User talk:Miracle Pen

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Welcome!

Hello, Miracle Pen, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

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I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your messages on discussion pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically insert your username and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or ask your question on this page and then place {{helpme}} before the question. Again, welcome! HamburgerRadio (talk) 22:23, 16 September 2009 (UTC)[reply]

When creating new categories

Please help the project by adding the Australian template on the talk page - unless someone is keeping track of your creations it can be a hand full of tracking back and putting them in for you - cheers Satu Suro 07:46, 7 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Just saw that - thanks it is appreciated - we used to have a long standing admin who used to check that stuff - but he has been in semi (if not permanent) retirement for a while... and thanks for your improvement of Australian business articles - they were lacking the dedication you have put into it - it is a relief to find eds who are prepared to fix up some dark corners of the australian project :) Satu Suro 08:03, 7 April 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Wheat Exports Australia

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Unwise Move = Resorts of the Canadian Rockies

I saw this in my watchlist:

(Move log); 17:47 . . Miracle Pen (talk | contribs) moved Resorts of the Canadian Rockies Inc. to Resorts of the Canadian Rockies over redirect (WP:NCCORP)

The BIG problem with that is that the name of that company is too easily mistakeable for an article on (all) resorts in the Canadian Rockies. I expressly added "Inc." onto it to keep it from coming up in a general search on that topic. I oppose your move and recommend you move it back; but failing that, and knowing the general intransigence of this envirnoment, I'm just going to move it again to a disambiguation to keep it from being confused with an article on the general topic of "Resorts of the Canadian Rockies"... i.e. Resorts of the Canadian Rockies (company) .... this was clever marketing on their part, with their name meant to attract google hits, and apparently also Wikipedia hits...."WP:NCCORP" should be wise to this kind of manipulation of search terms, apparently it's not.Skookum1 (talk) 20:07, 13 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I was thinking the same thing when I moved it: are people going to confuse this with an article on resorts in the Canadian Rockies? You should have just moved it back, now you're going to have to list it at WP:RM. Whether they'll amend NCCORP depends on how serious a problem people think this is. The customary way of dealing with it would be a hatnote, not by amending or breaking a convention. Miracle Pen (talk) 05:27, 14 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Your contributed article, Western Power

Hello, I notice that you recently created a new page, Western Power. First, thank you for your contribution; Wikipedia relies solely on the efforts of volunteers such as yourself. Unfortunately, the page you created covers a topic on which we already have a page - Western Power (networks corporation). Because of the duplication, your article has been tagged for speedy deletion. Please note that this is not a comment on you personally and we hope you will to continue helping improve Wikipedia. If the topic of the article you created is one that interests you, then perhaps you would like to help out at Western Power (networks corporation) - you might like to discuss new information at the article's talk page.

If you think that the article you created should remain separate, you may contest the deletion by adding {{hangon}} to the top of the page that has been nominated for deletion (just below the existing speedy deletion or "db" tag - if no such tag exists then the page is no longer a speedy delete candidate and adding a hangon tag is unnecessary), coupled with adding a note on the talk page explaining your position, but be aware that once tagged for speedy deletion, if the page meets the criterion, it may be deleted without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag yourself, but don't hesitate to add information to the page that would render it more in conformance with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. Lastly, please note that if the page does get deleted, you can contact one of these admins to request that they userfy the page or have a copy emailed to you. Additionally if you would like to have someone review articles you create before they go live so they are not nominated for deletion shortly after you post them, allow me to suggest the article creation process and using our search feature to find related information we already have in the encyclopedia. Try not to be discouraged. Wikipedia looks forward to your future contributions. Shadowjams (talk) 06:50, 1 June 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Disambiguation

Hello. Noticed you moved Ian Smith (footballer) to (footballer born 1952), and redirected (footballer) to the dab page, which is fine. But you forgot to change his entry on the dab page to point to the new name. And you may be unaware of WP:FIXDABLINKS, which says we're supposed to fix all misdirected links resulting from such a move. I've done both now, there was only the one incoming link. If you just ran out of time, and were coming back to do it, please ignore me... :-) Actually, I'm glad you made him come up on my watchlist, because it drew my attention to a mistake in the infobox which had been there forever and is now fixed. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 08:17, 12 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I was going to fix up all the borked links on the Ian Smith dabpage, but it was about 6:30am here... Miracle Pen (talk) 08:36, 12 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Ditto with Stuart Henry (politician). You can find the articles that link to the page by clicking "what links here" in the toolbox on the left hand side. It's best to leave time to do this when you do a move, since otherwise there'll be a whole heap of broken links out there. Frickeg (talk) 23:46, 24 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I even forgot to remove the superfluous dabs from the other articles. Did that a few hours ago. Miracle Pen (talk) 16:29, 25 August 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Nomination for deletion of Template:Australian Capital Territory elections

Template:Australian Capital Territory elections has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Thank you. Mhiji (talk) 12:16, 12 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Lee Tarlamis

Hi! It seems you recently created an unreferenced biography of a living person: Lee Tarlamis. The community has decided that all new biographies of living persons must contain a reliable source that supports at least one statement made about the person in the article as per our verifiability policy. Please add references as soon as possible. Thanks! --LaraBot (talk) 00:12, 16 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Nomination for deletion of Template:Expand

Template:Expand has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Thank you. 134.253.26.6 (talk) 22:50, 16 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Not sure

