or then we will move to next Fundamental.

If you want to discuss any thing with me, it shall be on point by point
basis and in a logical manner.

Otherwise, you know I deal with people who do not listen to me!!

Q. Noetics (Who is 2, 590)

Then you have an obligation to cite my emotions " of anger, hate, spite, contempt, insult, or pain
or any such at you or anybody..." which you will find none any time any where. Truth often is
painful.

…Have you ever condemned this? Will you? Saying that this is not what you understand from
the Koran will not do. You know that.

Why not?

Noetics

ANS

I just do not know as to how to argue with you!!

Can you give me any EXAMPLE of any one born from the womb of
mother and not dying?

There are fundamentalists in each and every religion…in each and

every nation.

Since I belong to India…. I know there is a very large group of Hindu

Fundamentalists….. these people did many blasts in many cities in
India ….. and later blamed them on Muslims…

Then there are Jewish Fundamentalists and there are Christian

Fundamentalists and every other type of fundamentalists.

There are even Evolutionary Fundamentalists!!

But every type of fundamentalism is not bad. It depends what are your
fundamentals.

All Fundamentals of Islam are for good and benefit of human society.

A true Fundamental Muslim is a boon to human society and not a

bane!!

Q. Noetics (Who is 2, 593)

No, Noetics is not avoiding anything by insisting that the Five Pillars of Islam do not motivate
Terrorism. It is the fundamentals of the Koran which Noetics have quoted DIRECTLY from the
Koran filling 4-pages of this forum which instigate the Terrorism on the INNOCENTS.

This is especially true since there is nio UNIVERSAL condemnation of these acts in the Muslim
world. MUQ has never condemned them either. The naive admission that MUQ sees the Koran
differently if anything is condoning Terrorism.

So Noetics rightfully ask why these 4-pages of PURE Mecca Koran are not fundamentals! If they
are not fundamentals (direct oracles?)why not revise or remove them!!

ANS

You are wrong, the topic was not Terrorism….you started your posts
and Fundamentals of Islam Part-1, 2,3 & 4 and quoted “authentic
verses” from Quran on one subject only.

Defending your faith and dealing with your enemies is certainly an

important topic in Quran and there are much details there (that could
run even into ten or twenty pages).

But if you want to discuss fundamental teachings of Islam, then you

first start with articles of faith….then we will touch upon articles of
worship (including five pillars of Islam) and then we will discuss
maintenance of Law and Order in society (that will touch on Criminal
System and Jihad etc).

This is a logical and correct step by step procedure to understand

Islam and its teachings.

If you are ready for that, then say so, and do not try to avoid or
circumspect the main topic.

Q. Noetics (Who is 2, 597)

There are two things fundamentally wrong here:

1. This is a complete, misrepresentation or misunderstanding of my statement. Koranic

fundamentals are directly quoted from the Koran.If they are not true, by all means give the correct
version.

2. "Fundamentals of Christianity" is a categorical error. There are three major divisions of

Christianity- Roman Catholic, Eastern Orthodox and Protestant. The only thing common as
"fundamental" between the traditional/orthodox communities within these three major divisions
(excluding the liberals)is the Deity of Jeshua Messiah and a conditional agreement on Trinity. On
practically everything else they are divided with unbridgeable gaps….
Then remember you are comparing Earthly things with Earthly things.

Noetics

ANS

You are avoiding the main topic of discussion here,

Quoting a Verse Honestly from Quran is not equal to quoting

Fundamental teachings of Quran.

You say that when you quote any thing from Bible, it should be in
contextual order. You cannot take any verse from Bible and quote it
out of context, same is valid for Quran also.

The point before us is what are Fundamentals of any religion?

Are these instructions for worship, eating, dealings with people of other
faith of Fundamental articles of faith?

What you have done is picked up verses from Quran that deal with
fighting, and war and present them as “Fundamentals of Quran”

This is a dishonest practice (after I clarified and told you about it) and
avoiding the main issue.

Jihad and War is not Fundamental of Islam…it is means as to how to

defend your faith, your person and your country when faced with
danger.

Fundamental teachings of Islam are its Fundamental articles of

faith….first we should discuss about them and then we will move to
other topics.

If you are patient enough….then I will also discuss Islamic Jihad with
you. I am not ashamed or afraid to discuss it with you, but it has a
place in Islam and it should be given its due place.

Any discussion with Fundamental Teaching and principle of Islam must

begin with articles of faith.

You yourself acknowledge that when discussing with Christianity…. You

only included articles of faith and not about Powers of Pope, Cardinals,
X-Mass, Easter, Holy Communion etc (all of them have importance, but
are not Fundamentals of Christianity)!!
Q. Noetics (Who is 2, 599)

Sorry, the issue has been your (and the Muslim world in general)condoning TERRORISM
motivated by the FUNDAMENTALS of the Koran.
Either you deny that these are not FUNDAMENTALS or you have no choice bu to defend
TERRORISM on innocents as you continue to do!

If these 4-pages of unedited direct Koran Quotes are not FUNDAMENTALS, then it is high time
for your "hierarchies" to REFORM or REVISE or REINTERPRET or RENOUNCE or whatever,
these as secondary nonessentials of the Koran and Islam.

ANS

No the topic was not about Terrorism, it was about Fundamentals of

Islamic teachings present in Quran.

I can also give you 10 or twenty pages of “authentic quotes from Bible”
that are Fundamental teachings of Bible….they are certainly more
harsh than what you have quoted from Quran.

If you want to discuss only about war and dealings with people other
than your own, then say so.

I can challenge you that “war verses in Bible” are many times more
than what we see in Quran.

But then you do not take refuge in your lame excuse that these are not
“Fundamental Teachings of Bible” Fundamental teachings of Bible are
Love of God and Love of Human etc!!

You should not throw stones at others while sitting in glass house of
your own.

I told you, I am not shy or ashamed to discuss with you or any one
Islamic concept of Jihad, but you should be honest and use the same
standard every where.

Q. Renegade 89 (Who is 2, 478)

By your own logic, Christianity was the real God's religion at some point of time. So was
Zoroastrianism, the first monotheistic faith. So is mormonism in America today.An increasing
number of people are starting to believe in reincarnation/Karma/Dharma as well.
The list goes on..
First of all, if the majority of people believing in or converting to a faith/belief is necessary for
that belief to be true, the earth would have been flat for the past thousand years because the
world's majority believed so. This is simply absurd. Secondly, Islam, if it is indeed the fastest
growing faith, grows by the amazing birth rate among muslims. It does indicate a religion being
true.

ANS

1. Yes, at one time, all the prophets and their teachings were the true
religion and path of the God. But when they were distorted or
corrupted, God sent other prophets and other books. But that does not
mean that any belief or any religion or any philosophy which is gaining
popularity in the world should also be true.

2. We have to analyze that theory, philosophy or theory, in light with

the scriptures. That is why Communism, Materialism and Atheism shall
be wrong, irrespective of how many followers they gather.

3. The religion who “believed” that earth is flat, is now issuing apology
to scientists for their persecution and mistreatment.

4. Growth of Islam is not only by high birth rate, there is continuous

stream of people accepting Islam almost very day and that is one of
the major reason.

5. You can Quote any verse and draw any meaning from it. I can also
quote many verses from Bible, Bhgawat Gita and every other scripture
and draw my own meaning from it. You have to see the actions of
Muslims and their prophet. If Muslims had killed every Non Muslim,
how come after 1000 years of Islamic rule, 67 % of Indian population is
Non Muslim? How come 20 Millions Coptic Christians are living in
Egypt. When Muslims ruled Spain for 700 years, how many Non
Muslims lived there? When Muslims were defeated there, how many
Muslims were left in Spain after say 25 years?

6. “Let there be no Compulsion in religion” 2:255 was revealed in

Medina itself and nobody believes that it has been abrogated.

7. What projection means in Islamic terms is shown by 67 % percent of

Hindu population in India, majority of Christian population in Span and
Millions of Jews and Christians in Arab countries.
8. I do not deny that Hindus at one time were learned people in the
world. They would have established Nalanda University and I do not
feel jealous about it. But for Hindus what mattered was only India,
They did not preach their message to outside world. Muslims preached
their message and distributed knowledge to all corners of the world.

9. Concept of Zero was lying dormant in India, Arabs introduced it to

whole world and that contributed a lot is the progress of world’s
knowledge and civilization.

10. Persia could have had an old civilization, during Muslim rule, its
civilization rose to even higher heights. Muslims only helped growth of
knowledge and civilization of every country they went.

11. Just see how Hindus has treated majority of their own brethren
whom they call SUDRAS and Untouchables and then complain about
how Islam and Muslims treat Non believers.

Q. True Christian (Who is 2, 580)

GOD (peace upon him) delivered jesus for the Christians and mohamed for the muslims. both
these prophets were sent by 1 GOD to save humanity from sin. we both sides should have some
respect upon us because the fight is useless! we both believe in a heaven and a hell the enemy of
religion are indeed the jews. y? because they don’t believe in an afterlife,
which is GODS eternal gift. a Jew has money, riches, and bichez (a sin) a Christian has heart but
no love, a muslim has love but heartless? Christians (heart) and muslims (love)= PEACE

ANS

I really appreciate you message. In fact our threads need such type of
messages and not the hate messages, with which these threads are
full to the brim!!

We need to understand and appreciate each other’s view points.

Jews, Christians and Muslims are basically worshipping the same God
and all of them are Monotheistic in their teachings.

They have more in common than the differences.

But instead of discussing common points, we prefer to discuss the

differences and try to do down each other.

It is time that we should have sincere dialogues with each other and
understand each other’s view point.
Al least we should try to “live” with each other and not be mortal
enemies of each other.

In the climate of mutual hate and bickering, posts like yours are like
welcome rain to a parched land.

I wish to see more people and more posts like yours.

But alas, common sense and broad mindedness is a rarely found

quality these days….at least on these threads…and in political world
…. And in Media circles in general.

Please accept my thanks and appreciation for such post.

Q. JAG (Contribution, Israel, 729)

Don't talk like you know me, MUQ. You don't. I never said I supported American and European
actions there. I also have a great respect for Islam as well and for all it has contributed to the
world.
True, my knowledge of history is and never will be complete. But I try my very best to get the
facts right. And I know that the Jews lived and died by the sword because of not only the
incredible persecution they have suffered at the hands of others since the birth of monotheism,
but also because they are a deeply religious people who take enormous offence when the people
who rule over them attempt to (in their view) compromise their most profound beliefs.

ANS

I thank you for your post. At least you are honest enough to say that
you are in market for knowledge.

As for Jews and other Non Muslims being second class citizens under
Muslims, I do not contest it.

Can you give me any example of any country which really treats its
citizens equally and is free from bias of any kind?

I know you will give examples of present day US and Europe who
“Claim” to be above any kind of bias and treat every one equally,
irrespective of its religion.

This is only a claim on paper, we find wide spread discrimination in

these countries based on race, color, language, ethnic background etc.

But in Islam, Non Muslims are clearly told of their status and they are
protected by state on the payment of a fixed term which is called Jizya.
This amount is not a heavy burden on any community and it is agreed
between the parties with mutual consent.

This may look discriminatory, but Muslims have to pay much more
than Non Muslims to state in the form of Zakat and Military service and
other dues.

It can be seen that compared to all other religion and groups, it is

Islam which treats Non Muslims with maximum fairness.
The idea of gathering all Jews from all over the world and giving them
land, where other people were living was wrong in my view from every
point of view.

How can you import bulk of population from outside a country and
have no care for the people who were already living there?

You could do so for any desert and unpopulated land, but not in a
thickly populated nation like Palestine. I find fault with the basic idea
of creation of Israel itself and I do not discuss smaller day to day
issues.

Q. Unknown (Herald, 25)

To: All My Muslim Friends in Malaysia on Topix

Assalam Alaykum

I am unable to understand, why there is so much mayhem in Malaysia

regarding Christians using the word Allah instead of God.

I am an Indian Muslim, working in Saudi Arabia, and what little

knowledge I have of Islam and Quran, show me that this dispute is only
harmful to Muslims and to no one else.

The truth must be told, how hard it looks and we should always tell the
truth. Let me put my case in proper prospective:

1. Guidance from Quran: As per Quran, the Deity that Muslims,

Christian and Jews worship in no other than Allah.

a. It is mentioned in Quran at several places that we Muslims should

tell to Jews and Christians that we worship the same Deity.

b. As per Quran all the prophets sent to any nation were Muslims. And
they preached the same message.
c. In Quran there is no other word than Allah is used for the Deity that
Jews and Christians worship (I can provide all quotations from Quran if
some one is interested).

2. Guidance from Hadith:

a. If we look at Hadith literature, we find that Prophet (PBUH) has had

many discussions with Jews and Christians of his time and at no place
he objected them for using the word Allah by them.

b. In fact on one occasion, he allowed the Christians of Najran, use of

his own mosque to carry out their rituals in their own manner. The
word used for Christian rituals is nothing else but “Salat” which is used
by Muslims for their prayers

c. In fact I have no knowledge that any Muslim during Prophet and

Companions time, objected the use of word Allah by Jews and
Christians.

3. Contemporary Arab World:

a. If we look at contemporary Arab world, there are millions of Arab

Christians living in Egypt, Syria, Lebanon, and else where, they all use
the word Allah for God and no one objects. In fact in Arabic there is no
word for God except Allah!!

b. Same way, they use the words like, Rasool, Nabi, Kitab, Salat, Saum
etc and no one objects to any of them.

4. From a Non Arab world:

a. I am from India, where the common language is Urdu or Hindi

amongst Muslims and Hindus. The Christians use the word Allah,
Khuda, Parwardigar, etc for God in their Urdu books and no one objects
to it.

b. In the same way, we Muslims use the word Bhagwan or Ishwar, or

Pameshwar when talking to Hindus about our Creator and they do not
object to it.
c. In fact it is written in Quran that Allah has most beautiful names.
These names are not only in Arabic language but could be in many
other languages too.
5. Teachings of Christianity:

a. Teachings of Christianity will not change if they use Allah for God, or
Rasul for Prophet and Kitab for Book. They would still call Jesus Son of
Allah instead of calling him Son of God and they will still believe in
Trinity (They call it Tathleeth in Arabic and Urdu and Persian!!).

b. It would have minimal effect on existing Muslims or Non Muslims

who want to accept Islam. Just by using the word Allah instead of God,
will not change the matter much.

c. Then how would Muslims preach in English language? Do you mean

to say that we should not use word God and should always use Allah?
Thereby indicating that we believe in different gods?

Conclusion:

a. I feel sorry that Malaysian Muslims have taken this simple matter so
high that it had top go to Supreme court!!

b. Not only that they have made violent protests against Christians for
using the word Allah, which we want them to use more and more!!

c. Prolonging this issue will only cause harm to Islam’s cause in

Malaysia and else where.

Unless some one gives me specific reason as to what is the basic

problem in Malaysia, I think that people demonstrating against use of
word Allah by Christians are not correct.
Q. Muck (Israel, 712)

To Muq,
Don't forget that I said Radicals. Not all Muslims are Radicals like yourself! I will show you later
a letter from Walid Shoebat, a one-time Palestinian Radical and author of "Why I Left Jihad."
Maybe it you put a tiny little dent on your radical views. But for now I just want to give you some
important statistics that can answer some of your questions.

ANS

Thanks for providing statistics that 93 % Muslims in the world and non
Radical and only 7 % are radicals.

This is a very positive attitude….. Now look again at the headlines in

media and News Channels are see do they use the Phrase “Radical
Muslims” or “Radical Muslim Terrorists” in their writings?

They use the phrase “Muslim Terrorists” and “Muslim Extremists” in

their posts, thereby equating every Muslim with Terrorism and
Extremism and Violence.

But they take care when dealing with other faiths, LTTE Terrorists are
never called as “Hindu Terrorists” , Extreme right wing Jews are never
mentioned as “Jewish Terrorists”, neither do we hear phrases like
“Christian Terrorists”.

It is this biased and one sided reporting by media which has

brainwashed and poisoned the minds of most people in west towards
Islam and Muslims.

Media is the real reason for present hatred in Europe and USA against
Islam and Muslims.

People controlling media are not idiots neither they are uneducated.
These are highly professional people and well trained in the arts of
propaganda. They have a vested interest in this propaganda.

Most of these people are either Jews or controlled by Jews. They are
afraid that if Muslims and Christians are united, their interests would
suffer and that is why they want to create a permanent rift between
Muslims and Christians.

9/11 events was a big step in this direction and it has crated a wide
gap between USA and Muslim nations, which were coming closer, and
there was hope that US would support Justice for Palestinians and
pressure Israel to solve that issue.

Now no one speaks or talks about Palestine and Palestinians…. For last
10 years every one talks about Osama… Al Qaeda…. Taliban …
Christian forces are busy in fighting with Muslims in Iraq,
Afghanistan…. Pakistan,….

Iran, Libiya, Syria…. Etc. are next in line

You can say that they are successful!!!
Q. MKOT (Israel, 710)

LOL- so don't answer anything!!!! It is better to ignore reality than give up your prejudices. Try
to continue to blot out the sun with your madrassa text...only YOUR vision is obscured, the rest
of the world sees the light.
Which is why Iran is in trouble and the "holy" sheiks, mullahs, clerics and strongmen of the Arab
Middle East are in a dilemma - if they modernize, they either share the power and the wealth or
they create a Dubai ---a huge pleasure palace for WESTERN values.

ANS
It seems you are in a mood to know truth about Islamic Shariah. You
will continue to live in the darkness of ignorance and be content with
half truths and hearsay what you pick up from surfing Anti Islamic
sites.

In your view none of western including Israel is perfect…. But you want
that each and every Muslim country should be perfect, what is this
type of logic?

Q. MKOT (Israel, 734)

Right, not madrassa trained -

1)Islam should rule the world

2)Turkey is "cut-off"
3) Jews (since that is what you really mean, instead of Israel) are doomed
ANS

I never supported any terrorist activity and I never justify any terrorist
activity.
But I see all acts of terrorism with the same eye and with same
attitude.
I do not distinguish between acts of terrorism done by any Palestinian
and that done by any Jew or Jewish army or US army.
But you on the other hand condone the acts of Israel, Jews and US and
criticize only the acts of Palestinians.
This is the approach, which instead of salving the problem is actually
increasing it. If same standards of justice are not used, then you can
never have peace and co-existence.
Now you asked me, what will happen to those “Muslims” who kill
innocent people and commit acts of atrocities against men, women
and children…
Let me say, they all will be accountable to their Creator on the day of
Judgment. And He is common creator of all humans, he does not
distinguish between an innocent man, whether it be Jew, Christian,
hindu or Muslim.

He will judge every one and punish guilty irrespective of whichever

religion he is.
That is why, Islam is strictly against killing innocent human beings and
it is one of the Biggest of Big crimes.
That is Islamic teachings, now let us hear what is US or Jewish versions
of those innocent people getting killed in Palestine, Iraq and
Afghanistan?
A TCCH, Collateral damage, unavoidable costs of war…..really
deplorable….that is how far it goes!!
In fact you care less, if they were humans or flies that were killed, what
matters to you is the life of US and Jewish citizens and not human
lives.\
This double standard is the root cause that the menace of Terrorism is
always on the rise.

Q. MKOT (Israel, 710)

Shariah reveals itself in cloth cages of women, multiple marriages permitted for men, Honor
Killings at the hands of "family" executioners versus a public court system, limited travel,
education and life choices for women and the "holy" power of clerics who can order fatwahs
against novelists, cartoonists, politicians, website operators, journalists,
playwrights or anyone, anywhere in the world who displeases them…

ANS

I think you would still be happy to live in your world of half truth and
bigotry, than attain knowledge about Shariah and its laws.

How do you know what are Islamic Shariah guidelines regarding

woman, or how to deal with people who are of other faiths than Islam?

It seems that you are content to accept the actions of Muslims as the
guidelines of Islamic Shariah, Is that true?

This is a very wrong course and if we follow this example, we can say
that Christianity promotes Homosexuality, Lesbianism, Addiction with
Narcotic Drugs, Violence and Rape of Women, Domestic Violence,
leaving aged parents unattended etc. Because that is what we see in
the Christian Nations of the west,

Your approach is wrong, you cannot use the actions of followers as

yardsticks for the real teachings of any religion. You should first study
the religious scriptures of that religion and find out what are the real
teachings.

Then you should accuse the followers why they are not following their
religion’ teachings. If you follow that approach, you will see how good
are Islamic teachings and how for present day Muslims have gone in
not following them. You should criticize Muslims and not Islam and
Islamic teachings.

But I think that you are in no mood to follow any reasonable approach
and will be happy to live in your world of half truth and bigotry!!

If you do not know, then you can ask me Islamic position on each and
every issue you have raised…. But one by one and in a civil manner.
Q. Eric (Messianic, 320)

I see. And how were they dealt with during his life? And how were those who resided in the
Hejazi community dealt with during his life? You say that there were but a few scattered tribes
left at the time of his death, but isn't that a self fulfilling prophecy due to what happened during
his life?
ANS

If you want to know what happened to Jewish tribes living in Medina? I

can tell you about them in short. About BANU QURAIZAH , I have
already mentioned earlier in answer to another post. Let me tell you
about the other two Jewish tribes of Medina
A. BANU QAINUQAH: This tribe broke the treaty held with Muslims in
the year 2 Ah, Just after the famous Battle of Badr. It pained them to
see that a very small and ill equipped Muslim army of 300 plus had
decimated a fully armed and 1000 strong army of Makkah people.
They were seething with anger and wanted any opportunity to take on
Muslims. The matter came to head when they misbehaved with a
veiled Muslim lady in their market. They broke the treaty of peace and
asked prophet not to take them as Makkah people.
After a small siege, they surrendered and were allowed to vacate
Medina with all their belongings and arms.

B. BANU NADHEER. They broke the treaty and even tried to

assassinate the prophet in 3 AH, just after the famous battle of Ohad.
The prophet laid siege to their areas and after ten days or so, they
surrendered and asked for pardon.
They were allowed to vacate Medina and go away and take a camel
load of items, excluding arms.
These people left Medina and most of them stayed in KHAIBAR. These
Jews were the main reason for Battle of Trench in 5 AH, when they
managed to get most of Arabian Tribes to attack Medina and finish
Muslims once for all.
These were the people who incited BANU QURAIZAH to perform High
Treason at the most critical juncture of war and led to their
extermination.
C. Caution: In case these details make you think on other lines,
remember the total number of casualties during all ten years of
warfare during the time of our prophet do not add up to even 1000.
Q. MKOT (Israel, 712)

1) Islam believes everyone should be Muslim

2) Islam never lets anyone leave the faith
3) Islam refuses to sanction Islamic terrorists and therefore aids them
4) Islam seeks to 'bring its peace" to all of Europe
5) Islam is a ruling system and not a personally based faith
6) People like MUQ are here to sooth Western concerns and provide a
distraction to the threat of Jihad.
7) anyone who cannot easily condemn using kids in war is a fanatic
8) MUQ is a fanatic who evades questions about Islamic terror.
9) THE WEST WILL NEVER BOW DOWN TO ISLAM

ANS

I will reply to each of your observations in short:

1) Islam believes everyone should be Muslim

MUQ: And what is harm in that? Do you not wish that every one in
world accepts your idea of Democracy, Homosexuality, Free Sex and
Freedom to do every evil thing?

2) Islam never lets anyone leave the faith

MUQ: You are right, Islam highly discourages that after some one has
come to the right path, he or she should be mislead to wander into the
false hood of darkness. Islam claims that it is the best and most
practical of all religions. Let some one prove that their own version of
religion is better than Islam, then Islam will remove this barrier. But no
one has come forward so far!!

3) Islam refuses to sanction Islamic terrorists and therefore aids them

MUQ: There is nothing like “Islamic Terrorists”. Islam and Terrorism

are poles apart. There could be some Terrorists who have Muslim
sounding names, but they are not Islamic Terrorists. In same way, we
have Terrorists who have Hindu, Jewish and Christian sounding names.
They are not called as Hindu Terrorists, Jewish Terrorists and Christian
Terrorists.

4) Islam seeks to 'bring its peace" to all of Europe

MUQ: Islam means peace and it wants to bring real peace not only to
Europe but to all corners and all parts of the world. What is wrong in
that?
5) Islam is a ruling system and not a personally based faith

MUQ: This is an absurd comment. Islam is a complete way of life,

which is based on revelation from God All Mighty.

6) People like MUQ are here to sooth Western concerns and provide a
distraction to the threat of Jihad.

MUQ: People like MUQ are here to clarify the prejudice and ignorance
and misconception about Islam which is prevalent in Most of Western
countries. And this is mainly due to wrong propaganda of Jewish
controlled media and their innocent Christian Friends.

7) anyone who cannot easily condemn using kids in war is a fanatic

MUQ: At least I am not fanatic. But people who justify shooting down
of two years, three years kids by Jewish Police and Army are real
fanatic supporters of Jews and Israel.

8) MUQ is a fanatic who evades questions about Islamic terror.

MUQ: I leave the readers to decide whether I promote Terrorism or

promote peace and understanding between different religions.

9) THE WEST WILL NEVER BOW DOWN TO ISLAM

MUQ: This is a strange remark. If Islam represents truth, justice,

equality and peace in the world, why should any one refuse to bow
down before it? In fact the persons who are propagating hatred
between Islam and Christians are the real people who are responsible
for violence and terrorism in the world.

Q. Alex (Israel, 758)

have no problems with people following the muslim or Christian faith and i am not trying to
convert anyone.
lets say there is an order by god which appears in all of the versions of the jewish bible and is
contradicted by the Quran, by your logic would that mean the whole Quran is corrupted and is not
really the word of god?

ANS

If you have no proof about the authenticity of your books then you
have no RIGHT to call it as an order from God.

At best, It is only your assumption that it is from God…..Even if we

assume that it was from God, how do you know that it was for eternity?

If any law of Torah is superseded in Quran, then it means that law was
of temporary nature and has outlived its utility.

That was one of the prime reason for sending the Last and Final
Testament.

Jewish and Christian scripture refer to age when the human society
was developing…so the laws were made which cater to that phase of
humanity.

When Quran was revealed the human civilization had reached to its
mature age and that is why the Final version of laws were given.

PS: I refer to only the ritualistic and legalistic part of the laws. As
regards fundamental articles of faith, there is no difference between
Torah and Quran….none…I repeat none…!! (if you want, I can give you
these articles of faith also)

Q. Alex (Israel, 762)

am not here to attack the Quran, i personally haven't read it and i am sure most of it is preaching
for peace and good. i am sure some of it isn't just like you can find evil things in bible if you set
your mind on looking for them. those books were written a very long time ago when the world
was very different and so were norms.

ANS

I like your honesty by saying that you have not studied Quran…. And
you assume that it must have preached good things as other religious
books do. This is a good part.

I have no problem with you being of Jewish background and having

some doubts about some portions of your scriptures.

But I want to clarify your one mistake, in which you have said that
these books were written many centuries ago and were meant for that
period and are no more practical in present conditions.

