Talk:John Peel (huntsman)

Ontario

In the section titled "John Peel's Life", it is stated that "Peel Region, the equivalent of a county in Ontario, Canada may be named after him." Peel Region inherited the name Peel from Peel County from which it was created. Peel County was named for Sir Robert Peel, Prime Minister of the United Kingdom when Peel Country was organised in 1848. In addition, Peel Region is not the equivalent of a county in Ontario. Counties and Regional Municipalities both exist in Ontario. A Regional Municipality resembles a unitary authority more than a county. A "Region" has more power and responsibilities than a country. --Beowulf cam (talk) 23:39, 2 April 2010 (UTC)

A View to a Kill

It strikes me that this is probably the source for the James Bond title "A View to a Kill".

I'm fairly sure it's documented as being such, somewhere. May even be in our own A View to a Kill entry. Angmering

It is indeed. I wondered if the origins (words usually attributed to John Woodcock Graves 1795-1886, most popular tune possibly part of W. Metcalfe's version, 1868) & further lyrics of the song would enhance the entry, something like:

Alternative versions

As is common with songs often sung from memory, this has been recorded with other verses and minor differences in lyrics, most obviously in the lines also rendered: 'From the drag to the chase, From the chase to the view' and 'From a view to a death in the morning', as quoted, for example in the title of Matt Cartmill's book "A View to a Death in the Morning: Hunting and Nature Through History".

It also is usually sung with a repeated refrain:

D'ye ken John Peel with his coat so gay?

D'ye ken John Peel at the break o' day?

D'ye ken John Peel when he's far, far a-way.

With his hounds and his horn in the morning?

Chorus:

For the sound of his horn brought me from my bed,

And the cry of his hounds, which he oft-times led;

Peel's view halloo' would waken the dead,

Or the fox from his lair in the morning.

Yes, I ken John Peel and Ruby too,

Ranter and Ringwood, Bellman and True;

From a find to a check, from a check to a view,

From a view to a death in the morning.

For the sound of his horn etc.

Then here's to John Peel from my heart and soul,

Let's drink to his health, let's finish the bowl;

We'll follow John Peel through fair and through foul,

If we want a good hunt in the morning.

For the sound of his horn etc.

D'ye ken John Pell with his coat so gay?

He liv'd at Troutbeck once on a day;

Now he has gone far, away;

We shall ne'er hear his voice in the morning.

For the sound of his horn etc.

J. W. Graves

Additional verses

And I've followed John Peel both often and far

O'er the rasper fence and the gate and the bar

From Low Denton Holme to the Scratchmere Scar

When we vied for the brush in the morning.

For the sound of his horn etc.

Do ye ken that hound whose voice is death?

Do ye ken her sons of peerless faith

Do ye ken that a fox with his last breath

Cursed them all as he died in the morning?

Alternative verse

Then here's to John Peel with my heart and soul

Come fill, fill to him a brimming bowl

For we'll follow John Peel thro fair or thro foul

While we're waked by his horn in the morning.

There are a number of stories as to the more detailed identity of John Peel, but I lack the authority or references to sort them out.

What do you think to the suggestions? Salvianus 23:20, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

Lyrics amended in line with Tulliehouse Museum reference

This reference is a good source, and I've edited the lyrics in line with its version, but more could be done as it has a lot of other information on the man and the song. Talking of which, I wonder if the song should actually be a separate article? Rexparry sydney 03:16, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Nice one. Separation would be logical, with links. Salvianus 11:43, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

'The sound of his horn'

I've recently read the novel 'The sound of his horn' by Sarban (pen name of British diplomat John William Wall). The Wikipedia entry on the novel says its title seems to be taken from the lyrics of 'D'ye ken John Peel'. Also, the entry on Sarban says he's described in The Encyclopedia of Fantasy as being "conscious of the darker and less acceptable implications that underlie much popular literature" - which seems consistent with drawing inspiration from the song to entitle his dystopian novel. If there are no objections, I'll soon add to the Trivia section a reference to the novel.--Pedro Gomes (talk) 04:19, 24 November 2007 (UTC)

Move the page?

I'd like to move this page to John Peel (huntsman). He's better known as a huntsman than a farmer. Are there any objections to this? Thanks, Pikemaster (talk) 22:23, 8 October 2010 (UTC)

Done. Pikemaster (talk) 22:56, 13 June 2011 (UTC)

John Peel's Coat

As to Peel's coat being alternatively "Gay" or "Grey", the folk song The Horn of the Hunter (aka. John Peel's Echo) states that:

No broadcloth nor scarlet adorned him

Nor buckskin that rivals the snow.

But of plain Skiddaw grey was his garment,

And he wore it for work not for show.

Roud index #1859 if anyone's interested. (here)

No idea if that's notable or not, but it supports the idea of a grey coat. 62.196.17.197 (talk) 16:07, 31 July 2014 (UTC)

There's another (reasonably) early reference to a grey coat, where D'ye Ken John Peel is quoted in Parade's End by Ford Madox Ford (1924). This is long before the word had any connotations of sexuality. I wonder if there are any historical references to a coat so gay - the three listed in the article all appear to be modern. My guess is the original word was grey, and gay is an adaptation by people used to seeing huntsmen on horseback wearing 'pinks' (bright scarlet jackets). Zipperdeedoodah (talk) 08:24, 17 September 2017 (UTC)

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