Who or what you are - :) - but you have been showing up on my watch list - thank you for the doing the gnome stuff so few eds do these days - fixing the cats with prject tags - (why some eds even vent heavily against project tags - they seem to have no idea of assessments etc) - have a safe and good christmas! Satu Suro 08:03, 24 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, you too. I was mucking out the Category:Australian navigational boxes hierarchy, particularly Category:Australia politics and government templates, in early to mid September. I mostly finished it, or so I thought (particularly the premier/governor navboxes), but after the Victorian election I figured that someone had to do the state MP navboxes, which led me down rabbit holes of updating old templates and articles in the meantime. Most of the categories I just catted were categories I created. I wasn't in the habit of categorising templates, I think I should mostly be in the habit by now. Miracle Pen (talk) 08:35, 24 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Proposed deletion of Lee Tarlamis

The article Lee Tarlamis has been proposed for deletion because under Wikipedia policy, all biographies of living persons created after March 18, 2010, must have at least one source that directly supports material in the article.

If you created the article, please don't take offense. Instead, consider improving the article. For help on inserting references, see Wikipedia:Referencing for beginners or ask at Wikipedia:Help desk. Once you have provided at least one reliable source, you may remove the {{prod blp}} tag. Please do not remove the tag unless the article is sourced. If you cannot provide such a source within ten days, the article may be deleted, but you can request that it be undeleted when you are ready to add one. Mhiji (talk) 01:42, 25 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Disambiguation

Hey, can you please be a touch more careful about the moves you're making? I spot a couple of examples where you've moved from (Australian politician) to (politician) when the Australian is not the only politician on Wikipedia. Rebecca (talk) 12:29, 26 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I've been looking through them specifically to avoid that. That's why I passed over (for instance):

etc etc. That's why it's taking so long, because I have to check them first. (If I did bork any, feel free to move them back).

I suspect you might be referring to (correct me if I'm wrong) articles that don't exist yet (e.g. when you have John Smith (Welsh politician), which does exist, and John Smith (Zambonian politician), which doesn't exist but is linked somewhere; therefore just putting (politician) could be considered an incomplete disambiguator) and I don't see any reason to disambiguate for articles that don't exist yet. When the articles on those politicians are written (if they ever are), they can be further dabbed then - not before. (I'm assuming this is what you're referring to).

The reason why I take that view is because otherwise, every time you try to dab an article, you'd have to ask yourself "is this REALLY the only Fred Dooblestein who was ever a politician/footballer/musician/businessman/etc?". It's simpler to just take the simplest dab, and if it eventually becomes incomplete (because it turns out that there's more than one Fred Dooblestein who's a politician/musician/etc), then dab it further when and if necessary - but not before.

This is a problem that has occurred before with footballer articles (you have two footballers with the same name, but born in different years, and eventually someone gets around to writing the article on the second footballer - so at that point, Fred Dooblestein (footballer) gets moved to Fred Dooblestein (footballer born 1950) (or whatever his birthyear is) and the second footballer's article is at Fred Dooblestein (footballer born 1980) (same).

I suppose this could be further discussed, if it hasn't been already, as a dab style guideline - how much initial disambiguation is too much? I take the view that disambiguation is to distinguish between articles on Wikipedia, not to distinguish between articles that do exist right now and articles that might eventually exist in the future. YMMV. Miracle Pen (talk) 13:12, 26 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I also found an example of the opposite occurring - Tom Lewis (politician) and Tom Lewis (Australian politician). Miracle Pen (talk) 19:33, 26 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Kevin Morgan

Hi, now that Kevin Morgan is a disambiguation page, please help WP:FIXDABLINKS. This tool makes the job a lot easier. Thanks, --JaGa^talk 19:26, 27 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Pls use WP:CFD

Please use CFD if you want to rename Category:Legislative speakers. Do not attempt to rename categories manually. Good Ol’factory ^(talk) 09:47, 26 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

You still don't seem to have figured out that you can't put Chairs of upper houses in a "speakers" category, because they're not speakers. It's not renaming a category. Miracle Pen (talk) 11:08, 1 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

You did this and then created Category:Chairs of legislative houses. That's called renaming a category out-of-process. And if you read Speaker (politics), you will see that a chair of an upper house can indeed be called a "speaker" since that term is a generic term that refers to the presiding officer of a legislative body. Good Ol’factory ^(talk) 13:00, 1 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The generic term, as used in the hierarchy, is "chair", not speaker, and you shouldn't break the existing usage in the hierarchy. Second, it's confusing anyway to use "speaker", particularly when there's a perfectly good alternative ("chair"). Third, I was planning to list Legislative speakers to be moved to Lists of chairs of lower houses (because that's what the articles still in there mostly are, with a corresponding Lists of chairs of upper houses cat). That's why a new cat wouldn't have qualified as renaming a cat out of process (because I was going to list Legislative speakers to be moved to List of chairs of lower houses instead). Miracle Pen (talk) 13:10, 1 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I did not "break the existing usage". Category:Legislative speakers has existed since 2005 (when it was Category:Legislative Speakers). If you want to rename it, nominate it using CFD. I'm not interested in having a mini-CFD here, but "Chairs of legislative houses" and "Legislative speakers" are essentially synonymous terms, and either could work. There are speakers in upper houses—several are even called "speaker", as in the Canadian Senate. Have you read Speaker (politics)? Good Ol’factory ^(talk) 13:14, 1 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

My point is that the usage in the hierarchy had evolved away from using "speaker", for obvious reasons - it's unclear. (The usage of "speaker" to mean "president" is unheard-of in Australia, for instance). The "speaker" of the Candian Senate is really a president - that's why the French title is "Président". As you can see, it's unclear to use "speaker" in a generic sense and it would be good to avoid confusion in an encyclopedia, of all places. How about this:

Create a category called Category:Lists of chairs of upper houses.
List Legislative speakers to be moved to Category:Lists of chairs of lower houses. Park both cats somewhere in Category:Legislators.
While that's happening (CfD is a huge timesink), recat the upper house chair list articles from Category:Legislative speakers into Category:Lists of chairs of upper houses.
Recreate Category:Chairs of legislative houses as a new cat for the chair categories.