You said this because you have not studied Quran and Prophetic
sayings. It is true that in old times prophets came to their own people
and the teachings were applicable to their own times and places.

But in the knowledge of God…there had to come a time when a

Universal messenger was to be sent and a Final Book of God was to be
sent for all humans and for all times till the day of judgment. That
Final book was Quran and that Final Prophet was Prophet Mohammad.

If we assume your logic that teachings of old scriptures are no longer

practical, then God must send another prophet. How come He sent the
prophets to older generations and not to us?

How can He judge us, without providing any guidance?

All religions teach good things….but good things are not enough….you
should have right set of beliefs also.

That makes any one perfect….sound beliefs and good deeds. And
THAT is also the TEACHINGS of ALL OLD Scriptures too!!

Q. Ben Zuriah (Israel, 764)

MUQ,
In the Quran the word "Jerusalem" isn't mentioned so why muslims claim to sanctity of it ?

The five books of "Torah" are including the bible that was given by god to mosses (orally and
handwriting).
All the rules are in there and the story is from creation of the universe until the People of Israel
entered the promised land)

ANS

The word “Jerusalem” might not be used in Quran, but “MASJID AQSA”
which was in Jerusalem is used in Quran. That is where our prophet
was taken in his night journey. That MASJID was Qibla (Direction of
prayer) for all Muslims for almost 14 years. That is why Muslims
sanctify it.
If you think that the present First Five books of OT is the same Torah
which was given to Moses by God….well then you need a lesson in
Bible History.

Pick up any Bible Commentary and read the Introduction before each
book. It will throw some light on how these books came to be written
in their present form.

If you want any help, I can post it for you from a Bible that I have with
me (it was published by Christian Church and not by any Muslim)

Q. Muck (Israel, 712)

Consider the following lines from the Qur'an, which Radicals draw upon to call Muslims to
violent action:
"Prescribed for you is fighting, though it is disliked by you. It may well be that you dislike a thing
but it is good for you."--Sura 2:216
"[Jews and Christians] are the ones whom God has cursed,
.."For those who disbelieve, garments of fire are certain to be
cut out for them, with boiling water being poured down over
their heads, with which all that is within their bodies,
as well as their skins, is melted away."--Sura 22:19-20
"Pay no heed to (the desires of) the unbelievers, but engage in
a mighty striving against them."--Sura 25:52….

Muq, did you skip these? I wrote it just in case you don't have it. You said: "These are not Islamic
teachings(violence) and have nothing to do with Islam." Wake up Muq!!!!!!!

ANS

Now I point out some brief answers to the real meaning of the verses
you have quoted under the right context:

A "Prescribed for you is fighting, though it is disliked by you.

t may well be that you dislike a thing but it is good for
you."--Sura 2:216
MUQ: This is a general guidelines to Muslims to take up arm to fight
against the injustice and tyranny of Makkah people and enemies of
Islam. What is the objection about it

B. "[Jews and Christians] are the ones whom God has cursed,
and he whom God excludes from His mercy, you shall
never find one to help and save him."--Sura 4:52

MUQ: What is your objection to these verses? Jews and Christians by

rejecting the true prophet of God have gone away from the mercy of
God. There is no recompense for them unless they turn back

C. "The recompense of those who fight against God and His

Messenger...they shall either be executed, or crucified,
or have their hands and feet cut off alternately, or be banished
from the land." Sura 5:33

MUQ: What is your objection to this verse? Should the enemies of

state or those who do mischief in the land be allowed to roam freely
and should not face any punishment?

D. "O you who believe! Take not the Jews and Christians for
guardians and confidants...Surely God does not guide such
wrongdoers." Sura 5:51

MUQ: This is a very prudent advise from Quran and I wish Muslims
should have adhered to it. Quran asks Muslims not to take Jews and
Christians as their Bosom Friends or as their protectors. How many
times Muslims have been duped by the cunningness of Jews and
Christians. Even now their cunningness is evident on any issue dealing
with Islam and Muslims.

E. "Kill them[infidels, namely Christians and Jews] wherever

you may come upon them, and seize them, and confine
them, and lie in wait for them at every conceivable place." --Sura 9:5
MUQ: Is it not strange that you mean Jews and Christians as “Infidels”,
whereas in India , they refer to Hindus as Infidels!!! The verse refers to
Pagan people of Makkah who were the addressed party and not every
Non Believer or every Jew or Every Christian.
Now you have quoted verse 9:5, what about the next verse? 9:6….
Why did you forget to quote it? Just because it contradicts your own
perverse mind?

F "Fight with the leaders of unbelief." --Sura 9:12

MUQ: What is your objection to it? It is a general command to Muslims
to be ready to defend their faith and their lands and their nations
G. "Fight against those among the people of the Book who do
not believe God and the Last Day...until they pay the
jizyah(tax of protection and exemption from military
service) with a willing hand in a state of submission.
MUQ: Is it not strange that you quote this verse as a “Killer Verse”. In
fact this is the verse which is a “peace verse”. It shows that when the
fighting should stop and peace should be given chance. You should
fight till the peace is restored or your enemies sues for peace, what
better advise should be given to end any war?
H And those Jews say:'Ezra is God's son'; and the Christians say:
'The Messiah is God's son.'...May God destroy them!"
--Sura 9:29-30

MUQ: What is your objection here? May be you object at the swearing
by God…. Let me tell you, that it is an Arabic Idiom and used at places
where some one is not happy with actions of someone. It is not to be
taken literally. God shows His displeasures at those Jews who say Ezra
is son of God or those Christians who say Jesus is son of God

K. "For those who disbelieve, garments of fire are certain to be

cut out for them, with boiling water being poured down over
their heads, with which all that is within their bodies,
as well as their skins, is melted away."--Sura 22:19-20
MUQ: And what do you object here? You mean to say that God should
not warn clearly as to what is going to be the fate of those who reject
His message? Do you mean to say that God should keep people under
false hopes and say in mild tones that it is OK for you to believe in or
reject truth, they do not really matter one way or other?
Quran has come to give clear warning to those who willfully reject the
message of truth and reason send by God.

L Pay no heed to (the desires of) the unbelievers, but engage in

a mighty striving against them."--Sura 25:52

MUQ: And what do you object here? Perhaps God should have said
that it is OK whether you believe or not. It does not really matter one
way or other?

M . “When you meet those who disbelieve in war, smite them at

their necks."--Sura 47:4
MUQ: And what else would any army general advise to his forces when
the ranks of enemies are filed in front of them? Islam is not the
religion of cowards, if enemy comes to fight, Muslims should be ready
to fight back. This is a common sense advise. Nothing else

N "O Prophet! Strive hard against the unbelievers and the hypocrites,
and be stern against them. Their final refuge is Hell."
--Sura 66:9

MUQ: This is addressed to prophet directly, do you know how prophet

acted on it? Do you know how many hypocrites he killed in Medina? It
is advise to prophet to be on guard against the viles and cunningness
of Non believers and hypocrites. Prophet did that and was not fooled
by their smooth tongues.

I have tried to give brief answers to show the real meaning and context
of all these verses. I did not say that Islam is against violence. Islam is
a religion of peace and wants the peace to prevail generally.

But of there are people who do not want to live in peace and try to
destroy Islamic state, its land, its property, then Muslims are allowed to
fight back. This is a natural law and no one can find a fault to it.

However Islam is against killing innocent men, woman and children.

Islam is against Terrorism and Islam is against Oppression, Tyranny,
Injustice and Mischief on the earth.

Q. Alex (Israel, 756)

have just written a book and there is only one version of it (I mean god just written a book and
there is only one version of it) its the only word of god and everything contradicting you would
find in the Quran is false. everyone of the holly books were written by a man, all of the are
corrupted to a degree. when a giant stone Quran fall from the sky i would say its the word of god.
you expect people to provide evidence that the bible is the word of god but other people bring
evidence that the Quran isn't?
*other people have to bring evidence that the Quran isn't?

ANS

I appreciate your “pun” , but it will not change realities;

A. Who says Biblical books are corrupted?

1. It may come as a surprise to you, that it is not Muslims who are
saying that Biblical books are corrupted, It is Jewish and Christian
Scholars themselves!!

2. Read any book on Higher Biblical criticism, and it will explain to you
in detail, how these books originated and how they took shape.

3. for a layman, if you find contradictory statement in one book and

another books, then it means that both cannot be true at the same
time. If both books are from God…then either God did the mistake or
it was because of some poor scribe or translator’s. Now you pick you
own choice and decide whom to blame!!

B. God wrote all Books:

1. God does not “write” in the literal sense of the word (He is far above
and exalted , than our human contractions) , He sends the Revelation
to His prophets thru His angels and that message is recorded in oral or
written form.

2. That is the origin of all “divine books”. Afterwards it is the duty of

prophet and his followers to take care of that Book.

C. What is special about Quran?

1. Origin of Quran was just like any other “book of God”. It was
revealed to our prophet thru Archangel Gabriel.

2. Since Quran was to be the Last and Final Book of God, so God took
special care to preserve and protect that book.

3. He did it by the simple method of “making it public”!! Books which

were the property and prerogative of Scholars and Scribes were now
available to every one. People could memorize it and people could
write it down.

4. Quran is the only book in the Universe which is preserved by both in

Written Form and in oral form. There is no other book that can
challenge Quran in this respect (I do not write because I am Muslim,
you ask your rabbis and Priests as to how much of Torah and Gospels
they really memorize and it will become clear to you).

D. If a stone Quran had fallen from the sky!!

1. Pardon me for saying it, even that Quran would have been broken
into pieces and lost to us!!

2. But the Quran written on the hearts of hundreds of thousands of

Muslims thru all ages is much more safe and reliable than a stone
Quran fallen from sky!!

3. By the way, God did gave some Tablets to Moses writing it by His
own Fingers……what happened to those stone Tablets?

E. Who is saying Quran is written by man?

1. Look at the beginning of my post, where I said, that it is jewish and

Christian scholars who are saying against these books.

2. No Muslim says that Quran is from men, it is only Jews and

Christians (common folks and their biased scholars) who are saying
that Quran is not from god.

3. Is it unreasonable to ask those who lay allegation to provide proof

also?

4. Islam is based on reason, logic and common sense. There is very

few Dogmas in Islam if any.
Q. JAG (Israel, 734)

Okay, who's teaching you all this nonsense? I already argued that Turkey has not severed its ties
to Asia and Islam, and even if it has, that's their government you're talking about. They don't
necessarily represent the views and actions of all Turks (once again, about 95% Muslim).

The power of a prejudiced teacher lies most in influencing his or her students into looking at the
world with the same perspective as him or her. I'd like to know what else your teachers have said
about the West and other issues, and I'll relate what my teachers have said. Want to try? It'll be
interesting, and we could both learn something. Smash the cultural divide and misconceptions
about one another.

What say you?

ANS

There need not be any teacher to teach you every thing in this world.

You have your own reasoning and logical faculties. What we have read
and how I analyze world events, is my own thinking.

If we have to leave all decisions to respective governments, then we

have to close 99 % of the threads on Topix!!

My comments about Turkey were based on their proud history as a

Muslim Super Power of the world and to what status they were reduced
when they went ahead with “Modern European Secularism” sort of
thing.

They were reduced to a second rate European Power, begging to be

admitted into EU at any cost. I hope the treatment they received
opened their eyes to this futility.

They forgot the Quranic advice “Never Ever Jews and Christians would
agree with you, unless you follow their brand of religions….”

How prudent and how ageless was this advice, every one can see.
We can share our views and discuss our prospective, to break the
barriers and know about each other’s view point.
I think that is the main reason for these threads. Not to convince or
convert anyone to their view points.

Q. MKOT (Israel, 735)

LOL. What is your proof that Islam, the Ideology is "invincible?" Ask Iranian students how its
"working" for them. Name one other "ideology" that has survived longer than Judaism. Name one
other "ideology" that has endured in EVERY society in EVERY age. We shall see how long
Islam endures in the modern world. Isolation, deprivation, totalitarianism and fascist theocracy
simply created a CLOSED SOCIETY. but, if it produces such a superior way of life WHY ARE
MUSLIMS FLEEING THE MIDDLE EAST FOR THE WEST?

ANS

You asked me what is my proof is that Islam is invincible? The growth

of Islam in the presently highly charged atmosphere of Islam phobia in
West is the Proof!!

Islam is the fastest growing of all religions in US , in Europe and in

whole world. This is the proof!!
Every day hundreds of Non Muslims enter into the faith of Islam , that
is the proof.

That more than 2/3rd of New Muslims are women (whom Islam is
supposed to enslave and persecute) that is the proof!!
I have to accept that Jews have SURVIVED all these 4000 years. Is this
really an achievement ?

Indians have survived, for thousands of years, Chinese and Japanese

have also survived for more number of years, Egyptians themselves
have survived for longer period that Jews
What does it proves?
Is survival the ONLY achievement of any race? The Tigers have also
survived in the jungle and Foxes and Jackals have also survived there.
Which one you want to be?
 Chapter-5 Evolution (Theory of Evolution, Creator etc.)

Q. Abbey Yoro (Should, 1554)

MUQ wrote:
I thought you to be intelligent fellow, but this blind faith in BTOE and rejection of Creator have
destroyed your common sense.
Instead of me reading “Laws of science”, I suggest you OPEN your EYES and have a good look
at the nature around you!!

AY: When ancient peoples looked at the nature around them, they concluded that the earth was
flat and the center of the universe. Incidentally, those conclusions are both wrong, you know.

ANS:

If someone concluded that “Earth was flat” and “that Earth was center
of Universe” was his mistake.

The Creator of this Universe NEVER said that Earth is flat or Earth is
center of Universe.

The advancement of science and technology has never PROVED that

Universe created itself.

Q. AY (Should, 1558)

Well, there's darn little in the Quran about how the universe works or what causes diseases or
how long the earth will continue to exist. So human beings had to devise science to answer those
questions. If you don't believe in modern science, please don't avail yourself of its products, like
medicines.

ANS:

There is TOO MUCH information in Quran about Universe and how long
the earth will EXIST.!!

You have to open your eyes and see it!!

What is given in Quran are FUNDAMENTALS of every thing. After that

you use your GOD GIVEN brain and find out details.

Every thing for curing diseases in ALREADY AVILABLE on this earth.

We do not need any thing from outside this earth.
Modern medicine is not the prerogative of modern science. People
were getting cured even 4000 to 5000 years ago also. Otherwise how
could the human race survived.

No one stops you to find out how the Universe works, in fact in Quran ,
Allah asks us at numerous places to ponder on His creations and find
out how they work.

But so called Pseudo Scientists have used their powers to deny the
existence of Creator itself. That is Misuse of powers given by God to
humans.

Q. Chaz (Should, 1484)

Evolution has never, and will never be, an explanation for the origin of life. It is an explanation of
how life changes over time.

Do you understand the difference?

Evolution does not occur by chance. Natural selection is NOT random.
That has nothing to do with evolution. And the end result of natural and physical forces is not
"chance".
Typical fallacy. "It sounds unbelievable, so I won't believe it regardless of any evidence".

Pretty much everything in this universe is unbelievable, MUQ. If you knew nothing of
reproduction and I were to tell you that your entire body is merely the result of the reaction
between two cells no bigger than the head of a pin, you'd laugh it off too. But it's true, regardless
of your inability to believe it.

ANS:

If you do not know how to walk, how can you expected to run?

If you do not know A, B, C, how could you be expected to lecture some

one in English?

If you do not know, how life began, then how can you understand , how
it evolved?

That is why BTOE, without understanding and explaining origin of life is

a bunch of empty words and nothing else.

If evolution is by Random Mutation and Natural Selection, then let me

say, that these two are the most non scientific terms , that any
scientist can use. That is why this BTOE is not a scientific theory at all.
You may not know the intricacies of your body and function of all its
organs, but so long you believe that you have a Creator, who has
created you, gave you life, and will test you for your actions in this
life…. You are on the right path.

But if you know each and every action of all your organs… and have
very deep insight about functioning of every part of your body… but
are one of those unfortunate lot…who gave no thought to their
creator…or the purpose of their lives, then you have wasted your life.
All your knowledge is a sort of waste, if you have not understood the
very purpose of your life.

Q. Chaz (Should, 1486)

Wrong. Many people who accept evolution, including scientists, are religious.

What's more, accepting evolution does not alter nor diminish anyone's philosophical beliefs.
Frankly, I think your statement that all people who accept evolution share a singular belief is
incredibly and obviously stupid

ANS:

You have posed two questions in your reply:

A. Many of those scientists who accept evolution are scientists and

B. Believing in evolution should not change your philosophical outlook.

Both of these are based on poor understanding of real issues involved

and your lack of depth of knowledge about religion or this BTOE, let me
clarify both.

A. Many “religious” scientists also accept evolution:

1. In our present society “religion” is just a sort of label. If your are

named in a certain way, and perform some rituals, then you are a
religious person.

2. However the real purpose of religion is to accept divine guidance

that came thru revelation on true prophets of God and live your life
accordingly.

3. As per religion, this human life is a test, and we are accountable to

our creator for the way we have spent our life on this earth. Our life is
not just a coincidence or an idle sport or just in vain.
4. Any one who is “religious” in true sense, will immediately know that
where this belief in BTOE is taking him. By believing that humans
evolved out of a single cell creature., all by themselves would negate
all concept of God, revelation, purpose of life and accountability etc.

5. But so called religious scientist do not ponder on this matter

carefully or they think it is of no real importance.

6. Like any diversion from a straight road, the separation between the
two is very less in the beginning, but as the two roads progress, the
separation gets on increasing.

7. In the days of Darwin, when his TOE was a nascent, the separation
between religion and TOE was not that much, but after 150 years, his
TOE has been hijacked by Atheists and Materialists and converted into
BTOE, the separation between religion and BTOE has become very
large.

8. So either these religious scientists do not really know what is

religion or what is BTOE or just play innocent.

Now coming to your second question

B. Believing in evolution should not change your philosophical outlook.

1. This is also explained in my above reply. BTOE is no longer a

scientific quest to find out how the life proliferated in the billions of
years since the first cell was formed.

2. It has “decided” that Creator had no hand on it. Even if He had…

they have found no “Evidence” of it.

3. So if you are die=hard supporter of BTOE, you cannot be a true

religious person and the vice versa is also true.

4. The only road open for you is to behave like a hypocrite, pay lip
service to God and religion and let your heart be with this Atheist
philosophy of BTOE.

5. I am sorry to say that most of our correspondents on this thread are

example of what I have written. They say Science and religion should
be separate. They say, religion is your personal outlook, what it has to
do in day to day life and statements like that.

6. Those who oppose them are branded as ignorant, barbaric,

fundamentalists, fools and all such names.
Q. Chaz (Should, 1562)

Do you understand the difference between self-replicating life forms and a painting?

Apparently not. The reason we know that paintings have painters is because we observe people
painting, and there is currently no known natural phenomena that produces formations such as
what appears in paintings.

We have never, not even once, observed or even evidence any kind of God or other creator
designing or taking part in the design of any kind of life. Life has only ever reproduced through
natural, chemical processes. Not once in the entire history of human kind has any life form ever
been recorder to have been the result of anything other than natural, chemical processes….

ANS:

You have tried your level best to answer my objections. Let us see the
synopsis of your arguments:

1. Paintings are not Self Replicating Life forms.

2. We have seen painters painting, but we have never seen God

creating any thing.

3. Life is nothing but a Chemical Process.

4. If instead of God, you believe that anything else created Universe,

then that thing also will really be Existing.

5. Less that 1 % scientists reject evolution.

6. Missing links are not significant. We have sufficient fossils to trace

species thru their ancestors.

This is the sum total of your arguments (plus a usual does of insults
which is a common norm for BTOE followers!!)

Now let me tell you that all of your arguments are based on limited
knowledge and over simplification: I will take them one by one:

1. Paintings are not Self Replicating Life forms:

a. I know that paintings are not self Replicating Life forms. But from
where the Self Replicating life forms originated?

b. The idea is same for every thing there has to be a Creator.

c. Have you seen self generating images on Computer Screens? They
keep on generating newer and newer patterns.

d. Can any one say that Computer is self generating these patterns?
No this is the job of programmer, who by a simple program asked the
computer to perform the task.

e. So the self Replicator also was programmed to act in the way it was
programmed by the Creator.

2. We have seen painters painting, but we have never seen God

creating any thing.

a. This is a faulty argument. We can see the painter, because he is

human like us.

b. But the Creator of this vast Universe is not a human like us or a

material body that we can se Him.

c. In fact the vastness of Universe and its mere size demands that the
Creator of such a massive design must be beyond our imaginations
and our eyes and instruments are incapable of seeing Him.

d. It is our weakness and not His fault!!

3. Life is nothing but a Chemical Process.

a. If life was but a chemical process, what prevents us from creating a

single house fly? We know all the chemical elements that are present
in a house fly!!

4. If instead of God, you believe that anything else created Universe,

then that thing also will really Exist.

a. To a primitive man, this could have some logic. But to a modern

scientist who has some idea about the vastness and complexity of
Universe, he has to have some idea as to whom he is talking about.

b. The concepts of God in various religions have to be compared with

our known knowledge and then we should see which one fits with the
hypothesis.

c. Just because some concepts of Creator (used by some religions) are

false, does not mean that God does not exists at all.
5. Less that 1 % scientists reject evolution.

a. These issues are not decided by popular votes.

b. The reason and logic from existence of Creator far exceed than the
tame voices of all scientists (because they have no knowledge, it is
their ASSUMPTION that God does not exist)

6. Missing links are not significant. We have sufficient fossils to trace

species thru their ancestors.

a. Well if you have millions of years of separation between different

stages, then missing links are very significant.

b. In order to prove some thing as revolutionary as BTOE, we must

have proofs for at least one specie and able to trace its path from
beginning to end.

c. If we cannot have such proof for even a single specie, then BTOE is
nothing but a SPECULATION. And it is noting but a SPECULATION.

Q. Chaz (Should, 1563)

We don't know. Which is exactly the problem with your analogy - it assumes that complexity
must mean design, but we known this to be false this every human ever born was born through
natural processes. Do we know exactly how ALL life started? Nope. But that's no reason to
assume it was designed just because a painting was. If reason tells us that life reproduces
chemically, then it falls to reason to deduce that life originated in that same way.

Now, do you finally see the flaw in your analogy?.... Pull the log out of your eye.

ANS:

I wish you stop answering every line of my post. It becomes very

difficult to answer you back.

But if you continue in the same way, I might not reply to your further
posts.

From your long post, I could find (despite your one sided rhetoric
criticizing me) following points worth answering

1. Only complexity means that it must be designed

2. Why things reproduce?

3. Why believe in God when we cannot Understand Him?

4. Majority of Scientist believe in TOE, so It must be true.

5. We have thousands of Transitional life form Fossils

Now I will take them one by one:

1. Only complexity means that it must be designed

a. While complexity is not the only reason that things might have a
creator, I mean a simple think like a paper pin, or a complicated like
thing like an Air Plane, both have to have a maker!!

b. My point was that, if things be simple it is possible by mere

permutation and combination for a meaningful sequence to be created
by chance.

c. But when things are very complicated, the possibility or probability

of coming them by chance becomes negligible, hence it indicates a
strong reason for a Wise and Knowledgeable Creator.

d. For example it is quite possible that after ramble shuffling, we get

Ace of Spade as first card….. but the possibility or probability that after
shuffling all cards will arrange themselves in an ascending or
descending order is negligible (unless we have a magician who places
each card at proper place while shuffling!!)

2. Why things reproduce?

a. You just glossed over that when things reproduce…did you ponder
why things should reproduce at all?

b. How they developed the quality of reproduction? It just cannot

come by mere chemical reaction.

c. They reproduce because they are designed to reproduce!!

3. Why believe in God when we cannot Understand Him?

a. This is another strange logic. That why we believe in God, whose

personality and attributes we cannot or will not understand.

b. This is not a mere philosophical question , whether we believe in

Creator or Not. Our whole purpose of life depends on it.
c. It does not matter whether we fully understand God’s personality or
attributes or not. We have to live our lives in accordance with His
wishes, otherwise we will face His wrath when we die.

4. Majority of Scientist believe in TOE, so It must be true

a. As I told that majority or minority of any opinion does not make it

true.

b. When I said that strong objection against BTOE have been raised
from within Scientific community itself, I was not speaking about
number of scientists, but the nature of objection.

c. The objections are serious and which have never been answered
except in a lame excuse that time will prove TOE to be right.

6. We have Thousands of Transitional Life forms:

a. Let me challenge you, that you do not have a SINGLE Fossil of any
Transitional life form!!

b. Perhaps you do not understand what a transitional life form is. Eyes,
Ears, and Organs (according to you) developed over millions of years.
So there would be life forms (in fossil forms) with half formed eyes,
ears, teeth and other organs. Wings, feet .

c. What ever so called transitional life forms we have, they are

complete and working specie and not any transitional form.

d. It were not discovered in Darwin’s time and they have not been
discovered even after 150 years and they never will be (because they
only exist in your minds and in minds of creative artists)!!

Q. Chimney (Should, 1470)

What is Peer Review?

ANS:

I would comment on this “peer review” hoax, that some of our

correspondent on this thread are so awed with.

They asked me to show ONE, only ONE example where this “peer
reviewed” system has failed us… In fact there are not one but many
such examples where the “peers” just let the half cooked theory and
assumptions to get thru their net:
1. The example of Piltdowm Man and Nebraska man have been quoted
earlier. The “peers” were duped by the faulty evidence for many
decades. No one apologized for their goof up.

2. Then all these “fancy drawings” which are constructed and imagined
in the “Evolution Laboratories” by the artists get the nod from these
“peers”. I do not know what criterion these “peers” use to certify
these drawings as “authentic reproduction” from a mere jaw bone or
teeth?

3. All these fantastic theories that are propounded by these BTOE

followers all are cleared by these so called “peers”. The ideas that
specie change from one to another just thru Random Mutation and
Natural Selection is propounded by these peers. Without able to trace
the full path of evolution of even a single of the millions of specie.
These “peers” never shy out to claim that BTOE is fully proven and a
fully authentic Scientific theory.

4. If a thing is so illogical and unreasonable to start with that life

originated and proliferated just by itself without any design, plan or
Creator, gets the nod from these “peers” then let me say that they are
no peers at all. They first got themselves deceived and then they use
their position to deceive others.

B. Prophet “listening” from traders coming to Makkah and then

“reproducing” that later in Quran: This is another allegation which has
been “peer reviewed” and allowed for General publication, let us see
its validity:

1. It seems that 7th Century was the “most advanced” century in the
world as for as science is concerned. All the foundations of modern
science were established, and what was needed was only a good
“listener” and “translate it into Arabic”.

2. Makkah could have been a trade center but it was never a Scientific
or Cultural center of the world. Persons visiting there were mostly
traders and one cannot think that they were fully aware of the Greek
Advances in sciences and medicines. At best their knowledge could
be rudimentary.

