Talk:Castillo San Cristóbal (San Juan)

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Military history: Fortifications / European / Spanish

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	Fortifications task force
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Archives

Archive 1

Requested move 28 July 2018

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: no consensus to move the page at this time, per the discussion below. However, it is possible that something should be done with Castillo San Cristóbal, which currently redirects here; either this should go to the plain title, or that should be turned into a disambiguation page. Dekimasuよ! 18:13, 4 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

(

Done Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 14:29, 17 August 2018 (UTC))[reply]

Castillo San Cristóbal (San Juan) → Castle of San Cristóbal (San Juan) – I previously moved this article from Castillo San Cristóbal to Castle of San Cristóbal (San Juan) per WP:USEENGLISH and to disambiguate location from other uses. User:Awvazquez has moved it to Castillo San Cristóbal (San Juan) with summary "... the native and official name is 'Castillo San Cristobal'". In my opinion it should be moved back per WP:USEENGLISH (and consistency with All pages with titles beginning with Castle of San). Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 09:43, 28 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Support per Fodor's Puerto Rico 2010 "Castillo San Cristóbal. This huge stone fortress, built between 1634 and 1785, guarded the city from land attacks from the east. Even larger than El Morro, San Cristóbal was known in the 17th and 18th centuries as the Gibraltar of the West ..." Maybe while we're here the feeling which led to one lone Puerto-Rican Mónica Puig being singled out among our Puerto-Rican bio articles for removal of ó to "Monica Puig Marchán" can also be revisited one day. cf. Castle of San Cristóbal (Santa Cruz de Tenerife) . In ictu oculi (talk) 11:14, 28 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Against There are some places in the world that have translations into multiple languages. For example, the Viejo San Juan is translated into English as "Old San Juan". The reason is because the word that describes the characteristic "Old" can be translated. But at other times, places should be named with their native, local, and in this case even official name. San Francisco is a city in California. It has a Spanish native name, but it's the official name of the city and should not be translated into any other language. The official name of the National Park in which the Castillo San Cristóbal is located is "San Juan National Historic Site". Plese, look at this picture where you can see a sign in English (National Park Service) where this unit of this park is named as "Castillo San Cristóbal" ( https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Puerto_Rico_%E2%80%94_San_Juan_%E2%80%94_Castillo_San_Crist%C3%B3bal_(sign).JPG ). Awvazquez (talk) 20:33, 31 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose. WP:USEENGLISH does not mean we should translate absolutely everything into English no matter what. -- Necrothesp (talk) 14:06, 1 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

@Necrothesp: Indeed, but my proposal is based on the logic of WP:UE guidance. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 08:32, 2 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

And where does that say that all names should be translated into English? We use the commonest name in reliable English-language sources if there is one. That's not necessarily an English translation. -- Necrothesp (talk) 08:49, 2 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose. The National Park website uses "Castillo San Cristóbal", for example at https://www.nps.gov/saju/learn/news/newsreleases.htm. Gruepig (talk) 03:01, 3 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.