Any further suggestions would be appreciated. Miracle Pen (talk) 13:31, 1 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I honestly don't see the problem. Categories generally mirror article names, and the article is at Speaker (politics). I think it's folly to create two parallel category systems for exactly the same thing. In the category system we generally don't create different categories for the same thing if the only thing that is different is the name of the thing. A speaker of an upper house and a president of an upper house are exactly the same thing—the only difference is one of terminology. Good Ol’factory ^(talk) 13:36, 1 February 2011 (UTC)[reply]

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Vaucluse

I ... er ... stuffed up. I didn't even see the link - that'll teach me not to check properly! I've fixed it up now. Sorry about that! Frickeg (talk) 23:22, 11 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

No problems! Thanks. Miracle Pen (talk) 07:45, 12 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

CSD notification

The page Siltech Pty Ltd looks like it may be a valid CSD, but I prefer not to delete a page unless the creator has been notified. I understand that sometimes automated tools fail to do the notification for some reason. Not sure if that was the case, but could you make the notification?SPhilbrick T 15:17, 24 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I didn't notify because the account was a single-purpose account - it's only made two edits. Just put {{Db-inc-notice}} on it then. Miracle Pen (talk) 15:28, 24 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Electoral results for the district of Toongabbie

I am not complaining but I wonder if you have made a rod for your own back with the creation of pages such as this one.

Also should the page be called "Election results for the Electoral District of Toongabbie"?

You can reply here as I am watching :-) Silent Billy (talk) 07:17, 5 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Results pages are customary for federal divisions; state districts are lagging behind a bit. The pages are named in sync with the seat articles (I borrowed the syntax from the existing NSW pages). Have to go through and correct errors every now and again. Miracle Pen (talk) 07:55, 5 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Wolseley links

Hello. Since you moved Wolseley (electoral district) to Wolseley (Manitoba electoral district), and then redirected the old title to a disambiguation page, I hope you will remember to help WP:FIXDABLINKS. Although some of these have been fixed by edits to templates and redirect pages, there are still a good number of other Wikipedia articles that contain links to "Wolseley" or some variation of it that now need to be fixed. Thanks. --R'n'B (call me Russ) 21:52, 20 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Question for administrator

{{adminhelp}}

Need some help moving some edits around - a page was moved years ago and so some historical edits need to be moved to other articles.

--Miracle Pen (talk) 18:24, 23 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The admins will need to know what the pages are. Would you please list them? Cheers! Reaper Eternal (talk) 20:14, 23 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

OK. The story is a bit complicated so I need to explain it:
If you want to export bulk wheat from Australia, you need an export licence. Various federal government instrumentalities have been responsible for this:
- Wheat Export Authority (July 1999 – September 2007)
- Export Wheat Commission (October 2007 – June 2008)
- Wheat Exports Australia (July 2008 –)

What happened is this: in this edit, someone moved the article, then at Wheat Export Authority, to Export Wheat Commission, on the basis that the latter was the 'new' name of the body. But that was wrong - the two bodies are different and therefore should have separate articles (they do have separate articles now). The correct thing to have done would have been to leave the Authority article alone and start a new article for the Commission. In this edit, I went ahead and copied over the Authority info from the EWC article - what I should have done is reverse the pagemove, then expand the Commission article by copying over the Commission info from the newly-reinstated Authority page. Silly me.

So what needs to be done is this: all the edits to EWC prior to that 211880057 edit in May 2008, need to be transferred to the Wheat Export Authority article. If you look at, say, the first EWC edit, for instance, it's all about the Wheat Export Authority (which is unsurprising, the EWC didn't exist until a year and a half after the Authority article was started.)

The second thing that needs to be done is for this edit to EWC to be transferred to Wheat Exports Australia. If you read the edit, it's someone adding information (copyvio, it seems, but because it's a historical edit it shouldn't be a problem) to the EWC article about Wheat Exports Australia, so the edit needs to be transferred to the latter article. Miracle Pen (talk) 20:43, 23 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Sounds like you need a cut and paste repair man - I would post your request at WP:REPAIR. Ronhjones ^(Talk) 21:15, 23 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

But page Wheat Export Authority starts (except for a redirect) at 02:13, 12 April 2010 by User:Miracle Pen (2,149 bytes) "(move from Export Wheat Commission)"
- And the history of page Export Wheat Commission is continuous throughout May 2008 and around, and none of its edits are around 2149 bytes. If this is a partial copy-and-paste and not a complete cut-and-paste, there is no reason for a history-merge between these 2 articles.
- Similar applies to the one-edit move request at "The second thing that ...". That edit (at 02:10, 8 July 2008 by User:Glenn Conroy, 6,764 bytes) may be information in a wrong article, but it is not an edit in a wrong history list: no edit of Wheat Export Authority is anywhere near 6764 bytes.
- Anthony Appleyard (talk) 05:56, 24 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Ok, thanks anyway. My logic was that Wheat Export Authority starts at EWC here, so that means it's in the wrong article's history (the article shouldn't have been moved in the first place). Miracle Pen (talk) 11:18, 24 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