3. None of the Classic Greek literature were by time translated into

Arabic, that happened two centuries after the prophet.
4. Then prophet had to “listen” only for first 40 years of his life,
because when he declared his mission, the time for “Listening” was
over and now it was the world that had to listen.

5. If we analyze any of the classic Greek literature of bygone ages, we

do find certain thoughts which are correct even today, but they also
contain many things that have been proven wrong. So the genius of
prophet does not lie in “copying” but “editing” How he able to pick up
right information and leave the things which were going to be prove
wrong many centuries afterwards.

6. None of the Greek Scientist or Philosopher has been found to be

error free, while it is Quran which has kept pace with changing time
and has never been proven wrong on any of its numerous scientific
verses.

7. No doubt there are scientifically correct statements in all scriptures

like Vedas, OT and NT books (whom their followers quote very often)
but there a re also grave irreconcilable scientific errors. That is not the
case with Quran.

8. Quran is not only a linguistic miracle, it is a scientific Miracle, it is a

miracle of sociology, criminology, human rights….in short it is a
miracle of a miracle of a miracle!!

C: Curbing Israeli atrocities:

1. Then they have proposed that the Novel Idea that if Palestinians
want to avoid atrocities and brutalization by Israeli army, then they
should stop firing rockets into Israel. Just a “very Christian” type of
advise to be given by a “Non Christian”!!

2. Does the writer knows that by how much Israeli boundaries have
grown since 1948. Wars between neighboring countries are not a
thing that is very strange. We have had many hundreds of such wars
in all parts of the world. After the end of armistice , both parties are
forced to return to their old boundaries. The only exception is Israel.
Whatever lands it wins, becomes its homeland.

3. The Mighty UNO and World Super Powers feel themselves impotent
against this tiny country and it gets its way, irrespective of what the
world opinion is.

4. Palestinians have tried every sort of approach for many decades,

appealing to UNO, to US to World powers. Making silent and peaceful
protests. Using only stones as arms and now using rudimentary type
of weapons.

5. The writer asks Palestinians to keep quite, but what solution he has
for Israel to return all that land it has kept since 1948? If the
Palestinians keep quite, then the same writer would say, why they kept
quite for so long, they should have protested!!

6. Heads I win and Tail you loose type of Solution in the end!!

D. Energy Dependence:

1. The writer seems to be under assumptions that interest of World

Powers in ME and Israel is only because of Crude Oil. He has no idea of
historical facts.

2. He is under false assumption that if West develops any alternative

to Crude Oil, they would just ignore ME and leave Israel and Arabs to
sort out their differences by themselves!! The West will never
abandon Jews to their fate, as is seen by their current attitude. Oil or
no Oil, protection and preservation of Israel would be the article of faith
for most of these Western People.

Q. Chimney (Should, 1484)

When you start this rubbish, I see before me some idiot savage without a clue about the scientific
process or the way in which scientists or "peers" (you use the term incorrectly) work, think, or
consider.

Nobody "swallows" anything.

In science you are dealing with the search for new knowledge from the level of conjecture, to
hypothesis, to theory.

For example the idea that life began in a shallow pool, exposed to atmosphere etc, was an early
conjecture. Nobody "swallowed it". It was just considered the most likely candidate based on
what was known then. ….

Evolution is a modern scientific theory and has passed the test for 160 years. Origin of Life
hypotheses exist but nobody has "swallowed" one or the other. They are being investigated.
Origin of Universe - the Big Bang began as a hypothesis back when Hubble found the universe to
be expanding. It became a theory when a great deal more evidence was shown to support it e.g.
the background microwave radiation.

Until you even begin to understand the way science actually works, you will continue to sound
like an idiot.
ANS:

There is only one point on which all "Scientists, peers and Blind BTOE
followers" agree.... That there never was a plan, design or creator for
this Universe!!

What else is called a close mind?

If they had started on the right foot... may be this nature and every
thing in it would have guided them to the right path...

But by first rejecting the hand of Creator in everything, they have

doomed all their efforts to failure.

They are groping in the dark, running after red herrings one after the
another...

That is the problem with falsehood, it seems to solve one problem but
in reality creates ten more!!

The correct approach for these BTOE followers is to come back to right
path...start from the very beginning....

See the Power, Wisdom and Mercy of Creator in every thing....from the
first Bang to the formation of primitive matter....

The origin of life... the forms it took... looking for evidence and praying
to Creator to help them in their search....saying " We do not know
anything, except what You had taught us and You indeed are knower
of every thing hidden or open"

Q. Chimney (Should, 1486)

False.

Different scientists, peers, and BTOE followers have different views as to whether there is a plan,
design, or creator. As many have pointed out to you 1000s of times. Are you really this stupid?

Another potentially good brain, obviously destroyed by Islamic brainwashing. No wonder only 2
Nobel prizes ever in science, and those two Muslims were working in the West! It is apparent
why, to everyone but you - you are merely a showcase for the reason why!

Riddle? Proteins are simply long chains of amino acids and can form from non-biological
precursors….

ANS:
1. “Someone” is trying to educate me about these protein molecules,
saying that these are just a long string of Amino acids and nothing
else!!

Does he want to say that any combination of Amino Acids becomes a

protein? If that was the case, then there was no problem…

but the problem is that not every combination of Amino Acids is a

protein….they have to be certain specific combinations of certain
specific polarity!! Out of Billions upon Billions of such possible
combinations, only a few thousands are only correct and rest have to
be discarded.

That was not possible by mere permutation and combination… he tries

to override this difficulty by saying over millions of years…as if the
millions of years are a helping factor!!

Any thing done idly over millions or billions of years would only add to
the confusion and would make the choice difficult

2. As to his comment that opinion is divided between “peers, Scientists

and BTOE followers” that if indeed there is a Purpose, Design or
Creator behind all this….speaks more than these words can convey.

3. It means that you can go on believing in what you want, so long as

you do not contradict us and allow us to lead the way..

4. The success of your life will not be calculated as to how many Nobel
Prize you have won….. no one can even say that all these Nobel Prize
Winners were really successful and fulfilled the mission of their lives.
Their answer book is in the hands of their Creator and He will decide if
they deserve any prize or not.

5. Nobel Prize and all such prizes are only recognition by humans that
they did some thing remarkable in their lives. The standard by which
God judges and by which humans judge are different from ach other.

6. I want to pose one question to such type of people.

Who is successful in this life, A CEO of a Multinational Company or a

mere Janitor who sweeps the floor of the same Multinational Company?
Please reply with justification. (this is not a Multiple Choice type of
question)

Q. Chimney (Should, 1486)

Yet again betraying your utter lack of understanding of how science works.

We can know how evolution works before we know the origin of life or of the universe. We can
have partial explanations before we have complete ones. In fact we MUST, in science, that is how
science grows and learns.

Your problem is that you are so brainwashed you can only see the world in the terms dictated by
your religion. You thinks that its fake certainty and answers to everything are real.

Then you compare it to science, an HONEST discipline that admits doubt where doubt exists, and
you say "if they don't know everything, then they know nothing!".

….Two absurdly stupid and simplistic tricks that only your brainwashed mind could fall for.

ANS:

Some one is again trying to teach me what science is and what

evolution is, as if I do not know it.

I have mentioned many times that science is only the study of cause
and effect. It has no place for philosophy or theorization, if it does,
then it goes beyond its scope.

It is not necessary for any scientist to know every thing (no one can do
that also, for sure), but he should not comment on some thing and be
firm in his comment without knowing most of it.

Take the case of this Universe and every thing in it. Can any
reasonable man think that all this would have happened without a
Creator just by itself?

The people of bygone ages could be pardoned for saying so, because
they did not have enough knowledge. But in this age, when we have
used powerful telescopes to see countless galaxies and stars all
moving in coordinated orbits and following same laws… how can we for
an instant believe that they came just by themselves?

The laws of Physics, Thermodynamics and every other branch…indeed

prove that there is a single Creator. The laws did not create
themselves. How could the same laws be applicable in every part of
this universe?

The same thing happens for life, its origin , and its proliferation. If
people of bygone centuries denied the existence of a Creator, they
could be excused.
But how come a modern scientist who sees with his own eyes, the
intricacies and the details that is available even in the smallest unit of
life forms, how can he be not amazed at the power and mercy of
Creator?

How can a scientist say, that it all happened by itself without any Plan,
Design or Creator? If he says that, then he is not a True Scientist.

Further when they are unable to prove any of their hypothesis by

“Creating themselves” any living thing, a thing as small and negligible
as a “House Fly”!!

The writer says that I am blinded by my religious beliefs, I say that he

is blinded by his Atheist beliefs.!!

Q. Chimney (Should, 1518)

The problem is your hang-up with "random". You've already been told that evolution is NOT a
random process, so either you have a REALLY short memory, or you are being dishonest.
Neither is very flattering. You are also mixing abiogenesis with evolution. Which one do you
want to discuss? That we don't have an exact answer to how life started has nothing to do with us
knowing how it then diversified. Even if some god planted that first life, what we do know is that
evolution occurs. The only random part is that of genetic mutation. Evolution itself is far from
random as selective pressures drive what mutations do or do not become entrenched in a
population.

You claim to be "rational" with a post like this?...

ANS:

I have told many times that a sound theory should explain every thing.
How come BTOE which deals with evolution of species be blind as to
how it all started.

Just by using two different words "Abiogenesis" and "BTOE" for the two
will not solve the problem.

If the God Created the first cell....then it was He who caused it to

change into any other sepcie as He wished!! What is illogical or
unreasonable about it?

But the claim that God had nothing to do, once He created the first cell
and left then the process to RM and NS, is very illogical and
unreasonable on the face of it.
In none of your explanations you have able to explain how "Information
and Intelligence" can enter into a "Totally Dumb" system!!

I only used Pin as one of the example... But let me say , NOTHING can
be created unless we plan in advance and then put our plan is
execution in right order.

The existence of so many life form s in front of us.....this is the real

proof of Creator..... But people should first open their eyes to look at
them!!

Q. Chimney (Should, 1538)

No, MUQ, they accept that there is no easy answer from Gods or Prophets.
That such truths as we have learned came from careful observation and hard thinking, of
comparing and rationally arguing the alternatives, from continual testing and challenging of our
theories, from opening our eyes and getting out hands dirty and making mistakes and learning,
being humble before the reality of the universe.
You want to believe that the Truth fell from the sky, whispered into the ear of one man, just to
make it easy for you. I would not care about that. What I do care is that given the chance, you
would try to force your fake easy truths on everyone else at the point of a sword, and destroy the
real hard won truths EARNED by men, not fallen from the sky.

ANS:

There are some things that can be seen and verified with Physical Eyes
and Material Instruments.... but there ARE things that CANNOT be seen
thru eyes and CANNOT be verified by MATERIAL Instruments.

It is foolish to say that anything which we CANNOT see and CANNOT

verify using our means does not exist at all!!

Our eyes and our Instruments have LIMITATIONS and it is not the fault
of these non material things that they CANNOT be seen thru eyes.

These non material things have to be SEEN thru reason , logic and
arguments. And that is what I am doing on this thread since beginning.

The case for existence of Creator has a very strong logical proof.

The existence of Universe and every thing in it is biggest proof, the

uniformity of laws and its application on every part of this vast
Universe (from sub atomic particles to galaxies) is another proof.

The special power given to humans , above and over all other Creation
is another proof. No Power comes without responsibility.

The continuous chain of prophets all preaching the same message is

another proof. These are not things that could be just hushed away.
Those denying existence of Creator have no proof at all, they have only
their assumptions and EXCUSE that We could not see Him thru our
physical eyes and our material instruments were unable to detect His
Presence!!

Q. Chimney (Should, 1551)

There is, as usual, not one iota of logic in your post.

You have not demonstrate that intelligence has to lie behind any complexity, which is what your
assertions boil down to.

All you communicate, underneath it all, is that you cannot stand the concept that your life is not
some magical gift from a loving God who cherishes you, the same God who will allow you to
magically avoid the reality of your own death as the end of all things for MUQ.

In other words, it is not "reason and logic" at the foundation of your arguments, just "fear and
cowardice". You would destroy all freedom and truth for the sake of your fear and cowardice….

ANS:

All I think to say about your mail is that Reason and Logic are the
Prerogatives of BTOE followers!!

No reason and no logic is to be found in any other group of people!!

What else I could accept from a “Die Hard BTOE Follower”!!

As for as logic and reason goes, if our lives are not a mercy from our
Creator, then on whose mercy they are? Charles M. Darwin’s?

If some one other than God can give life, then how come we have not
been able to create even a single House fly? (An old Joke? Is it)

I thank you for giving links between so many species. Can you please
give me time differences between the earliest fossils of these species?

And how many DOTS are missing when you link these species?

For example how many stages came between Hyracotherium and

Orahippus?
If we go by your own RM and NS theory, it could be millions of years!!
Do you have fossils of in between stages or it is hidden in minds of
some “Creative Artist”?
Q. Chimney (Should, 1553)

Your point is clear but your "answer" is the joke.

We don't yet know how the physical laws that operate came to be, and there is no guarantee that
we ever will, and we accept that. We also look to the honest researches and results of people who
are looking.

But you don't know either, you just pretend to. Unable to stomach the real answers we have and
the questions we still have, you run to a magic book.

ANS:

So inspite of being BTOE follower, you some time have to spell out
truth.

“We do not know how the physical laws came to be and there is no
guarantee that we will ever be….”

That was the honest part…. But the dishonest part came afterwards
….”yet we reject that there was a Wise, Knowledgeable, and Merciful
Power, that made all these laws”!!

That is where Blind Faith in BTOE took over and your bout of “honesty”
ended!!

I do hope that your bout of honesty lasts a little longer!!

Q. Chimney (Should, 1554)

Ah, but there is a source of information.

Let us be precise. Information can be defined as departure from randomness. How does evolution
achieve this, without a "designer"?

Step one: By generating random variation. No design, purpose, thought. Just changes, which in
most cases have no effect or a negative one, but in a few cases happen to improve survival
chances.

Step two: By generating more copies of life, with (step one) random changes) than can survive.

Step three: By the fact that the few with beneficial random changes will be more likely to survive
and pass on those changes to the next generation.

Step four: Repeat step one.

Survival in a competitive environment is the NON-RANDOM selection factor that creates

information. Specifically, it creates additional information at the level of DNA.
ANS:

You are moving around in circles.

If it was possible for Random ness to create Information….why we are

unable to make as small a thing as paper pin by randomly hitting steel
with hammer?

There is no proof that at ANY TIME, the universe was Randomly

evolving.

Right from the moment of Big Bang, EVERYTHING went as planned!!

Check with scientists, they say that even if there was some minutest
variations in the parameters at Big Bang Time, this Universe would
have collapsed upon itself.

Such minute balances are not because of randomness. They show the
presence of Creator, His power and His Wisdom.

What steps you have mentioned, they just exist in your head. Why
cant you create a single Housefly using these stages!!

Q. Chimney (Should, 1556)

No, the fact that the laws of this universe needed to be very close to what they turned out to be,
suggests that the Big Bang was not a singular event but a common one, and that the vast majority
of universes so created will not develop in such a way as to support life. We, logically, happen to
live in a universe where the laws make our existence possible.

This is far more plausible than your "magic book" explanation

MUQ, don't just look at half the picture.

The Variation is random, but the Selection process is not. ….

ANS:

It is like what I said. If you BELIEVE in BTOE, you will go to ANY

LENGTH to defend it!!

And that is what charge you put on us “religious people”. Your newest
post is based on your latest “hallucinations” to defend BTOE at any
cost, for example:

A. Big Bang not a singular event:

Pray tell me what PROOFS or EVIDENCES you have of earlier Big
Bangs? What evidences you have of Multiple Universes?

They all are in your head only!!

B. Mutation was Random but NS was not Random:

This is another of your gems!! When there as no intelligence in any

part of the system, why NS should also not be dumb?

C. Men CREATED Dogs from Wolves:

This is not called creation. Use of existing process in a refined way

using the natural process is in no way called creation. Dogs are still
dogs and wolves are still wolves.

Their outward similarities is like between man and monkeys.

D. When every thing else is possible, why a Powerful and Wise Creator
is not possible?

If you would INVENT any theory just to deny the existence and
presence of Creator, why can’t a simple and logical stand which gets
you out of all these difficulties is possible?

But like I said before “once a Blind BTOE follower, ALWAYS a blind
BTOE Follower.”

Q. Chimney (Should, 1566)

Transitional forms” as you understand them are not a feature of evolution, they are an invention
of creationists.

Every species alive today is a potential “transitional species”, and is itself the result of numerous
transitions that show in the fossil record.

A bat is a mammal with wings. A flying fox is a mammal with “half wings”, enabling it to glide
but not fly efficiently the way a bat does. If future chance variations in the flying fox genome
make some flying foxes slightly better at gliding/flying, and this provides a survival advantage,
then these variations will spread through the population. Not over one generation, or 10, or 100,
will this accumulation of changes make a flying fox a true flier. But over 10,000 or 100,000
generations, they could, step by tiny step. …

ANS:
Now there is another MASTER PIECE!!

I could have shouted EUREKA if I was Archimedes.

Poor Charles Darwin…he died looking for “Transitional life forms”…..

the fool that he was!!

Thousands of “Transitional Life forms” were already present in his

time, how did he miss it? Was the guy blind or short sighted?

And then why we NEED to go to Fossil record at all!!

We have Transitional Life forms, right in front of our eyes:

- Bat , which is half mammal

- Flying fox, which is half Bird has half wing

- Cephalods have “half eyes” and some one “half ears”…some others
with “Half legs” and others with “half hands”

- If we look carefully, we could find specie with “half heart”, half lung”,
“half blood” and every other brand.

- People who are searching fossil records are real fools.

That is why I said that people would go to ANY LENGTH to justify and
PROVE BTOE,.

Some one surely needs a Nobel prize for that discovery!!

The one which was wasted on Obama, should be snatched and sent to
UAE via DHL for PRONTO Delivery!!

Address: Darwin’s father

BTOE Street
Any Post Box
Dream Land

PS: Then any thing is possible in 10,000 or 100,000 generations!!

1. May be the Bats would De-evolve to either Mammal or Bird

2. Flying Foxes could de-evolve to normal fox or re-evolve to become

total birds (and save themselves from all that negative propaganda
that is around them).

3. All those with "half organs" could either grow full organs, or leave all
the organs and live without any organs!!

Every thing and any thing is POSSIBLE in our Universe governed by

Random Mutations..... But who placed the NATURAL SELECTION there?

It could not be Creator, because He does not exist....it must have been
Darwin...or his 1,000,000th ancestor

The one who was before the common ancestors of men and ape!!

Boy, if you need laughs, sometimes you should read posts of

"Committed BTOE followers"

Q. Christopher (Should, 1551)

These 'laws' that you seem to be getting hung up on are merely man's attempt to understand the
universe around him. There is no 'author' to these laws, and even if there was, you have provided
no evidence that it was your god (rather than any of the other ten thousand gods that man has
invented in the last forty thousand years) who did so.

Might I suggest you read brush up on what 'laws of science' really means? You can start here -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laws_of_science

ANS:

It is very interesting to learn that there are no “Actual Laws” in the

nature and things are just running hanky panky there!!
Then it was very amusing to learn that there could be over ten
thousands gods making and writing these laws. I think they probably
have a committee to write down these laws.
Then prey tell us , why the Laws are Uniform thru out Universe? Do all
these gods have same dominion? Why no god Objects, why other is
interfering in his domain?

I thought you to be intelligent fellow, but this blind faith in BTOE and
rejection of Creator have destroyed your common sense.

Instead of me reading “Laws of science”, I suggest you OPEN your

EYES and have a good look at the nature around you!!
Q. Christopher (Should, 1554)

did open my eyes. That's why I was able to dismiss all gods as the inventions of the deceitful to
(not) explain the universe to the ignorant in order to distract him while his pocket is being picked.

ANS:

No you did not open your eyes fully. You only rejected the concepts
which most people have about god.

You NEVER listened and pondered on what God the Creator Himself
says about Him.

If you would have OPENED your Eyes and LISTENED with your ears, you
would not be persisting in that childish theory called as BTOE!!

Q. Christopher Pearsol (Should, 1551)

Do you enjoy displaying your ignorance for everyone else to mock?

There are very good reasons why there are not mountains everywhere, and why they show up
where they do. If you had even the most basic of understandings of Plate Tectonics, you would
know this.

Here are a few articles where you can brush up some and try and acquire a clue.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plate_techtonics
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volcano

You have presented no evidence to back your assertions that the Earth is 'supervised' and 'tightly
controlled', just as you have provided no evidence that such a supervisor and controller, if it
existed, is the god of Islam. Until you do, I would suggest you mind your tone and try not to sneer
at us from behind your own ignorance.

ANS:

Thanks you for “lecturing me” on why Mountains are not every where
and what the Plate tectonics and other phenomenon mean.

But as usual you missed the real argument and contended yourself
with Obiter Dicta!!

The real question is how come this Plate Tectonics originated? Did it
came by itself? Are there not laws covering every aspect of every
thing in this Universe?

Who is the author of these laws? Did these laws came by themselves
or “slowly evolved” from “simple laws”?
These are basic questions which need to be answered, but you are so
engrossed in the outer shelf that you miss the core issue!!

God the Creator is the Author of All Laws that are to be seen in this
Universe. Some we humans have found out and there are millions that
are still hidden from us.

I think that your “outer knowledge” has proven a shield for you to look
inside.

If you had EYES (and kept them open) every thing in this Universe
would have pointed to you to their and yours own Creator!!

The biggest tragedy of our time is that persons who should be in the
forefront of arguing for Creator have become His enemies!!

Q. Denis 2 (Should , 1522)

Now you are just lying. The majority of people who accept the theory of evolution, including
scientists, most certainly do not reject the teachings of the religious...most of them ARE religious.
Some of the biggest proponents of TOE are also devout believers in various religions.

You say "Quran answer these basic questions about the creations of Universe, earth, everything in
it, the purpose of creation of things in Universe and specially about the position of human life and
their rights and duties."...but in fact, it answers nothing. It CLAIMS to answer those things, but
there is nothing, no basis whatsoever, to believe it. No evidence. Worse yet, people like you try to
use your "holy" books to not only believe something with no evidence (which is fine, doesn't
impact me), but to then also try to deny reality and science when reality and science doesn't mesh
with your chosen mythological explanations.

ANS:

I have explained in before and want to repeat it now. The so called

“religious believers of BTOE” are really hypocrites. They are neither a
true BTOE supporter nor a true religious people. At best they have a
very wrong concept what religion really is
The religions say that God is the ultimate Creator of Universe and
every thing in it. BTOE says that things got created by chance ,
coincidence or mere hit and trial, how could both be true?

Religions say that human life has a purpose and man is accountable for
his actions,. BTOE says that man is nothing but a more evolved animal,
how could both be true?
So you could either be a BTOE supporter or a believer in religion.
Quran does answer the topics I mentioned and it speaks with the
authority of the Lord and Creator of this universe. It even throws a
challenge to all humans to bring a book like Quran if they are in doubt
about its divine origin.
Evolution which is supported by religion is as apart from this BTOE as
east is from west.
So you pick your choice and be not a hypocrite.

Q. Dude (Should, 1514)

Not interested in your preaching and unsupported opinions, MUQ. (yawn)

ANS:

You are content to walk with your eyes closed..... Self inflicted
Blindness and being led by another Blind...BTOE.

Is it too much to guess what would be the result?

There is a couplet in vernacular Hindi by Poet Kabir which means:

"If the teacher is Blind, his pupil would be double blind.

One Blind leading and pushing another Blind, till both fall into well or
ditch"

And seems to be the fate of BTOE and its Blind Followers!!

But they will not open their eyes to SEE the Universe around them.....to
HEAR the voices of everything in it.....To REFLECT on the working of
Universe and every thing in it.

They have EYES but closed them

They have EARS but shut them.

They have HAERTS (reasoning power) but sewn it.

Can they be compared with Cattle?.....Might be, but they really are
worse than cattle!!!

Was I too harsh in my judgment? No. not in the least

Q. Dude (Should, 1518)
False. What's more, this is as far as your analogy takes you. In life, the cards keep what works
and goes with that. If something better comes along, it keeps those too. The "good" stuff is
selected for, and the "bad" stuff gets left behind. And this apparently happens without any
external "intelligent influence".

You continue to argue against "randomness" while not even attempting to contemplate the
mechanism of natural selection.

That is why you fail.

And you've just been informed - evolution is not "blind".
Exactly. You prefer willful ignorance. For you fear knowledge, logic, rationality and learning, as
you feel they may be a threat to your faith. …

ANS:

The basic flaw in your analogy is "from where in the intelligence comes
in a totally blind system"? Who decides which is good and which is
bad?

And the number of "bads" are many millions before a "good one"
comes along, so the creations are overwhelmed with "Bad ones" and it
is impossible for a good one to survive.

Natural Selection is also blind and has no hindsight to select which is

good or which is bad.

Just because article of faith of my religion are so reasonable, logical

and keeping up with modern science.... why should I discard those in
favor of some thing as wild and unreliable as this BTOE? It is only a
very biased person who will reject these logical and reasonable views,
only because they are expressed in a revealed book 1400 years back.
You should answer arguments with arguments and not just rhetoric’s.

Thank you for patting yourself on the bank....this is the self delusion
and bias which I was speaking about. That is your eyes and in the eyes
of BTOE followers, yours arguments are sound. reasonable and logical
and all arguments of your opponents are unreasonable, illogical and
wrong.

What else is bigotry?

Q. Edape (Should, 1516)

I am not an intellectual but a student on this forum.

I especially enjoy this debate and have already stated I side with TOE.
I personally don't believe even the people that gang up against you think you are a threat but are
sincerely debating you with the knowledge they have.
Kindly keep the debate.
Happy Thanksgiving if applicable.

ANS:

I appreciate your comments.

This is the beauty of BTOE of followers....they follow different standards

, one for themselves and another for their opponents.

For example, when we ask them to "Show me or Prove to me or Give

me REAL Evidence" that the so called "First Self Replicator" came by
chance or by happy coincidence....they too become "philosophical" and
start giving lame excuses that see it happened so many millions of
years ago...how could we find it...etc..etc.

But they have FULL right to demand the same for God . that I should
show Him physically, or bring HARD evidence of His existence (as if
this Universe is a SOFT Evidence!!)....

The questions I raise about BTOE are not about evidence...they attack
at the very basics and very roots.

Such questions do not need any physical evidence at all. They have to
be answered by reason and logic.

Can any thing self create itself....? Can any thing randomly and then
change into some thing useful?

How come we humans despite so much advancement in science and

technology and no much knowledge about universe, are not able to
CREATE even a single Housefly despite our best efforts?

These are the questions which really HURT these BTOE followers and
they try to shut me down my using all sorts of accusations.

And these are the Questions which are answered in Quran and other
Revealed Books. They tell us what is the purpose of human life on this
earth and why humans have been given so many powers which no
other creatures has.
But saying that "Human life has a purpose" seems like showing "red
flag" to these raging bulls !!!

