Talk:Viggo Mortensen

Danish-American

I don't understand why it can't say "Danish-American". He is Danish-American as he holds dual-citizenship in both Denmark and the U.S. It says "Do not add Danish because he was born in the U.S, known for his work there and still spends much of his time there." The former CEO of YouTube Susan Wojcicki was also born in the U.S, known for her work there and still spends much of her time there, but it still says Polish-American om her page. TheManTheyCallAdam (talk) 23:12, 8 March 2023 (UTC)

You can check MOS:NATIONALITY for the official Wikipedia policy on the use of nationalities in the first paragraph. The article can mention any dual nationality the subject may hold, or his origin, that's not the problem; it just does not go in the first sentence. Unlike Peter Lorre, used as an example in the linked policy, Mortensen was born in the USA, started his career there and has always been considered an American actor. The fact that a Danish page considers him Danish is not really relevant. Wojcicki's page contradicts the official policy here exposed; in fact, it is Wojcicki's page that should be changed, not this one.

Gorpik (talk) 16:26, 13 March 2023 (UTC)

With all due respect but you're main argument of his nationality being solely American because of his birth and upbringing in the US is not sufficient at all. The subject of nationality and national identity is factually linked to one's given citizenship. Mortensen have American as well as Danish citizenship - furthermore he speaks the language (Danish that is) and have close familiar ties to the country. For staters his Surname should be a dead giveaway regarding his Danish heritage. His Danish citizenship is highly relevant in regards to his nationality. You're argument is vague and subjective at best.

Citizenship = nationality. It's that simple, there's really no way around it. Laroucan (talk) 11:38, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Neither me nor the article say that his nationality is solely American. Gorpik (talk) 11:43, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

His background before he became notable is well covered in the Early life section of the article. He lived in a lot of places and moved around a lot. His having Danish citizenship from his father is more trivia than anything else and just merits a sourced mention in the infobox. Otherwise it is a minor legality that has no bearing on anything notable he has done. Geraldo Perez (talk) 15:46, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

His upbringing and nationality are two different things. Though I don't blame you for confusing the two. You made several arguments that are ranging from plain wrong to debatable and subjective in nature (not fit for an encyclopaedia)

His having Danish citizenship from his father is more trivia than anything else and just merits a sourced mention in the infobox.

Your own subjective thoughts on his Danish citizenship Citizenship is irrelevant to the subject. To label it as "trivia" and a side note is questioning the whole concept of nationality. Fact is it's a legal status that by definition regards one's nationality - plain and simple, however unimportant and irrelevant you personally might find it. I'm basing my argument on the law you seem base yours on a much more vague concept of upbringing.

I don't know what classifies as major or minor legalities in your mind but this is certainly not a "minor legality" regarding the subject.

Tell me, if citizenship isn't an indicator regarding one's nationally then what is? Laroucan (talk) 23:17, 22 July 2023 (UTC)

Where he did his notable activities is what is important. He's done nothing notable in Denmark. Geraldo Perez (talk) 23:34, 22 July 2023 (UTC)

His achievements in Denmark are factually irrelevant when talking about his dual citizenship and thereby nationality. You're yet again defining his nationality based on subjective and vague parameters. Citizenship and hereby nationality is a legal status that's not really up for debate.

- The concept of 𝘕𝘢𝘵𝘪𝘰𝘯𝘢𝘭 𝘪𝘥𝘦𝘯𝘵𝘪𝘵𝘺 however is a whole different subject that is based on sociology and cultural upbringings and is indeed up for debate - once again you’re confusing the two.Laroucan (talk) 21:03, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

Going in circles now. See next section below for more about what goes in lead section of article and why. Geraldo Perez (talk) 21:20, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

Nationality in lead

MOS:CONTEXTBIO is very clear that what goes in the intro is where he did his notable activities which is the United States. He has done nothing notable in Denmark. He is an American actor, not a Danish actor. His dual citizenship is covered in the article sufficiently but the fact he has dual citizenship is irrelevant to why he is notable and where all his notable actives were done. Geraldo Perez (talk) 05:14, 25 April 2023 (UTC)

Whether or not he has done anything notable in a country is irrelevant in terms of nationality. Viggo himself has stated in multiple articles and interview that he identifies as Danish-American. TheManTheyCallAdam (talk) 22:47, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

The location of all his notable activities is very relevant as to what goes in the intro sentence and the lead. See the linked MOS section on the topic. Geraldo Perez (talk) 23:00, 30 June 2023 (UTC)

Himself stating that he identifies as Danish-American and that he feels at home in Denmark makes his weather or not he is notable for his work less relevant. TheManTheyCallAdam (talk) 22:11, 1 July 2023 (UTC)