HotCat

Hi there, please be careful when using HotCat, as you recently added a category relating to Australian politics to an article on an English footballer! Regards, Giant Snowman 12:28, 2 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for that. I'll go through and fix the links in the lists I got them from. Miracle Pen (talk) 16:07, 2 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Template:New South Wales ministries

Hi. Thanks for all your clean-ups lately of page that II started/edited re NSW politicans. As you may be aware, I've been slowly working through each of the NSW ministries; and adding the composition of the ministries, as they were prevsiously redirecting to the Premier of the period. At the same time as I completed each ministry, I changed the template. It appears that I can no longer amend this template (or don't know how to do so). Would you please provide some advice? For example, I have just completed Robertson (5) that needs to follow Dibbs (1). Can you please help. Thanks Jherschel (talk) 11:59, 4 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Problem solved. Jherschel (talk) 12:12, 4 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hi. I think I see what happened - I moved the template but I forgot to update the name field (whoops, sorry). So you were clicking on that little edit link in the template and getting an edit window with nothing but a redirect in it. Er, sorry about that. Mediawiki doesn't automatically use the PAGENAME for templates, you have to manually insert the name (copy and paste it, or just {{subst:PAGENAME}}) in the "name" field of the template, which you did. Miracle Pen (talk) 21:22, 4 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

C.R.Kennedy & Company Pty Ltd

I added some references to C.R.Kennedy & Company Pty Ltd You may want to revisit Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/C.R.Kennedy & Company Pty Ltd Eastmain (talk • contribs) 18:45, 8 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Adelaide city centre

FYI, this edit] replaces accurate information with inaccurate information, and hence has been reverted. There are so many inaccuracies in your change, I'm not going to bother to explain, unless you ask me to. Also, might I suggest you use the edit summary to explain what you think you are trying to do? Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 04:20, 20 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

It doesn't change any information. It combines two hatnotes. I am puzzled and would like you to explain it. Miracle Pen (talk) 04:26, 20 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Politicians

Writing in view of the current AfD... what do you make of the articles Gurm Sekhon, Rochelle Porteous and Kathleen Maltzahn? Orderinchaos 21:26, 22 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Funny you should mention Sekhon, I actually had his article bookmarked for a possible AfD nomination. From the looks of it, I can't find any WP:POLITICIAN sources on Sekhon. None of the Age sources in his article establish notability (they mostly seem to be passing mentions). There are 23 hits for Sekhon at The Age - individually the passing mentions don't mean much but collectively some people (mostly inclusionists, I suppose) might consider that many passing mentions to add up to notability. I'd vote delete in an AfD.

Rochelle Porteous is mayor of Balmain (although for some reason the fact isn't mentioned in her article, possibly because it seems to be a recent development), so that's probably good enough for notability.

Maltzahn is similar to Sekhon - lots of hits but not much in the way of reliable, independent secondary sources. Miracle Pen (talk) 03:53, 23 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, my opinions are pretty much the same as yours. I didn't know that about Porteous, so that's fair enough. Orderinchaos 21:20, 23 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

New Page Patrol survey

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Election results pages

Hi. Careful with the state result pages - while the changes in formal and informal vote should be available on the full report (to be honest I don't care enough about them to go and fix all the 2007 results), careful with turnout - remember there was a redistribution before 2007 so you can't just compare the 2007 turnout with the 2003 one. Frickeg (talk) 09:04, 1 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

OK. I'm getting the formals and informals from NSW2007_ResultsFinal.pdf. I don't expect the turnout figures to be much different (because patterns of informality are distributed fairly evenly, and redistributions don't change boundaries much), but because there's no source (and probably never will be), in theory we shouldn't be including them at all if there's an intervening redistribution. (Speaking of redistributions, you also might be interested in adding a note about redistribution, like this one and this one. Miracle Pen (talk) 11:25, 1 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

(Absurdly late reply) I've always been unsure about what to do with redistributions. I've considered working out an actual template or table for them (since the AEC calculates the new notional results, at least federally), but doing so would make some already long articles even longer for not that much reward. It's something I've intended to put into a "History" section in the main article, something that's still hovering around my to-do list. I've also wondered if we should maybe have some text in the results articles giving some basic context, but again I'm leaning towards keeping that on the main page when/if they're expanded. Frickeg (talk) 01:43, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I'd say that, at a minimum, we should be avoiding turnout swings altogether, redistribution or not. For instance, suppose you have a seat with turnout of, say, 91.44% (rounded, 91.4) at an election. Suppose at the next election turnout rises to 91.46% (rounded, 91.5). That's an increase of 0.02 (rounded, 0.0), but "91.4" to "91.5" looks like an increase of 0.1. Short of calculating the swings manually, it should be avoided. That said, calculating the swings shouldn't be that difficult - take, for example, the raw "total votes" and "roll" figures here and here for instance. One could just plug the figures into a spreadsheet and calculate the swings to a gazillion decimal places. I agree that a note might be a good idea explaining why not all turnout swings can be calculated, owing to intervening redistributions. Miracle Pen (talk) 04:48, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Nomination of Electoral results for the district of Burwood for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Electoral results for the district of Burwood is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Electoral results for the district of Burwood until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on good quality evidence, and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion template from the top of the article. Gaijin42 (talk) 02:38, 5 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Nomination of Electoral results for the district of North West for deletion