When humans create anything, from paper pins to Powerful

airplanes...they have to have some purpose....but when God created all
this Universe and every thing in it, it has no purpose.

That is why I call these people Blind, because they have closed their
eyes and do not want to open it, even if some one asks and pleads
them to open it.

If they opened their eyes, then EVERYTHING in this Universe....will be

pointing only in one direction....the Direction of their Creator!!

Q. Erasmus (Should, 1577)

Probably not all of them, but when asked for evidence I do supply it. When you are asked to
supply evidence you change the subject.
Again the heads I win and Tails you loose situation!!
You really like to play the part of the martyr, don't you. Please, spare us the pitiful "poor
persecuted me" act. Evidence, you win. That's how it works. That's how it has always worked.
If any one can prove that nothing exists which is not Materialistic or Non Materialitic things can
be PROVEN by Materialistic means.....then may be you could be right.
Why do I have to prove that nothing exists? That makes zero sense.

ANS:

You ask me to play martyr…but in fact you are playing yourself….you

say that we provide evidence where ever we are asked.

Now I ask you one Question “Where is your EVIDENCE that First Self
Replicator came by chance or by coincidence”?

I ask you another Question “Where is your EVIDENCE that Life started
by chance or by coincidence on this earth”?

I ask you another Question “Where is your EVIDENCE that things can
create themselves without any plan, design or purpose”.

If you cannot PROVIDE any REAL EVIDENCE of these things (unless in

philosophical language and ducking the main issues)…… then why you
COMPLAIN that I cannot SHOW you existence of God?

The existence of Creator is proven thru His Creations and that is where
you should concentrate.
How is it possible for this vast Universe and every thing in it, to come
by itself without any Plan, Any design or any Purpose.

Have you found any thing in this Universe that does not follow laws of
nature? Who made these Laws of Nature? What is your EVIDENCE
that Laws of Nature came by themselves?

If you ask these BASIC Questions, then you will find that all
FOUNDATIONS of Your BTOE are placed on shifty grounds.

You have NO EVIDENCE for answering the BASIC Questions of this

BTOE.

And that is where Quran and religion helps you find answers to basic
Questions.

Once you have solved this basic question….there is no harm in

exploring nature to any details and with as much minute details as you
want.

You will never be mislead again…once your FUNFDAMENTALS are

right…..you will never again be fooled by this nonsense BTOE!!

Q. Leg of…. (Should, 1595)

Evolution is already taught in schools.

The Bible bashing still exists in schools too, at a very young and impressionable age.
Imagine the up roar if the Koran was to be taught on equal grounds in primary schools in the US
and Australia.
I think it all should be replaced with morals and ethics classes. Keep religion in the home and
church, were it belongs.
I am 100 % with you...but please tell me what is the source of these "moral and Ethics" that you
speak of?

ANS:

As per my research there is not one word in BTOE or any book of

science on "Moral and Ethical values"?

Is walking nude on street is Immoral or un-ethical? (How will you prove

it?).

Is making sexual intercourse in public places Immoral or un-ethical?

(How will you prove it?).

Is marrying your mother, sister, or daughter immoral or un-ethical?

(How will you prove it?).

I am all for teaching good moral and good ethics in schools, colleges,
universities and market places, industries and financial institution.

But we need to know what we mean by morals and ethics and where is
the source from where we get it?

It is a non religious question....so do not be biased in answering it.

What is relation between Science ...moral and ethics?

Q. Lin (Should, 1562)

I believe that the God of Abraham is the creator. It is funny how these scientist see humans and
apes. It is like comparing a Rolls Royce and a hay wagon, these two were designed different from
their beginnings. We have freedom to believe as we see fit in our country but these guys seem to
think they can hoard all knowledge and dispense it to us as they see it.

ANS:

Yes you are absolutely right!! God of Abraham, God of Ishmael, God of
Isaac, God of Jacob, God of Joseph, God of Moses, David, Solomon, God
of Jesus and God of Mohammad (May peace of Allah be on to all His
prophets) is the true God!!

What more, jews, Christians and Muslims believe in and worship the
same God. Despite our slight difference in concept of God; we
basically worship the same Creator of this Universe!!

This Theory of Evolution is basically an Atheist concepts to explain the

Creation and variety of life forms which we see around us.

All leading lights behind this TOE are basically atheists, the so called
religious people supporting it are in minority and in most case they do
not know what are the repercussion of what they say.

Any body with right thinking mind and heart in proper place cannot
believe for even an instant that this whole Universe would have formed
itself, without any plan, design or purpose behind it.

You have common sense , which this TOE followers lack. I wish you
best of luck and have a nice day.
Q. Steve (Should, 1522)

Qidwai, you're a hoot. Grab a kleenex and blow your nose while I clear something up for you.

I'm not a "BTOE Expert". I'm a boiler operator. No higher up the food chain than Homer
Simpson. Lemme tell you something about my job. If I ignore science; if I let fake science rule
my day, I die. People around me die. Millions of dollars of equipment turns to scrap metal. Lots
of other folks are out of work. All because I accepted fake science.

Ain't gonna happen.

ANS:

As a boiler operator…. You do need a lot of Kleenex tissues to swipe all

those controls and knobs.
Who asks you to ignore science… but if you were a BTOE follower, you
would close your eyes and push the buttons at random…. And WISH
that boiler will run safe.
As a true boiler operator, you go thru all the manuals and safe
operating procedure and Emergency Shutdown Systems. Unless you
are thorough on these…they would never leave you alone near a boiler
control panel.
Now is it conceivable that God would have left that Big Hydrogen
Boilers (Sun and million type bigger stars than sun) just to run by
themselves and carry on as they wish? But that is what these BTOE
followers would led us to assume….that every thing originated and
regulated itself …

As a true boiler operator….you do know the proper steps for lighting up

and shutting a simple device like a boiler and what havoc it would
cause if they were ignored….can you even think that these huge
Nuclear Fission and Fusion boilers are running unsupervised?
It is so strange to see that you use double standards when it comes to
your boiler and when it comes to religious scriptures.

The words of one man spoken by the authority of the Lord, Master and
Creator of Universe are above the words of whole humanity. You
cannot keep Creator and Creations in the same scale.
As for your comments about the Quran, it seems you have not studied
it with the care and attention with which you read your Boiler
Operations Manual.. This Quran is Human’ Operational Manual and
needs much more care.
Q. Steve (Should, 1565)

wrote a rebuttal in simply worded paragraphs and you ignored me.

I wrote a point by point rebuttal showing that your entire argument consisted of a series of
fallacies including "begging the question", "circular reasoning", and "argument from ignorance".
You ignored me.

It is clear that you do not intend to respond in any format wherein you lose, which would be all of
them.

What's left you whining little coward?...

ANS:

May be I did not respond to you, because some time I am flooded with
mails and I do not reply to each one of that.

Or may be the question or objection you raised was already covered by

some one else. (Or on second thought, if your earlier post was like the
present one, I just ignored it!!).

Now the epithet you used to address me…just think how I can reply to
these accusations!!

You yourself become the Prosecutor…the Jury…the Judge and the

Executioner!!

What ever you write is all logical, reasonable and “scientific” and
whatever I write is “circular reasoning” and “argument from
ignorance”…

With that attitude how can we discuss any thing?

Yes I know that Topix does not support Arabic and so many other fonts,
but we cannot help it.
In my view , if you want to raise any objection against Quran, raise it
one point at a time (there is no shortage of time here, as per TOE, it
takes millions of years for any substantial change to be noticed in any
specie!!).

If you want to discuss any thing with me, you have to use civil
language, raise one point at a time and listen to my answer before
replying.

This Rambo like attitude in which you hold all the aces and you dictate
your views on me, is not going to work.
I have a simple tool to deal with such people and such post…..I just
ignore them!!

Q. Unknown (Should, 1563)

Nails as “health Bulletin”?

ANS:

I received a very interesting E-mail, which I want to share with out

fellow BTOE believers.

If I asked our BTOE believing fellows, what are nails and why we have
them….many will say “Nature’s blunder” or “Just a nuisance”.

Many would be wishing for the day when “Scientists and Doctors”
would invent an antidote to stop this continuous grow of nails and
causing all these “problems”

Relax guys, Just see, how the nails act as your “Current Health
Bulletin”!!

First you read the “scientific” part of the E-mail…..then I will comment
with my “Non Scientific” point of view

Nails and Health: Read the Signs ([email protected])

Did you know your nails can reveal clues to your overall health? A
touch of white here, a rosy tinge there, or some rippling or bumps may
be a sign of disease in the body. Problems in the liver, lungs, and heart
can show up in your nails.

. The nail plate (the nail) is the keratinized structure, which grows
throughout life

. The nail bed (ventral matrix, sterile matrix) is the vascular bed that is
responsible for nail growth and support. It lies protected between the
lunula (the "half moon" seen through the nail) and the hyponychium
(the posterior part of the nail bed epithelium); and The eponychium
(cuticle). The epidermal layer between the proximal nail fold and the
dorsal aspect of the nail plate.

The primary purpose of the nail is protection. Abnormalities of the nail

are often caused by skin disease and infection (most often fungal) but
may also indicate more general medical conditions.

Brown-Gray Nails

Brown-gray nails may suggest the followings:

Cardiovascular disease;
Diabetes mellitus;
Vitamin B12 deficiency;
Breast cancer; Malignant melanoma;
Lichen planus; Syphilis; and
Topical agents, including hair dyes, solvents for false nails, varnish,
and formaldehyde.

Beaked Nails

- Severe Nail Curvature, Curved or beaked nails Consider the

following:
- Hyperparathyroidism,
Renal failure,
Psoriasis,
Systemic sclerosis

Pale Nails

Very pale nails are sometimes linked to aging. But they can also be a
sign of serious illness, such as:
- Anemia,
- Congestive heart failure ,
- Diabetes,
- Liver disease,
- Malnutrition

White Nails

If the nails are mostly white with darker rims, this can indicate liver
problems, such as hepatitis. In this image, you can see the fingers are
also jaundiced, another sign of liver trouble.

Dark Lines Beneath the Nail

Dark lines beneath the nail should be investigated as soon as possible.

They are sometimes caused by melanoma, the most dangerous type of

skin cancer.
Longitudinal brown lines.

Longitudinal brown lines form because of increased melanin produced

by nail matrix melanocytes. They are associated with:
Addison's disease;
Nevus at the nail base;
Breast cancer;
Melanoma; and
Trauma.

Gnawed Nails

Biting your nails may be nothing more than an old habit, but in some
cases it’s a sign of persistent anxiety that could benefit from
treatment. Nail biting or picking has also been linked to obsessive-
compulsive disorder. If you can’t stop, it’s worth discussing with your
doctor.

Yellow Nails

One of the most common causes of yellow nails is a fungal infection. As

the infection worsens, the nail bed may retract, and nails may thicken
and crumble. In rare cases, yellow nails can indicate a more serious
condition such as severe thyroid disease or psoriasis.

Bluish Nails

Nails with a bluish tint can mean the body isn’t getting enough oxygen.

This could indicate an infection in the lungs, such as pneumonia.

Rippled Nails

If the nail surface is rippled or pitted, this may be an early sign of

psoriasis or inflammatory arthritis. Psoriasis is a skin condition that
starts in the nails 10% of the time.

Cracked or Split Nails

Dry, brittle nails that frequently crack or split have been linked to
thyroid disease.

Cracking or splitting combined with a yellowish hue is more likely due

to a fungal infection.
Inflammation Around the Nail

Paronychial Inflammation Paronychia is associated with separation of

the seal between the proximal nail fold and the nail plate that provides
entry for bacteria and leads to a localized infection of the paronychial
tissues of the hands. Symptoms may include inflammation, swelling,
and/or scaling.

Puffy Nail Fold

If the skin around the nail appears red and puffy, this is known as
inflammation of the nail fold. It may be the result of lupus or another
connective tissue disorder.

Nail Beading

It is associated with endocrine conditions, including the following:

Diabetes mellitus;
Thyroid disorders;
Addison's disease; and
Vitamin B deficiency.

Spoon-shaped concave nails

Koilonychia are spoon-shaped concave nails. This occurs normally in

children and usually resolves with aging.

Causes include the following:

Iron deficiency;
Diabetes mellitus;
Protein deficiency, especially in sulfur-containing amino acids (cysteine
or methionine);
Exposure to petroleum-based solv Systemic lupu, Raynaud's disease

Leukonychia Striae

Example of leukonychia striae. Note location of white splotches, which

can indicate timing of the traumatic event.

Nails Are Only Part of the Puzzle

Though nail changes accompany many conditions, these changes are

rarely the first sign. And many nail abnormalities are harmless -- not
everyone with white nails has hepatitis. If you’re concerned about the
appearance of your nails, see a dermatologist.
Hi Guys!! Now you have seen how useful these nails are and how much
they work for us.
Now I want to draw your attention to the following questions:
1. Why Random Mutations and NS should have cared for such non
important things as nails?
2. Why should all those “disease symptoms” be sending to nails by
Nature and RM and NS, and for whose use?
3. In what way the Evolution process would have suffered if this
“health bulletin” was not send to the nails?
4. Was it mere coincidence or chance that these diseases symbols
were sent to our nails?
5. The doctors who discovered this…they really did some thing to bring
those signals? Were the same symptoms not available for thousands
of years, without any one knowing it?
6. Is it not possible that thousands of such information are still
available for other parts of human bodies?
7. How can you answer for so many different signals to come to a
single part of human body…. How a Blind and dumb Evolution System
could have decided that?
Now read this verse from Quran:
“Does man think that We cannot assemble his bones? No we are able
to put in perfect order the very tips of his fingers” (75:3-4)
God is able to assemble even our fingers (with all its ingredients), Why
mention finger tips? Is it mere chance or poetry or has some meanings
behind it?
Commentators of Quran have tried to answer this:
1. Some say because of its small size and so many joints.
2. Some say that since finger prints of no two men are same, so God
will create every human as individual as he was in this world.
3. And now this “discovery” about nails as “individual health
bulletins” .
4. There could be many more possibilities.
5. Is there any doubt that God planned and executed perfectly Fingers,
with its so many joints and individual finger prints and current health
bulletin properties.
7. And that is why God says in Quran “And He gives you of all that you
ask for, if you count the favors of God, never will you be able to
number them, Verily the man is given up to injustice and ingratitude”
(14:34).
Are our nails not proofs and evidences that they were designed, and
executed by a merciful Creator and not a Blind Nature with Blind RM
and Blind NS?

Over to you guys!!

Q. Unknown (Should, 1594)

A “True” BTOE Story

Inspiration: Eavesdrop on a private conversation between Lowell “The

Guitar Guy” and “Science Junkie…Girl”

Time: 10 Million + 2010 CE

Place: Some where in an African Jungle

Species involved

1. Ele-bird (A ferocious Bird of Prey that has a huge Elephant like Body,
with extra huge Wings, a Long flexible beak) Sorry we cannot show the
picture on this thread.

2. Poacher: A descendant of humanoid, with fixation on killing innocent

animal species.

3. Charles Darwin, the revolutionary thinker, who lived 10 Million + 200

Years ago and left his indelible print on all living and dead species.

Scene-1

The Poacher armed with his “nuclear powered air gun” approaches an
innocent Ele-bird perched on the braches of an extra strong pine tree,
apparently in deep sleep.

The poacher aims the gun at Ele-Bird and is about to fire, when the Ele-
bird suddenly flies off the branches and sores high into the sky.

The poacher returns to his house cursing the ever elusive Ele-Bird and
the Ele=bird returns to his Huge Nest and to his mama.

Ele-Bird: Mama! Mama! Today I had a narrow escape from that Evil
Poacher. I flue off in a hurry, Thank God I am safe….but how long we
can survive like this?

Mama Bird: My dear do not thank God, because there is nothing like
God, but thank Charles Darwin , who was the cause of our survival
over millions of years.

Ele- Bird: Mama, who is this Charles Darwin and what he has to do with
our species? Mama please, Mama please tell me all about it
Mama Bird: OK if you so insist, I found it written in our holy scribes,
that it was a scene exactly like yours 10 million years ago….

Secene-2

Place: Some where in jungles of Africa

A poacher approaches lone surviving She-Elephant of a big herd. She

takes refuge in a cave, unnoticed by the poacher. The cave also had a
Bird Nest, where a He-Bird was living.

Elephant: Oh, what shall I have to do to survive? I have tried every

thing to save our specie. I have shortened my trunks….I have tried to
break our Ivory teeth at birth….but nothing helps…. If only I could have
wings, I would be safe….but how can I have wings? It is impossible…

He-Bird: Do not be so despondent She Elephant. Have you not heard

about Charles Darwin, the Greatest Scientist of all time?

She Elephant: No, what he says and how it affects us.

He-Bird: He says that for survival, you have to grow traits that help you
survive.

Now you want to grow wings to survive….and I need a big body to

escape from these cursed birds of prey…..so if we breed, may be our
offspring will have all the traits which we need.

She-Elephant: That is Marvelous, Thank Charles Darwin and his ideas

So they cohabit….and She-elephant gives birth to a Elephant which has

tiniest of the wings……..over the period of 10 Million Years…..the
specie grew into Ele-Bird….the ferocious bird of prey, having good
point of both Birds and Elephants.

Mama Bird: So you see how much we owe to Charles Darwin for our
Survival? If we had depended on God….our specie would have become
extinct 10 million years ago!!

Ele-Bird: Long Live Charles Darwin ….Long Live BTOE!!

End of Story!!

Note:
1. Fortunately for us, the evolution of Ele-Bird from Elephant to Ele-bird
is fully documented. It all happened when Ideas of Darwin had taken
roots.

2. Fossils of all “Transitional Life forms” starting from that She

Elephant, He-bird, their first off spring….down to the fully developed
Ele-bird are all preserved.

3. These fossils are all at display on the “Charles Darwin Museum of

BTOE”. Any one not believing in God is welcome to visit that Museum
any day of the week. Charges are 100 Dollars per person per hour!

Epilog:

The story of Ele-bird did not have a happy ending as we would have
expected.
They became so powerful, that they were threat to all other birds and
animals on the earth.
In order to save other species from extinction George W. Bush-Darwin
(300,000th Direct Descendant of a cross specie between Charles M.
Darwin , , the originator of Darwinism and GWB the Greatest US
President ), the President of United Countries of Africa, Asia and
America issued an “Executive Order” to kill all these “cursed’ Ele-birds
using Airplanes, Missiles and whatever weapon available to humanoid.
So the Ele-bird did become extinct after all!!

Moral of the story:

1. Your evil deeds ultimately catch you on … and you have no escape
from them!!
2. A wrong idea has to fail in the end, even if it dazzles human minds
and thoughts for some time.

More on “True Eli-Bird Story”:

Epilogue to the Earlier Epilogue:

1. The surviving members of AIPAC group charged George W Bush-

Darwin with extinction of a harmless animal specie.
2. They said that Eli-bird was a harmless bird specie that displayed
best qualities of Elephants (extinct for 10 Million years) and House
Sparrow (extinct for 10 Million – 50 years).
3. They said that President had a vested interest; as he was the
member of “Super Poacher Club” and had large farms where small
animals were bred.
4. When the noise grew louder, the President George W. Bush-Darwin
appointed a 13 member “Multi- Partisan Commission for Eli-Bird
Extermination”. The commission consisted of members from all groups
(majority being of Pro-Extermination’s).
5. The commission issued a “unanimous” report saying that
Extermination of Eli-bird was a “System failure” and no one is guilty of
the crime.
6. President in his “Executive Order” only wanted to kill the “Harshest
members of the herd and not all Eli- birds”. Some overzealous
members in the armed forces (mostly from vested interest group- ED)
interpreted this order for total annihilation of the species.
7. The commission “recommended” that such acts be not repeated in
future and President should not be under influence of Alcohol or drugs,
when issuing such orders.
8. Commission further “recommended” that a “Inter National Eli-Bird
Memorial” be built at the cost of 1000 Million Dollars….which should be
100 times the life size of Eli-Bird and would list all the “benefits” that
Eli-Bird provided for the Eco System of earth.
Re-moral of the story:
a. It is still possible to evade punishments for your crimes, if you have
power and proper connections at right places.
b. It shows that there is a need for a ‘Higher Court” that is free from all
human biases and where every one can be judged and be accountable
for their actions.

Q. Urban Cowboy (Should, 1582)

ANS:

Boy you have not learned the rules of the game on this thread. May be
you are new to this thread.

As a veteran of surviving for many months, I give some tips to you.

1. It is extremely RUDE and NON SCIENTIFIC to question any thing or

cast any doubt on TOE or any of its postulates.

2. It is very NON SCIENTIFIC to say, that TOE has no proof for such a
thing. It is MOST SCIENTIFIC to say that as yet TOE has no proof or
evidence but TIME will provide that proof eventually (The reality is that
TIME will de bunk this TOE or BTOE).

3. You should not question or challenge any one on this TOE....you can
only REQUEST them humbly to clarify certain complex issues which
your underdeveloped mind could not fathom (By the way, you should
not mind in the least, the names calling, the abuses on your learning
abilities, your educational and cultural background etc which you
receive from these BTOE Teachers...they are all for your own good to
develop your personality).

3A. Please do not reject any thing on the ground that it is too complex
to have occurred because of RM and NS....complexities is the cue word
for these BTOE believers......the MORE COMPLEX a process is....the
MORE LIKELY it is to achieved by RM and NS....complexity and RM go
hand in hand (that is why I say, you comment about complexity was
most rude and very childish!!)

4. On no account mention the name of religion or God any

where....these words are like showing red flag to a raging bull!! (and
you know what happens then....you should not complain at the barrage
of insults and swearing that you receive in return....) it was YOU who
mentioned the name of religion or God, not THEY...so why should you
complain.

5. And I say PLEASE and I Repeat PLEASE....on no account say any

good word about ISLAM or Muslims..... it is like poking that Raging Bull
in its rear sensitive parts!! The consequences could be many times
worse than mere mention of Religion or God...

6. Always have a word of praise for Darwin and his lasting gift to
humanity...it helps to mollify these "raging bulls" for what ever you
might have written....ends your post in good terms...all forgotten and
forgiven etc.

7. Even if you do all these things....I doubt that "doubting Thomoses"

like you will last on this thread for many days....

You have a sickness...you have a fatal disease that is incurable.... You

try to use your brain and question about the very foundations on which
this TOE is founded!!

That is a sin which cannot be forgiven or tolerated on this thread.

You may not know it, this thread is OWNED by Blind BTOE followers!!

Best of luck to you and may you last on this thread for more than a
couple of weeks!!
Q. Urban Cowboy (Should, 1594)

ANS:

These BTOE guys keep on changing their stand!!

First they “swore” by RM and NS…..now I think “peer reviewed

articles” is the new catch word.

I am sure that none of them are “peers” themselves….so they look at

awe on any thing that appears in press as “peer reviewed”!!

It could be something like “Pope Authorized” version of any religious

document.!!

First thing to ask is that who are these “peers” and how they are
“selected or elected”?

I am certain that these “peers” are confirmed BTOE believers and they
do not allow any one else to enter into their “select group”.

Any one saying anything against this BTOE is immediately removed

from his / her status of “peer”, irrespective of how much high or
renowned he may be in any field of science.

So don not be mislead by all this “peer reviewed” stuff!!

Just ask them , are these “peer reviewed articles” infallible? And how
many times they have published wrong and erroneous articles which
were reviewed by the “peers”?

Then is the “peer” system applicable only for BTOE or for other fields
also?

I see all or most of them acting like “peers” when any issue of religion
is concerned!! Who appointed them as “peers” to decide on religious
matters?

You are under attack from every one on this thread, I have not seen
any one coming in support of you or give you even moral support.

I told you in advance that this thread is OWNED by these BTOE

believers!!

You will be forced to exit or keep quite….that is the LEVEL FIELD these
guys want!! No opposition of any kind…only themselves patting each
other on the back!!

Did you SAW their reaction to my “True” Ele-bird story?

Apparently first thing they loose when become BTOE believers is there
sense of humor!! Especially if it is at their cost (they themselves
reserve the right to use it against their “religious” or “scientific “
opponents)

My sympathies are with you all the time.

Q, Zaphod (Should, 1519)

MUQ, you remind me of a child that refuses to stop saying "why?". You just keep saying the
same things over and over, even after people explain to you why you are incorrect.
ANS:

Now this is a very interesting comment!!

In fact that is my basic question to BTOE followers!!!

Scientists and BTOE followers are content only with the question
HOW!!! The word why never enters into their vocabulary!!!

It is religion which answers the question WHY.

So for a balanced view of the Universe.... both these words HOW and
WHY must be answered. That is why I always said that there is no true
rivalry between Science and religion per see.

Science deals with the question How and religion with the question
Why? Both should work hand in hand for a balanced development of
humanity.

But the Zealots in Science (like Blind Followers of BTOE whom I call
Pseudo Scientists) down played and ridiculed the idea of Why and did
all propaganda that we only need to understand How and nothing
more....

On the other hand Zealots in religious groups (like Church of Medieval

ages and Extremists in every religion) thought that it is not important
to know How, we should only know why...

These two zealots have caused so much gap between religion and
science that no one remembers that at one time, most of the scientists
were also experts in religious matters too.

All my effort on this thread is to bridge this Gap and bring science and
religion closer together.

Every one can see how these Blind BTOE followers are "ganging up"
against me and ridiculing the very idea of Why.

I am very pleased that you have brought up this subject.

 Chapter-6 Terrorism (9/11, Afghan and Iraq War and related topics)

Q. Jerry Lister (Elite, 50)

Ah yes, the last of the 9/11 nutcases, believing that 19 box cutters would make it thru the metal
detectors, believing that any passengers would allow their jet to get hijacked by some skinny little
runt carrying a plastic toy such as a box cutter, believing that an untrained person, someone that
had never flown a commercial jet before would fly with total precision and accuracy, believe that
buildings would fall down even though they were designed and tested to withstand aircraft
strikes, believing that an untrained guy could hit the low lying Pentagon, even though all
witnesses said the "jet" resembled a cruise missile or a predator plane and the "jet" leaves a hole
1/3 of the size of a commercial airliner in the Pentagon's side.
go away twerp, this has already been proven to be nothing more that a myth.

ANS:

Yes you have provided some more of the “coincidences” that this
“official 9/11” theory has!!

There are layers upon layers of assumptions and trivialization that

never happened.

I think the people minds were caught with the grandeur and shock of
what they witnessed with their own eyes!!

They saw the Planes hitting WTC towers with their naked eyes and
collapse of the towers after 45 or so minutes. What else could be more
solid evidence than that!!

Then there were Arab passengers in each of those planes….what more

incriminating evidences than that!!

Rest all was fill in the gap really….when you have seen planes hitting
the towers and presence of Arab Passengers in all of them……every
thing else was “swallowed” by the public when mixed and greased with
“Patriotic Syrup” and “American Dream in danger” type of hysteria.

People forgot the basic science and engineering and structural

strength and law of friction and Newton’s third law of motion and every
thing and any thing that could be at “variance” with the official
position!!

