Talk:Dragon (zodiac)

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Are Abraham Lincoln and Charles Darwin born in the year of the Dragon, or the year of the Snake? When did the 1809 Chinese New Year officially begin?

Note: according to this website, Abraham Lincoln was born in the year of the Snake, which means Darwin was also born in the year of the Snake (according to that website). The truth is, 1809 was so long ago, does anyone really remember what Chinese Signs occured during that year? And if so, what were they?

Mathematics can determine when this was. The article for the Chinese New Year mentions that it takes place on "the day of the second new moon after the day on which the winter solstice occurs." I thought it was during the spring, but okay... so chances are, if Abe and Chuck were born sometime after or before switching over, then we could figure out if they were Dragons or Snakes, or whatever. MasterXiam 21:13, 21 November 2005 (UTC)

I thought I should mention that there's apparently a rather indignant Snake-born who vandalized the Dragon description and edited the Snake article to read "It is widely accepted that Snake is way better than Dragon." I've reverted his/her edits. --Jitterro 05:14, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Given their personalities and accomplishments, it's much more likely for both Lincoln and especially Darwin to have been Snakes.

Also, Joan d'Arc was a Rabbit.

February 14, 1809 was the first day of the year of the Snake [1], meaning Abraham Lincoln and Charles Darwin were both born in the year of the Dragon. joturner 01:24, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

Sure theres not some kind of calendar dispute? If Lincoln was a Dragon how come he was so different from Jefferson Davis and Andrew Johnson who were also Dragons? Sure there wasnt something back then were the years didnt match exactly? Cuz itd seem more likely that Mozart was a Rat too!

Actually I would not at all be surprised if Mozart was a Pig (I don't know much about mozart, but he was a musician). Pigs seem to be much nicer than Rats all together and are more artistic and sensitive. Some people forget that despite being charming, charismatic and talkative, Rats can be very rigid and brutal in attitude and actions (I don't think any of the signs are as "mean" or as brutal and relentless against a perceived enemey as the Rat is; on the flp side they are very loyal and loving to those they love). Though all sources claim he was a Rat, so maybe the Rat year started very early the year mozart was born (though who really knows?) Lincoln and Darwin on the other hand, I've seen conflicting sources. Most say Snakes, some say Dragons. They turned out to be Dragons. VeronicaPR

You can't really tell a person's sign just from his or her characteristics. This is just Chinese astrology after all. Of course, this is obvious, but I just like to say the redundant.

All the Chinese sites list the Year of the Dragon as Jan 23, 2012 – Feb 9, 2013 - as do the Chinese temples - Wikipedia does not, why the confusion? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.60.201.194 (talk) 20:46, 7 December 2012 (UTC)

Chinese Character

I thought the Chinese symbol for 'Year of the Dragon' was 辰, as apposed to 龍, which just means 'Dragon'. I could be wrong though. Could somebody please verify which is correct. Sadako No Deshi 18:50, 18 July 2006 (BST)

No, again, that is not the right character at all. The character you have there is "chen2" and means various things, but often "celestial bodies". Are all the characters wrong? I've looked at two so far, and two are totally wrong.Lesotho 03:03, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

"辰" and "龍" are totally wrong? So that means "Scorpion" is correct? NO! It can't be! I never want the Dragon to be replaced with a scorpion for the Chinese zodiac! Yusheng02 (talk) 10:44, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

England/United Kingdom

Is the Dragon the sign for England, as was in the original article and as suggested on other sites on the web, or for the United Kingdom? This seems to have been changed by an anonymous editor who may have been operating under the fallacy that England and UK are synonymous or that United Kingdom is the correct term for England as I know that constituent countries of the UK (at least England, Scotland and Wales) usually have their own zodiac signs attributed to each of them, the western zodiac for example. Benson85 21:19, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

Hi Benson, from what I know, the Dragon governs the United Kingdom, not just England. England is sometimes the only one listed because it's probably the most notable part of the UK, but for sure the UK is governed by the Dragon. Ireland is governed by the Dog (which is the sign opposite to the Dragon). Though Ireland is not listed under the Dog because only 6 countries are listed, not more. VeronicaPR 23:13, 1 December 2006 (UTC)

can anyone elaborate what this means? any significance to the Dragon on the Welsh flag?:) 109.153.203.51 (talk) 00:36, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

List of Celebrities Sign (Chinese zodiac)

I vote for making a new article, List of Celebrities Sign (chinese zodiac) - with a list of famous persons of all signs (separeted by sign/element), something like the List of games Daniel Leite 04:25, 28 March 2007 (UTC)

Since no one protested and I agree with you, I boldly went ahead and created the Category Category:List_of_Celebrities_(Chinese_Zodiac) and the subcategories for each sign. I'm currently adding the categories to the current Year of the Dog celebrities (I will remove the section afterwards, replacing it with a link).