Lots of American people identify as some subtype of American, identifies that are very important to them, like African-American, Jewish-American or Mexican-American. We still put American in the intro sentence and talk to their ethnicity and ancestry in the early life section where it belongs. Geraldo Perez (talk) 23:21, 1 July 2023 (UTC)

Wikipedia is not a collection of personal pages. This article is not a reflection of what Mortensen wants to say or not about himself. Wikipedia has a clear set of guidelines, and the one linked by @Geraldo Perez is the one we must follow in this case. Gorpik (talk) 13:53, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

Not a collection of personal data? There is a whole section called "Perssonal Life" TheManTheyCallAdam (talk) 23:44, 13 December 2023 (UTC)

Not a collection of personal pages. Please do not misrepresent what I say if you want to discuss it. Gorpik (talk) 12:28, 14 December 2023 (UTC)

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Viggo Mortensen/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: TompaDompa (talk · contribs) 23:35, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

This is a WP:QUICKFAIL based on criterion 1 (It is a long way from meeting any one of the six good article criteria). Specifically, it is far from meeting WP:GACR 1, which mandates that the article be well-written. This is not trivially fixable, because it is not just a matter of individual sentences needing copyediting. The overall impression I get when reading this article is that it was written piecemeal over a fairly long period of time (perhaps updated as time went on). That is of course probably exactly what happened, but it shouldn't show. Articles should ideally look as if they were written all in one go by a subject-matter expert after reading all the relevant literature and carefully considering the best way to structure the article in order to present the information as effectively as possible. While it is not necessary to accomplish that level of writing quality, this article needs to be rewritten to give a more cohesive impression so it at least comes closer. There is also an issue of tone, where the article to a large extent reads like an attempt to present its subject in a positive light (this could be reflective of the overall literature; I haven't checked). I'm afraid this means that the article will pretty much need to be rewritten from the ground up to meet the standards to be considered for WP:Good article status. I'll provide a (non-exhaustive) sample of issues I noted while reading through the article:

• He appeared in several notable films – MOS:NOTABLE.
• The first paragraph of the WP:LEAD is basically just a laundry list of films.
• A third teaming with Cronenberg – odd phrasing.
• Large portions of the body resemble WP:Proseline writing.
• During the 1990s, Mortensen appeared in supporting roles in a variety of films [...] – again basically just a laundry list of films.
• films such as The Lord of the Rings and Alatriste. Mortensen also talked about his work with Bob Anderson, the swordmaster on The Lord of the Rings, Alatriste [...] – there is really no reason to repeat links in consecutive sentences like this.
• While it was reported in April 2009 that Mortensen had, at least temporarily, retired from film acting, Mortensen said he was misquoted. In a 2012 interview, he denied that he ever said he was retiring, only that he didn't have "plans to do another movie" at the time and that he was "taking a little break now. I don't have anything lined up." – was this a serious rumour? It is not self-evident that this should be included at all (an incorrect rumour of this kind seems like a WP:MINORASPECT, prima facie).
• The play is about a man and woman confined either a psychiatric hospital or prison together. – anacoluthon. Also, "either"?
• The play premiered from November 4 to December 18. – surely it only premiered once, on November 4.
• During the COVID-19 pandemic, Mortensen together with Sean Astin, Sean Bean, Orlando Bloom, Billy Boyd, Ian McKellen, Dominic Monaghan, Miranda Otto, John Rhys-Davies, Andy Serkis, Liv Tyler, Karl Urban, and Elijah Wood, plus writer Philippa Boyens and director Peter Jackson from The Lord of the Rings in May 2020 joined actor Josh Gad's YouTube series Reunited Apart, which reunites the cast of popular movies through video-conferencing, and promotes donations to non-profit charities. – this is a run-on sentence, and very difficult to parse as a result. It's also a single-sentence paragraph.
• which he also wrote, produced, composed the score and starred in – not grammatical.
• The sentences Mortensen was cast as British cave diver Rick Stanton in the biographical film Thirteen Lives directed by Ron Howard which was released in July 2022., He reunited with David Cronenberg in the horror sci-fi film Crimes of the Future alongside Kristen Stewart with filming beginning in August 2021., and He will star and direct in a Western film which he wrote, starring Vicky Krieps later in the year titled The Dead Don't Hurt, with shooting to commence in Mexico. all suffer from clunky phrasing and dubious grammar.
• Mortensen will also reunite with Lisandro Alonso on the film Eureka. – reunite from where? This is the first time Alonso has been mentioned in the article.
• In 2016, Mortensen traveled to New York to take care of his father, who died a year later. Two years earlier, Mortensen's mother had also died from complications of the condition. – rather odd to present this out of chronological order.
• he publicly criticized the use of his character Aragorn – certainly not "his" character. If they used his likeness and he criticized that, write that instead.

The "Filmography" section is also mostly unsourced, which would in itself be sufficient for a quickfail and which I will tag accordingly. TompaDompa (talk) 23:35, 7 August 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.