In the absence of any report of hijacking, the first suspicion should be

on the pilots of the planes. Was there past and their connections were
investigated?

Then the collapse of Towers and specially WTC-7 tower was to be

investigated. How can a 47 story tower will collapse like a “free fall”
without any jet hitting it and just because of falling debris of WTC
towers?

Why no other building behaved like WTC-7?

The beauty of truth is that, it will answer all the questions and
objections.

And the problem with lies and falsehood is that it will seldom
collaborate each other. You have to keep on lying and inventing lies
upon lies to answer each question.

In Urdu there is a saying that to “Justify one lie, you have to invent 100
more lies”.

9/11 is a prime example where emotions, drama and false patriotism

killed the truth of the incident.

The perpetrators and cover up guys are all safe and sound and
enjoying protection of Law and Government.

Common folks are paying the bill of illegal wars that is going in trillions
and trillions of Dollar!!

A small price indeed to save “bigotry, half truth and false national
pride”!!

Q. Peter (Elite, 50)

He was correct as far as I skimmed over it, but I would like to correct him on WTC 7.

Nobody died in it. When it collapsed, the firefighters had long pulled away from the structure for
it was unsound.

It collapsed late in the afternoon, several hours after getting impacted by debris primarily from
WTC 1.
That is a lie, John Lester. Nobody saw a cruise missile hit the Pentagon. Over a hundred people
saw a twin-engine jet slam into it. The hole is plenty large enough.
Don't think you can get away with fooling people because many people are already armed with
the truth.
If you want anybody to believe that a Boeing 757 would leave a cartoon outline in a reinforced
wall....you are ignorant.

ANS:

Let me put a rejoinder on WTC-7 collapse. I think you took it very

lightly.

Collapse of WTC-7:

1. Some one commented (on another thread) that WTC 7 collapsed due
to Debris falling from WTC North tower.

2. Damage of a building due to huge debris falling on it is not so

strange….what is strange is the manner in which it fell!!

3. It also collapsed on this base (exactly like WTC North and South
Towers)….without any jetliner hitting….without any fire…..just with
falling debris!!

4. Mind you WTC-7 was a 47 story building, not a 2 or 3 story

apartment building. If some one thinks that, this is how buildings are
designed in Manhattan…..then they should move out of Manhattan as
quickly as possible!!

5. Collapse of WTC-7 is the most important clue to this 9/11 riddle, but
people have just glossed over it, without pondering over it.

Pentagon:

a. What really happened at Pentagon in secrecy. Since it was a

Defense Headquarter, so every one is tight lipped about it.

b. Only thing what I heard is that “Black Box” of Jet which hit Pentagon
was never recovered!! If that is the case with a jetliner hitting a few
storey building…then you can imagine the secrecy of the thing!!

c. Any way it was highly improbable that people who have never flown
a Jumbo Plane before, would be able to maneuver it to hit a low floor
building the way it really happened.

d. but 9/11 was not a every day affair. It was a event where every
thing that Murphy law stood far was proven true!!

e. Every thing that could go wrong (on the part of authorities) went
wrong and every thing that depended on chance (in favor of hijackers)
went right!!

f. That is why no one has ever seen any thing like 9/11 before or will
see anything like that after wards.

g. Our Grand children will be amazed , that we actually SAW the events
of 9/11 and “believed” in the “official version”. They will be
“ashamed” to admit that they are related to us!!

Meanwhile hats off to those who are trying to find out truth about 9/11
in this “Patriotism Charged” atmosphere of USA.

They are real heroes and I Salute them with the bottom of my heart.

Q. Rattle cattle (Elite, 42)

The USA is in the WAR BUSINESS

Fact: The US AIR FORCE does not need or want any more super expensive C-17 Cargo aircraft.
But it does not matter, because congress appropriated even more money to build more planes.
Why: Because almost every congressional district of any size has some sort of contract to build
something associated with those planes, that is how those planes got the political support to be
built to begin with. When they attempt to cancel more unwanted planes, there are screams of
JOBS, JOBS,JOBS in those districts.

That is how we got so many useless aircraft and ships...like the Ra5c bomber, B1 bomber, V-22
Osprey, Seawolf submarine, etc.

The B2 bomber's cost of 2.3 billion per plane was also political as all these congressional districts
got a piece of the WAR PIE. The USA is choking on its own internal corruption and living a false
economy based on eternal war. America would bomb heaven and call anyone that objected Un
American. Two Expressions from the Vietnam WAR " Why spoil a perfectly good war by
winning it?" and "War is business and business is good". The USA is a sick nation blinded by
arrogance and choking on greed. Maybe some day Americans will realize their enemies are
themselves

ANS:

You are right in USA war is a Business!!

That is why US is ALWAYS at war all the time….and the beauty is that ,
they consider them to be MOST PAECEFUL NATION and accuse other’s
of provoking war!!

Greed by politicians is one reason….there is another hidden reason

and that is provided by another section, whom we call Think Tanks.

These people MANUFACTURE reasons for war….and try to mold public

opinion in favor of wars….

These Think Tanks and War Mongers are controlled by Jewish Lobby
and they want that USA should ALWAYS be at war.

They have a hidden agenda……if US had real peace for some time….it
might get wise to the exploitation of Jewish Mafia of their country.

That is why they want War Hysteria to continue and America is in

Danger and We are under attack and we are at war to go on
continuously…perpetually.

I post here one article from such a War Monger for your info (Contd.)

How the War Monger lobby Works in USA?

Manufacturing Consent For Attack On Iran:

How to Save the Obama Presidency: Bomb Iran

Circumstances are propitious, and the American people would support

it.

By Daniel Pipes

February 02, 2010 "National Review" -- I do not customarily offer

advice to a president whose election I opposed, whose goals I fear, and
whose policies I work against. But here is an idea for Barack Obama to
salvage his tottering administration by taking a step that protects the
United States and its allies.

If Obama’s personality, identity, and celebrity captivated a majority of

the American electorate in 2008, those qualities proved ruefully
deficient for governing in 2009. He failed to deliver on employment
and health care, he failed in foreign-policy forays small (e.g., landing
the 2016 Olympics) and large (relations with China and Japan). His
counterterrorism record barely passes the laugh test…

He needs a dramatic gesture to change the public perception of him as

a light-weight, bumbling ideologue, preferably in an arena where the
stakes are high, where he can take charge, and where he can trump
expectations.

Such an opportunity does exist: Obama can give orders for the U.S.
military to destroy Iran’s nuclear-weapon capacity.

Circumstances are propitious. First, U.S. intelligence agencies have

reversed their preposterous 2007 National Intelligence Estimate, the
one that claimed with “high confidence” that Tehran had “halted its
nuclear weapons program.” ..

Second, if the apocalyptic-minded leaders in Tehran get the Bomb,

they render the Middle East yet more volatile and dangerous. ..

Third, polling shows longstanding American support for an attack on

the Iranian nuclear infrastructure:

Los Angeles Times/Bloomberg, January 2006: 57 percent of Americans

favor military intervention if Tehran pursues a program that could
enable it to build nuclear arms.

Zogby International, October 2007: 52 percent of likely voters support

a U.S. military strike to prevent Iran from building a nuclear weapon;
29 percent oppose such a step.

McLaughlin & Associates, May 2009: When asked whether they would
support “using the [U.S.] military to attack and destroy the facilities in
Iran which are necessary to produce a nuclear weapon,” 58 percent of
600 likely voters supported the use of force and 30 percent opposed it.

Fox News, September 2009: When asked “Do you support or oppose
the United States taking military action to keep Iran from getting
nuclear weapons?” 61 percent of 900 registered voters supported
military action and 28 opposed it…

Not only does a strong majority — 57, 52, 58, 61, and 61 percent in
these five polls — already favor using force, but after a strike
Americans will presumably rally around the flag, sending that number
much higher.

Fourth, if the U.S .limited its strike to taking out Iran’s nuclear facilities
and did not attempt any regime change, it would require few “boots on
the ground” and entail relatively few casualties, making an attack
more politically palatable.

Just as 9/11 caused voters to forget George W. Bush’s meandering

early months, a strike on Iranian facilities would dispatch Obama’s
feckless first year down the memory hole and transform the domestic
political scene. It would sideline health care, prompt Republicans to
work with Democrats, and make the netroots squeal, independents
reconsider, and conservatives swoon….(Abridged)

— Daniel Pipes is director of the Middle East Forum and Taube

distinguished visiting fellow at the Hoover Institution of Stanford
University.

Q. RLH (Elite, 26)

When was the last time the US or Israel hijacked and blew up an air plane? When was the last
time that Israel or the US planted a bomb on a civilian bus full of children? When was the last
time you heard the US or Israel declare holy war upon Islam? When was the last time you heard
of an American sponsered Christian church set up in the midst of a Muslim country preaching to
the people that it is their duty to join Jihad? When was the last time you heard of the Israelis
forcing and packing their own people, at gun point, into the bottom floors of buildings while they
then shoot from the upper levels? When was the last time the Americans or the Israelis receive
money from Iran for attaching explosives on their own children and sending them into the
market?

ANS:

If hijacking a plane or blowing a bus are the only acts of Terrorism in

your vocabulary….then I do not want to comment.

But if you want to ask when was the last time US and Israeli planes and
missiles bombarded Civilian areas in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Gaza and
West bank and killed scores of innocent men, woman and children….. I
could answer almost every day!! And many times on the same day!!

If you asked when was the last time US and Israeli forces mistook the
simple village wedding procession, or assembly as Al Qaeda terrorists
and bombed and killed them…. I would have said frequently.

If you asked me how many times US and Israeli armed forces killed
innocent civilians by “mistake” and issued “simple and plain apology”
for the “Mistake” (without taking ANY action against the culprit) …..And
then repeating the “same mistake” for the umpteenth time….. I could
cite hundreds if not thousands of such incidents.

If you asked me, when was the last time that innocent Muslim and Arab
passengers were maltreated and undressed at US and Israeli Airports
and subjected to all types of harassments, I would say almost every
day!!

If you asked me, how many times Muslims have been made to look like
terrorists and projected as stereotyped terrorists, I would have
answered daily.

If you would have asked me, how many times Islamic Schools
(Madarsas) have been called as breeding grounds for Terrorists in
western Media, I would have said, hundreds if not thousands.

If you would have asked me, how many times innocent Muslim aids to
war torn countries of Iraq, Afghanistan and Palestine, has been
equated with aiding Terrorist, I could answer in thousands.

But apparently, none of these are listed in your book of Terrorist

Vocabulary!!

So actually we are poles apart.

In your vocabulary , any and every action done by your armed forces is
PER SEE the act of justice and any similar act done by others in reprisal
in Terrorism PER SEE.

In your vocabulary, only You have feelings and have RIGHT to Revenge
and Reprisal and no one else.

In our vocabulary EVERYONE has right to revenge and take corrective

action on the wrongs done to him, his family or his country.

How can we have a common ground? How, Please tell me!!

Q. World Peace (Elite, 32)

HERE YOU go RON ! List of ugly USA wars since inception of for a pretty young nation only
300 plus years of history WARS WARS WARS - more Militaristic empire!(List does not include
USA covert wars!!

18th Century
American Revolutionary War, 1775 &#8211; 1783
Boston campaign, 1775 - 1776
Canadian Theatre, 1775 - 1776
New York and New Jersey campaign, 1776 - 1777
Saratoga Campaign, 1777
Philadelphia Campaign, 1777 - 1778
Western Theatre, 1775 - 1782
Northern Theater, 1778 - 1781
Southern Theatre, 1775 - 1782
Northwest Indian War, 1785 - 1795
Quasi-War, France, 1798 &#8211; 1800
[edit]
19th Century
First Barbary War, 1801 &#8211; 1805
War of Sitka, 1804
War of 1812, 1812 &#8211; 1815
Tecumseh's War, 1811 - 1813
Lake Champlain Campaign, 1812 - 1814
Niagara Campaign, 1812 - 1814
Detroit Campaign, 1812 - 1814
Chesapeake Campaign, 1813 - 1814
Creek War, 1813 - 1814
Peoria War, 1813
Southern Campaign,
Second Barbary War, 1815
First Seminole War, 1817 - 1818
Winnebago War, 1827
Black Hawk War, 1832
First Sumatran Expedition, 1832
Battle of Quallah Battoo, 1832
Texas War, 1835 - 1836
Second Seminole War, 1835 - 1842
Second Sumatran Expedition, 1838
Bombardment of Quallah Battoo, 1838
Missouri Mormon War, 1838
Bombardment of Muckie, 1838
Aroostook War, 1838-1839
Dorr War, 1841-1842
Milwaukee Bridge War1845
Mexican-American War, 1846 &#8211; 1848
Texas Campaign, 1846
Bear Flag Revolt, California, 1846
Arizona Campaign, 1846
Mexican Campaign, 1846 - 1848
Navajo Wars, 1846 - 1863
Cayuse War, 1847 - 1855
Apache Wars, 1851 - 1900
Nicaraguan Expedition, 1854
Bombardment of San Juan del Norte, 1854
Kansas War, 1854 - 1860
Raid on Harpers Ferry, 1859
Third Seminole War, 1855 - 1858
Second Opium War, 1856 - 1859 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Battle of the Pearl River Forts, 1856
Second Battle of Taku Forts, 1859
Utah War, 1857
Pig War, 1859
American Civil War, 1861 &#8211; 1865
Union blockade, 1861 - 1865
Eastern Theater, 1861 - 1865
Western Theater, 1861 - 1865
Lower Seaboard Theater, 1861 - 1865
Trans-Mississippi Theater, 1861 - 1865
Dakota War, 1862
Pacific Coast Theater, 1863
Sand Creek War, 1864
Comanche War, 1867 - 1875
Colorado War, 1863 - 1865
Japanese Conflict, 1863 - 1864 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Battle of Shimonoseki Straits, 1863
Shimonoseki Campaign, 1863 - 1864
Formosan Expedition, 1867
Battle of Formosa, 1867
Red Cloud's War, 1866 - 1868
United States expedition to Korea, 1866 - 1871 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Battle of Keupsa Gate, 1866
Battle of Gangwha, 1871
Modoc War, 1872 - 1873
Red River War, 1874 - 1875
Black Hills War, 1876 - 1877
Nez Perce War, 1877
Bannock War, 1878
Cheyenne War, 1878 - 1879
Sheepeater Indian War, 1879
Ute War, 1879-1880
Ghost Dance War, 1890 - 1891
Pine Ridge Campaign, 1890-1891
Battle of Sugar Point, 1898
Spanish-American War, 1898
Cuban Campaign, 1898
Puerto Rican Campaign, 1898
Pacific Campaign, 1898
Second Samoan Civil War, 1899 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Philippine-American War, 1899 - 1913
Battle of Manila (1899), 1899
Moro Rebellion, 1899 - 1913
Boxer Rebellion, China, 1899 - 1901
Peking Campaign, 1900

20th Century
Banana Wars, 1907 - 1934
Nicaraguan Conflict, 1907 - 1933 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Honduras Conflict, 1907 - 1933 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Guatemalan Conflict, 1907 - 1933 (time span of U.S. involvement)
First Panama Conflict, 1908 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Cuban Conflict, 1912 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Haiti Conflict, 1915 - 1934 (time span of U.S. involvement)
First Dominican Republic Conflict, 1917 - 1924 (time span of U.S.
involvement)
Mexican Revolution, 1914 - 1918 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Battle of Veracruz, 1914
Battle of Columbus, 1916
Battle of Carrizal, 1916
Battle of Bear Valley, 1918
Battle of Ambos Nogales, 1918
World War I, 1917 &#8211; 1918 (time span of U.S. involvement)
European Theatre, 1917 - 1918
First Battle of the Atlantic, 1917-1918
Russian Revolution, 1918 - 1920 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Polar Bear Expedition, 1918 - 1919
Siberian Expedition, 1918 - 1920
World War II, 1941 &#8211; 1945 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Second Battle of the Atlantic, 1941 - 1945
Pacific War, 1941 - 1945
African Theatre, 1942 - 1943
European Theatre, 1942 - 1945
Korean War, 1950 - 1953
South Korean Campaign, 1950 - 1953
North Korean Campaign, 1950 - 1953
1958 Lebanon crisis, 1958 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Operation Blue Bat, 1958
Cuban Missile Crisis, 1961 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Bay of Pigs Invasion, 1961
Vietnam War, 1962 - 1975 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Laotian Civil War, 1962 - 1973
Cambodian Civil War, 1969 - 1970
Second Dominican Republic Conflict, 1965 - 1966
Operation Powerpack, 1965 - 1966
Second Korean War, 1966 - 1976
Contra War, El Salvador, 1981 - 1990
Libya Conflict, 1981 - 1989 (time span of U.S. involvement)
First Action in the Gulf of Sidra, 1981
Second Action in the Gulf of Sidra, 1986
1986 bombing of Libya, 1986
Third Action in the Gulf of Sidra, 1989
Grenada Conflict, 1983 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Operation Urgent Fury, 1983
Iran&#8211;Iraq War, 1987 - 1989 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Operation Earnest Will, 1987 - 1988
Operation Prime Chance, 1987 - 1989
Operation Eager Glacier, 1987
Operation Nimble Archer, 1987
Operation Praying Mantis, 1988
Second Panama Conflict, 1989 - 1990 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Operation Just Cause, 1989 - 1990
Persian Gulf War, Iraq, 1991 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Operation Desert Shield, 1991
Operation Desert Storm, 1991
Iraq Conflict, 1991 - 2003 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Operation Provide Comfort, 1991 - 1996
Operation Northern Watch, 1997 - 2003
Operation Southern Watch, 1992 - 2003
Operation Desert Fox, 1998
Operation Southern Focus, 2002 - 2003
Somali Civil War, 1992 - 1994 (time span of U.S. involvement)
On Somalia II, 1993 - 1995
First Haitian Rebellion, 1994 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Operation Uphold Democracy, 1994 - 1995
Yugoslav wars, 1994 - 1999 (time span of U.S. involvement)
Bosnian Conflict, 1994 - 1995
Kosovo Conflict, 1997 - 1999
AND 21 st century you know about it already
MIDDLE EAST WARS
Q. MEHS (Israel, 685)

Oh please get a grip on yourself. You, an islamofascist lunatic, claims to have a monopoly on
truth ! Come to your senses.

Insanity like this makes for great entertainment. On one hand you say America's leaders are
stupid and blind to manipulation and obvious Zionist conspiracies. On the other hand these same
leaders are so smart and organized they could have pulled off 9/11 and incredibly, kept it secret!
So they are stupid when you want them to be and diabolical genius's at your convenience.

There are literally libraries of professional studies and evidence documenting the horrible events
perpetrated on the USA by Islam on 9/11 and the years prior. It will neither be forgotten nor
forgiven.

ANS:

Where did I say that all Americans are fools or stupid? I said that most
of the Americans are simply brainwashed by the Jewish controlled
Media.

They take as absolute truth which they see or hear in their Print or
Electronic Media.

Obviously there are persons who are creating this materials…they are
also Americans and they are highly intelligent.

These are the fellows who planned and executed an operation like
9/11.

If there are libraries filled with books detailing “Official Version of

9/11”….then there is no shortage of also books finding holes in the
official version.

You should read both of them before deciding…. But you are so
programmed by your media that anything which is against “Official
Version” is rejected summarily as fantasy and fairy tale.

What else is the purpose and aim of Brainwashing?

Q. MKOT (Israel, 687)

Nothing on Bin Laden? But I thought you were a religious expert. Is Bin Laden's interpretation of
Koran correct? Does the Middle East need to be "cleansed" of Jews? Does Saudi Arabia need to
be "taken back" from Westerners? Bin Laden draws his positions as being the defender
of Islam. Is he?....
ANS:

A. Bin Laden’s Interpretation of Quran:

1. You are wrong, I am not a religious expert. I am but a novice in

Islam.

2. In the same way, I am not an authority on Bin Laden and do not

think that he has any authority or responsibility to speak for all
Muslims.

3. What I feel is that West has made him as an Escape Goat , Fall Guy
and Red Herring and continue their Anti Islamic propaganda. They
give too much importance to his every uttering and use them as a
propaganda weapon.

4. At the same time they “see” to it that no “physical harm” or

“Calamity” should come on his personality…so that their propaganda
machines can run indefinitely.

5. That is my interpretation of last 8 years of Afghan War !!!

B. What is “Pains to preserve”?

1. The Pains Muslim took to preserve each and every word uttered by
their prophet is unparalleled in the religious history.

2. They not only memorized his words, but also preserved the
biographies of hundred of thousands of narrators.

3. Then they fixed the rules of evidence and placed each narrator on
the s\place he or she reserved.

4. No other followers of their religion did that to their prophets….for

them each and every statement attributed by any one has equal
authority. They rate Paul and Peter in the same class forgetting that
Peter was taught by Jesus and Paul’s philosophies are self claimed!!

C. Did Time stood still for Muslims?

1. No time did not stop for Muslims. But the golden age of Islam was
when prophet was walking on this earth.

2. That is the standard by which we are judged and we should try to

reach there.
3. The passage of time does not change the fundamentals of prophetic
teachings which are applicable for all ages.

Q. MKOT (Israel, 690)

You know, if your kind of brainwashing wasn't dangerous I would laugh.

1)You now are "new" to Islam and refuse to tell us whether Bin Laden's interpretation is
legitimate. Funny, your lines and lines of posts never said you were a "novice" when arguing for
the supreme correctness of your religious certainty. You support Bin Laden, his tactics and his
credo, otherwise, you would denounce him. Coward-you won't even admit your terror agenda and
convictions.

2) The West IS NOT RESPONSIBLE for Bin Laden-Islam is...the faithful MAJORITY who
remain silent when his hatred murders people worldwide in the name of YOUR religion.
American "makes too much" of him?..

ANS:

1. Tell me in my posts, if I at any time praised or supported his

interpretations. I have told many times that I do not know really know
about Bin Laden and his views. I never heard of Al Qaeda except after
9/11. So what the world really knows about Bin Laden and his
message and interpretation are thru Western Media.

2. Knowing how biased Western Media is against Islam and Bin Laden, I
can not pass any judgment for or against him based on one sided
reporting. My stand on Bin Laden is very logical and moderate.

3. It was west, who created Bin Laden…who used him against Soviets
in Afghanistan…..the poor fellow thought that US was his real friend….
So when after the soviets left…ho found that US was really no friend of
Islam and Muslims…. He turned against them.

4. It is US and Western media who created him and it is up to them to

take care of him.

5. If we are “licking our wounds” from defeats in 1500 then I hope that
you have “Licked and bandaged” your own wounds inflicted by
Muslims during 650-1500!! So we are even as of now!!

6. The age of prophet is the ultimate standard for our behavior. This is
our choice, for which we neither ask support or praise. If you have any
complaints about the standard which was set by our prophet, then
come and discuss those principles.
7. Just writing hate messages against Islam, Muslims and our prophet
would not help you or solve the problems and misunderstandings that
we have.

8. I know the age of truth, justice and equality shall never be good for
those who follows that. The time of Jesus was very uncomfortable for
Jews of his time….the reign of Moses…. Joshua….. David was very
uncomfortable for non Jews living in those times and even Pharaoh….
So just because those opposing our prophet suffered humiliating
defeats in battle field and else where says any thing bad about the
message or personality of our prophet.

Q. TRP (Israel, 686)

War and the instruction there of are the lust and plans of man for conquest God needs no such
plan with one word he can end all he needs no instruction nor does he value the sword or warring
nations his instructions are for peace you muslims distorted and perverted the words of the lord
grotesquely and added to it according to your personal lust for bloodshed and conquest of nations
and land which is the divine plans of satan to destroy the nations God have created because
SATAN desires power death and conquest over the hearts and souls of mankind! your allahs
name is Lucifer who begot satan and satans dominion live through the lusts and desires and
wickedness of you muslims.

ANS:

If you think that War is not a fact or part of life….then either you are
very naïve or want to avoid the realties of actual life.

Some one can say about Sex issues….that what God has to do to
regulate these issues

Then same thing can be said about Dietary issues, about Trade and
Business…..

The religion would then be left to be some beliefs and lifeless rituals to
be performed by individuals in their individual capacity.

This is not the Model of life, which Islam advocates. As per Islam this
whole life is a test. Humans have to regulate every part of their lives
in accordance of God’ Laws and Commandments.

Family life, Dietary Laws, Trade, business, Contracts…Treaties and

even wars come under the purview of religion. There is nothing like
separation between State and religion in Islam.
Satan actually has no real power on this earth. Its only purpose is to
“whisper” bad thoughts and “bad ideas” into the hearts and minds of
humans. If they accept these ideas, then they become his follower.

Satan will never advocate the worship of one True God of this
universe…Satan would never advocate for prayer, fasting, charity,
pilgrimage …..being kind to parents….shun Alcohol and Gambling and
shameful deeds etc…

Therefore your arguments that Islam is influenced by Satan fall flat on

the first hurdle itself. Islam is the biggest enemy of Satan and those
who are influenced by Satan.

Q. WW Man (Israel, 691)

Dear mr jihad what a funny post coming from you. America was attacked first by the Japs the
bomb saved many lives on both sides. The Japanese were a resourceful and it has to be said a
brave enemy not like the jihad cowards that place bombs on buses fire rockets and behead
journalists. Korea stopped china in its tracks*(only just). Vietnam showed that America would
pay the price to the Chinese if the south had stood firm like the south Koreans it would have been
a different story. Afghan why were bothering with that pile of shite who knows refer to china in
the vacuum? Iraq 2 is a mistake we should stayed and finished the job 1st time. Don’t blame
America for firing back when it is attacked or threatened the Iraqis have been fortunate that the
troupes are going softy softly on the bombers which proves that the great muslin sadan knew his
people best.

ANS:

Do you want to hear Hitler’ account for what justification he had to

give for everything he did in WW-2.

Every one can justify each and every action and pit all blames on the
other side. That is what is going on in this world and that is what
would go on.

No one grudges America for fighting back… but first it should be

certain who attacked it?

US attacked Afghanistan without fully investigating who was

responsible for 9/11 attacks. 9/11 Commission and investigation for
WTC fall were done much after the war on Afghanistan was already in
full swing.

Is that the way, how you lay the blames on International matters?
Yes Saddam knew his people best, that is why he did not cause the
death of more than 1 Million of Iraqis in civil war, which botched up US
operation did.

War mongers in US do not want that US should leave in peace at all.

First it was Korean and Vietnam wars…then there was cold war with
USSR… after the end of USSR…. They picked up a new enemy…. This
time it was Islam and Muslims.

And that is what we are seeing after the collapse of USSR in 1991.

The poor common citizen of US has to bear the burnt of all these
adventures.

Q. WW Man (Israel, 695)

So even when the US/ UK does something right its wrong?? As for the Detainees they have been
very well treated considering the circumstances .Some of those silly buggers have traveled from
Uk to Pak to Afg to kill and maim our troops who are their own countrymen that is treason. These
fools have had these nasty jehadist ideas planted in their heads by the so called holy men of islam
in UK mosques. l know of muslims that will not go to croyden mosque for prayers because as
they put it in their own words there dirty people there!! Talk about being slow to come forward
what about the muslim response to the bus and tube bombings in London a disgrace l would send
them Packing!!

