Scott Sumner had a recent post about how people get so hung up on how to define words, or what labels to attach to certain ideas, that they lose sight of actual issue at hand. I largely agree, and I think a very important skill to develop is the ability to “taboo your words,” as Eliezer Yudkowsky once said.
Very briefly, Yudkowsky imagines two people who seem to disagree with each other over whether the proverbial tree that falls with nobody around to hear it still makes a noise. Two people argue with each other about it, one saying yes and the other saying no. But the one saying “yes” is defining noise to mean “acoustic vibrations,” while the one saying “no” is defining noise to mean “auditory experience.” Both parties actually agree about the state of the world. They both would agree that the falling tree generated acoustic vibrations and did not generate an auditory experience – but because they’re using the same word (“noise”) to describe these different phenomena, they are going in circles over a disagreement that doesn’t actually exist.
Now, you’d expect this dispute to be easily rectified once they realized the source of the confusion. And in this specific case, it might even work out that way – once they realized they’re just using the same word to mean different things, they would also realize their dispute has been dissolved and go on with their day. Wouldn’t it be odd if instead, they ended up starting another argument insisting the other person’s definition of “noise” was objectively incorrect?
That’s pretty unlikely to happen because nobody feels personally invested in how “noise” is defined. But it happens all the time in political discussions, because so many terms, once politicized, carry an emotional valence with people. Sumner’s post focused on whether or not “addiction” is properly categorized as a “disease” as opposed to a “character flaw.” Someone with a disease is automatically coded sympathetically, whereas someone whose problems arise from character flaws is coded unsympathetically. Thus, people fight each other tooth and nail over the semantic issue of what constitutes a “disease” because they want to support a more (or less) sympathetic view towards people addicted to drugs.
We see the same thing play out in political disputes. For example, racism is a very charged, highly valanced word. Everyone agrees that racism is bad – which is why there is so much furious dispute over what is or isn’t racist. To successfully brand some idea or action as racist is an automatic victory in the debate over whether or not it’s good or bad.
For example, suppose you think equal outcomes is intrinsically good, and you wanted to convince other people to think the same way. One way to do that is to engage and refute arguments made by the Princeton philosopher Henry Frankfurt that equality of outcome has no intrinsic value, or the arguments by Michael Huemer in support of the same conclusion. Or you can skip all that and insist that unequal outcomes are racist. That is, you can claim not merely that unequal outcomes can be a result of racism – the claim is that unequal outcomes just are racist, by definition. And if unequal outcomes are racist, that means they must be bad, because anything racist is bad. You can simply define your side of the debate into victory.
This appears in the worldview of Ibram Kendi. By Kendi’s lights, equality (treating people equally without regard to race) isn’t the goal. His goal is equity (treating people differently according to race to get equal outcomes). As a result, he thinks discriminating on the basis of race can be a good thing – and if racial discrimination can be good, that means racial discrimination can’t be what it means to be racist. He says this very plainly, stating “racial discrimination is not inherently racist” because what actually matters is the outcome of discriminating on the basis of race – i.e., “whether the discrimination is creating equity or inequity. If discrimination is creating equity, then it is antiracist. If discrimination is creating inequity, then it is racist.” If discriminating against people on the basis of their race leads to more equal outcomes, and unequal outcomes are racist, then you’d have to be a racist to be opposed to racial discrimination. And we all agree that racism is bad, right? Hence the push to define “racism” not in terms of processes, but of outcomes.
Or say you’re someone who is opposed to an “either/or” mindset. You can try to convince people to abandon such a mindset through arguments and reason. Or, you can take a shortcut and just declare that using an “either/or” mindset is actually a way of promoting white supremacy culture – and since we all agree that white supremacism is a bad thing, we don’t need to do any more work. Framing something as either/or promotes white supremacism, and white supremacism is bad, therefore the either/or framing is bad. Case closed.
