Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2022 October 25

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October 25

Category:Ongoing legal disputes

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkl talk 17:13, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Propose deleting Category:Ongoing legal disputes (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: No real need to differentiate between here and Category:Ongoing legal cases, propose deletion. QueenofBithynia (talk) 22:48, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Delete, unnecessary category layer with a single subcategory. There is no need to merge, the subcat is already under Category:Legal cases. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:03, 26 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Buildings associated with crimes

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkl talk 17:14, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Propose deleting Category:Buildings associated with crimes (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: Seems to be an extremely broad and vague categorisation (how are we defining "associated with crimes") - not sure if this should be deleted or renamed, so opening up to community opinions on this. QueenofBithynia (talk) 20:09, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per nom, but move Category:Buildings where murder took place directly under Category:Buildings, otherwise it becomes orphaned. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:13, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Added Category:Buildings and structures to the category – sorry if this is premature. – QueenofBithynia (talk) 07:01, 26 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Just seems like a case of overtcat. And to what end? If there was a purse stolen outside the front doors, would that qualify that building to this category? Also, what's the point exactly? --PerpetuityGrat (talk) 14:08, 26 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Phanerozoic taxonomic families

Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2022 November 2#Category:Phanerozoic taxonomic families

Category:Viceroys of the British monarch in sovereign countries

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the discussion was: rename. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkl talk 17:15, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Propose renaming Category:Viceroys of the British monarch in sovereign countries to Category:Governors-General of Commonwealth countries

Nominator's rationale: This category is for representatives of the British crown in Commonwealth countries. In all (or most) cases, the title is Governor-General. The title Viceroy was only used in respect of India, so that its use for categories is misleading. If this nom is successful, there will need to be a follow up to rename subcategories that currently use Viceroy. Peterkingiron (talk) 18:47, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Rename per nom, and per WP:C2C, by far most subcategories use "Governors-General". Marcocapelle (talk) 22:19, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Rename per nom. As an aside, as some Commonwealth countries have 'High Commissioners' (eg Malawi), why are these not included in this category? Oculi (talk) 10:39, 26 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Rename per nom. To answer Occuli, I think "realms" where Charles III is still monarch have Governors-General, and fully independent ones with presidents, like India, have "High Commissioners". Actually these are generally larger. There's good case for merging the two, and none are Vicroys except India. Johnbod (talk) 19:53, 26 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Many of these articles are about people well before the establishment of the Commonwealth. Rathfelder (talk) 18:14, 28 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Are you sure? Which ones? Most are like Barbados, which has a note "For British viceroys prior to Barbados gaining independence in 1966, see Category:Governors of Barbados". Of course there have never been any "viceroys" there, as previously noted. Maybe a merge to Category:Governors-General and British High Commissioners of Commonwealth countries would be better. Johnbod (talk) 18:22, 28 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Artemy Vedel

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkl talk 17:16, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Propose deleting Category:Artemy Vedel (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: An eponymous category with only one list article is unnecessary per WP:OCEPON. Starcheerspeaksnewslostwars^{Talk to me} 18:22, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 22:20, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Delete 🌊PacificDepths^talk|contrib 03:53, 1 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Economics books by writer

Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2022 November 2#Economics books by writer

Category:My New Picture films

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the discussion was: delete. WP:OVERLAPCAT. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkl talk 17:17, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Propose deleting Category:My New Picture films (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: "Films by studio" category for a "studio" that's really just one film director's personal shingle for his own films. At present, this is effectively just redundant with Category:Films directed by Bertrand Bonello, because work Bonello directed himself is all this studio has ever actually released -- and unlike the Xavier Dolan category below, there are no films filed here by any other director. There just isn't any urgent need for every film director's own personal shingle to automatically have its own "films by studio" category, if the director's own films are all that "studio" actually releases. Bearcat (talk) 23:33, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I'll thank you to kindly not put words in my mouth that I didn't say just so you can argue with a strawman. Nobody said "production shingle owned by filmmaker" was in and of itself the problem — the problem is "production shingle that exists only to make its owner's own films, and does not produce any films directed by anybody else". Exactly none of these supposed analogues you listed are in that boat at all, because all of them have produced films by multiple other directors besides just their own owners alone, and are thus not equivalent situations.

We do not automatically need a "films by studio" category for every single studio that exists, especially when all of the films the studio has released are already grouped together in a "films by director" category because that one director's films are the only films said studio has released — we need categories for major studios, and not necessarily for minor or independent studios. Bearcat (talk) 04:09, 10 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

So this is not about films produced by the director, what you want is to get rid of categories for independent film studios. Why? I didn't see any rule about that. Why is that a problem?