ANS:

No I do not say that when US or UK do something right, it should be

wrong or criticized. What I meant that they should not pat themselves
on their back too much and show that as “conclusive proofs” of their
good will and fair treatment to Islam and Muslims.

These “good deeds” are isolated cases and the reason was something
else , rather than saving Muslims of Bosnia.

If anyone wants to see the hatred and bias towards Islam and Muslims,
he should read your post in full.

I wonder, if you were incharge of NATO forces in Bosnia, you would

have turned a blind eye towards all that violence and given “no real
proof of atrocities against Muslims” to your higher ups!!!

Q. Zoilus (Israel, 687)

Muq,

I really pity you for your blindness. Get your head out the big black hole! To shed a little lite in it,
how about this short excerpt from bin Laden's 1998 fatwa: "We-with God's help-call on every
Muslim who believes in God and wishes to be rewarded to comply with God's order to kill
Americans and plunder their money wherever and whenever they find it. We also call on
Muslim[nations], leaders, youths, and soldiers to launch the raid on Satan's U.S. troops and the
devil's supporters allying with them, and to displace those who are behind them so that they may
learn a lesson."

ANS:

For your Information, Bin Laden has no official or religious authority to

issue any Fatwa for all Muslims in the world. Whatever he says or
rights have no authority in themselves and I would not like to comment
on his words or actions , directly or indirectly.

I am here to clarify about Islam and its teachings and not to justify or
criticize actions of any Individual Muslim or group of Muslims.

If Bin Laden and his followers have done any thing wrong, you should
catch them and prosecute them in a court of law and punish them.

But instead of doing that, you want to continue the trail in Media, In
News Papers, In TV, In Films, In Movies, In Novels , on Internet…. And
you want to implicate (directly or indirectly) all Muslims as either
followers of Osama or his sympathizers.

Even now US has no material evidence to convict Osama for planning

and executing 9/11…He is still a prime suspect for 9/11…and will
continue to remain so.

Q. MEHS (Israel, 685)

What makes you think I haven’t read a significant amount of material related to 9/11
conspiracies? You assume yourself all knowing. There is no compelling or scientific analysis that
can refute what actually occurred that day.

Paranoid, murderous people like yourself deny the truth; that’s a component of your sickness.
You are a member of the very cult that perpetrated the heinous crime, of course you wish it were
a conspiracy. At the end of the day, the evidence 9/11 was perpetrated by the death cult Islam and
cult members like yourself stands. Conspiracy theories are for the loonies like yourself and those
trying to gain a quick 15 minutes of publicity. Not that I'm in the habit of helping fools however,
this time I'll make a small exception, you should study the subject of tangents, then you'll see how
truly stupid your appear when you espouse such goofiness.

ANS:
If you had “read” , real material about 9/11, then you would not have
been so “confident about official version”. It shows that you have read
“vast amount” of “official literature” about 9/11.

You should read both type of literatures to make a fair judgment.

The “Truth” about 9/11 is that despite 8 years and after holding
thousands of persons in GITMO camp, US has yet to convict any one
with planning and executing 9/11.

It seems the plan started and ended with those hijackers. Even if
they catch Osama, I doubt he can ever be convicted, based on the
evidence they have with them. Only option would be to “lock up”
Osama in GITMO for rest of his life as a “prime accused”!!

If you watch collapse of WTC towers carefully, you will SEE that it could
never have come down because of hit by Jet and fire caused by it.
WTC was DESIGNED to take hits by fully loaded Commercial Jet
airliners!!

So it shows that your readings about 9/11 are very limited and based
on CNN video clips and Jewish Propaganda machine!!

Q. MKOT (Jews don’t, 83)

Oh, the NOVICE is interpreting again? On another thread you refused to disagree with Bin
Laden's calls to murder in the name of the Koran saying you were "new to Islam." What a fake. I
suppose your intense study of the Torah and Gospels is just as deep. You say the West "makes
too much of Bin Laden" and you claim the West lets him live
to support its "propaganda machine." Now that doesnt sound like promoting peace and justice. It
is not easy to recognize an Islamic nut when you can't see how they live, or the …

ANS:

I have given you a proper response for your allegations in “another

thread”!!

I condemn all sorts of terrorism…for me dropping a Bomb from sky on

civilian population…or hitting a civilian population with Cruise Missile
and rockets and Grenades is as much act of Terrorism as some one
blowing himself in a crowded market place.

Both acts kill innocent people knowingly and should be equally

condemned.
But you shower praises and appreciate these ‘acts of Terrorism”
carried out by your “Brave and Honest and Upright Champions of
Human Right Soldiers” and only condemn those who blow themselves
up in market place…..the terrorism is never ending.

The moment you apply equal standard for terrorism and hang your
soldiers and pilots who knowingly drop Bomb and Missiles on civilian
populations….. Terrorism will be reduced dramatically.

The moment you apply same standard for Israel and Iraq and
Iran….the terrorism will come down in the world.

But I know that “Brainwashing” you receive at the hands of your

“Jewish Controlled Media” will not allow you to reach that level.

You will always follow double standards and double standards never
solve any problem but only increase it.

Q. Savior Self (Jews don’t, 323)

And here's the thing on that... SOME Americans choose to engage in that sort of behavior, SOME
Americans do not. NONE of the Americans who do NOT choose to engage in that behavior feel it
is morally appropriate to be able to execute those that do. It wouldn’t be what we consider
"honorable," to execute someone for a moral crime that can only be judged by God; in fact, it
would be pretty much the most DISHONORABLE thing a person could do, because even if the
behavior itself is morally inappropriate, the intercession of the judgment by man (stoning a
woman to death, for instance) would rob her of the chance to be truly repentant. Now, as to your
nonsense naked or semi-naked people everywhere in public, it's pretty obvious you've never been
to America. You can spend all day out on the streets and never see a naked or even semi-naked
person anywhere, that's a myth fed to you gullible anti-westerners by the potentates who rule you
from their harems. It is true we don't force women in America to wrap themselves in black
sackcloth from head to toe, but that is because we expect men to actually assume responsibility
for their own sexual behavior and don't allow excuses for gang-rape such as women appearing
unveiled in public. We have a saying over here... "with freedom comes responsibility." Part of
that responsibility is NOT acting like an animal.

ANS:

Crime is a crime, there is nothing like a Moral crime (which only God
can punish) and immoral crimes (which state can punish).

Then when some people in your country do some moral crimes and
some do not…then you do not accuse every citizen of your country of
being part of it….

But when some Muslims do some Non Islamic acts….you accuse ALL
Muslims and even islam as the cause for that crime!!
That is why I called you a hypocrite, because you use DOUBLE
standards, one for your people and another for others.

You say that you may not see any naked or semi naked women in say
a month…..but at the same time you Presume that Every house of a
Muslim is a harem and place of sexual orgies!!

If you accuse us of Anti Western bias….then let me tell you, you are
also brainwashed by Anti Islamic propaganda.

The truth is in between , neither every Muslim nor every Western is

Devil or angel.

We all are human and we all have our strengths and weaknesses.

Let us consider each other as such and should not demonize the other
fellow.

You are a product of your own culture…how do you know that could be
better and more suitable cultures than your own’s?

Q. Savior Self (Jews don’t, 323)

And here's the thing on that... SOME Americans choose to engage in that sort of behavior, SOME
Americans do not. NONE of the Americans who do NOT choose to engage in that behavior feel it
is morally appropriate to be able to execute those that do. It wouldn’t be what we consider
"honorable," to execute someone for a moral crime that can only be judged by God; in fact, it
would be pretty much the most DISHONORABLE thing a person could do, because even if the
behavior itself is morally inappropriate, the intercession of the judgment by man (stoning a
woman to death, for instance) would rob her of the chance to be truly repentant. Now, as to your
nonsense naked or semi-naked people everywhere in public, it's pretty obvious you've never been
to America. …

ANS:

Crime is a crime, there is nothing like a Moral crime (which only God
can punish) and immoral crimes (which state can punish).

Then when some people in your country do some moral crimes and
some do not…then you do not accuse every citizen of your country of
being part of it….

But when some Muslims do some Non Islamic acts….you accuse ALL
Muslims and even islam as the cause for that crime!!
That is why I called you a hypocrite, because you use DOUBLE
standards, one for your people and another for others.

You say that you may not see any naked or semi naked women in say
a month…..but at the same time you Presume that Every house of a
Muslim is a harem and place of sexual orgies!!

If you accuse us of Anti Western bias….then let me tell you, you are
also brainwashed by Anti Islamic propaganda.

The truth is in between , neither every Muslim nor every Western is

Devil or angel.

We all are human and we all have our strengths and weaknesses.

Let us consider each other as such and should not demonize the other
fellow.

You are a product of your own culture…how do you know that could be
better and more suitable cultures than your own’s?

Q. YWM (Afghan, 6)
No offence but you are in bed with USA and UK! weapons for oil etc... Israel is very close to
you. You even took it for the British in ww1. This Zionism has as much support among powerful
Arabs as it does with so called "Christians" in the west.

ANS:

The rulers and politicians of Arab world (and in most part of the world
for that reason) are poles apart from the common people.

These rulers and politicians are the puppets of Western Powers and
they do many acts which are not liked and openly condemned by
common people of these nations.

I do not want to comment on what these politicians said or did, I speak

on behalf of justice and common sense.

Q. RLH (Afghan, 1)

The West owes you nothing; thinking so is a Third World mentality. Everyone knows that the US
has given more resources than they should; you can find out all there is if you want to. For those
who actually care, you will be amazed. Go look for yourselves. No nation has done more than the
US. What has the Taliban done to ‘better the lives of the common Afghan people’ besides enslave
them? Use them as human shields, force them to plant mines in the road, burn their schools and
drag them back into the Dark Ages?
ANS:

I think you should once again check what you mean by US giving to
other countries.

They do not give any charity to any nations (Israel exempted), what
they give is LOAN WITH INTEREST. And they show off as if they are
giving FREE AID to these poor nations.

On the other hand US is the biggest debtor nation in the world. They
have taken other nation hostage and force them to lend money to it
they World bank and IMF..

What Taliban did in their short stay was to bring peace to the land of
Afghanistan for the first time in ten or more years.

The biggest service they did to West (without asking any money in
return) was to stop the cultivation and trafficking of Opium during their
short rule.

This one service was enough for whole West to kiss hand and feet of
Taliban. Now since US and NATO forces have occupied that land, they
are unable to stop opium cultivation and export despite millions of
dollars they have spent. They do not know how to do such things!!

If Afghan people do not like Taliban, why they are not finished even
after 8 years, who is supporting them? Why should Afghan people
support and help Taliban when mighty US and NATO are there to back
them and finish off Taliban?

You accuse me of having Third World Mentality…. But if you get out of
your own First World Mentality, you will see the logic of it.

Q. Hope and Faith (Afghan, 1)

We have soldiers who have died and been severely injured in Afghanistan....we have spent US
treasure to build schools, set up an infrastructure....surely you can see the good that the US has
done. The people are not organized enough or are they strong enough to go up against the fierce,
inhumane fight against the Taliban. It has been an exercise in trying to help, but it will fail as all
other occupations have done. We cannot police the world, but we still try. …

ANS:

I accept that you have soldiers who have died and who were severely
injured in Afghanistan…. I think they were playing sports when they
got injured and killed!!
They were there trying to occupy and kill others…. With each US
soldiers killed or injured there are at least 10 or more Afghanis killed or
injured…. But I think you have least regard for their dead and injured.
What matters is your own loss.

As regards development work done by US and NATO in Afghanistan,

why not visit and see for yourself? Afghanistan is not only Kabul or a
few Major cities or US and NATO Army bases!!

Go and verify the infrastructure (other than that needed for Military
operations) that have been done by US and NATO forces in villages and
small cities.

US can strike by air or can strike by missiles or by any weapon they

possess. Before them USSR also tried every means to stay there and
get out in a face saving manner.

What happened to them also awaits US and NATO forces.

Only hope for Afghan people is when every foreign soldiers are out of
their country. That is their history and that is their culture.

You should leave them to their own fate. They will fight with each
other, but when there is any outsider, they all will unite to fight the
outsider!!!

You have my sympathies!!

Q. Dude (Should, 1590)

MUQ, the fact you think that those buildings *could* withstand collision with a jetliner and think
that no model can explain their collapse shows you've been reading WAY too many conspiracy
theory sites. I'm surprised they lasted up to 20 minutes before falling. ….

ANS:

I think you were the only one who commented on my 9/11 post (the
others were mainly abuses).

So you think that WTC towers stood for 20 Minutes before collapsing,
so that answers that they were “designed” to withstand such a
collapse!!

I only wish that WTC designer can see your post and “know” what
“design” really means!!

Collapse of WTC Towers:

1. Collapse of WTC Towers was most unusual to any Civil, mechanical,

structural or Architectural Engineer.

2. While demolishing, they spend lot of time and energy to see that
any high rise building collapses on its base in “near Vertical fall”.

2A. This is done by placing many detonators thru out the structure and
then detonating them in a computer generated pattern. So that each
member gives way at exact the right moment.

3. Coming to the WTC fall, the most normal view is that due to crash of
jetliner and Ensuring fire, the steel members of 64th or 82nd Floor
gave way and the weight of 40 or 20 floors made them as a Ram to
crush all the lower floors.

4. This is true for laymen….but experts KNOW that even though there
is a extreme load of 40 odd floors above it….the remaining 70 odd
floors and their steel structures were not weakened at all!!

5. Each floor will provide more resistance than the one above it and by
the time we reach 10 or 20 floors below, the resistance will be more
than the force, so the top structure will tilt and fall on one side, not on
its base.

6. Only way in which this “free fall” is possible, is where the lower
floors are already weakened before the “Top Load arrives” and so the
structure fall on their bases.

7. Free fall is what was seen on TV and was never explained by proper
modeling of WTC towers.

8. That is why they were in “hurry” to remove all evidences….dust

from WTC towers, Steel Bars from fallen towers etc….it makes sense to
every one ….except those who were ‘part of the conspiracy” or those
who were “Blind believers of Official theory”

Collapse of WTC-7:

1. Some one commented (on another thread) that WTC 7 collapsed due
to Debris falling from WTC North tower.

2. damage of a building due to huge debris falling on it is not so

strange….what is strange is the manner in which it fell!!

3. It also collapsed on this base (exactly like WTC North and South
Towers)….without any jetliner hitting….without any fire…..just with
falling debris!!

4. Mind you WTC-7 was a 47 story building, not a 2 or 3 story

apartment building. If some one thinks that, this is how buildings are
designed in Manhattan…..then they should move out of Manhattan as
quickly as possible!!

Conclusion:

a. It was the shock of the event, the hysteria created by the

media….the abundance of “experts” appearing on TV News channels
and the hate and bias towards islam and Muslims, that made most of
US population to “swallow” the official and TV version as true.

b. Then immediately “cover up” started at the highest level to shield

the truth from the eyes of general public.

c. The most potent weapon was to appeal to the ‘Patriotism” of US

nationals. We are at war, American way is in danger….American
Dream shall remain unfulfilled if we sit idle…..

d. The same propaganda is affective even today…where any request to

re-open the 9/11 investigation is termed as “Non Patriotic
act”…..sympathy with Osama….Taliban and Support for terrorism.

e. We see same thing in India…where every thing is justified in the

name of Anti Terrorism and to investigate any atrocities committed by
police and armed forces is termed as ‘Anti Indian”. “Pro Terrorism” and
“Pro Taliban”.

f. More human rights violation is done by National Armed forces and

police in every country than that by terrorist outfits and that is the
main reason that terrorism is on the rise every where.

g. You cannot fight wrong with wrong. You can fight wrong only with
justice and punishing every one who is guilty….nor our guilty versus
their guilty.

Q Unknown (Should, 1589)

ANS:
I think, we should hand it over to “Science Junkie…..Girl” (this title shall
hold till she has that “fit” of Foul mouth again)…she has come clean
and told her “Biography”. It transpires that:

1. She was not a born Islamic Hater.

2. She spent most part of her life as “Islamic Neutral” person.

3. The sudden change in her attitude came after the events of 9/11.

4. Immediately after 9/11 incidents, she took a “crash course” on

Islamic studies and she got converted to her “Islamic Hater” religion

5. The “New Convert’s Zeal” propelled her to do her Graduate, Post

graduate and Doctorate in Islamic studies in record time (1-3 Months
at the most) and now she is an authority on Islam, Islamic society and
its harmful effect on humanity for past 1400 years.

4. Now her life’s mission is to educate the world about the danger of
Islam and its teachings and the threat they pose for “Civilized and Free
World”.

5. There cannot be peace in the world unless Islam and Muslims are
shown their “rightful place” and that is total annihilation or their
unconditional surrender to Modern Civilization.

6. If this action is not taken…incidents like 9/11 will become every day
phenomenon and lots and lots of “Innocent Western people” will loose
their lives at the hand of Muslim Barbarians.

This is the gist of her latest post (I have included some earlier posts of
her for completion).

Now I want to offer my comments on her true story.

A. 9/11 a defining moment:

a. 9/11 incident was a real defining moment at least for US and

Western European nations. It had two types of effects on the lives of
people.

Positive Effect:

b. I have reports that number of people accepting Islam in US and

Europe, since 9/11 incident has risen considerably. These were the
people who wanted to know what Islam is and what are its teachings.
These people learned about Islam from authentic sources and saw that
media hysteria in Western press and hate crimes in many cities of US
and Europe were indeed wrong and Islam and its teachings have
nothing to do with 9/11.

Many of these people accepted Islam and are busy in its propagation.

Negative Effect:

c. Another group of people were carried away by the Media hype, they
“learned” about Islam from “Experts appearing on TV and Media” and
from many Anti Islamic sites on Internet.

These people got “convinced” of the negative image of Islam and its
“atrocities on women children and Non Muslims” and became “Rabid
Islam and Muslim haters”.

Which School She Went to:

d. It is not difficult to guess from where our “Science Junkie….Girl” got

education about Islam. I am sure that she learned about Islam from
Anti Islamic sites and from Islam Hating Experts.

I am also sure that she had completed her “doctorate” On Islam Hate
prior to Start of Afghanistan War!! (within 3 months of 9/11).

I have had dealings with her since 2007 (on a homosexual thread of
TOPIX!! ) and by that time she was a “confirmed Islam Hater. So I am
not that far in my assumptions. (Contd.)

C. Matter of Choice:

a. As every one can see, after 9/11 there were two paths available for
her

- To learn about Islam from authentic sources and find out its real
teachings on every issue (a somewhat slow, tedious and systematic
study, that might take many years)

- To learn about Islam from Anti Islamic sites and Islam Hating Experts
( a ready made course, that will give you Diploma in one week and
Doctorate within 1-3 months)

b. It is evident on which path she chose.

c. How can we blame her is she is a “Confirmed Islamic Hater”

D. Quran Confirms the “Choice”:

In Quran we find the confirmation of choice which every man makes in

his or her life:

“We showed him (humans) the way whether he be grateful or

ungrateful” (76:3)

“ And (We) shown him the two highways (90:10).

And it is the choice for which every one will be judged in the hereafter.

Now I will comment on 9/11 incident itself , which changed her

personality from Islam Neutral to Islam Hater in a matter of weeks and
months

9/11 A study in Coincidences:

Any one studying 9/11 incidents (with an unbiased mind) will conclude
that it was full of coincidences, every one of them could happen by
chance, but that all of them would happen all at the same time, is
highly unlikely
I will list some of these coincidences
1. It was coincidence that four Long Distance Jet Carries are hijacked
within such short time and none of the pilot raise any alarm.
2. It was coincidence that the hijackers had never flown such type of
planes before, but were able to change its course and complicated
maneuvering to change its course.
3. It was coincidence that at the time the planes were hijacked there
was a planned exercise that involved a hijacked jetliner hitting a sky
scrapper (so that if some one raises alarm, it could be taken as part of
exercise).
4. It was coincidence that first plane hits WTC tower , then second
plane hits another tower after 45 minutes and third plane hits
pentagon after another 45 minutes and no one is able to do anything.
The fourth plane could also have hit White House or Capitol but for the
“Ultimate Sacrifice” made by the “patriotic passengers” of the Aircraft,
who forced it to crash land.
5. It was coincidence that Both Towers . which were designed to take
the impact of a fully loaded Jetliners at highest speed, collapsed on
their bases in identical fashion. A feat which cannot be explained by
any realistic model.
6. It was coincidence that WTC-7, a nearby 47 story tower also
collapsed on its base in identical manner, without any Aircraft hitting it
or debris of WTC North and South Tower falling on it. Further the
collapse of WTC-7 was so insignificant that it was not even mentioned
in 9/11 Commission report.
7. It was coincidence that hijackers who were so secretive before going
on mission, left their car parked in Parking lot, with Arabic Manuals
about Jet aircraft and Plan of WTC tower on their PC s at hotel.
It could be excused if they acted on their own, but highly improbable if
they were part of an International Gang of Terrorists, who was
meticulously planning for it for past many years.
7A. It was coincidence that Osama and Al Qaeda denied their role in
9/11, immediately after the incident (which is most normal and best
time to corner the glory and show their muscle). Later “admission”
tapes two or three years after the event have no such effect.
8. It was coincidence that debris from WTC towers were quickly
disposed off, dust thrown away and steel melted, so that now there is
no evidence left for fresh investigation. It is highly suspicious that
such evidence was destroyed even BEFORE the Trial of guilty has
started!!
9. It was coincidence that Super Thermites (Nano Thermites) were
found in ALL samples of dust collected from fallen WTC towers.

10. It was coincidence that NIST (which took investigation of fall of

towers) never tried to check about any other means bring the towers
down. Seeing is believing was evidently their motto. Despite being
involved with Nano Thermites for a long time, they never checked its
presence.
11. It was coincidence that 9/11 commission presented a most “tooth
less” report….making no one as guilty of negligence and dereliction of
duty. It was a “system failure” and every one is goody...goody
12 It is a coincidence that any one questioning about the “official
version” and demanding a fresh probe and find the “Real cause” of
9/11 incident and investigate those responsible for it are branded as
“anti patriotic” and “Al Qaeda and Taliban sympathizers” so that most
people stay away from this issue.
All in all, the whole 9/11 incident and “official version” is a study in
coincidences and how every thing fits in place when “creative minds”
are at work.
I can find only one parallel in all “coincidences of 9/11 happening one
after other” and you know what it is……It is this BTOE and origin of
life!!! There also so many “coincidences” happened one after the
other.
No doubt most of BTOE followers are also supporters of “Official 9/11
version”!!!
Moral of the Story: They say, basis of science is to start with doubt…
only then you will find the truth. If they would have followed the same
principle for 9/11, it was not very difficult to find out the truth.

But they “First believed” the official version and then provided or
manufactured “justification” for every thing.
Exactly the same tactics they follow on TOE and BTOE!!

Q. Chimney (Should, 1563)

Is there any thing you like about USA?

ANS:

Now some one has asked me that if I find any thing good in USA.

I thank Allah, that He has not made me a rabid hater of any country
and any faith. Islam always shows us the middle path.

So there are many things in USA and Western society that I admire.
But the stage is so set, that I am not given any chance to express
those points.

Before I start my argument, let me break a myth.

A. Myth that USA and Europe are peaceful countries!!

This is a myth, which has been perpetuated my media. recently some

one posted in one of the threads, a list of wars in which USA has
engaged itself since its inception.

The record for other European nations is more or less the same, so let
us first enjoy this “little piece”!!

Now I think our correspondents would have come to ground level and
would not be walking on the cloud.
Now let me throw some light on USA and its past.
1. Discovery of New World and its timings:
a. When Columbus discovered New World in 1492, it was a tumulus
period for whole of Europe. Nations were in war with each other.
b. Religious persecution and massacre was very common
c. For centuries, Church had tried to stop any new learning avenues
and was brutally persecuting scientists and scientific thoughts.
d. People were fed up and they wanted to study science and discover
nature’s secret on which Church had put a stop.
2. South America was claimed by Spain:
a. Since Columbus was from Spain, so the new territories came under
Spanish rule.
b. Spain being Roman Catholic, the new territories also became Roman
Catholic and no one else was allowed.
c. This was the reason why South America did not progress as fast as
North America, because it was still under Church’s influence.
3. North America was claimed by Britain:
a. It were British people who reached North America, these were those
who were persecuted by the Church and they founded the new nation.
b This New British colony was populated by those who had suffered
Church’s persecution, so they had an Anti Church feeling. They did not
allow Church any inroad in their nations. Religion became the matter
of only “personal belief”
c. After much fighting with Spain, finally USA was established as a very
Big country, with almost unlimited natural resources and a very small
population.
d. Any immigrant was welcome to come and work in the new Land and
share in the American Dream… A Nation for Free people and freedom
of thought, equality, equity and justice. These are the traits which I
admired.
4. Along Came the Cancer:
a. As it always happens, there is always fly in the ointment, so Large
numbers of jews also migrated to USA, first to flee the religious
persecution of European Christians and later as to share in the loot of
“New found Treasures”.
b. As always happens with Jews (in which ever country they go), they
tried to control the finances and media of the country. In USA there
was almost no restriction of any kind.
c. So slowly but surely, Jews spread their tentacles to control the Media
and finances of the New country.
d. They started news paper chains, magazine chains, News distributing
agencies, Banks, Insurance companies, Stock brokerage firms, Law
Profession and very soon were in the position to dictate their terms.
e. Using the dual power of Media and Finances, they brainwashed US
population towards their eternal dream of coming back to Palestine.
5. The Cancer Bursts:
a. It is not possible in this small space to detail out the machinations by
which Jews convinced most of US Christians that they must support,
protect and safeguard Jewish Home Land in Palestine.
b. The cancer burst in 1948, when Jews unilaterally announced the
Creation of New State of Israel and US Government became the First to
recognize it during the same night!!
6. US Neutrality Compromised:
a. From that day, US became emotionally attached to this Jewish
agenda and earned the enmity of Muslim Nations in one flash.
b. Since 1948, There has not been a Single Resolution in UNO against
Israel, which US has not vetoed, not any resolution in General
Assembly which US has not opposed.
c. At the same time, there has not been a single resolution in UN
security council against any Muslim Nation which US has not
supported, or in General Assembly which US has not supported.
d. The Jews have attained their aims and are now enjoying the fruits of
their labor. US is full time engaged in its war against Islam and
Muslim nations.
e. Threat to Safety and Security of Israel is a Master Mantra to get US
into action to fight with any Muslim nation.
f. And the beauty is that Muslim Nations are projected as hell bent to
Finish Off USA and its way of life!! No one looks at the world map and
see, how could any Muslim nation pose a threat to USA!! They are so
far away, from USA and even if they want they cannot carry the war to
USA. In fact it is USA which is attacking and besieging every Muslim
country.
 Chapter-7 Miscellaneous Subjects

Q. Froggy (Elite, 37)

Yes, we have to have an enemy to keep our citizens in a state of fear. We use this fear to justify
more restrictions against a somewhat free society. "Somewhat", because our Constitution has
been eroded to the point where the three branches of government are complicit in their ability to
demand any sacrifice of our freedoms with the excuse "keeping us safe from terrorism". The
Patriot Act is only a small part of the abuse of power ----- we have little left; the First and Fourth
amendments to our Constitution have been eviscerated. Read: "A Nation Of Sheep" by Andrew
Napolitano. Why fight for freedom when most of them are being taken away ---- George Orwell's
"1984" is already here.