Of course, such tactics can lead movements to eat their own tails. After all, one key point of Kendi’s worldview is that there is an all encompassing and mutually exclusive binary. You are either an antiracist, or you are a racist – there are no other options and no middle ground. Again, he says this plainly in his book, writing “One endorses either the idea of a racial hierarchy as a racist, or racial equality as an antiracist. One either believes problems are rooted in groups of people, as a racist, or locates the roots of problems in power and policies, as an antiracist. One either allows racial inequities to persevere, as a racist, or confronts racial inequities, as an antiracist.” So, by framing the issue of racism as an either/or dichotomy, Kendi is also promoting tenants of white supremacy culture. To be clear, that’s not actually my view – I don’t believe Kendi promotes white supremacy culture. My point is simply to show the absurdities people can trap themselves in when trying to play these definitional games.
Unfortunately, I don’t know of a good way to get people to drop the baggage and association attached to words and phrases and focus on the underlying issues instead. But I’m told recognizing a problem exists is at least a necessary step to fixing it – and this is definitely a problem that needs a fix.
READER COMMENTS
Richard W Fulmer
Feb 28 2024 at 3:03pm
A key question is whether one’s definitions lead to constructive policies and desirable outcomes. For example, according to Ibram X. Kendi, anything that increases racial disparities is racist, and anything that reduces racial disparities is anti-racist. Simple. But, which of the following are racist and which are anti-racist?
1a. More school discipline: If we punish students for bullying, we are likely to find that we’re punishing more black boys than, say, Japanese American girls. So, discipline is racist.
1b. Less school discipline: If we don’t punish students for bullying, we are likely to see an increase in black victims. So, discipline is anti-racist.
2a. More police presence: More cops on the street will likely mean more arrests of young black men. So, hiring more cops is racist.
2b. Less police presence: Fewer cops on the street will likely mean more black victims. So, hiring more cops is anti-racist.
3a. Race-based college admissions: If we ensure that our university student bodies reflect community racial makeup, more blacks will have the opportunity to obtain higher education. So, basing college admission on race is anti-racist.
3b. Merit-based college admissions: If we make sure that students attending a university are well-matched to that school’s standards, more students – including black students – will graduate. So, basing college admissions on race is racist.
4a. Minimum wage laws. If we raise the minimum wage, some black people will earn more money. So, minimum wages are anti-racist.
4b. Minimum wage laws. If we raise the minimum wage, some people will lose their jobs. And these people will likely be the least employable – that is, the least educated, least skilled, and most discriminated against. Often that translates into minority youth. So minimum wage laws are racist.
5a. Higher teacher quality. Increasing standards for teachers could result in fewer minority teachers. Therefore, high standards are racist.
5b. Lower teacher quality. Maintaining or lowering current standards for teachers will result in poor education for minority students. Therefore, low standards are racist.
Kendi’s definitions of racism and anti-racism don’t seem to provide much policy guidance. The problem is that the definitions depend on what we choose to measure and who we choose to look at. Do we count perpetrators or victims? Teachers or students? Do we count admissions or graduations? Do we count jobs kept or jobs lost? Do we focus on minority demographic A or minority demographic B? Do we count heads or accomplishments?
David Seltzer
Feb 29 2024 at 9:30am
Nicely done Richard. It is assumed racism is objectionable because it harms individuals. My premise. If a person harbors racial antipathy but never expresses it through words or action, is there harm? For example. A small business in our town is owned by a person who is anti-LGBTQ. His best employee is a gay man whom he treats with respect.
Peter
Feb 29 2024 at 12:15pm
Well said David, I’ve made that point to people around me for years. The problem is once you start requiring harm, or even better provable individualized harm, the entire US civil AND criminal system collapses. Harm is assumed and lack of harm, even if you can prove it, isn’t a defense. There really should be some sort of mens rea equivalent where non-temporal harm must be proven for any crime or tort.
David Seltzer
Feb 29 2024 at 1:31pm
Thank you Peter.
steve
Feb 29 2024 at 1:04am
Shouldn’t we have metrics if we are going to try to claim we have equality? Haven’t read much Kendi, and I doubt anyone here has either, but there are other people who write seriously on the topic and whether or not you think equality exists often depends on your personal incentives that influence your decisions. It’s hard to come up with truly objective metrics in many cases.
