Talk:Middle Ages

Semi-protected edit request on 27 September 2024

The word “spelt” should be “spelled.” (First paragraph) 2601:602:D280:B3B0:DD7B:562E:E31D:40A7 (talk) 04:33, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

Not in British English according to the OED, and the aticle is tagged as British English. Norfolkbigfish (talk) 08:07, 27 September 2024 (UTC)

Query

@Norfolkbigfish: I highly appreciate your constant attempts to contribute to our community efforts. However, please try to avoid original research and also try to use the "Preview" button before saving your edits to avoid obviously distructive edits. For instance, could your refer to reliable sources stating that the Middle Ages "saw the rise of agriculture as the primary economic force", or to scholarly works suggesting that Germanic migrations began in the Early Middle Ages? I know that WP can be edited by any editors but editors who do not have a certain level of knowledge about an article's topic can hardly improve it without familiarising themselves with the relevant literature. Sorry, I must revert all your edits because they did not improve the article, and I do not have time to correct all of your misinterpretations. Borsoka (talk) 01:53, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

There were review comments unactioned at Wikipedia:Featured article review/Middle Ages/archive1 since the 21st October, so in attempt to move these on I summarized the lead and another section as the comments suggested. No factual information was added. The article says Scholarly consensus characterises the period by the economic predominance of agriculture and the issue with Germanic migrations required a tweak in language to position this as a precursor to Early Middle Ages rather than a constituent part. A reversion was therefore disproportionate. Norfolkbigfish (talk) 11:25, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

Please compare the verified text you quoted from the article what you wrote before commenting. If a short text contains two unverified statements, its total reversion is not dispoportionate. Borsoka (talk) 11:32, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

Restoration

I must apologise before the whole community because my edits destroyed an FA and as a consequence it was delisted. The destroyed version must obviously be restored because our readers cannot be forced to read a version representing a lower standard than the restored version. I urge the original nominators to re-nominate their version. I will show my contrition for my distruptive edits by comments during the process. Borsoka (talk) 02:37, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

I added a new main picture because it was chosen through compromise, not through my bludgeoing tactics. Borsoka (talk) 02:40, 8 November 2024 (UTC)

Compromise?

Watching from the sidelines I have seen many passionate editors give their best for the article. Like any worthy knightly quest, their efforts should not be in vain. I have then tried to find ways to take the best from both versions, at least in prose (I see no reason why sources from both could also not be used, giving a varied academic support to the article). I request compromise, because I think both versions of the article have their strengths, one really gives a great picture of western Europe (not suprising given the emphasis of English language scholarship) while the other is more continental and its approach. I am optimistic that we already have great medieval articles, we just need to bring the best of them together.

Here is one example

Black Death "Between circa 950 and 1060, severe droughts struck the Middle East and the Eurasian Steppe experienced anomalous cold. After 1250, the Medieval Warm Period began to transition to the Little Ice Age. These environmental challenges were followed in 1347 by the Black Death, a pandemic that spread throughout Europe during the following three years. The death toll was probably about 35 million people in Europe, about one-third of the population. Towns were especially hard-hit because of their crowded conditions - one town, Lübeck in Germany, lost 90 percent of its population.

All this impact changed economic and social structures. Peasants who survived had to pay less rent to landlords, and town workers demanded higher salaries but were then much more highly taxed. The trauma of the plague led to profound social and religious changes. Communities showed increased piety with the establishment of new charities. The flagellant movement showed that there was widespread fear combined with extreme religious zeal. Because of this, Jewish communities became scapegoats for the disaster and were severely persecuted. The economic aftermath reconstituted relationships between landlords and tenants. Urban economic structures began to shift as cities adapted to their new, reduced populations.

Charlemagne

Christmas Day 800 saw the coronation of Charlemagne as emperor, a watershed in medieval history. The occasion represented both a symbolic revival of the Western Roman Empire and a functional challenge to Byzantine hegemony. An itinerant court, which travelled with the emperor, formed the hub of sophisticated administrative structures. Some 300 counts were responsible for administering local regions, while imperial emissaries, or missi dominici, served as roving inspectors and troubleshooters. Essential records of grants and administrative decisions were preserved by the royal chapel.

The cultural impact of Charlemagne's reign was profound. His court revived many Roman administrative practices, while it spurred the development of the Carolingian Renaissance. Religious practices became more uniform across his domains, while education and literacy received royal patronage. His relationship with Byzantium proved complex, since his imperial coronation presumed a status as equal to that of Constantinople-a source of diplomatic tension, even as cultural exchange between the two empires continued.

Women

Women's roles in medieval society were complex and varied depending on social class and region. Although technically subject to male authority, women's real influence and activities varied extensively throughout medieval Europe. Aristocratic women held positions of great influence chiefly as wives and mothers, while queen mothers were especially important in Francia. Many noblewomen enjoyed quite significant informal political authority, but the nature of that influence proved fragile and rested upon male connections. The abbess also provided other forms of aristocratic female authority in especially monastic contexts.

Working women were involved in a variety of economic pursuits. In addition to their work in managing a household, many working women also contributed to economic production by spinning and brewing. Urban women were permitted to trade, but access to guild trading was commonly through the rights of husbands. All classes of women worked in agricultural labor during harvest season. Their legal status remained formally subordinate to male relatives, though they could inherit land in the absence of male heirs. Regional variations in legal protections and special provisions for widows created additional complexity in women's social position."