A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Electoral results for the district of North West is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Electoral results for the district of North West until a consensus is reached, and anyone is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on good quality evidence, and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion template from the top of the article. Gaijin42 (talk) 16:40, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Controversial move

Hello; earlier today you requested Super Pit gold mine be moved to Super Pit. I didn't see an issue at the time so I performed the move, however an editor has expressed concern on my talk page that the move may be controversial. As such, I have reverted my actions, and I would advise you to initiate a discussion on the article's talk page to garner consensus on a name, or to request the move under controversial or potentially controversial moves section at WP:RM. Thanks, and sorry for the confusion. CharlieEchoTango (contact) 04:36, 8 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. I've raised a requested move on its talk page. Miracle Pen (talk) 06:20, 8 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Electoral results for the district of Gympie

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Democratic Party

Ah, the wonders of pre-1949 political parties. I'm afraid I can't shed any light on this at the moment, although I'll put it on my to-do list for checking out when I have access to more material. Thanks for cleaning up the various Democratic Party pages; they've been a bit of a mess for a while. You're obviously correct about the 1931 outfit being a separate one to the two NSW parties. For what it's worth Hughes & Graham also lists them as "Democratic Party". Often info about these minor parties is extremely hard to come by, but I'll see what I can find. If all else fails a trawl through the newspaper databases may unearth something.

(If only the Climate Sceptics had changed their name to The Communists. After the year we've had in politics, we could use some levity!) Frickeg (talk) 03:06, 5 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Happy Australia Day! Thank you for contributing to Australian content!

	Australian Wikimedian Recognition (AWR)
	Thank you for your contributions on English Wikipedia that have helped improve Australian related content. :D It is very much appreciated. :D Enjoy your Australia Day and please continue your good work! LauraHale (talk) 01:53, 26 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

What did you think about the deletion notice you received?

Hi Miracle Pen,

In December you received a message about either "Nomination for deletion" or "Proposed deletion" of an article you created. I'd like to ask you a few quick questions:

Was the message helpful? Were the instructions clear and easy to follow?
If not, how do you think the message could be improved?
What do you think about the deletion process in general? Do you understand how to contest a deletion?

You can feel free to answer on my talk page or send me your response by email (mpinchukwikimedia.org). (I won't quote you or link your answers to your username if you don't feel comfortable with that.) Your feedback is incredibly useful for improving the content of deletion notifications, so please take a minute to think about and answer these questions. Thank you! Maryana (WMF) (talk) 23:57, 17 February 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Speedy deletion declined: New Rural Bank of Binalbagan, Inc.

Hello Miracle Pen. I am just letting you know that I declined the speedy deletion of New Rural Bank of Binalbagan, Inc., a page you tagged for speedy deletion, because of the following concern: The 1979 award indicates importance beyond what's required for A7. Thank you. Martijn Hoekstra (talk) 20:23, 18 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

An uncited award from an unspecified body? Er, ok. I prodded the article. Miracle Pen (talk) 20:52, 18 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Your technical move request

Hello Miracle Pen. About Media Gateway Control Protocol at WP:RM. What do you think should be done with the old history? You are requesting us to interchange articles A and B where both have history that could be worth preserving. Should I use a temporary title, C, to assist in the swap? For instance I could delete MGCP and use it as the temporary title C. EdJohnston (talk) 03:33, 11 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The usual way of doing it (at least, I can remember Anthony doing something like this once) is to move the old article to a subpage, then move the other article into its place. In this case, it would amount to moving Media Gateway Control Protocol to something like Media Gateway Control Protocol/old, then moving Media Gateway Control Protocol (MGCP) to Media Gateway Control Protocol. Miracle Pen (talk) 03:38, 11 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Hmm. The article previously resided at the very title you want it moved back to. See the first entry in this move log. The rationale was "make it more specific to distinguish from the other media gateway control protocol, Megaco." Has this reason gone away? EdJohnston (talk) 03:46, 11 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

There's a bit of a discussion at Talk:Media_Gateway_Control_Protocol#Recent_move about what seems to have been a cut-and-paste move by user Kbrose. His initial move (adding the "(MGCP)") should not have been performed - his "more specific" seems to have been an attempt to distinguish between two things (possibly MGCP and Media Gateway Control Protocol (Megaco)), but you don't change article names to do that, you add hatnotes.

A possible alternative would be to not move anything, but make Media Gateway Control Protocol a disambiguation page between (MGCP) and (Megaco). This would break WP:TWODABS, but that's not a big deal. Miracle Pen (talk) 03:54, 11 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I have moved Media Gateway Control Protocol to Media Gateway Control Protocol/version 2 and its talk page with it, and then Media Gateway Control Protocol (MGCP) to Media Gateway Control Protocol and its talk page with it.Anthony Appleyard (talk) 09:21, 11 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Critical Infrastructure Modeling Simulation (CIMS)

Don't forget to follow through with the nomination. Marcus Qwertyus 16:03, 21 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

It's listed at the April 17 subpage. Have I forgotten to do something? I used Twinkle to make the nomination. Miracle Pen (talk) 02:21, 22 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Alinta

There is discussion about the update the Australian energy company Alinta article and its connection to Alinta Energy. Your input to clarify these issue and update these articles is appreciated. Beagel (talk) 09:17, 12 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Speedy deletion declined: Scorpions

Hello Miracle Pen. I am just letting you know that I declined the speedy deletion of Scorpions, a page you tagged for speedy deletion, because of the following concern: The incoming links suggest the page should redirect to Scorpion, not the band. Thank you. — Malik Shabazz ^Talk/_Stalk 00:36, 21 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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The Olive Branch: A Dispute Resolution Newsletter (Issue #1)

Welcome to the first edition of The Olive Branch. This will be a place to semi-regularly update editors active in dispute resolution (DR) about some of the most important issues, advances, and challenges in the area. You were delivered this update because you are active in DR, but if you would prefer not to receive any future mailing, just add your name to this page.