I think a big part missed in Kevin’s piece is that people are deliberately muddying the meaning of terms. For example Rufo…
“We have successfully frozen their brand — ‘critical race theory’ — into the public conversation and are steadily driving up negative perceptions. We will eventually turn it toxic, as we put all of the various cultural insanities under that brand category,” he wrote. “The goal is to have the public read something crazy in the newspaper and immediately think ‘critical race theory.’ We have decodified the term and will recodify it to annex the entire range of cultural constructions that are unpopular with Americans.”
Steve
Kevin Corcoran
Feb 29 2024 at 10:31am
I don’t see why, particularly since, as you go on to point out, it’s “hard to come up with truly objective metrics in many cases.” Indeed, Jerry Muller wrote an excellent book outlining all kinds of problems that come when we try to use metrics to make claims, and the whole idea of metric-based equality is extremely vulnerable to every single possible way the use of metrics goes wrong.
I have nothing nice to say about Rufo – he’s a bad actor in my book. But, I didn’t “miss” that people are “deliberately muddying the meaning of terms.” People muddying the meaning of terms, and the negative effects that has on effectively communicating, is literally the entire point of this post.
steve
Feb 29 2024 at 11:34am
So because it is difficult we just give up and say everyone is equal? We just base stuff upon feelings? That’s great if your real goal is to support the status quo. I think you need to measure stuff and then you can argue about the relative value of the measurements but to just ignore the numbers is folly, though good for those who already have the advantage.
Steve
Kevin Corcoran
Feb 29 2024 at 11:41am
Actually, this isn’t what I’m saying. And here’s how you can tell that’s not what I’m saying – because it’s not what I said 😛
Richard W Fulmer
Feb 29 2024 at 9:42am
First, define “equality.” There is no hope of measuring that we don’t understand.
Second, is your goal achievable? Kendi’s definition of equality (or “equity”) is equal – that is, proportional representation in all categories of life. But that simply can’t happen:
-The median white American is 44 years old, and the median black American is 34. The average 44-year-old is more experienced than the average 34-year-old, is further up the corporate ladder, and has a larger salary and more accumulated wealth.
-The average height of a white American adult male is 5′ 9.5″. The average height of a non-Hispanic Asian male is 5′ 7.1″.
-Black Americans are concentrated in the South, Hispanics in the Southwest.
Just those three variables alone ensure that equal outcomes cannot be achieved, and there are countless other variables.
The variables also ensure that equal opportunity is not possible. Someone growing up in a small town in New Mexico or Mississippi will not have the same opportunities as someone growing up in Manhattan.
The best we can do is aspire to equal treatment under the law. But can we measure even that? If more people of race A are arrested, is that proof of unequal treatment, of unequal behavior, or of a combination of the two?
steve
Feb 29 2024 at 11:44am
Arent you an engineer? You are seriously suggesting we dont measure stuff. Note that I didnt say, I will probably never say, that the numbers should end up equal and I am largely ignoring Kendi since I think he is more of an agitator than a real thinker. So if you are going to take the issue seriously I think you need metrics and then look at why the numbers are the way they were. For example in 1900 only about 1% of doctors were black while the general population percentage was 11%. Now it is 5.7% and 14%. Is that 5.7% the ceiling because blacks are actually inferior, they dont want to be doctors or are their external factors keeping them from increasing that percentage? Or, there were zero black quarterbacks in the NFL in 1960 and now there are a bunch. Did black athletes change or did something else?
You, or at least Kevin, think it’s too difficult to figure this out so we just ignore it.
Steve
Kevin Corcoran
Feb 29 2024 at 11:45am
That’s not even close to what I think.
Richard W Fulmer
Feb 29 2024 at 2:50pm
Yes, I’m a retired engineer-turned-computer jockey, and, yes, engineers measure stuff. But the stuff we measure are physical things and physical phenomena like length, volume, and flow rate.
One of the problems with trying to measure intangibles is that you’re typically forced to use a measurable proxy in place of the intangible. Often, the result is that you get more of the proxy and less of the intangible. For example, one of our IT managers decided to measure productivity by the number of completed work orders (aka “tickets”). All of a sudden, work that, before, could be requested by a single ticket now required five. Ticket completion skyrocketed but productivity took a nosedive.