ANS:

I felt sad after reading your post…. What you have written is correct.

One scholar has written that in old days, people used to worship idols
made of stone, wood, copper and gold. They used to offer their wealth,
cattle and dearest possessions to these idols. Any form of sacrifice
(even human sacrifice) was justifiable for worship, safety and security
of these idols.

But in our days, the place of idols has been taken by NATIONS….Now
our nation is our idol. We worship our nation and we can do any thing
and every thing for security, prosperity and well being of our idols.

We can cheat, browbeat, make war, loot wealth of other nations just on
the name of our nation.

We are prepared to give unlimited freedom to our armies and soldiers

while in the act of defending our country. No crime is a crime if
committed on the name of safety and security of our country.

No sacrifice is big....or adequate if done in the name of our

country…..what we call is Diplomacy is nothing but cheating lying,
intrigue and try to get maximum out of others … the only aim is that it
should help our country.

Patriotism Act (there is a beauty in choosing the words, they do exact

opposite of what the word says) and others you have mentioned are
but a small price that citizens are paying for the safety and security of
their idols…..their dreams….their nations.
WW-1 and WW-2 were the sole reasons for this extreme nationalism.
But we have not learned any lesson from those wars.

We are always ready to start WW-3 (at the touch of a button) should
there be any danger to the safety and security of our own created
idols.

This is a Universal Malady and it bodes ill for the whole world.

So what you wrote, really touched my heart…. But I witness the same
symptoms in almost every country.

Our Country is in danger…we must do everything to save it from our

enemies…..is the Universal cry!!

Is there any solution to break these modern day Idols?

Q. MDUSN (Elite, 22)

I've been to Israel and Saudi Arabia...Never felt like I was walking on eggshells in Israel like I did
in Saudi Arabia.

How to be an American in Saudi Arabia:

-Walk head down

-Don't make eye contact with ANY female wearing either a hijab,-burka or any sort of veil.
-Better yet just don't make eye contact with an Arab woman...not even by accident
-Watch what hand you use to shake or point direction.
-better yet don't point at all
-keep both feet on the ground, do not show the sole's of your shoes in public.
-Do not stare.
-Be aware of call to prayer 5X a day .
-No alcohol in public, Muslim's only drink gamble womanize in non-muslim countries and
hotel's, Saudi shieks and princes are famous for partying hard in Monte Carlo and Monaco, and
Cannes. as well has Bahrain.
-Any violation of the above could result in serious punishment.

Unless your Muslim and can afford to pay off the Judge, then anything is fair game, up to and
including child rape, which seems to be fairly common occurance in Saudi Arabia..

Yeah nice folks..do has I say not has I do..

ANS:

Thanks for your comparison between Israel and Saudi Arabia.

When you come to a country with different culture than your, you have
to make some adjustments.

I agree with that part where you do not stair at any women and do not
take her photograph in public.

You have to be aware of Calls for Prayers and you do not drink alcohol
in public.

What Saudis do outside their country is not my concern. If they do not

behave as true Muslims outside KSA, they have to answer it before
their Creator on last day.

Saudis are no angels neither are Muslims in general. But the

stereotype image which you have posted is not true either.

Regarding child rape a common practice in Saudi Arabia shows your

prejudice and not an honest judgment.

Saudi Arabia is one of the safest countries in the world and has
minimum crime rate in the world.

As for how you are treated in Israel….well I cannot comment on

that….they are your own bastard child…..undeclared state of USA….

But I would recommend that you once visit there with Arabic Sounding
name and with full Arabic Dress…. To see How they welcome you!!

Q. MDUSN (Elite, 24)

Whoa!! You mean your country won't accept me for who I am??

Where's the tolerance in that?

Every country that has a Muslim population has been threatened for not respecting Islam...You all
want it both ways
MUQ wrote:
To: MDSUN
What Saudis do outside their country is not my concern. If they do not behave as true Muslims
outside KSA, they have to answer it before their Creator on last day..
That's a excuse for condoning poor behavior
MUQ wrote:
To: MDSUN
Saudis are no angels neither are Muslims in general. But the stereotype image which you have
posted is not true either.
Regarding child rape a common practice in Saudi Arabia shows your prejudice and not an honest
judgment.
You right to a degree, but you hold everyone to a standard even you can't admittedly maintain not
even Muslims.

Maybe I'm a little overboard on the child rape, some in your country refer to it be another name
"arranged marriage" which I guess justifies it.

ANS:

No , our country would accept what you are, but you should also
respect the laws of country in which you are.

It is a two way street and not one way!!

If you treat us to stereotype, then why you complain if we do the same.

Arranged marriages are in no way Child marriages, reaching age of

marriage is a condition of marriage.

You cannot prove rule by exceptions. How many cases of child abuse
are reported from your country every day?

Should we say that all Americans or Westerners are like that? Or their
society is like that?

Yes it is implementation of Islamic Criminal system that has made

Saudi Arabia safest country in the world.

Instead of shipping your Criminals here, why don’t you implement the
system itself, so that you are permanently safe.

Due to support and help, Israel has become a bully in this region. It is
your country which keeps tab on every country that they do not
become a real threat to Israel.

And then you pose innocently at Muslims that they are no match to
Israel and Jews!!

Ups and Downs come in every society and Muslims are no exception….
But you should remember one thing:

When Islam was on top, Muslims were also on top. The decline of
Muslims started when they went away from their religion.

While in case of Europe, when Christianity was on top, they were at

bottom, when they started to get away from Christianity, they started
to rise.

That explains difference between Islam and Christianity.

Unfortunately you are equating Islam with Christianity.

We want to go back to Islam to start our rise..

You want to keep down Christianity ( and all other religions, without
understanding the differences between them) to stay afloat.

Q. Monk (Elite, 19)

Saudi Arabia and the House of Saud are America's best allies. We took back Kuwait for the
House of Saud- Saudi Arabia paid for that war. We fight al-Qaeda in Yemen alongside Saudi
Arabia. We will fight al-Qaeda to the death together. You are an al-Qaeda operative within the
House of Saud and they will neutralize you very soon. Go to Yemen where you belong.

ANS:

God save House of Saud, if they think that America is their friend!!

It took America less than 24 hours to brand their “best friends” as a

Terrorist nation.

Every Person from “their best Friend” Saudi Arabia is to be searched

physically and some times ask to disrobe completely to justify they are
not Terrorists!!

They goaded Saudi Arabia to instigate Iraq to fight with Iran in that 10
years Iran and Iraq War, and they are using Saudi Arabian land and its
infrastructure to spy upon its neighbors and use it as advance base.

Now they are planning to use their “Best Friend” and its land to attack
Yemen.
I think with America as its “Best Friend” why do they need any
enemy!!

America is “Best Friend” only to Zionists and Terrorist nation of Israel!!

They would kill themselves and sacrifice themselves for the safety and
security of their Bastard Child Israel. Not because they love it, but
they have no other options really.

Powerful Vice like grip of Jews on American Media and their Financial
Institutions leave them with no other choice. Common US citizen is
really to be pitied than censored!!

Q. Monk (Elite, 41)

Your memory is warped. We fought Communism in SE Asia to keep it from spreading. Our
enemies- the USSR and Red China were supporting the onslaught. We saw what the Commies
did when they captured Hue- mass murders and torture. The 2 million Cambodians who were
victims of genocide by the Khmer Rouge when the Communists invaded in '75 attest to what we
fought against. But you conveniently leave out those facts. We're all sick of your anti-American
hatred. You are an enemy of America who stands for nothing- all you stand for is treason against
the US. You are an impotent whining child and a traitor.

ANS:

I think you are showing extreme nationalism and any thing posted
against USA is taken as Non Patriotism…

What I see (and which is confirmed by listing the number of wars in

which USA has participated in its brief 300 years history) is that YOU
MUST ALWAYS BE AT WAR WITH SOME ONE!!

Your state cannot survive unless there is any enemy “threatening its
existence and its way of life”!!

First it were Communists who were Mortal enemies of “USA and Free
World… a stumbling block for American Dream (whatever that term
means, I do not know, because it is always a dream and never
materialized)….

After Communists went….next day they picked up Islam and Muslims

as their next “Mortal enemies” and “hell bent upon destroying USA, its
way of life and waking up people from dreaming that American
dream!!
Basic problem with USA is Jews and their media and financial
power…..they want that USA should ALWAYS be at war…on one
pretext or another.

If it gets a period of REAL Piece….it might discover its real

enemies…..The Jews, that have taken US and its citizen as ransom.

That is why, we see so much extremism in your posts and condemning

any one that raise questions as to why should USA be ALWAYS at war?

By fighting against Communists, did US do any good to its population?

In which way US improved their condition of living?

The fight was only to get supremacy over USSR and China and not to
help poor people of these countries.

Q. Unknown (Elite, 56)

Police: Lone shooter kills 8 in central Virginia (Yahoo 20 Jan 2010)

APPOMATTOX, Va. – Police say a lone shooter killed eight people in central Virginia, with
seven bodies found at one home.
State police say officers had the suspect, 39-year-old Christopher Speight of Appomattox circled
in the woods late Tuesday near the home and that they believe he is still alive.
Police say the eighth shooting victim was found on the side of the road and died on the way to the
hospital.
Police say all the victims in the Appomattox shootings were adults.
State police Sgt. Sgt. Thomas Molnar says both men and women were killed. Police refused to
speculate on a motive.
THIS IS A BREAKING NEWS UPDATE. Check back soon for further information. AP's earlier
story is below.

APPOMATTOX, Va. – The victims of a gunman's violent rampage in

central Virginia included the suspect's sister and brother-in-law, as well
as two other adults, three teenagers and a 4-year-old boy, according to
authorities who charged the alleged shooter with first-degree murder
on Wednesday.
Christopher Bryan Speight, a 39-year-old security guard, surrendered
to police at daybreak after leading authorities on an 18-hour manhunt
following the slayings at a house in rural central Virginia where
deputies found a mortally wounded man and seven bodies.
A bomb squad discovered a multitude of explosives at Speight's home,
and crews were detonating the devices into the night.
Speight had no weapons when he surrendered at the house. He was
wearing a bulletproof vest over a black fleece jacket, camouflage pants
and mud-caked boots. Neither the sheriff nor a state police
spokeswoman would disclose what Speight said when he gave up.
Speight was charged with one count of first degree murder, but other
charges are likely. He's being held at a jail in Lynchburg.
Speight co-owned and lived in the home where some of the bodies
were found. David Anderson, co-owner of the Sunshine Market grocery
store in Lynchburg, where Speight sometimes provided security, said
Speight was worried that his sister and brother-in-law, wanted to kick
him out of the house. The two recently moved in with Speight, he said.
Speight's mother deeded the house to Speight and his sister in 2006,
shortly before she died of brain cancer. His mother's obitary listed the
daughter as Lauralee Sipe and her husband as Dewayne Sipe.
State police identified the Sipes, both 38, as two of the victims, along
with 16-year-old Ronald Scruggs; 15-year-old Emily Quarles; 43-year-
old Karen and Jonathan Quarles; 15-year-old Morgan Dobyns; and 4-
year-old Joshua Sipe.
Police say Speight knew all the victims, but they did not outline the
victims' relationships or discuss a motive. No court date has been set.
Their bodies are at the state medical examiner's office in Roanoke,
where their causes of death will be determined.
In nearby Lynchburg late Wednesday, about 100 people attended an
impromptu prayer gathering at Thomas Terrace Baptist Church, where
friends described Scruggs as a class clown and Emily Quarles as
outgoing and friendly.

Suicide Data in US Army:

The Army released suicide data today for the month of

December. Among active-duty soldiers, there were ten potential
suicides: one has been confirmed as suicide, and nine remain under
investigation. For November, the Army reported 11 potential suicides
among active-duty soldiers. Since the release of that report, three
have been confirmed as suicides, and eight remain under
investigation.

There were 160 reported active-duty Army suicides during 2009. Of

these, 114 have been confirmed, and 46 are pending determination of
manner of death. During 2008, there were 140 suicides among active-
duty soldiers.

During December 2009, among reserve component soldiers who were

not on active duty, there were six potential suicides. For the year 2009,
among that same group, there were 78 total suicides. Of those, 49
were confirmed as suicides and 29 are pending determination of the
manner of death. For 2008, there were 57 suicides among reserve
soldiers who were not on active duty.

“There’s no question that 2009 was a painful year for the Army when
it came to suicides. We took wide-ranging measures last year to
confront the problem, from the service-wide stand-down and chain-
teach program, to enhanced suicide prevention programs and
guidance for our Army units, and the suicide prevention research
through our partnership with the National Institute of Mental Health,”
said Col. Christopher Philbrick, deputy director, Army Suicide
Prevention Task Force….

PS:

1. It is self explanatory. If this is the case with potentially trained Army

personnel, what would be happening to general public who are not so
trained

2. I think this is what happens, if you break link with your Creator and
have only materialistic outlook.

3. Could these people turn into suicide bombers at any stage?

4. May be a psychologist has answers

Q. MKOT (Jews don’t, 148)

YOU talk of bravery????? Saudi Arabia? When was the last time YOU sent troops anywhere?
Where we YOU during Operation Desert Storm and WE were defending Kuwait's oil fields?
Where were YOU when Palestinians were left in tents for 30 years as sign of how "tragic" the
creation of Israel was? Did YOU fight with the Allies during WWII? Ha. You don't HELP
anyone-ever. How many doctors, nurses, soldiers, engineers and volunteers do you have in
Haiti? Talk about CONTRIBUTIONS. In 60 years a TINY nation has built
….THEY DO YOUR WORK.

ANS:

Again you are flying off….

I told you I am not a Saudi Arabian National…

I know of your BRAVERY during Desert Storm war….

More than 20 Super powers of world, arranged against a Tiny Country

like Iraq…..was there ever a match to brag you about your bravery!!

The war, fully PAID UP and financed by Arab Nations and Japan….and
you call that sacrifice?

Entire wealth of Kuwait, Iraq and Saudi Arabia was sucked by US during
and after that war….and you have cheek to call is assistance!!

Every country in the world is helping Haiti as for as I know….there is no

Extraordinary contribution from USA that I know off.

Just compare how much you give to Israel as a FEE GIFT, not loan on
Interest and then check how much Aid (read loan with interest) is given
to rest of the world.

Then as world’s most indebted country (USA), what can you give at all?

Some one else’s money, for sure….and that is the reason for your
intimidating smaller countries with your military might.

You are acting like a bully to the world…and your bastard child is
acting like a bully in ME.

Like father…like son!!

Q. WW Man (Jews Don’t, 59)

The ss had muslim divisions. The people there have long memories . Who saved the Bosnian
muslims yes it was great Satan and little Satan(wait a minute were all controlled by jews so the
jews saved the muslims). Their brothers are thanking us now in so many ways. Just proves the old
saying a good deed never goes unpunished!! Some have traved hundreds of miles to thank us in
person and honour us by drawing welfare from us in UK
ANS:

Do not pat yourself too much for "Saving the Muslims of Bosnia". It
was not the milk of human kindness which helped you to do it.

The carnage happened in Europe and it was cruelty of highest order by

any standard.

Western Media tried to down play it for many months, so that Serbs
could make a "clean job of it" and execute the "Final solution".

But the things leaked out as such butchery cannot go unnoticed in this
20 th century.

How could EU and US allow such acts in their own backyard when they
keep on blowing the trumpet of peace , tolerance and human rights in
all parts of the world.

That was the Dilemma which they faced . So very reluctantly, US and
NATO tried to use force, and that also was not approved by all NOTO
members. Many NATO members did not join it.

The real heroes were Bosnian Muslims, who fought against all odds,
and without much help or support from neighboring Christian
Countries.

That shows that inspite of all what they preach, European countries are
very hostile and biased towards Islam and Muslims.

Now they want to take all the credits for "Saving Bosnians Muslims
from Butchery and Extreme Cruelty of Serbs"?

Just watch the trial of Serb Leaders accused of genocide and compare
it with what happened to Saddam, abu Gharib prisoners, Gitmo
detainees and Osama Bin Laden

Q. YAM (Jews don’t, 147)

rabbee: this what you wrote, sounds like it came from a prejudiced muslem, in some prejudiced
muslem country. with an obvious, prejudiced agenda.
and i don't what to know what you think, as much as i want to know what HaShem G-D, has to
say about it all, here in TheTorah again. cause your judgement is scewed, to the manner of the
selfishness of your own country. are you a patriot of G-D, or a patriot of muslemanity? and by the
way, i was actually commanded by G-D, to go to vietnam, long before, any one even knew we
were to go to war in vietnam. where i would be reported as killed in action, and be returned after,
three days and a half days dawttle. so are you saying HaShem G-D was wrong by commanding
the vietnam war to happen, and that you are always more right than G-D? which sounds an awfull
lot like what hasatan or baal molech would say. shalomcha vshalomech???,?...

ANS:

If you accuse me of being a prejudiced Muslim, well you yourself are a

prejudiced Jew, that makes us equal.

You should know the history of Bible and its parts, How they came to
be written and how they came to be translated.

If you know that, then every statement of Bible will not be from God
Almighty. Much of it has been written by human hands whom we do
not even know.

I think you are beyond reason, if you think it was God’s work that you
were doing in Vietnam.

In a way you could be right, because nothing happens in the world

without God’ s permission. But we do not ascribe evil to God (even
though He allows it to happen), it is ascribed to Devil.

So your blood shed in Vietnam, Korea, Iraq and Afghanistan was

handiwork of Devil and not God.

Q. YAM (Jews don’t, 147)

well then i just guess, that everyone who fought in wwi, wwii, korea, vietnam, iraq etc, are not
patriots for supporting other countries. shalomcha vshalomech???,?...

ANS:

I cant say about WW-1 and WW-2

But those who fought in Vietnam, Korea, Iraq and Afghanistan....are

not patriots.

These people fought on other people's land without just cause or

reason.

They were there not because of any moral reason....only to subjugate

other people and nations and exploit their wealth and resources.

The people who fought against USA were patriots, saving their country
from foreign yoke!!
Q. Anikitos (Messianic, 325)

No, Majority did not support Hitler, please read history. There was a strong Social Democratic
movement in Germany. NSDP declared itself the only legal party once it acquired more than 60%
of the votes through intimidation and political dishonesty.

Yes, as it stands right now in US, there are only two viable parties. But anyone can become a
leader in that party. Take a look at Obama, Carter - both came from relatively poor families.

I get why you defend islam. But look at it objectively, why is there the worst oppression of
individual right under Islamic governments? I understand that the law of the land should be
respected. Not every society is truly 100% free, but said that Islamic societies are the most
oppressive.

ANS:

If Nazi party was able to get 60 % Majority of Germans to vote for it

using “Intimidation and Political Dishonesty”….then it speaks very bad
about Germany in general and German people in particular.

I know that after War, name of Hitler is synonym with that of Devil….
People can write any thing about him.

But he was elected by majority and he was supported by majority….no

nation can sustain such a war as WW-2 and make so much sacrifice
unless it is behind its leaders.

How could GWB the Great start Iraq and Afghan War if Majority
population of US was not solidly behind him? It is now after things
backfired that every one is trying to disassociate themselves from it.

If you think ANYONE can become leader in these parties…why not try
yourself? You will see the Political Mafia that you have to
encounter…..you have to make adjustments and please all those
sharks before you move even one step on that ladder!!

I defend Islam and not Islamic countries!!

Islam is totally against oppression and personal freedom. These acts

are of the ruler of these countries and not of Islam.

But Islam does not recommend the Western Type of

Democracy….where Parliament is Supreme and can make any law.

Islamic Parliaments and senates and assemblies work under the

Supreme Law of Quran and Prophetic sayings. Their powers are
limited….they cannot make any thing legal which is made illegal by
Quran and Prophet….neither they can make any thing illegal which is
made legal by Quran and Prophet.

That controlled democracy is what Islam recommends.

But there is no Muslim country in which this type of democracy is being

followed.

It is not the fault of Islam but of rulers of these countries.

Q. Anikitos (Messianic, 325)

Hitler was not elected by an overwhelming majority. That is a big fallacy that is part of their
history. Hitler's party have became sole party through deceit and lies.
Reasons those parties are not recognized as winners of election, is because of questionable
electoral process.

Yes, chances to become a president are low. No, mafia bosses and billionaires do not get elected
in USA. Name one if you disagree.
Yes, Muslim are better rulers when people they subjugate have all basic human right stripped
from them, and have them live in fear. If that is what you call good rule of law, then yes - they are
great at it.

ANS:

It is very easy for you to cost doubt on other countries “questionable

electoral process”.

Democracy means, choice by majority of people. And Hitler had that

majority, otherwise, his nation would not have supported him during
that long WW-2 war.

I did not say Crime Mafia, I said Political Mafia…..you have to be a

member of inside mafia of the two Political parties before you can have
any chance to become President or Senator or Governor….they just do
not pick up any guy from street (or draw lots) and say, This is our
Presidential Candidates.

If some one can PROVE that there is a totally unbiased society existing
any where in the world, then I will withdraw my words.

We all are human and we all have our like and dislikes and prejudices
and Muslims are not above that either.

What I said that compared to all other religions, Islam deals much
better with people of other faiths than in other system. These are
historical facts and you can verify it.

Human Civilization did not start after WW-2 and it will not end when US
and Europeans are overthrown and some other nation or race takes
over as World’s Most Powerful nation.

Q. Anikitos (Messianic, 326)

skip the bit about Nazis since we are deviating from topic.

But the rest of it... It is not a democracy that you are describing but a theocracy.

ANS:

The word Theocracy is not known in Islamic Jurisprudence. It refers to

the rule by Pope and Church in Christian countries.

In Islam there is no official religious post or office…so there is no

“official” spokes person of Islam.

Any one with Islamic knowledge and proof from scripture can put his
point of view.

In Islam there is no separation between affairs of world and religion.

Islamic Caliph leads the prayer as well as leads the country and armed
forces. It is not a dictatorship either.

Islamic democracy is a controlled democracy…..it is not necessary that

it must always be multi party…with each accusing and maligning other
with all evils, real or imaginary.

Each party going before poll to public making all sorts of (false)
promises and then forgetting them after they have won the election.

Each presidential candidate appearing as angel during election

campaign and making (false and unachievable) promises to increase
his “sale” value. Bowing before each powerful lobby to get public
support by any means and then forgetting every such promise, once
he wins the election.

In Islamic democracy the will of people could be extended to the leader

by direct or indirect means.
In Islamic democracy the parliament is not Sovereign…they are bound
by a higher law…and they make rules within the limits allowed to
them.

In western democracy, the same thing could be made legal, then

illegal and then again be made legal at the drop of hat.

- One government prohibits Alcohol, then another one comes and

legalizes it. Then someone else will again ban it.

- Same way prostitution could be legalized or banned depending upon

the whims of ruling party.

- Same thing goes for Homosexuality, drugs, pornography and any

issue.

Q. Free Cannabis (Messianic, 320)

wow there are more comments on this article than there are words in the bible! lots of religious
profits$ out there. An old dude said "Creator made man, man made religion and religion made
war."

ANS:

It is wrong to say that "religions made war". Most wars in the world
have been made from non religious causes than the religious causes.

The two deadliest wars of our times WW-1, was not fought on religious
causes (the total casualty figures in these two wars is more than all
wars made in so many centuries).

Vietnam War was not due to any religious issue, neither was the
Korean War.

USSR occupation of Afghanistan was not due to any religious cause.

US attack on Iraq and Afghanistan was not due to any religious issues
(at least that is what US people claim).

I can prove that very few wars have been fought on religious issues.

But people have done so much propaganda against religions and wars,
to show that they mean one and same things.

Most wars have been made in the world due to lust and greed of rulers,
people and nations, to exploit land, treasure and manpower of other
people, races and nations.

That is the single most effective causes of wars thru out human
history.

If you have doubt, check the real motives behind each war and you will
find out.

Q. Savior Self (Messianic, 319)

I don't think that guy even understood what he wrote. He said that Israel behaves towards non-
Jews just like Saudi Arabia behave toward non-Muslims, but Israel should be condemned for it
while Saudi Arabia should be excused for it. Somebody should tell him that according to it's own
constitution, Israel IS a theocracy, just like Saudi Arabia.

ANS:

Saudi Arabia is a 100 % Muslim country while Israel is not a 100 %

Jewish country, how can the two be compared?

In Saudi Arabia, Non Muslims are only immigrant workers, who come
there only on a Worker Contract Visa, while in Israel, Non Jews are its
citizens since the country came into existence, how can Israel and
Saudi Arabia be compared?
In Saudi Arabia , Non Muslims are not persecuted, except that they are
not allowed to perform Public Prayers, in Israel the Palestinians are
deprived of their rights and face open discrimination, how can you
comparer Saudi Arabia with Israel?
You can, if you have no sense of decency or what is right and what is
wrong!!

Q. Savior Self (Messianic, 319)

well first Saudi Arabia was this wonderful nation that respected MILLIONS of people from other
cultures who had made it their home according to you, now you say Saudi Arabia's just a
completely homogenous 100% Muslim land and has been for hundreds of years. Which is it?
[/QUOTE]

ANS:

Saudi Arabia (It was then known as Arabia only, there was no Saud
Family there) was steeped in ignorance and idol worship.

They had lost all senses of right and wrong and they were just
following their whims or their forefathers.

God had a mercy on them and send the Last prophet to that nation,
initially they did not accept him, ridiculed him, persecuted him and his
followers, he and his followers were forced to flee for their life from
Makkah.

But they soon realized their follies, they came to recognize him and his
message and they ALL converted to Islam . That was 1400 years ago
and still they adhere to that faith.

Is it not a miracle of God?

See how much Jews and Christians and Hindus and Buddhists have
gone away from their faith in 1400 years?

Q. Savior Self (Messianic, 325)

like the Saudi woman known as Qatif girl who was gang-raped and sentenced to 200 lashes while
her rapist was sentenced to 90 lashes in 2007? You know which case I'm talking about, the one
that your king Abdullah granted a pardon for after the international outcry. I wonder... which, in
your personal opinion, was the real travesty of justice there... the sentence, the sentence for the
rapists, or the pardon as a result of international pressure?

ANS:

I think every one is familiar with the importance of Evidence in Criminal

Justice system. It is very easy for any one to charge any one with any
crime or criminal doing, but unless the charges are proved in court thru
reliable witness, the man is considered innocent.