In this issue:

Background: A brief overview of the DR ecosystem.
Research: The most recent DR data
Survey results: Highlights from Steven Zhang's April 2012 survey
Activity analysis: Where DR happened, broken down by the top DR forums
DR Noticeboard comparison: How the newest DR forum has progressed between May and August
Discussion update: Checking up on the Wikiquette Assistance close debate
Proposal: It's time to close the Geopolitical, ethnic, and religious conflicts noticeboard. Agree or disagree?

Read the entire first edition of The Olive Branch -->

--The Olive Branch 19:17, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free media (File:Knox City and Knox O-Zone.png)

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Hi

Thanks for reminding me about the electoral results pages too - I'm still getting used to all the work you've done getting them up and running at state level! Mostly I've just been picking up a few mistakes made back when I completely redid all the lists to bring in the party colours and things. The emdashes are left over from a looong time ago and I try and change them when I think of it, but it's not a fun job.

The templates ... are going to mean a LOT of templates. I don't know, I think it's probably fine to leave them for the time being. Changing two or three pages is not that arduous; we just need to get in the habit of it. It seems like a lot of work for not much return to template all that. But if you want to I wouldn't object. Frickeg (talk) 23:28, 10 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

By-elections

Thanks for catching that re: Wannon! Fixed. I usually try to update the results pages if I make a change but looks like I missed one there - thanks for catching it. :) The Drover's Wife (talk) 19:52, 3 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

EnergyAustralia

Hi, Miracle Pen. There is a proposal concerning EnergyAustralia and TRUenergy articles. Your opinion is appreciated. Beagel (talk) 05:50, 14 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Talk:EnergyAustralia#Merge_proposal

It seems a non-controversial proposal to me. Is there any reason not to ask an admin to do the moves? Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 12:15, 14 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

He's probably just looking for consensus before he does anything. I think Beagel was wondering "should I merge the TRUenergy stuff into the current EnergyAustralia article or should I move EnergyAustralia out of the way and move TRUenergy into its place?" The old EnergyAustralia and the current EnergyAustralia are different, so they merit separate articles. Given that we all agree, there's no reason why Beagel shouldn't feel free to go ahead with it. (An admin is going to have to move TRUenergy over the redirect left behind when EnergyAustralia is moved, so it's good to have a talk page discussion to point to in case the moving admin wonders why TRUenergy has to be moved.) Miracle Pen (talk) 16:36, 14 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Orphaned non-free media (File:Alberta Investment Management Corporation Logo.png)

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Disambiguation link notification for March 2

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Soyuz 5/V

While I agree that the letter V can be mistaken for the numeral 5, this is not true the other way around. Someone who types "Soyuz 5" into a search bar cannot plausibly be looking for the Soyuz V. I have reverted your edit, per WP:BRD please discuss this change on the article's talk page and establish a consensus to change it if you disagree. --W. D. Graham 18:48, 11 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

My point is that someone might see "Soyuz V" somewhere, think it means "Soyuz 5", and type "Soyuz 5" into Wikipedia looking for it. That's entirely plausible. Miracle Pen (talk) 19:05, 11 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I can see your point, but I respectfully disagree. If a user sees "Soyuz V" written somewhere and then searches for something other than Soyuz V to try and find it then I don't think they can have much to complain about if they find the wrong article. --W. D. Graham 19:38, 11 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Orphaned non-free media (File:SaulBassLogos.jpg)

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A second opinion on disambiguation top-hat tags on some Japanese articles

Hi. Sorry to bother you with a question. I don't think we've spoken before, but I've seen your name occasionally on edits to Japanese articles that involved fixing or removing disambiguation tags, and you seem quite knowledgeable on that area, so I wondered if I could get your opinion on something. I've recently come across an editor who insists on adding what I consider unnecessary {{Distinguish}} tags to pairs of articles whose names are not particularly similar or likely to be confused. The pairs of articles are:

In the latter case, Nishidai Station (Tokyo) already includes a disambiguator, so it's hard to see how there could be any confusion on Wikipedia. Anyway, I'd be grateful if you could have a look when you have time and let me know what you think, as unfortunately the editor involved is either unwilling or unable to communicate on this, and just reverts any changes without comment. Thanks. --DAJF (talk) 14:48, 18 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Hi there, thanks for the note. Hmm, good questions. My grasp of Japanese pronunciation is virtually nil, so I wonder: how similar are the pronunciations of "Zōshigaya" and "Koshigaya"? If the pronunciations are close enough, that's an argument in favour of putting {{distinguish}} templates on the two. For example, look at Carotene – there's a hatnote at the top telling readers not to confuse it with the similar-sounding substance Keratin, and the latter article has a hatnote distinguishing from four (!!) possible things that "keratin" sounds like. Manganese and Magnesium have matching distinguish tags too. So, at a minimum, there's precedent for distinguish hatnotes on articles on similar topics with similar pronunciations and/or spellings.