Now, it would be great if you and all the other regulars (Maestro, VeronicaPR, IrishPearl etc.) would each take a Zodiac Sign and do the same, since it would take ages to do this alone. Teshik 12:33, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

Split contested, candidate for deletion

Hrmpf. In the very minute I finally got the Dog article finished, the new categories were put up into the Deletion candidates. Go here for details, and please tell if you want the categories kept, deleted, or if you got another suggestion entirely. I've stopped editing for now. Teshik 14:53, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

remove list of people

Do not reply here; go to centralized discussion at Talk:Rat (zodiac)#Let's remove all the celebrities lists. — coelacan — 18:15, 6 April 2007 (UTC)

External links

I have factual links that tell you the meaning of the Chinese zodiac Dragon, etc. They are not advertising anything personal. I feel they may help the site. If you do not believe so, please remove. They were previously posted on two articles. I want to combine them and post them on each horoscope, Including this one. All I am doing is changing the name as on the sites them selves. Such as chineseastrology.com/Dragon I would change Horse to Dog or Snake and it would give me the meaning of that horoscope. now that link i just posted is not real, but It is an example of the real ones that I am doing. You can check me to make sure. They link to the meaning of each horoscope and is accurate from what I've done so far. Ariyen (talk) 13:33, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

Conflicting dates?

Hey guys, just passing by on this article and noticed that the first set of dates in the Dragon (zodiac)#Years and the Five Elements section says 16 February 1916 – 3 February 1905: Wood Dragon. I'm assuming that's a typo, since from 1916 to 1905... well... is backwards! Does anyone know what this should be? Joshua Lee ^{talk softly, please} 14:57, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

Never mind, turned out it was vandalism or a mistaken edit. Joshua Lee ^{talk softly, please} 15:00, 23 January 2012 (UTC)

Missing year?

where is 1940 in the list of years? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 60.230.215.24 (talk) 13:40, 9 August 2012 (UTC)

The Elements

If there were sources for these then please list them. --Mr.Goblins (talk) 20:53, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

Traditional Dragon attributes and associations

Attribute
Zodiac Location	5th
Ruling hours	7am-9am
Direction	East-southeast
Motto	“I Reign”
Season and month	Spring, April
Fixed element	Wood
Stem	Positive
Lunar Month Dates	April 5 – May 4
Birthstone	Bloodstone
Colors	Red and Violet
Roughly equivalent western sign	Aries
Polarity	Yang

There should be a list of elements to different Dragons in different countries.--74.34.81.237 (talk) 21:32, 10 January 2013 (UTC)

References

Dates

I just edited the dates and years, several of which were off by a day (not using UTC?) and some that were way off (a couple of dates in March, when dates can only be in January or February). I also added the dates for 1892-93, which makes it more consistent with the date ranges for other Chinese animal signs.

I used calculations from the Solar Fire astrology software program, which is usually very accurate (to within a fraction of a second). Dates are for the New Moon in Aquarius (using tropical zodiac; always initiates the Chinese New Year), and all dates and times were calculated in UTC.

I don't edit very often, and not for a very long time, so I thought I would explain my edits here. If I did something I shouldn't have, or didn't do something I should have, please let me know and accept my apologies. Thanks! --Pegasuss (talk) 21:00, 7 February 2013 (UTC)

External links modified (January 2018)

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Remove list of people, again

Please chime in at Talk:Rat_(zodiac)#Celebrity_lists,_again regarding removing the list of people from all Chinese zodiac articles. --Elmidae (talk · contribs) 18:25, 14 March 2020 (UTC)

Panda for Dragon? Seriously?

I find this rather shocking claim on the page:

”During China's Cultural Revolution, there was an attempt to replace the dragon with the giant panda; however, the movement was short lived.”

One of the two references appears to misunderstand some political rhetoric from the Cato Institute; the second is nothing to rely on.

Is there a China expert at hand who would *not* simply delete this sentence and its notes? Infoslam (talk) 09:34, 11 February 2024 (UTC)

I see the citations for the ‘Panda Year’ mention are revised. The new ones do look stronger. I would still rate them as fluff-media references for an historical claim about which historians are unhelpfully silent.

Incidentally, one native Chinese person, educated, with CCP connections and living in Beijing at the time in question, tells me indignantly that the whole idea is preposterous.

It's just me — but if I were authoring this Wikipedia entry, I would omit or qualify the tidbit about pandas. It seems to me too dicey compared to its value.

I find no better references. Here's what I can say about the ones we have:

FOOTNOTE [6] links to a chatty infotainment article that cites 干支の動物誌 (Animals of the Sexagenary Cycle), a general-interest book in Japanese by author Tadashi Abe published in Tokyo in 1995 by Gihodo Shuppan Co. Ltd. <[2]https://gihodobooks.sslserve.jp/book/4216-5.html>.

In the publisher's blurb, the Abe book sounds highly idiosyncratic — a blend of calendrical folklore together with historical observations about human-animal relations and digressions into the author's area of expertise (said to be public administration of pest control). Not a scholarly piece with citations, but evidently itself a reference work for pop journalists.

FOOTNOTE [7] links to a 2021 article published by AFPBB News, the Japanese-language news agency of Agence France-Presse. The piece is labeled as syndicated content from Tōhō shinpō (Japanese: 東方新報, Eastern Daily News), which regularly translates its Chinese-language content into Japanese for AFPBB.

Tōhō shinpō launched as a free news weekly in 1994 with a mission of “connecting Chinese residents in Japan with Japanese society.” By now it may effectively have merged with its sister publication Dōngfāng xīnbào (Chinese: 東方時報, Eastern Times). Both belong to Tōhō International Co. Ltd., based in Japan <[3]https://www.tohonet.com/work.html>.

Tōhō International has partners inside and outside of China, including the state-run 中国新聞社 (Zhōngguó xīnwén shè, China News Service or CNS) headquartered in Beijing <[4]https://www.chinanews.com.cn> <[5]https://www.ecns.cn/>. Infoslam (talk) 23:53, 15 February 2024 (UTC)