I bring to your account the case of O.J. Simpson….there any many who
believe that the man was guilty, but since the charges could not be
proved …the man was considered innocent and was set free. We have
to leave our feeling to ourselves.

The same thing happened in the case of Qatif Girl…. He claimed that
she was gang raped by a couple of boys, but she could not provide any
evidence to that effect.

When she was asked why she went to that place…she told the court
that she had illicit relationship with one of the boys and the boy had
called her to this place and that is why she went there.

Therefore she was guilty of two offences….having illicit relationship

outside marriage ties and then meeting the boy at an isolated location.
That is why she was punished with those lashes. Once you have
committed a crime yourself, you cannot take protection of the law.

The case of rape was not proved against the boys (otherwise they
would have to face the capital punishment)….only meeting the girl was
proved and that was what they received as punishment.

This is how much I know about this case. The Western media have
painted the Girl as innocent victim of Islamic Criminal System and
made so much din that King had to intervene to “appease the western
media”.

Now can you tell me, why these Gitmo detainees are held in prison and
how they have been treated over past ten years?

What is your justice system that allows this much injustice?

Q. Abbey Yoro (Should, 1546)

Science is not Athestic

ANS:

Science is not Atheistic, but the people who have Hijacked it are!!

They are misusing science for their vested interest and using it a tool
against religion and religious people.

Science is a very powerful tool.... but in the hands of Atheists it is often

being misused.

Science needs guidance from religion, so as to concentrate its energies

in a useful topics, that are beneficial to human beings.

Q. Lemon Jello (Israel, 692)

Thank you for your concern about the common US citizen. We fundamentally fine here so If I
were you I'd worry about others including India.

For example, 350,000 Kashmiri Pandits, constituting 99% of the total population of Hindus living
in Muslim majority area of the Kashmir Valley, were forcibly pushed out of the Valley by
Muslim terrorists, trained in Pakistan, since the end of 1989 and forced to live the life of exiles in
their own country, by unleashing a systematic campaign of terror, murder.

ANS :
If Indian Army is so weak that it is helpless in front of Pakistani trained
Terrorist that it was unable to stop the 99% of Kashmiri Pandits from
leaving Kashmir…. Then it is high time that they should leave
Kashmir!!!

India is unfit and unable to rule Kashmir , if its army is so weak and its
writ is so small.

So what you say, weakens India’s claim on Kashmir….. please rethink

and do not post anything which weakens Indian claim on Kashmir as
being an Integral Part of India.

I know India is in mortal fear from invasion by all its neighbors…

Pakistan, Bangladesh, Nepal, Sri Lanka, China, Burma, Afghanistan and
every other neighboring country.

Can you tell me why every neighbor should have their eyes on India
and its land. Why China does not have any problem like India?

It is high time, India should seriously consider this… How come the
Only Hindu Nation in the World (Nepal) has better ties with China than
its Hindu Neighbor India!!!

Muslims know that they have enemies in the world from all groups….
That is the position of truth…it has enemy with every falsehood.

Q. Haha (Israel, 691)

not Jewish controlled media. Obama has announced that he controls the media.
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/israel/T597M...

can i now join the other side and say that a hidden Muslim controls the White house and he is not
only taking away the freedom of the people but also taking over their media (public opinion).

if you feel this sounds ridiculous then try looking at your perspective.

ANS :

I should say poor Obama, if he thinks that he controls the US Media.

He is given a narrow path on which he ahs to walk. US president has
no real power. He is only for window dressing.

The real powers is in the hand of think tanks, who control US

presidents and their actions. Do you mean to say Obama can do some
thing significantly for Muslims or blacks? You are Mistaken. We have
had many Muslims and Untouchables as window Presidents and Vice
Presidents etc.
Who is really controlling US media was made evident when Grandson
of Gandhi had to resign from Chairman ship of an NGO for making
innocent remarks against Jews. Could he have faced the same fate if
he would have made same remarks against Muslims?

US has no power to say what land Israel should have and what it
should not have. That decision will be taken by the Jews and Zionists.
US would only consent to put that into practice. As they say US is the
tail of Dog, and the Dog is Israel. The tail would wag in the direction
dog wants and not the other way round.

Indeed I have sympathy for a common American citizen, how much he

has paid and suffered for the so called “friendship” with Israel?

What they have got in return? Scoff and insults and abuses every time
they dare to protest however mildly against Israeli atrocities against
Palestinians.

Jews and Israeli lobby spies on most sensitive and advanced US

Research and technology.

US has to suffer, financially, Politically, Morally and Militarily …… if

some one wants to see the ingratitude personified…. He should look at
US-Israeli relations.

Q. Ehav (Israel, 674)

Nor have I visited Saudi Arabia. I would and have welcomed Islamic into my home in an instant.
However, I do not welcome anti-Israeli sentiments in my home. No one is perfect.
Again, all Israelis living in Israel may appear as an easy target. But I assure you, those who try to
harm Israel will suffer dearly.

ANS :

There is nothing wrong or against you, if you have not visited Saudi
Arabia.

We should not have Pro or Anti Israel sentiments at all. If Israel does
any thing good it should be appreciated and if it does any thing bad it
should be criticized.

But people divide themselves into camps, one is always supporting

Israel, irrespective of what it does and other always criticizes even if it
does some thing good.
We should be away from both types of extremism and follow the
middle path.

Israel will perish (like many nations before it|), if it continues to

oppress, do mischief in the land, and continue killing innocent men ,
women and children. It is God’s Law and it does not change.

Any Tyrant, Aggressor and Oppressor is only given a short leash.

Q. Fredrik Noble (Israel, 710)

MUQ

the problem is with the muslims who hate to adjust with others, and feel superior that others.

there has been a small misunderstanding or u must be lying its the king of Kashmir who took
India’s help India didn't forcibly annex the Kashmir. But it was Pakistan who want to forcibly
annex Kashmir,

As for palestine goes there no country called as palestine before 1971 there was no government or
a separate lang or a separate culture.

In the olden days these land was called as land of Canaan and then the land of israel(Jacob), and
more over muslims occupied israel its not their home land, u can say their fathers have been
living there. but its just a rented house for the Arabs they have give to the real owners.

In India the similar situation Pakistan is a property of India where muslims split from India
Pakistan is still India’s property.

ANS :

This is not true that Muslims hate to adjust with others, if that was the
case, why Millions of Muslims would leave their lands and reside in Non
Muslim countries of west?

But Muslims do need freedom to practice their religion, irrespective of

which country they live in. I think this is a reasonable demand, which
every minority has a right in every democratic country. Non Muslims
should not think that Muslims are against their country or their culture
if they want some concession so as to be able to follow their religion.

Most of Non Muslims have no such objection, it is only a handful people

who try to create tension and poison the minds of common people
against Islam. These people have vested interest and are frightened to
death seeing the popularity of Islam and people in their country
accepting Islam.
You got your facts wrong regarding Kashmir. Majority population of
Kashmir was Muslim and the King was Hindu. The Muslim population
wanted to merge with Pakistan while the Hindu king was non
committal. As per partition rules, people of Kashmir should have been
given freedom to make their choice. Neither the king, nor India
provided them with that choice.

It is still on the records of UNO that India was committed to hold

plebiscite in Kashmir once the situation normalized. India is yet to fulfill
that undertaking.

If you think that decision of King of Kashmir was final and people had
no say in it (even though it is against natural justice and against
democracy), then why India did not follow the same example in the
case of Jungarh? If you remember the Nawab of Junagrah was Muslim
and he merged his state with Pakistan, but the majority population was
Hindu and they wanted to merge with India. In that case India
occupied Junagarh and made it part of India.

So they follow one law in their own case and another in some one else’
case. This is hypocrisy and not following any principles.

India’s stand on Kashmir is therefore weak and illogical. It should ask

the local people where they want to stay.

Q. GJ Palestinian (Israel, 674)

I was with you until about 10. Super Powers come and Super Powers go. Arrogance and greed
tend to be their down fall. I give them about 3 years and then America is bankrupt. I can’t wait
for the Jews to cry for mercy from people who they never extended any mercy to.

ANS :

Thank you for agreeing with me. Yes the Super Powers are only
temporary titles….there have been many super powers in the past and
there will be many.

Jews have placed themselves into a very dangerous position…. They

have made themselves a permanent enemy to the people who are
surrounding them. They are asking for a fitting chastisement.
Q. JOEL (Who is2, 469)

TO MUQ:

We know the authors of most of the Vedic Revelations but some Seers preferred anonymity or
took a general family name as they were not concerned with name or fame.

What matters is not the author but the revealed contents that ought to be rational and yogically
verifiable and have tangible beneficial effects in the Seer's own life as well as with respect to
society.

The author of the Quran is supposed to be Allah via Gabriel (Jibril) but can such a claim ever
stand the test of reason or be proven? Obviously not !!!

Can you ever prove that the scriptural extra-cosmic, anthropomorphic, creationist god (Allah) or
the invisible, flying angels exist? No.

So, what's the use of your hollow boast about authorship?

Moreover, going by the plagiarized information, pseudo-science, nonsensical scriptural accounts

of extra-cosmic hells with burning logs and extra-cosmic heavens with rivers of honey, wine and
milk together with the outlandish narratives of the extra-cosmic, anthropomorphic, creationist,
angry, vindictive, sectarian god (Allah) makes the Quran a laughing stock ! …

ANS :

If you do not know who is the author of a particular scripture, how can
you ever verify that it is indeed a scriptures.

Any one can produce a book and you can “Yogically” verify its truth.

Your claim about Quran’s verification is really uncalled for, because

Quran gives us a simple test and that does not need “Yogic
verification” . It asks those who doubt its divine origin , to bring a book
like it, nay 10 chapters like it or even one chapter like it!! That is no
Yogic verification, but pure and straightforward test for all humans.

It is strange on your commenting on Paradise and Hell in this manner,

because your own “yogically verifiable” scriptures describe them in no
different manner.

So you think that Kaliki Avatar will be a destroyer of human race and
he will kill more than 90 % of humans visiting on this earth? May be
Hitler and Genghis Khan would have been a better candidate for that
post in your eyes than any one else. Or the man who will start nuclear
war on this earth would be a most likely candidate for that Avatar!!

But I am amazed at you saying that Kaliyug started more than 400,000
years ago. Did you “Yogically” verified this statement? As per every
information and analysis that we can have, human civilization does not
go beyond 50,000 years.

So who was living on this earth during Satyug, Treata and Dwapar?
Hindu gods? And their progeny?

Q. Joel (Who is 2 , 513)

But the simple act of harvesting fruit from trees by plucking them from the stalks does not cause
pain to the tree as the permanent tissues that do not divide have lost their sensitivity and even if
the tissue concerned is meristematic yet the pain is not felt by the tree if the stalk is broken for
reasons given below....

Trees can withstand far more rough treatment when compared to fragile creatures like man and
they can easily withstand storms, harsh sunlight, pouring rain, smoke, hailstones, hard hits to the
stem and so on. This is because unlike the higher life forms plants or trees do not have a well
developed nervous system and hence possess a far greater capacity of endurance.

But the main issue is killing - cereal crops die and the grains are then harvested, fruits are plucked
off the trees without causing pain to the tree and mainly without killing the tree which naturally
produces several harvests, ages and withers. This is the main difference between slaughtering an
animal and harvesting fresh produce from crops, trees, plants.

And much more....

ANS :

1. Now it seems that you know "more about the trees than the tree
themselves"!!! It is you who decide whether trees should feel pain or
not!! The pain which trees feel is according to their type of life... what
authority we have to disregard that pain?

2.And what about pains which we cause when we spray crops with
pesticides, insecticides and other chemical sprays? Do these lower
animals also do not feel pain?

3. It seems that only "pain" in your eyes is one which is caused while
slaughtering an animal.

4. Now you have introduced another spurious argument into our

discussion that meat eating is harmful to humans. Then in your views
majority of world population is sick and only a few vegetarians are free
from all disease. Do you know how many vegetarians people in India
suffer from all sorts of diseases, what is the cause of these diseases?
Not eating Animal food?

5. Two "Foods" which cause maximum health problems in the world

are Alcohol and Tobacco and both of them are "Vegetarians" ? What
are your views on banning Alcohol and Tobacco from the World?

QJoel (Who is 2, 505)

Do you feel pain when you get your beard or hair are routinely cut or when your nails are
clipped? No. Similarly, fruit stems are hardened tissues that're not sensitive to "pain" to plucking.
But the main issue is murder. Where fruit trees are concerned, the tree is not killed but keeps
producing harvest after harvest of produce till it naturally withers and perishes.

Advanced Yogis don't need to eat, sleep, or excrete.

Yogis lived on milk must have certainly done so only after making sure that they drank only the
surplus milk after the calf had its share. Besides, Yogis in remote areas mainly live on fruits, nuts
and roots and not necessarily on milk as you naively assume. Yogis living in urban areas eat
frugally - rice, lentils, fruits, etc.

This can easily be done provided the intake of meat (by senselessly killing animals) is reduced.
This then would mean that a far lesser number of animals will be bred and in such a scenario the
government or NGOs can easily step in to care for old, diseased or rejected animals.

….As such everything hostile ought to be fought and eradicated or at least preventative measures
ought to be adopted that block their multiplication and subsequent spread.

ANS :

1. The point here was causing pain and harm to a living thing.
Whether tree survives or keeps on producing more fruit is not the issue
here.

2. If some yogis survive without eating, sleeping or breathing, then

they are most welcome to it. But these are not role model for common
citizens. they are as good as dead being in their stance of trance in
some remote cave, mountains or tree tops. They cannot and have not
built any civilization.

3. Do not give empty lectures on what should be done or should not be

done to reduce or stop killings of animals. Give you practical proposal
and tell us what can YOU DO to implement your own ideas.
4. I think the best was to see you light is to send a herd of Old Cows,
bulls, Buffaloes and Goats to your door step, so that you can spend
some of your "prime Yogic Times" with these poor creatures. People in
our age have no time to take care of their own real old fathers and
mothers.... how do you expect them to take care of 20 or 50 old and
unproductive animals.

5. God the Creator KNOWS the need of every one of His creations.
Some animals are created for food, some for milk, some for well and
some for other benefits. We should use these bounties of our Creator
and should neither misuse or show unnecessarily cruelty (like not
feeding or watering them, or killing them shoeing unnecessary cruelty
etc). These are practical solutions for a practical world.

6. It was very interesting to read your account that Mosquitoes, rats,

virus and Bacteria are reprehensive of dark forces.... Are they been
created by dark forces themselves or Got Created by mistake. I know
Yogis like you are stymied by such questions.

Q. Joel (Who is 2, 505)

You harvest grain only after the crop completes its life cycle and as for fruits they're plucked off a
tree without killing the tree so new fruit appear on the same tree the next season and this
continues until the plant dies a natural death. So, where's the question of killing in vegetarianism?

As for milk, only the surplus should be consumed but well milk is not such an important dietary
requirement and there exist other substitutes like soy milk.

Regrading taking care of old animals, the government or private NGOs can easily care from them
in animal shelters the same way they do for aged, homeless or sick people.

…CORRECTION:

This humane work CONCERNING LOOKING AFTER old or rejected animals is actually being
practiced by certain Hindu organizations in India and in vegan societies elsewhere.

ANS :

I had thought that you will be an “intelligent person” since you brag so
much about Yoga, Yogis and their Hidden Powers.

1. What about fruits which are plucked while they are ripe and young
from the trees. Does the tree does not feel any pain?

2. Who cares about taking only the surplus milk from the cattle? Since
when the Milk alternatives like Soya bean were available. All the past
yogis have survived on Milk only.

3. Do not talk about what Government and NGO s can and should do
about old and useless animals. You suggest a practical plan to take
care of these animals and how much it would cost to take of all such
animals.

4. You did not tell me, how many Old Cows, Bulls, Buffalo , Goat and
Sheep are you reedy to accept in your personal capacity. You should
also share some of Govt. & NGO responsibility!!! Post your address
and I will see to it that some of these animals are delivered at your
door step!!

5. When you talk about saving life forms, you should treat them
equally. It means that all life forms have not equal sanctity. It is
based on human logic or religious teachings. Cow, Goat , Sheep and
Animal are allowed to be used as meat for humans, while Swine and
Meat eating beasts and animals and birds are not allowed to be used
as human food.

6. The “horrible way” in which “Mosquitoes , Virus , Bacteria, Rats etc”

are poisoned, gassed and killed is nothing compared with the “Islamic
process of slaughter” which causes the least possible amount of pain
to the animal.

7. Your post has shown how shallow is your thinking and how little your
Yogic Powers have helped you in understanding the realities of life.
Your place is indeed in a cave away from practical life…. Where you
should preach your philosophies to equally detached pupils of yours.

8. Just look at the records of Cow Shelters and verify how many cows
die within the first few months of their arrival to these shelters. These
are just eye wash to gobble government provided funds…!!

Q. Joel (Who is 2, 508)

Why I can’t express my views?

ANS :

Nobody wants you to stop posting your views on any thing.

But you should not post extremely long posts. You should post one
page at a time, so people could read and comment on it.

By posting 8 or 10 pages at one time, it becomes ridiculous. Very few

people have time to read such long posts and you loose your very
purpose.

Now your heart is heavy feeling that so many animals will be

slaughtered..... Now let us come to the basics.

Killing animal means that we should not kill any living thing.... Now you
let me know any way in which humans can survive on this earth
without killing other life forms.

Now you are a Yogi... so you should not make distinction between one
life form and another.

Can we have good agriculture without using all these pesticides and
insecticides? How many millions of insects and germs are killed by this
process?

Then they use all this sprays to kill mosquitoes, flies, cockroaches and
other life forms, by millions if not by billions?

Tell me what your Yogic Powers say on these type of killings, do these
mosquitoes and cockroaches do not feel pain or do not suffer ?

You know that all plants also have life in them, so eating vegetables is
also a form of killing.

Do you think it is OK to take milk from Animals? That milk was for their
offspring, what rights we humans have to deprive them of that milk
and drink it ourselves? Is it not a sort of cruelty to these animals?

Then do you know how many animals are killed for other purpose than
eating?

Or your objection is only for saving those animals that are used for
eating?

What is your solution for old and aged animals? Already India has
more than enough of such animals.

How many old and useless cows, bulls and male and Female buffaloes
you are ready to take care yourself for the rest of their lives?

Please post you address, so I can send the first lot of these old and
useless animals to your house!!

It is very easy to lecture about saving these animals from being killed
for their meat..... but too difficult to find a practical solution.

It will be useless for you to ask proofs from your scriptures that if they
prohibited Animal slaughter. Because you yourself are a Yogic Guru
and you have your own authority to accept or reject any scripture.
Q. Unknown (Who is 2, 584)

Being called a Hindu is like an abuse to me: Dalit writer

JAIPUR: "Being called a Hindu is like a gaali (abuse) to me. I use Valmiki
as a surname because having one is almost a necessity these days.

If you just say Omprakash, it's not enough. People demand a surname
as they come from a certain mindset. Caste envelops every aspect of
life in India," said Omprakash Valmiki, leading Dalit writer in Hindi, at
the fifth Jaipur literature festival on Friday.

Valmiki was one of three speakers at the session, Outcasts: The Search
for Public Conscience with P Sivakami, Dalit novelist and political
activist from Chennai. Kancha Ilaiah, political science professor in
Osmania University, Hyderabad and author of the bestseller 'Why I am
Not a Hindu', was the third speaker. Ilaiah is an OBC by caste.

Sivakami maintained that upper-caste Hindus only have a caste

conscience and no public conscience. "They lack human conscience,"
she said. Sivakami resigned from civil services after 29 years of service
to join the Bahujan Samaj Party in 2008.

Valmiki, author of celebrated autobiography Joothan (1997),

maintained that Dalits continue to be shunned in the realms of culture,
literature and the arts. "And that is despite 60 years of independence
and numerous laws guaranteeing their fundamental rights," he said.
His other works include three collections of poetry: Sadiyon ka santap
(The centuries-old anguish, 1989), Bas! bahut ho chuka (Stop it! That's
enough, 1997) and Ab aur nahin (Not any more, 2009).

Valmiki is currently working on two novels. One is based in Bihar and

the other on the Gohana episode in Haryana (2005) where homes of
Dalits were burnt. He is also working on a compilation of Dalit poetry
from across India.

"A casteist person cannot write Dalit literature. He will first have to 'de-
caste' himself, only then can he give the right picture. A good Dalit
writer hardly gets any visibility. In literature, Dalit consciousness is not
visible even in the writings of Ismat Chugtai, Nagarjun or Premchand,"
said Valmiki.

While Ilaiah said Dalit literature is in its nascent stage, Valmiki believed
it has matured well in Gujarati, Marathi and Hindi languages. "It's just
starting out in Punjabi and Bangla," Valmiki said.
While sharing their angst at the way Dalits remain marginalised, the
writers maintained that a collective Dalit consciousness is the need of
the hour. Valmiki said that there's segregation in every village in India
and that Dalits are forced into ghettoes, to the western side of the
village where the sun's rays won't touch them. "Their homes are
mostly near drains or at the end of a river which is likely to swell
during floods hence making their homes the first to get washed away,"
he said.

Recounting discrimination of Dalits in Rajasthan, Valmiki recalled an

incident where in Rajasthan's village Chakwara, after Dalits managed
to gain access to the local lake, the caste Hindus started defecating
there and polluting it denying them access to it.

Valmiki said he doesn't need God because 'He' was not with the person
who's oppressed and pained. "Are we not his creation? He's
appropriated by those who conduct business in his name. "Saraswati is
no devi for me because when we were stopped from going to school,
she was not with us. For us God is Ambedkar and Buddha because they
were with us."

For Ilaiah, denouncing Hinduism was a necessity as he finds it

spiritually fascist. "I'm not a Hindu and I appeal to all brahmins that if
they read my book, please do so without self righteousness and self
pity. The idea is to put a sense of shame and guilt into them."

[email protected]

There's no national language in India: Gujarat High Court

Saeed Khan, TNN, 25 January 2010, 12:34am IST

AHMEDABAD: Does India have a national language? No, says the

Gujarat High Court. The court also observed that in India, a majority of
people have accepted Hindi as a national language and many speak
Hindi and write in Devanagari script, but it's not officially the national
language.

With this observation, a bench headed by Chief Justice S J

Mukhopadhaya refused to issue directions that packaged commodities
must contain details about goods in Hindi.

Petitioner Suresh Kachhadia had, in 2009, filed a public interest

litigation (PIL) in the Gujarat HC seeking mandamus to the Centre as
well as the state government to make it mandatory for manufacturers
of goods to print in Hindi, all details of goods like price, ingredients and
the date of manufacture. His contention was that the consumers are
entitled to know what they are consuming.

It was argued that because Hindi is the national language and is

understood by a large number of people in the country, directions
should be given to publish all such details in Hindi. His counsel placed
reliance on the deliberations in the Constituent Assembly in his
arguments. Even the Center’s counsel referred to the Standard of
Weights and Measures (Packaged Commodities) Rules and told the
court that such declaration on packets should be either in English or in
Hindi in Devanagari script.

But the court asked whether there was any notification saying Hindi is
India's national language, for it's an ``official language'' of this country.
No notification ever issued by the government could be produced
before the court in this regard. This is because the Constitution has
given Hindi the status of the official language and not the national
language.

The court concluded that the rules have specific provisions for
manufacturers that particulars of declaration should be in Hindi in
Devanagari script or in English, and it's their prerogative to use
English. Therefore, no mandamus can be issued on manufacturers or
governments for giving details or particulars of package in Hindi.

Q Noetics (Who is 2, 589)

I made no particular reference to any particular individual. Your definition of emotions is rather
uncommon. Fear, hate, anger, wrath, contempt, spite, scorn, insult, grief, love, joy, etc are
emotions. You referred to some anonymous person always insulting you and others in this forum.
I put what you wrote in some general terms, with no ference to anybody.
Life and death are existential problems. For some, they cause emotional problems, but they are
just neutral facts. Both are taken for granted. People are born with no "efforts" of any kind on
their part. People die likewise, except in cases of suicides.

"Worry about"? Hopelessness? Philosophically, that is existential angst!! Is the worry about your
good deeds being not good enough? Could that be the reason why so many Muslims are easily
recruited for suicide bombings- for a definite assurance of heaven? I wonder what kind of heaven
that could be. Every one will be bragging about how they could please Allah and get in there!! So
grade-4 entrant will be always unhappy in the presence of the grade-1, if ones good deeds are the
criteria for entrance. Eternal sorrows for all, except perhaps the top-10. That is no heaven at all!!
Besides the creatures of the Creator, as I have indicated before, have an added 2-in-1 dimension
whereby only they could get there through death of one body!! So they will all be now more
qualified than the Creator to be in heaven!!
I regret, if these cause more "emotions" for you.
Noetics
ANS :

I was referring to you and not any one else regarding that “emotion”
comment!! How could you miss that obvious pun!!

It is you who puts your posts with strange logic about love, and death
and sin….

You keep on harping about that God is imperfect because He created

imperfect being…. This is very absurd logic.

God says if He had so willed, He would have made every human as

angels…..

But that is not really a test? Is it? In test you have to give choice for
one to select right or wrong path.

God created humans for test….why He created? This question you

should ask God when you face Him in the Hereafter!!

Our job is to prepare ourselves and strive so that we pass the test.

You have unnecessarily introduced the topic of Suicide Bombers and

their age. You have to ask what are Islamic teachings on this.

What some one does , does not become Islamic teachings per see.
There is no ambiguity in Islam to know what is right path and which is
wrong path.

It is not the first time that we have exchanged posts…. I know your
style of writing and …well you also know mine!!
Q. Jeev (Who is 2, 596)
haha
Keep bringing on your lowly comments. You just proved in effect that your knowledge is no
where enough to engage in a learned debate , especially one on religion.
You were confused about Ayurveda being a 'veda' because you know nothing, zilch, about other
religions or culture. All you probably know is the Koran and the hadiths.
And seems like you believe Ayurveda has nothing to do with Hinduism.
That is not true.

ANS :

I told you before that I am not against Aurveda as such. It is a medical

system that derived thru centuries of observation and experiment by
ancient Indian men of medicine.

India is not alone in that department. Chinese developed their own

medicine system, Greek had their own, Romans had their own and
Muslim physicians developed their own.

These medicine systems have nothing to do with the religion.

If you think that Aurveda is derived from Vedas or ATHARVA Veda then
you should quote the verses of the veda and how they affected
Aurveda.

The point that we were discussing with Mr. Joel was about the
superiority of Quranic teaching as compared to his Yogic Guru Sri
Aurobindo.

I told him the teachings of personal hygiene as given by our prophet

and asked him what better scheme was suggested by Sri Aurobindo,
instead of coming with proper reply, he started to talk about Ayurvda,
as if it part of Hindu religion.

Our discussion is issue based and I do not unnecessarily criticize

other’s religions or their scriptures. The charge which you have laid on
me recoils back to you also as you have little or no knowledge about
Quran and Hadith.