Talk:Siege of Badajoz (1812)

Ian Fletcher as a source

He is the only historian to write a book solely dedicated this battle. I don't see how he can be objected to as a source for this article?KingOfAfrica (talk) 21:29, 5 April 2009 (UTC)

Simple. His justification of war crimes. Even by early 19th Century standards, what happened was disgusting. The thousands of civilians killed and Raped were not collateral damage. Under Fletcher's reasoning you could justify anything. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.46.198.5 (talk) 00:59, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

You go to war. you watch your friends die. you see your own leg blown off. then say that. 2.216.232.181 (talk) 21:28, 30 December 2011 (UTC)

Wikipedia is NOT here to judge the past, nor judge others on their standards. We must be careful not to apply 21st century standards to 18th and 19th century actions, nor to ignore accurate historical sources simply because we do not agree with their opinions. I may not agree with Fletcher's opinions, but his historical knowledge and research is excellent, and certainly valid as a source where facts and events are concerned. His discussion of why things happened is immaterial, and have no place in an encyclopedia anyway. Wikipedia does not judge history, it merely describes it. Please don't attempt to give modern context to historical events, or discounts valid sources simply because you disagree with the author. Audigex (talk) 12:18, 3 November 2014 (UTC)

Wellington's belief that the British Army consisted of the "scum of the earth" made him understand the need to allow the troops free rein was needed to insure that they would obey orders to assault the next fortress. He allowed the troop riot to continue for over 2 days before he had gallows constructed to warn that mlitary discipline was restored. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.244.53.140 (talk) 22:45, 19 February 2012 (UTC)

Nonsense, Wellingtons "scum of the earth" quote is an often repeated but highly selective one taken out of context. It was made in anger in the aftermath of Vitoria when many troops looted the French bagage rather than pursue the beaten enemy. He went onto say it again later but added, "but look what fine fellows we have made of them". It was in fact a nod of respect to the men. He did not "allow the troops free reign", he simply could not stop them. They were steaming drunk, bloodied and half mad from seeing their friends slaughtered hideously and simply killed any officer that persisted in attempting to halt the rampage.

Fletcher is a highly respected historian and is a perfectly acceptable source.

Gaius Octavius Princeps (talk) 20:22, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

Indeed, taking Wellington's comment out of context and applying it to a siege 18 months earlier, proves nothing. Besides which, all armies of this period were susceptible to the same things. Wellington was annoyed as his troops at Vitoria, but he wasn't judging them to be any worse than troops of other nations. And he certainly wasn't commenting on Badajoz. Audigex (talk) 12:18, 3 November 2014 (UTC)