Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Zouzous

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. (non-admin closure) Dori ☾Talk ☯ Contribs☽ 02:47, 14 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Zouzous

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

No indication that this one... thing is at all notable. I cannot even really figure out what it is. A "French dressing antenna"??? What the heck is that? The whole thing has something to do with foreign cartoons broadcast in France, but beyond that, I'm having trouble sorting the whole thing out.

References are all Primary, and in French. A Google search also turns up French pages.

Maintenance tags are repeatedly removed without being addressed. So given the lack of any real indication of notability, the lack of context of what it *is*, and the lack of good secondary sourcing to show notability, it's time for AFD. TexasAndroid (talk) 18:01, 30 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

"dressing antenna" is a literal translation of the French term "habillage antenne", which has established usage in French, presumably referring to a branded block of shows. If that's right, and it's a regular programme block on a major French television station, then it'll surely have lots of independent coverage, in French newspapers and trade journalism. That none of it is in English is besides the point. Morwen - Talk 18:29, 30 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

This has now been blanked by its creator and moved to L'article "Zouzous" en "English" n'existe plus! (the article "zouzous" does not exist in English anymore), which I suppose solves our problem. Morwen - Talk 19:56, 30 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Is that new article titles a request for deletion? I don't know French, but that looks plausible. - TexasAndroid (talk) 21:11, 30 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Another admin interpreted that author's actions to not show him/her wanting it deleted, which is fine. But that brings it all back to this AFD. I wonder if we have a language barrier issue going on here. The article is in English, nominally, but is incomprehensible in places. I have to wonder if it's an automated translation or a basic translation of something from someone with minimal English skills. The author has not edited any talk pages, so I also wonder if the various notices and edit notes are going right past them, if their English is limited. Maybe we should contact WP:France to try to get a French speaking regular to try to talk to the author. - TexasAndroid (talk) 16:14, 31 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I've filed a request for assistance at WP:FRANCE. - TexasAndroid (talk) 16:21, 31 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. It is a language issue resulting from poor translation. France 5 is one of the channel's of the public service franceTV and Les Zouzous is its morning strand for young children, equivalent to Ceebeebies on the BBC (though this is a wholly separate channel). The 5 website has a large area at the top which rotates with programme details and Les Zouzous appears there every few seconds. If you check the programme schedule (click GUIDE TV), Les Zouzous is not listed as such but the programmes in it are. France5.fr (bottom of page) gives a link to a dedicated Les Zouzous website, as this article indicates. Viewers of France5 will regularly see trailers and other info on Les Zouzous.

It seems to me that this a suitable topic for inclusion, but as it stands it requires someone to go over the translation (it for he, for example) which I would be happy to do if the article is kept. Emeraude (talk) 17:10, 31 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. As people here have mentioned, this article is about a TV channel, but is unclear. The article looks like raw machine translation, and as such can probably be rescued by some good copyediting or perhaps merging it into the article about france5. Passengerpigeon (talk) 08:56, 1 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The article is not about a channel, but about a programming block on the channel. France 5 is the channel, Zouzous is... something else. At least as far as I can tell. That might make it the equivalent of Adult Swim or others at Category:Television programming blocks. That still does not guarantee notability, but it's looking more likely. If someone could just come up with a couple of independant Reliable Sources, this could be settled once and for all. - TexasAndroid (talk) 13:04, 1 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Comics and animation-related deletion discussions. — Frankie (talk) 16:45, 1 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of France-related deletion discussions. — Frankie (talk) 16:45, 1 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This debate has been included in the list of Television-related deletion discussions. — Frankie (talk) 16:45, 1 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know Adult Swim personally, but having read the article I'd suppose that it's very similar to Les Zouzous, though the latter is probably bigger, at least within France. A google.fr search for "Les Zouzous" gives 821,000 results (though not alll will be relevant, and not, I know, conclusive evidence of notability). Programme-tv.com is one of many French listings mags with listings. Momesnet gives coverage. From news reports, Le Parisien reports that « Brico Club » will be transmited within "Les Zouzous" and Les Echos mentions Les Zouzous as a partner service in a report on the launch of Sony's Google TV. Emeraude (talk) 17:00, 1 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, SarahStierch (talk) 01:19, 6 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Delete due to poor translation. This deletion should be without prejudice to re-creation once someone is willing to write an English-language article about this topic. In addition, many of the Google hits for "Zouzous" may be irrelevant to this article; both this article and its French original include a tagline differentiating this program block from Les Zouzous. --Metropolitan90 (talk) 02:40, 6 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
- Keep in recognition of the improvement to the article since this AfD began. --Metropolitan90 (talk) 02:49, 8 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - There's lots of hits for the term Zouzous, but they are in French and it's not clear if they relate to the French dressing antenna. English sources mention "Les Petits Zouzous are enrolling babies and toddlers for their ten-week, spring-term sessions."[1], "In addition, Poppy Cat started her French adventures in June, broadcast in the key Zouzous slot on France5."[2], "La Zouzous WebTV "[3]. In the end, with few English languge sources, this topic requires someone willing to write a sufficiently coherent English-language article about this topic before it can remain in article space. -- Uzma Gamal (talk) 09:28, 6 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
- There are plenty of French readers in English Wikipedia - the fact that an editor cannot read French is not grounds for deleting an article. Previous comment distinguished Google hits for Les Zouzous and Zouzous; indeed, they are not necessarily synonymous. However, I oppose deletion on grounds of poor translation - since when have grounds for deleting a Wikipedia article included the quality of the writing. Half of WIkipedia articles are very badly written, but this is grounds for requesting an improvement, not deletion. I have already ofered to do a rewrite if the article is kept. Emeraude (talk) 09:34, 6 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Note: I have just done a rewrite of the article, in English English. Emeraude (talk) 09:59, 6 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Keep on the basis of the rewrite by Emeraude. I think all the previous objections are now met, and the underlying notability seems to be accepted. A good piece of article rescue. --AJHingston (talk) 10:25, 6 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Keep per WP:HEY. Cavarrone (talk) 11:13, 6 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I didn't !vote delete before, but this is clearly a keep now given the translation having been done and it made clear what this actually is. Morwen (Talk) 19:44, 6 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.