Wikipedia:Requests for comment/Logicus

The following discussion is an archived record of an user conduct request for comment. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.

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Logicus (talk · contribs · logs)

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Statement of the dispute

This is a summary written by users who are concerned by this user's conduct. Users signing other sections ("Response" or "Outside views") should not edit the "Statement of the dispute" section.

User:Logicus has been engaging in repeated disruptive editing involving original research on articles related to the History of Science

Desired outcome

This is a summary written by users who have initiated the request for comment. It should spell out exactly what the changes they'd like to see in the user, or what questions of behavior should be the focus.

In an ideal world, I would like to be able to convince Logicus to stop his original research, and begin to take on a cooperative, rather than adversarial, position on talk pages.
Given the long-term nature of this problem, and his unresponsiveness to past comments, I must ask for a long-term or permanent topic ban from articles and talk pages in the Category:History of science and its subcategories.

Description

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For more than six months, user Logicus has been engaging in a long-term policy of advancing idiosyncratic points of view in talk pages and articles concerning the history of science, most recently in the articles on the Scientific Revolution and Kepler. The net result of his work has been to create an extremely hostile working environment, which has tried the patience of other editors, and hindered productive editing in articles dealing with the history of Renaissance and Early Modern science.

To speak generally, his actions violate the guideline on disruptive editing in two ways:

First, by engaging in tendentious editing to advance idiosyncratic interpretations of historical facts, in violation of the no original research policy
Secondly, by engaging in uncivil behavior, sometimes crossing the line into personal attacks, both of which are prohibited by Wikipedia policies.

Evidence of disputed behavior

(Provide diffs. Links to entire articles aren't helpful unless the editor created the entire article. Edit histories also aren't helpful as they change as new edits are performed.)

My first encounter with Logicus came after the article Scientific Revolution [1] had been designated by Ragesoss (the organizer of the History of Science Project) as the History of Science Collaboration the Month for August. In the course of a week in the end of August, I noted that the article needed substantial improvement and drafted a proposed outline for a new article,[2] noting that I was beginning revisions on a user page[3]. On 2 September I posted[4] my revisions to date[5] as a starting point for further work, and found I had wandered into a hornets nest by raising several of Logicus's sensitive points.

Logicus soon added a claim[6] to the introductory section that the distinguished historians of science Herbert Butterfield, Alexandre Koyré, and Thomas Kuhn were wrong in maintaining there was a scientific revolution. Logicus denies there was such a thing as a scientific revolution, this deriving -- in part -- from his idiosyncratic interpretation of the development of the concepts of inertia and impetus. Since this relies, in part, on the interpretation of a passage in Aristotle, and Newton's quotation of it, I raised the problem[7] of the interpretation of primary sources and the application of the No Original Research policy.

I had also placed in the introduction an often cited passage from Herbert Butterfield on the significance of the scientific revolution. Logicus took issue, dismissing this quotation as "Butterfield's Blunder".[8] In the same lengthy essay, Logicus returned to Newton's quotation from Aristotle, noting that "apparently the only academic historian of science to have discussed the status of Newton's claim in a publication, namely Bernard Cohen, apparently dismissed it on the logically invalid ground..." Once again, the historians who disagree with Logicus's unusual historical interpretation are wrong. As the dispute continued Logicus dismissed other noted philosophers and historians,[9] maintaining that "like Feyerabend and others, Westfall was of the mistaken opinion that, unlike Newton, Galileo held a theory of circular inertia...."

I then raised the further problem of Disruptive Editing (I chose to raise that point because the new Disruptive Editing policy was then being talked of as a fast way to deal with problem editors). At this point, Ancheta Wis[10] and Ragesoss intervened, Ragesoss proposing a step by step editing procedure,[11] leaving the more controversial sections until the details had been worked out. Some progress was made on the ancient background to the Scientific Revolution, but Logicus soon argued that it was irrelevant[12] to the chronology of the Scientific Revolution, so Ragesoss opened a new discussion on the chronology of the SR. After a week or so, Logicus again sought to reopen the difficult introductory section.[13]

Ultimately, work on the Scientific Revolution article ground to a halt, and we turned to less controversial venues to tend our gardens. One of these was a new version of the article on Johannes Kepler, totally rewritten by Ragesoss on 16 December.[14] Almost immediately, it was attacked by Logicus, in a fashion that was all too familiar "Ragesoss adopts standard mistaken inductivist and revolutionist philosophies of the standard mistaken positivist theory of a scientific revolution."[15] Discussing Owen Gingerich's account of the observations of a transit of Venus in 1639, Logicus disagreed with the interpretation of one of the masters of Early Modern quantitative astronomy, asking whether "this is yet another example of the inability of historians of science to achieve logically joined up thinking and proof-read their works for logical consistency." [16]

I should mention only in passing that Logicus employs uncivil ad hominem attacks toward editors, as well as toward the scholars whose judgement he rejects. To select a few: "The books you [ragesoss] happen to have on your bookshelf (only 1 shelf ?) and your state of knowledge about this topic both seem rather minimal.... the rewrite of this article is being driven by two guys unfamiliar with the extensive literature of the subject they are writing about. Do you have a controlling editorial position of authority in the Wikipedia organisation? So do you think maybe they could see their way to buying you some books and bookshelves or maybe get you access to a good library ?"[17] "Steve McCluskey's comments suggest a very severe literacy problem."[18]; "McCluskey's historically uninformed and illogical views on the history of science"[19]

The Disruptive editing guideline was drafted expressly to prevent this kind of harassment of productive editors. If any instance merits being handled as disruptive editing, this is it.

Applicable policies and guidelines

{list the policies and guidelines that apply to the disputed conduct}

Guideline, WP:DE, Disruptive Editing
Policy, WP:NOR, No Original Research
Policy, WP:CIVIL, Civility
Policy, WP:NPA, No Personal Attacks

Evidence of trying and failing to resolve the dispute

(provide diffs and links)

Original discussion of NOR (11-21 Sept, 6 Oct) [20] [21] [22] [23] [24] [25] [26]

Discussion of Disruptive Editing (25 Sept - 1 Oct) [27] [28] [29] [30] [31] [32] [33] [34] [35]

Logicus Requests withdrawal of NOR and DE allegations; accuses SteveMcCluskey of breach of Good Faith (29-30 Sept) [36] [37]

NOR raised again (9 Oct) [38]

Logicus criticises ‘disruptive editing’ of McCluskey and Ragesoss (11 Oct) [39]

NOR twice more (6 Jan, 9 Jan) [40] [41]

Users certifying the basis for this dispute

{Users who tried and failed to resolve the dispute}

State of the RfC after one month

Logicus was asked to comment on this RfC at 14:07, 1 February 2007. [42]
A general announcement of this RfC was posted at Talk:Johannes Kepler at 02:01, 6 February 2007. [43]
A general announcement of this RfC was posted at Talk:Scientific Revolution at 02:03, 6 February 2007. [44]
A request for someone to look at this RfC was filed on the Administrators noticeboard / Incidents at 21:02, 16 February 2007. [45]
The AN/I notice was archived after 24 hours with no response, at 21:20, 17 February 2007. [46]

In the month since this RfC was opened Logicus ^{(talk • contribs • count)} has not done any editing in Wikipedia and no further comments have been made on this RfC. This suspension of disruptive editing has opened the way for further progress on the affected articles. --SteveMcCluskey 21:34, 2 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

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Response

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Discussion

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.