"Nobody said "production shingle owned by filmmaker" was in and of itself the problem — the problem is "production shingle that exists only to make its owner's own films, and does not produce any films directed by anybody else"

And yet you still requested for Sons of Manual films to be deleted despite having films produced by other directors and not only Xavier Dolan's films...

"none of these supposed analogues you listed are in that boat at all, because all of them have produced films by other directors besides just their own owners"

I said "either mostly or only their own films", which is exactly what those categories represent. Syncopy Inc. films only has two films that weren't directed by Nolan, Infinitum Nihil films only has one film that Depp hasn't worked in, and the same goes for the other categories I listed, most of the films were either directed by or starring the person who owns the company, they all started out by producing their own films. And there's also Category:Balboa Productions films (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs), with only 2 films and both of them starring Sylvester Stallone, and there are probably other categories in the same situation. Either we get rid of all of them and create a new rule or leave it as it is right now. Why only minor/independent studios need to be removed? Zoolver (talk) 04:56, 10 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkl talk 17:42, 17 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Support per WP:OVERLAPCAT, this overlaps entirely with Category:Films directed by Bertrand Bonello. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:39, 17 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkl talk 08:15, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Sons of Manual films

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkl talk 17:18, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Propose deleting Category:Sons of Manual films (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: "Films by studio" category for a "studio" that's really just one film director's personal shingle for his own films. At present, this is effectively just redundant with Category:Films directed by Xavier Dolan, because work Dolan directed himself is all this studio has ever actually released to date -- and of the two films filed here which he didn't direct himself, one was a minor "in association with" credit rather than a production defined by the involvement of Sons of Manual (and yes, it's the same film as the one in the "CBC films" category below). There's just one film here where Sons of Manual is genuinely a primary studio, with Dolan credited as producer but not director of that film, and it's a still-forthcoming future release.
There just isn't any urgent need for every film director's own personal shingle to automatically have its own "films by studio" category, if the director's own films are virtually all that "studio" actually releases. Bearcat (talk) 23:29, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose: You removed Sons of Manual from the infobox of Charlotte (2021 film), even though it is one of the film's major production companies, as show in the film's credits and on UniFrance, Cineuropa, and Nour Films (the French distributor), not a minor "in association with" as you claimed.

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkl talk 17:42, 17 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkl talk 08:14, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per WP:OVERLAPCAT, largely overlaps with Category:Films directed by Xavier Dolan. Marcocapelle (talk) 16:51, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Slaves of the Buyid dynasty

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the discussion was: dual merge. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkl talk 17:20, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Propose merging Category:Slaves of the Buyid dynasty to Category:People under the Buyid dynasty, Category:Iranian slaves and Category:Slaves of the medieval Islamic world
Propose merging Category:Slaves of the Samanid Empire to Category:People of the Samanid Empire, Category:Iranian slaves and Category:Slaves of the medieval Islamic world

Nominator's rationale: merge, redundant category layer with only one subcategory each. Marcocapelle (talk) 11:46, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Keep: Instead, merge Category:Samanid ghilman‎ and Category:Buyid ghilman into Category:Slaves of the Samanid Empire and Category:Slaves of the Buyid dynasty. Al-Andalusi (talk) 20:41, 13 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

That is another possibility, but then it should be a dual merge also to Category:Ghilman‎. Marcocapelle (talk) 21:03, 13 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkl talk 17:44, 17 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I have tagged Category:Samanid ghilman‎ and Category:Buyid ghilman in order to facilitate the alt merge proposal by Al-Andalus. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:33, 17 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkl talk 08:13, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Economics consulting

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the discussion was: purge/rename.

Purge Category:Economics consulting
Rename Category:Economics consulting firms to Category:Macroeconomics consulting firms
Rename Category:Defunct economics consulting firms to Category:Defunct macroeconomics consulting firms (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkl talk 17:11, 5 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Propose deleting Category:Economics consulting
Propose deleting Category:Economics consulting firms
Propose deleting Category:Defunct economics consulting firms

Nominator's rationale: delete as economics consulting is a non-defining characteristic. Economics is the social science that studies the production, distribution, and consumption of goods and services, but these categories are obviously not about consultancy regarding the social science. The best populated category of the three, Category:Economics consulting firms, mainly contains management consulting firms and financial services companies and we already have dedicated categories for that. Marcocapelle (talk) 11:23, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Delete the first. Keep but purge the firms. Germela seems to be a combination of lawyers and miscategorised. However, another firm Global Insight would be left orphaned from any category concerned with the field in which they operate. Management consultants might well be purged into daughter or sibling category, but there are a number of firms in the category that are providing consultancy services about economic affairs for various purposes. I agree that the subject category is not needed, as most of its contents is not about "economic consulting". I would suggest that main article for the firms article should be Economics. These are firms providing consultancy services about economics. Peterkingiron (talk) 15:45, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkl talk 17:44, 17 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Peterkingiron: if the category is kept and purged, the purpose of the category may be clarified by renaming it to e.g. Category:Macroeconomics consulting firms. (I still doubt whether a sufficient number of articles will survive, but let's park that for now.) Marcocapelle (talk) 20:29, 17 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

