Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Jill Phipps (2nd nomination)

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep and rename to Death of Jill Phipps. (non-admin closure) Naypta ☺ | ✉ talk page | 16:10, 16 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Jill Phipps

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The subject (Jill Phipps) fails WP:NBIO and this is basically a WP:MEMORIAL about an accidental death 25 years ago that made the news. The subject seems to be known only by her death. The 11 year old Wikipedia article has never had any content showing notability of this person while she was alive. Even changing the title of the article (per WP:SINGLEEVENT) wouldn't then pass WP:GNG. Normal Op (talk) 07:49, 9 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Animal-related deletion discussions. Normal Op (talk) 07:49, 9 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of England-related deletion discussions. Normal Op (talk) 07:49, 9 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Women-related deletion discussions. 20:12, 14 July 2020 (UTC)

Keep, but rename to Death of Jill Phipps. The incident was notable, generating protests decades after the event: [1][2]. Quite a collection of books cover this: [3][4][5][6] and many more. Phipps has become a martyr and symbol for these protests.--Eostrix (^{🦉 hoot} _hoot🦉) 13:41, 13 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: I have updated the article somewhat, and that gave me an even more in depth viewpoint of the subject. Of your suggestions of 4 books: Book#1 is not a reliable source (self-published book by not-notable author); Books #2-#4 have no coverage ABOUT Phipps. Book#2 covers the issue of transport of calves and covers the types of activities the protesters had been doing during their entire campaign. Phipps is mentioned only as an unfortunate accident and that other people piggybacked the accident's media coverage to catapult THEIR message into the news (RSPCA and ALF). Book#3 talks about dangers during protests and briefly mentions the Phipps incident as an example of how wrong things can go (death). Book#4 covers group dynamics of CROWDS, starting with a mob of footballers and then mentioning the death of a protester (Phipps). But mentioning Phipps' death over and over and over again while discussing "activism subjects" makes Phipps neither famous nor notable. I draw your attention to WP:SINGLEEVENT and Pseudo-biographies where this article has gone off the rails by padding this pseudo-bio, attempting to turn this page into a WP:MEMORIAL about Phipps. Phipps' mother continues to use her daughter's death to piggyback her own activism messages in the media, but the newspapers have ONLY been regurgitating the same content they wrote back in 1995. There is no new content added about Phipps or the accident; just new coverage about new protests. This does NOT "make" Jill Phipps (or her death) notable. If we took your suggestion to change the name to Death of Jill Phipps, then we would have a single news story about an unfortunate death of a young woman. (See WP:NOTNEWSPAPER.) The ongoing mentions of Jill Phipps' death are recycled news; no new content or coverage. It's just piggybacking on old news. On the other hand, there are an unlimited number of articles one COULD write in Wikipedia where Phipps' death could be mentioned without violating Wikipedia guidelines/policies, like an article about safety during protests and the risks of injury, or an article about England's veal industry. Normal Op (talk) 08:37, 14 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

There are several other newspaper and book hits. Variable quality wise, indeed, but the coverage of the death itself has been persisting for decades. Heck, there is even resulting coverage such as this book that mentions in 2016 a "JILL PHIPPS R.I.P. ALWAYS REMEMBERED '95" slogan inscribed in Scotland, with the local farmer there being clueless. Looking up who "Phipps 1995" is a reasonable encyclopedic query. I agree that the death itself is what is notable, not Phipps herself.--Eostrix (^{🦉 hoot} _hoot🦉) 09:34, 14 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

See WP:NOTDIRECTORY. Better yet, see the entire Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not. The family seems determined to continue to use this poor woman's name into eternity to promote their AR agendas, but this adds not one bit to Phipps' alleged notability or martyrdom. It would be appropriate to have Phipps mentioned within an article discussing — pick a topic; see my prior comment — and then have a redirect titled "Jill Phipps" directing to that content within an article. And that's the closest to a directory for 'farmers clueless of the meaning of local activist graffiti' that Wikipedia need get. Normal Op (talk) 23:12, 14 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: The relevant bits could go into Eastern Animal Liberation League, with a redirect from "Jill Phipps". Scrap the bio. Cover the accident. Normal Op (talk) 06:06, 15 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep and rename to Death of Jill Phipps. Very notable incident. -- Necrothesp (talk) 12:59, 15 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep and rename per above. The sourcing is not the best, but it's sufficient to pass BASIC (although I accept that it would not be of a BLP was involved). —— § erial 08:26, 16 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep and rename per above. For anyone who was around at the time (I then worked in Coventry) the protests were national news, and the death of Phipps was a big deal not only per her death in itself but in bringing the issue to national attention. There are a number of references to her long after her death, showing enduring notability. I even found references to a groups in the USA [7] and Brazil [8] protesting on the anniversary of her death to this day. The incident is still regularly referenced to this day in articles in RS about animal protests. Incidentally, if the depth of coverage of someone's death is sufficient, there is absolutely no requirement that they be notable beforehand. See, for example, Rachel Corrie. Black Kite (talk) 10:18, 16 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
Keep and rename as per comments above. — Czello 10:53, 16 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.