The moral of the story is: Bean counters get beans.
You suggest that we measure equality. Fine. I asked what your definition of equality is and how you propose to measure it. You say that you reject Kendi’s definition of equality (or “equity”), but the examples you cite seem to me to be based on his definition. Is that correct? Are you adopting his definition? If not, what is your definition and how would you measure it?
The benefit of Kendi’s definition is that it’s easy to measure. Are 60% of American doctors white? Are 18% Hispanic? 13% black? 6% Asian? 2% American Indian and Alaskan Native? Are 2.5% gay? Are 1% transgender? If not, we haven’t achieved equality – wash, rinse, and repeat until we have. Do we adopt Kendi’s definition simply because we are able to measure it? What are the consequences of doing that? Could we end up with a lot of things we don’t want?
Again, what are you going to measure, how are you going to measure it, and do you really want what you’re likely to get given the incentives your measurements create?
No one here is suggesting that we ignore inequality. Questioning your proposal that we measure what you have yet to define is not the same thing as opposing equality.
Kevin Corcoran
Feb 29 2024 at 3:11pm
Indeed so. And although after spending this much time in the comment section on internet blogs such things really shouldn’t surprise me anymore, I admit I was a bit flummoxed by the suggestion that either we must believe claims about equality be a matter of metrics, or we apparently just give up on everything and declare we have equality and base everything on feelings, as if somehow those are the only two options that exist. So if you don’t support one, you must be supporting the other. For one, that just reveals a spectacularly narrow minded view combined with an utter lack of imagination. For two, I have it on excellent authority than framing things in that kind of dichotomous, either/or way actually serves to promote white supremacy! (I kid, of course.)
TMC
Feb 29 2024 at 10:52am
I’m going to defend having good definitions of words. In your example of a tree falling in the woods, no, there was no noise, there was sound. Sound is the vibration of air and noise is unpleasant sound. Sound does not require someone to be there to exist, but noise needs someone to find it unpleasant.
Scott has several times run into the issue where he prefers his own definition to the commonly accepted one. It’s the only way his argument works. I can’t remember how many times he has defined nationalism as a complete negative and discounting patriotism as a subset of nationalism. Nationalism can be good, bad, or neutral, but his argument falls apart if you use the correct definition.
People who don’t ‘get so hung up on how to define words’ do so to obfuscate their poor reasoning. Not to pick on Scott though, his transgressions are minor. Kendi as you have mentioned has caused a lot more damage using this rhetorical trick. This one trick is the only reason he has a job.
J Mann
Mar 6 2024 at 10:19am
I agree that this is a good idea to keep trying to resolve disputes by defining terms more carefully, but it’s often an uphill battle.
This comes up all the time, and a good compromise would be to agree on words for each of the ideas, but that is usually impossible, so you get people fighting for the high ground of being able to capture the connotations of words for their own argument. For example
People who support private speech restrictions by companies like Twitter object to referring to that practice as “censorship” and demand that “censorship” be defined to refer only to the restriction of speech by government.
In an even more on-point example, in a recent US Supreme Court oral argument, when Justice Alito called the effort to limit the definition of censorship “Orwellian”, Justice Kavenaugh argued that the practice of trying to change people’s opinions by limiting their language should itself only be called “Orwellian” when conducted by the government.
This isn’t too bad when there is a unique word for both ideas. For something like “censorship,” however, there is no word.
“Grooming” is similar – I can see why people who are in favor of educating children about progressive gender values object to the same term being used to mold young people into your personal sexual targets and to educate people about being gay or trans or whatever, but again, there is no word for progressive ideological recruitment.
Similarly, Chris Rufo’s big win was when he popularized “critical race theory” for the package of progressive DEI values being pushed in schools. Most people didn’t have a previous understanding of CRT, so he wasn’t getting much of a headwind from an existing connotation, but once he had a phrase to describe the ideas, a lot of people decided they didn’t like it.
There are also cases where there are words for both ideas, but insisting on one or the other can be seen as bad faith. I’ve seen some people argue that Epstein or Jared from Subway were “ebebophiles” rather than “pedophiles,” but that never goes well.
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