No objection to that. Peterkingiron (talk) 15:42, 23 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Comment Category:Economists are generally not very well defined. Many articles categorised there for people who seem more like politicians or businesspeople. Rathfelder (talk) 08:46, 18 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkl talk 08:13, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Referendums in the Philippines

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the discussion was: not moved. Closing before another 7 days since the RM on the related article (Referendums in the Philippines) was procedurally closed and the old name kept (C2D). Also, disclosing this is a alternative account of ClydeFranklin, who closed this earlier and reverted, but now the 2 concerns (unclear consensus and the RM) have been resolved. (non-admin closure) Diverging Diamond ^{To the left! To the right!} 22:22, 26 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Propose renaming Category:Referendums in the Philippines to Category:Plebiscites in the Philippines

Nominator's rationale: As per MOS:TIES, "referendums" in the Philippines are almost referred to as "plebiscites". Hariboneagle927 (talk) 12:32, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose - according to the article Plebiscites in the Philippines, moved by Hariboneagle927 very recently without discussion from Referendums in the Philippines, referendums and plebiscites are different things. Moreover, 3 of the 4 articles in the category are titled 'referendum'. Oculi (talk) 21:16, 9 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Alt rename to Category:Referendums and plebiscites in the Philippines, while they are two different things they are similar enough such that we do not need two separate categories. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:39, 10 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose. "Referendums" are a general term, of which plebiscites are a specific subset. There had been several referendums in the Philippines, specifically during the martial law era (hint: If it's a national electoral exercise that doesn't involve people, and doesn't involve the constitution, it's a referendum). As stated above, the main article has been moved several times without discussion the past week, and I've opened a discussion, that has not received any feedback (LOL). Howard the Duck (talk) 04:36, 16 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Comment: I closed this as not moved, but, due to concerns raised on my talk page, I reverted that close. Clyde ^{State your case} (please use {{reply to|ClydeFranklin}} on reply) 06:30, 17 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Discussion at Talk:Referendums and plebiscites in the Philippines#Renaming this article
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkl talk 17:51, 17 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I have converted the discussion on the article talk page to an RM. The category name should follow the outcome of the RM. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:15, 19 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: The page is currently at the status quo ante of Referendums in the Philippines.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Qwerfjkl talk 08:12, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Close this already. Article has been restored to pre-moved title, and the WP:RM was closed days ago. Any discussion to move names should be an RM and not here. Howard the Duck (talk) 15:45, 26 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, now speedily keep per WP:C2D. Marcocapelle (talk) 20:31, 26 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Taxa named by Rosendo Pascual

Relisted, see Wikipedia:Categories for discussion/Log/2022 November 5#Category:Taxa named by Rosendo Pascual

Category:Privacy legislation

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the discussion was: keep. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkl talk 17:23, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Propose merging Category:Privacy legislation to Category:Privacy law

Nominator's rationale: same fgnievinski (talk) 05:16, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

If there are insufficient numbers of articles specifically on legislation, I don't object to an appropriate consolidation. (As the person who created the category.) But, to be clear, it should not be scratched as "redundant" or "same". There is a distinction bettween "legislation" (which includes bills proposed but not passed) and "law" (which includes legislation that has been passed, as well as case law, constitutional law, etc.) --Lquilter (talk) 02:20, 26 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose per Lquilter. This is more specific than the parent category. –LaundryPizza03 (d c̄) 04:00, 27 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Category:Areas around the Ohio River

The following is an archived discussion concerning one or more categories. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on an appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the discussion was: delete. (non-admin closure) Qwerfjkl talk 17:24, 2 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Propose deleting Category:Areas around the Ohio River (edit | talk | history | links | watch | logs)

Nominator's rationale: Vague scope. Not clear what defines "around" the Ohio River. The three articles currently populating it are about West Virginia cities, on the Ohio River. We already have Category:Populated places on the Ohio River and Category:West Virginia populated places on the Ohio River. DB1729^talk 04:40, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Delete per nom. Marcocapelle (talk) 05:12, 25 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Delete I agree with nominator's rationale. 🌊PacificDepths^talk|contrib — Preceding undated comment added 04:05, 1 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The above is preserved as an archive of the discussion. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the category's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.