If there is no risk of reasonably confusing "Zōshigaya" and "Koshigaya" – I apprehend that is your position – then there's no reason for the tags: ultimately, disambiguation is only necessary where there's actual ambiguity. So your question boils down to "is it possible for a reasonable person to confuse "Zōshigaya" and "Koshigaya"", and my guess as an outsider (could I confuse the two?) is "yes", so I'd be inclined to keep the tags.

As for Nishiarai vs Nishidai, same logic – could a reasonable person go to one article while expecting the other? I'd be inclined to guess "yes" again, for much the same reasons – similar spelling, similar pronunciation, similar topics.

Finally, I'd have to say that if anyone should have the final say on it, it's probably WT:WikiProject Trains in Japan. I'd take their opinion on the topic as final, so try asking there. Hope I've been helpful, Miracle Pen (talk) 16:57, 18 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

OK, thanks for that. Being familiar with the station names myself, it was hard for me to see how they could be confused, but it was good to get the opinion of someone not so familiar with them. That was helpful. Thanks. --DAJF (talk) 22:56, 18 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

William Jackson (engineer) change

I don't understand your removal of the dab link. There are a large number of people named William Jackson. Please explain. - Denimadept (talk) 16:28, 10 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]

There is only one engineer named William Jackson. There is no ambiguity to resolve. Miracle Pen (talk) 16:30, 10 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Caspar, South Fork and Eastern Railroad

Just curious why you thought the disambiguation link was silly enough to be deleted?Thewellman (talk) 02:10, 15 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Because there is no ambiguity. No-one would type in, or click on "Caspar, South Fork and Eastern Railroad" if they really wanted something called "California Western Railroad". Miracle Pen (talk) 07:41, 15 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- I believe you have inappropriately limited the focus of disambiguation to wording similarity rather than similar location. For the past half century, there has been a single railroad (the California Western) connecting the national rail network to the Pacific coastline between San Francisco Bay and Humboldt Bay. The Caspar, South Fork and Eastern Railroad is a better description of the route followed by the California Western Railroad. Someone searching through a listing of railroad names could easily inappropriately associate these locations with the route of the California Western Railroad; since the latter name could apply to any point along California's 900-mile coastline, while Caspar is less than ten miles distant from the actual route along the South Fork Noyo River.Thewellman (talk) 04:08, 17 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  - That probably falls under WP:LEGITHAT (specifically, the fact that there's another railway going through the area is useful information that should go in the body of the article.) What you've pointed out sounds reasonable, but that's too much information to cram into a hatnote. Try putting it into the lead paragraph, where you have more room to elaborate. By doing it like that, you make it obvious to a casual reader the scope for confusion. By using a hatnote, it's not obvious to the reader what the distinction is or why he might actually want the other article. Miracle Pen (talk) 06:18, 17 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Fulton College

The redirect at Fulton College was formerly a disambiguation page. I restored the disambiguation page and added some other institutions that might be known by that name. Eastmain (talk • contribs) 01:02, 16 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]

British Indian

I see you have taken issue with my reversion of your removal of the hat not on the above. also in future please make use of the edit summaries when making mass edits. It seems from reading you Talk Page above I am not alone but However I am not going to bother debating your change which I do not agree with. as I have learnt its best to ignore those engaged on a mission.Tmol42 (talk) 19:16, 16 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I didn't remove the hatnote. You may notice that there is, in fact, still a hatnote there. Miracle Pen (talk) 19:22, 16 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]

WTRM Hat Note

Perhaps you can tell me why you think a hat note, not using the standard {{dablink}} template is "malformed", when they both say the exact same thing. Your version says "For the railroad, see Warren and Trumbull Railroad." The previous version says "For the railroad, see Warren and Trumbull Railroad."

So, why the need to change a hat note, from the stadard dablink, to the {{for}} template which does the exact same thing? - Neutralhomer • Talk • 07:45, 16 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

{{Dablink}} is not standard. Dablink is only supposed to be used when you need a custom hatnote that can't be produced through any other means. You'll notice that {{For}} has nearly 90k transclusions but dablink has barely 6k. See the template documentation for more information on how to correctly use disambiguation hatnotes. Miracle Pen (talk) 08:14, 16 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
- Actually, according to the template on the Dablink page, it says "320,000+ pages." Stats aside, you are changing a template to something that does the same thing as the former. It's silly. - Neutralhomer • Talk • 08:24, 16 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

You are probably referring to the 330k figure for {{hatnote}}, which is mostly transclusions from the dab templates. They use hatnote as a base, which is probably where your confusion stems from. Go to Hatnote's backlinks and try finding a page that uses dablink or hatnote (the former redirects to the latter) raw. You will find that very few do; they almost invariably use templates like {{distinguish}}, {{about}}, {{for}}, {{redirect}} and so forth. Miracle Pen (talk) 09:27, 16 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Disambiguation link notification for March 26

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Removal from Energy Category

Hi Miracle Pen, I would like to understand why you are removing articles from the Energy in Queensland category. I appreciate you adding the Natural Gas category, but these LNG projects are huge factor in the energy sector in Queensland.--Graham Proud (talk) 05:07, 3 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Category:Energy in Queensland is a parent category to Category:Natural gas in Queensland, and you normally don't add/keep parent cats (see WP:SUBCAT). Miracle Pen (talk) 07:22, 3 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

April 2014

Hello, I'm BracketBot. I have automatically detected that your edit to Electoral results for the district of Wright may have broken the syntax by modifying 1 "[]"s. If you have, don't worry: just edit the page again to fix it. If I misunderstood what happened, or if you have any questions, you can leave a message on my operator's talk page.

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Page moves

If you move a page and then redirect its old title to a disambiguation page, as you did with Brookfield Place (skyscraper), then it's your responsbility to tidy up after yourself - instead of leaving a large number of previously accurate links now pointing to the disambiguation page. I've cleaned up after you this time, but please do it yourself another time. Thanks. PamD 15:24, 10 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Orphaned non-free image File:Sp-ausnet logo.png

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Orphaned non-free image File:Sp-ausnet logo.png

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File:Sp-ausnet logo.png listed for deletion

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Orphaned non-free image File:Sapowernetworkslogo.png

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Gender

Hi Miracle Pen,

I had one of the pages you changed on my watch list and I noticed that you are moving articles from "businessperson" to "businesswoman" or "businessman" and citing the essay Wikipedia:Gender-neutral language. Those changes are actually the opposite of what is recommended in that essay. Cheers. I am One of Many (talk) 21:45, 8 October 2014 (UTC)[reply]

It says "Where the gender is known, gender-specific items are also appropriate ("Bill Gates is a businessman" or "Nancy Pelosi is a congresswoman").". It's an article guideline, but I imagine it applies to titles as well. Miracle Pen (talk) 22:01, 8 October 2014 (UTC)[reply]

One way or the other is fine with me and I agree that it does read better as Nancy Pelosi is a congresswoman rather than congressperson. I am One of Many (talk) 03:07, 9 October 2014 (UTC)[reply]

I'm concerned about the edits you're making. The essay says "gender-specific items are also appropriate." I don't think it's a good idea to do mass moves (it looks like you've been moving a lot of articles) in accordance with your personal preferences, where both "businessperson" and "businessman" are acceptable here. Calliopejen1 (talk) 18:52, 23 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I don't see any need to settle for the generic where the specific is known. The wording of WP:GENDER should be tightened up to stipulate that the specific is preferable (why wouldn't it be?). Also, most of the moves are just reversing recent undiscussed moves. Miracle Pen (talk) 18:58, 23 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the quick reply. I don't think it's a matter of "settling for the generic" -- rather, it is about preferring gender-neutral language. (You may not think this is a virtue in itself, but many do. Clearly, we're not using "poetess" for poet, etc....) I don't have a problem with reversing recent moves, if that's what you're doing, but I don't think there's a consensus for bulk moves from "businessperson" --> "businessman" etc. Calliopejen1 (talk) 20:35, 23 February 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Orphaned non-free image File:Envestra logo.png

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Category:Defunct oil and gas companies of Australia

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Early party affiliations

Hey there... I'm noticing in articles like Electoral results for the district of Torrens you've added "Australian National League" (it's actually Australasian National League) to a couple of MPs but not in the main Electoral district of Torrens article, and this appears to be the case in various seat articles. Would you mind streamlining it one way or the other so the party affiliation is on both or neither? Note that with articles like Members of the South Australian House of Assembly, 1905–1906 and Members of the South Australian Legislative Council, 1905–1908 being created and affiliations added, having reliably sourced affiliations is an increasingly good thing. If you want to browse the Members articles and add affiliations you're aware of, that would be ok too. :) Timeshift (talk) 00:09, 24 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Hi there, good to hear from you. I didn't edit the member lists (your eyes might have glazed over when looking at article diffs, which is entirely forgiveable). From reviewing the article history, what's happened is that I copied them over in late 2011 and they've diverged since (eg. see this edit, my final edits being this (seat) and this (results). The real solution to this is to template the member lists and transclude that instead. You're quite right that the seat and results member lists diverging is a nuisance, and the best solution is templating. A while ago, I remember suggesting the idea of templating results at Frickeg's talk page, but templating members is probably an even better place to start. You might want to look at the results sections for articles like Ste. Rose (electoral district) - note how they template the results? We should do something similar, at least with templating members, then we can consider templating results. Miracle Pen (talk) 07:40, 24 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Good idea! Interested in doing it? :P Timeshift (talk) 07:49, 24 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

If I do, I might start with NSW, because I've been fixing a few discrepancies there lately :D. Miracle Pen (talk) 08:12, 24 June 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Warnbro Sound

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Moving of Post-election pendulum for the New South Wales state election, 2003 page

Hi, I was trying to de-orphan a page that you moved in the past, however the move created confusion for me about what it should be linked with. This is the change you made [[1]] The title now has the year 2003 in it, but the article says 2005. In the history it looks like someone else had moved it to 2006 at one point, and then it was moved back to 2005. The content of the page talks about the next 2007 election, which would indicate to me that the page should be 2005 not 2003. Can you please explain why you moved it? Thanks Powertothepeople (talk) 08:47, 20 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

The reason why I moved it was because it's standard practice to name pendulum articles after the election to which the article pertains - which was the 2003 election. I don't think there were many other pendulum articles on enwiki yet, so no standard naming practice had yet emerged. Given that the pendulum is notionally calculated on the 2004-redistribution boundaries (contra the article, the redistribution in question occurred in 2004, not 2005), a more appropriate title may be Pre-election pendulum for the New South Wales state election, 2007 (eg. see Pre-election pendulum for the New South Wales state election, 2015; pre-election pendulum articles are a fairly new innovation, and didn't exist at the time I moved the article). Miracle Pen (talk) 09:29, 20 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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